***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (7 Viewers)

[andy_b]

And i never said we can't be competitive. It's not like we're getting embarassed out there (most of the time). I just dont think we can ever consistently beat the top squads.

This makes zero sense.Even the top squads themselves can not beat the other top squads consistently.

 

[andy_b]

As far as england playing other sports...What other sports (that require similar phsyical characteristics as sports like football, basketball and soccer) is england losing elite athletes to? They dont play basketball, baseball, hockey or american football on any sort of competitive level. Sure, they lost some kids to track, but other than that, i dont see where else their elite talent pool would go.

good lord you are myopic.Have you ever heard of Rugby?

I did forget about Rugby. Good point. Thats fair. I still dont think its quite the drain that Football and basketball are on US soccer.

football and basketball are not the drain you think they are as the vast vast majority of those players could never play soccer affectively because of their size.In football, most of the WR's and some of the RB's would be suitable for soccer. The rest are too big.And only the guards in basketball, with the rare occasion of a small forward, be any where near as mobile enough for soccer.Don't make the mistake of watching a 6'8" guy look extremely mobile on a tiny basketball court with having the same impact on a huge soccer field. The levels of mobility do not translate.

 

[TLEF316]

And i never said we can't be competitive. It's not like we're getting embarassed out there (most of the time). I just dont think we can ever consistently beat the top squads.

This makes zero sense.Even the top squads themselves can not beat the other top squads consistently.

I didnt mean consistently beat as in beat them every time. I mean consistently beat as in defeat top teams on a semi-regular basis. If we play England, we maybe beat them 1/25 times (maybe, i dont really know) If Italy plays Germany or England plays France, its usually pretty even and could go either way. I dont think we will ever see that level of competitiveness with the top sides in europe or south america.

 

[kerpow]

As far as england playing other sports...What other sports (that require similar phsyical characteristics as sports like football, basketball and soccer) is england losing elite athletes to? They dont play basketball, baseball, hockey or american football on any sort of competitive level. Sure, they lost some kids to track, but other than that, i dont see where else their elite talent pool would go.

good lord you are myopic.Have you ever heard of Rugby?

I did forget about Rugby. Good point. Thats fair. I still dont think its quite the drain that Football and basketball are on US soccer.

Rugby is played at a realtively small, maybe 20%, of schools in England. Its soccer and if you're no good at that you play other sports. Just the way it is over here.

 

[andy_b]

i also think that soccer and football are just a tad bit more comparable than football and hockey. Maybe its just me.

There is almost no touch required in football for most of the positions.Every position in hockey requires touch.I could make a valid argument that touch is the most important item in soccer.

 

[TLEF316]

As far as england playing other sports...What other sports (that require similar phsyical characteristics as sports like football, basketball and soccer) is england losing elite athletes to? They dont play basketball, baseball, hockey or american football on any sort of competitive level. Sure, they lost some kids to track, but other than that, i dont see where else their elite talent pool would go.

good lord you are myopic.Have you ever heard of Rugby?

I did forget about Rugby. Good point. Thats fair. I still dont think its quite the drain that Football and basketball are on US soccer.

football and basketball are not the drain you think they are as the vast vast majority of those players could never play soccer affectively because of their size.In football, most of the WR's and some of the RB's would be suitable for soccer. The rest are too big.And only the guards in basketball, with the rare occasion of a small forward, be any where near as mobile enough for soccer.Don't make the mistake of watching a 6'8" guy look extremely mobile on a tiny basketball court with having the same impact on a huge soccer field. The levels of mobility do not translate.

Yeah, I'm not expecting to see Lebron James running over Lampard in the midfield. But i have to believe that a Chris Paul, Allen Iverson or Reggie Bush type athlete could have a shot to be a pretty dominant force on a soccer field (if they were given equal coaching and experience growing up) unless they just had zero touch. I'd be interested to see a Kevin Garnett type in goal (although GK really has never been our problem)

 

[kerpow]

i also think that soccer and football are just a tad bit more comparable than football and hockey. Maybe its just me.

There is almost no touch required in football for most of the positions.Every position in hockey requires touch.I could make a valid argument that touch is the most important item in soccer.

Control (Touch) and Vision.

 

[andy_b]

And i never said we can't be competitive. It's not like we're getting embarassed out there (most of the time). I just dont think we can ever consistently beat the top squads.

This makes zero sense.Even the top squads themselves can not beat the other top squads consistently.

I didnt mean consistently beat as in beat them every time. I mean consistently beat as in defeat top teams on a semi-regular basis. If we play England, we maybe beat them 1/25 times (maybe, i dont really know)

so does the fact that we have beaten England 1 out of the last 4 times we have played them mean anything?If we played England in a constant home and home series with both sides at full strength I think the US would come out with ~30% of the points available after say a 10 game series.

 

[andy_b]

I'd be interested to see a Kevin Garnett type in goal (although GK really has never been our problem)

I don't think this would work too well. 6'5" seems to be about as big as you see keepers get before their vertical size become a detriment in the speed of diving down to low shots to the side.

 

[TLEF316]

i also think that soccer and football are just a tad bit more comparable than football and hockey. Maybe its just me.

There is almost no touch required in football for most of the positions.Every position in hockey requires touch.I could make a valid argument that touch is the most important item in soccer.

obviously the skills exhibited in the sports are diferent. However, things like balance, acceleration, vision and quick reaction times are all transferable skills.My main point is that our young elite talented athletes (many of which grow up in poor areas) are never, ever, ever steered towards soccer first (unless they come from a soccer family or there are some other unique circumstances) They are put on the football field and the basketball court. In England, and most of western europe, its the other way around. It's a massive disadvantage i dont think we'll ever be able to overcome. Add in the fact that coaching and training in Europe is so much more developed and dedicated, and i just dont ever see US soccer being anything close to a world power.

 

[TLEF316]

I'd be interested to see a Kevin Garnett type in goal (although GK really has never been our problem)

I don't think this would work too well. 6'5" seems to be about as big as you see keepers get before their vertical size become a detriment in the speed of diving down to low shots to the side.

very possible. i just think it would be an interesting experiment.

 

[andy_b]

Yeah, I'm not expecting to see Lebron James running over Lampard in the midfield. But i have to believe that a Chris Paul, Allen Iverson or Reggie Bush type athlete could have a shot to be a pretty dominant force on a soccer field (if they were given equal coaching and experience growing up) unless they just had zero touch.

Many of the athletes you are generally referring to come from our inner city. The kids in the inner city play only one sport and thats basketball.Football, soccer and baseball fields are very hard to find and ice rinks are a non starter.Football, unlike soccer, baseball, hockey and basketball, can be picked up much later in life and one can still be a phenomenal player based on nothing more than your athletic gifts.I believe this is why you see relatively few African Americans in soccer, baseball or hockey. They don't have the ability to play the sport as a child nor can they pick it up later on as a teenager and become instantly good at it.

 

[TLEF316]

And i never said we can't be competitive. It's not like we're getting embarassed out there (most of the time). I just dont think we can ever consistently beat the top squads.

This makes zero sense.Even the top squads themselves can not beat the other top squads consistently.

I didnt mean consistently beat as in beat them every time. I mean consistently beat as in defeat top teams on a semi-regular basis. If we play England, we maybe beat them 1/25 times (maybe, i dont really know)

so does the fact that we have beaten England 1 out of the last 4 times we have played them mean anything?If we played England in a constant home and home series with both sides at full strength I think the US would come out with ~30% of the points available after say a 10 game series.

1 out of the last 4? when did we win last (asking honestly, as i dont know) What happend in the dozen or so times prior?(again, not being a smart ###. i honestly dont know)So, its your opinion that if we played England 10 times (5 home, 5 away) we would go something like 2-4-4? (giving us 10 out of a possible 30 points)

I know the math is a little off, but is that about how you think we would do? IMO, thats being a little bit too generous.

 

[Sammy3469]

I'd be interested to see a Kevin Garnett type in goal (although GK really has never been our problem)

I don't think this would work too well. 6'5" seems to be about as big as you see keepers get before their vertical size become a detriment in the speed of diving down to low shots to the side.

very possible. i just think it would be an interesting experiment.

There are plenty of soccer playing countries where the average male is tall (Holland, Croatia, Germany). I think it says something that there aren't 6'8" goalies from those places.

 

[TLEF316]

Yeah, I'm not expecting to see Lebron James running over Lampard in the midfield. But i have to believe that a Chris Paul, Allen Iverson or Reggie Bush type athlete could have a shot to be a pretty dominant force on a soccer field (if they were given equal coaching and experience growing up) unless they just had zero touch.

Many of the athletes you are generally referring to come from our inner city. The kids in the inner city play only one sport and thats basketball.Football, soccer and baseball fields are very hard to find and ice rinks are a non starter.Football, unlike soccer, baseball, hockey and basketball, can be picked up much later in life and one can still be a phenomenal player based on nothing more than your athletic gifts.I believe this is why you see relatively few African Americans in soccer, baseball or hockey. They don't have the ability to play the sport as a child nor can they pick it up later on as a teenager and become instantly good at it.

Agreed, and thats kinda my point. We're at a major disadvantage for just these reasons. I dont want to make this into a race thing, but the facts are that most of america's best athletes (at sports that require the type of phsical gifts that world class soccer does) are black. Just like with baseball, the fact that so few african americans play soccer is a real shame and hurts the sport for future generations.

 

[andy_b]

1 out of the last 4? when did we win last (asking honestly, as i dont know) What happend in the dozen or so times prior?(again, not being a smart ###. i honestly dont know)

You seem to think we play England on a regular basis for some reason. I think we have only played them 5-6 times in the past 20 years. We last beat them in US Cup back in the early 90's. I think we have only played them 3-4 times since. I would have to look up the exact numbers.

So, its your opinion that if we played England 10 times (5 home, 5 away) we would go something like 2-4-4? (giving us 10 out of a possible 30 points) I know the math is a little off, but is that about how you think we would do? IMO, thats being a little bit too generous.

I may be too generous I agree. Hard to guess either way.

 

[andy_b]

I'd be interested to see a Kevin Garnett type in goal (although GK really has never been our problem)

I don't think this would work too well. 6'5" seems to be about as big as you see keepers get before their vertical size become a detriment in the speed of diving down to low shots to the side.

very possible. i just think it would be an interesting experiment.

There are plenty of soccer playing countries where the average male is tall (Holland, Croatia, Germany). I think it says something that there aren't 6'8" goalies from those places.

much less 7'1" As a side note, Garnett did attend Beck's first game in MLS

 

[TLEF316]

I'd be interested to see a Kevin Garnett type in goal (although GK really has never been our problem)

I don't think this would work too well. 6'5" seems to be about as big as you see keepers get before their vertical size become a detriment in the speed of diving down to low shots to the side.

very possible. i just think it would be an interesting experiment.

There are plenty of soccer playing countries where the average male is tall (Holland, Croatia, Germany). I think it says something that there aren't 6'8" goalies from those places.

yeah, thats fair. i was just kinda thinking out loud. Like i said, goaltending isnt really our problem anyway. It's a moot point.

 

[TLEF316]

1 out of the last 4? when did we win last (asking honestly, as i dont know) What happend in the dozen or so times prior?(again, not being a smart ###. i honestly dont know)

You seem to think we play England on a regular basis for some reason. I think we have only played them 5-6 times in the past 20 years. We last beat them in US Cup back in the early 90's. I think we have only played them 3-4 times since. I would have to look up the exact numbers.

So, its your opinion that if we played England 10 times (5 home, 5 away) we would go something like 2-4-4? (giving us 10 out of a possible 30 points) I know the math is a little off, but is that about how you think we would do? IMO, thats being a little bit too generous.

I may be too generous I agree. Hard to guess either way.

Nah, I'm not under the illusion that we play england all the time. Thats why i was asking, because i honestly had no idea how far we have to go back to see a decent history of how competitive we are. If we have to go back 20 years to get a 5 game history, i dont think its fair to infer anything from that data. (positive or negative)When you go that far back, you're looking at several generations of players and massive changes to the athletic landscape of both countries.

 

[andy_b]

The US and England have played each other only 9 times (less than I thought). Here are the complete results.

5/28/2008 L 0 : 2 US Men England London, England Friendly 71233

England: John Terry 38, Steven Gerrard) 59

5/28/2005 L 1 : 2 US Men England Chicago, IL, USA Friendly 47637

US : Dempsey 79; England: Richardson 4,44

9/7/1994 L 0 : 2 US Men England London, England Friendly 38629

6/9/1993 W 2 : 0 US Men England Foxboro, MA, USA World Series of Soccer 37652

US : Dooley (42), Lalas (72)

6/16/1985 L 0 : 5 US Men England Los Angeles, CA, USA Friendly 10145

5/27/1964 L 0 : 10 US Men England New York, NY, USA Friendly 5062

5/28/1959 L 1 : 8 US Men England Los Angeles, CA, USA Friendly 13000

US : E. Murphy 18

6/8/1953 L 3 : 6 US Men England New York, NY, USA Friendly 7271

US : Decker (2), Atheneos

6/29/1950 W 1 : 0 US Men England Belo Horizonte, Brazil World Cup 10151

 

[ffldrew]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight.

Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18.

I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I don't know if you have been to some youth soccer tourneys lately - but it's not that bad. My daughter plays competitive here in Colorado and I've been to State Cup and some big tourneys they run in the summer at ****'s Sporting Goods Park(home of Rapids) and I drift away to watch the boys games at various levels and there is some major talent in those levels. It's getting pretty good - enough that a former co-worker of mine who's son play on ODP was asked to come overseas to play there instead of at college level. The talent levels are good enough to match what a young football high school or basketball player in the US has in terms of athleticism. These kids are also coming from all places as far as I can tell, black, white, hispanic, poor, rich - once they are getting to the top it is so competitive and the clubs are instilling that now at younger and younger ages. And these kids are playing at this high level for their entire youth - there are more kids playing soccer than football for sure and probably basketball but I'm not sure on that. There are so many soccer complexes of 10-20+ fields going up in this state it is amazing, world class complexes(they better with the number of kids parents paying 1,500+ a year for soccer) - so give it just a bit longer, but it won't be that long, the feeder programs are just fine.

 

[Mjolnirs]

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight. Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18. I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I understand what you are trying to say, but I think you are underestimating the amount of kids that are now being brought up almost exclusively on soccer.I have a co-worker whose son only plays soccer and has so since around 7 years old. The level of talent in youth club and travel teams is amazing. But, the problem with these teams is the cost. The really talented kid that isn't from a family that can afford to spend large $$$ for the paid coaches, travel and other costs doesn't get the soccer training and ends up playing whatever rec sports are available.While many soccer haters refer to the sport as a “third world” sport, others see it as elitist because of the demographics of the kids being indoctruinated in soccer. Conversely I know many soccer people that look down on football and basketball as “working class” sports.I think the US is making great headway in the world and fans around the world don’t want to talk about our potential. Remember it was just 2002 that we made the quarterfinals of the World Cup, and lost out there to Germany by a score of only 1-0.

 

[andy_b]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight.

Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18.

I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I don't know if you have been to some youth soccer tourneys lately - but it's not that bad. My daughter plays competitive here in Colorado and I've been to State Cup and some big tourneys they run in the summer at ****'s Sporting Goods Park(home of Rapids) and I drift away to watch the boys games at various levels and there is some major talent in those levels. It's getting pretty good - enough that a former co-worker of mine who's son play on ODP was asked to come overseas to play there instead of at college level. The talent levels are good enough to match what a young football high school or basketball player in the US has in terms of athleticism. These kids are also coming from all places as far as I can tell, black, white, hispanic, poor, rich - once they are getting to the top it is so competitive and the clubs are instilling that now at younger and younger ages. And these kids are playing at this high level for their entire youth - there are more kids playing soccer than football for sure and probably basketball but I'm not sure on that. There are so many soccer complexes of 10-20+ fields going up in this state it is amazing, world class complexes(they better with the number of kids parents paying 1,500+ a year for soccer) - so give it just a bit longer, but it won't be that long, the feeder programs are just fine.

The bolded statement is what makes Brad Friedel's academy in Columbus so important. The kids get there on soccer merit alone, not because their parents can afford it.

 

[andy_b]

I have to say for a Fantasy Football site, the thread is loaded with knowledgeable soccer folks.

Well done!

 

[ffldrew]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight.

Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18.

I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I don't know if you have been to some youth soccer tourneys lately - but it's not that bad. My daughter plays competitive here in Colorado and I've been to State Cup and some big tourneys they run in the summer at ****'s Sporting Goods Park(home of Rapids) and I drift away to watch the boys games at various levels and there is some major talent in those levels. It's getting pretty good - enough that a former co-worker of mine who's son play on ODP was asked to come overseas to play there instead of at college level. The talent levels are good enough to match what a young football high school or basketball player in the US has in terms of athleticism. These kids are also coming from all places as far as I can tell, black, white, hispanic, poor, rich - once they are getting to the top it is so competitive and the clubs are instilling that now at younger and younger ages. And these kids are playing at this high level for their entire youth - there are more kids playing soccer than football for sure and probably basketball but I'm not sure on that. There are so many soccer complexes of 10-20+ fields going up in this state it is amazing, world class complexes(they better with the number of kids parents paying 1,500+ a year for soccer) - so give it just a bit longer, but it won't be that long, the feeder programs are just fine.

The bolded statement is what makes Brad Friedel's academy in Columbus so important. The kids get there on soccer merit alone, not because their parents can afford it.

The reason it is that high is that some of that money goes to the club for subsidizing the talented kids that can't afford it - if you show promise at an early age there are plenty of clubs that will take you in, even for free.

 

[andy_b]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight.

Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18.

I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I don't know if you have been to some youth soccer tourneys lately - but it's not that bad. My daughter plays competitive here in Colorado and I've been to State Cup and some big tourneys they run in the summer at ****'s Sporting Goods Park(home of Rapids) and I drift away to watch the boys games at various levels and there is some major talent in those levels. It's getting pretty good - enough that a former co-worker of mine who's son play on ODP was asked to come overseas to play there instead of at college level. The talent levels are good enough to match what a young football high school or basketball player in the US has in terms of athleticism. These kids are also coming from all places as far as I can tell, black, white, hispanic, poor, rich - once they are getting to the top it is so competitive and the clubs are instilling that now at younger and younger ages. And these kids are playing at this high level for their entire youth - there are more kids playing soccer than football for sure and probably basketball but I'm not sure on that. There are so many soccer complexes of 10-20+ fields going up in this state it is amazing, world class complexes(they better with the number of kids parents paying 1,500+ a year for soccer) - so give it just a bit longer, but it won't be that long, the feeder programs are just fine.

The bolded statement is what makes Brad Friedel's academy in Columbus so important. The kids get there on soccer merit alone, not because their parents can afford it.

The reason it is that high is that some of that money goes to the club for subsidizing the talented kids that can't afford it - if you show promise at an early age there are plenty of clubs that will take you in, even for free.

This is excellent to hear. I am not in touch with the club system outside of a niece and nephew who play in it.Are the clubs doing a good job at finding the talent? I can't help but wonder with the millions of hispanic kids running around playing that many of them are being missed.

MLS starting up its own youth programs is going to be critical. They should be able to cheery pick the best of the best out of the clubs and get the kids in a pro environment as soon as they can. I fear all too often parents are looking at club soccer as a way to gain a college scholarship. MLS can help overcome that.

The growing club system and pro youth structure won't show benefits for probably another decade or so but I am confident we will be better off for it as a soccer playing nation.

 

[Sebowski]

Andy Gray joins ESPN for Euro broadcasts.

Effing awesome.

Is he the GOL TV guy with all the crazo analogies? He's (unintentionally?) hilarious.

That's Ray Hudson, who is insane. But that insanity can make for some very fun commentary from time to time. He had some crazy quotes when he was the coach for DC.Andy Gray is a Scottish commentator, generally considered one of the best. He usually is on Sky Sports, so if you've ever checked out a EPL match at a pub or streamed one online, you've heard him. I think he's also done commentary work for the EA FIFA video game series.

Thanks. I know I've heard of him.I watch my EPL on Fox Sports Soccer. I don't get Sky.

I play my FIFA with the Spanish commentators

GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Steve Tasker]

Andy Gray is a Scottish commentator, generally considered one of the best. He usually is on Sky Sports, so if you've ever checked out a EPL match at a pub or streamed one online, you've heard him. I think he's also done commentary work for the EA FIFA video game series.

Andy Gray wrote perhaps the best history book on formations. It sounds dry but it was a fascinating look at how formations have evolved and how each one is played and what affects it has on the game.It is called Flat Back Four.

Adrian Healy, Derek Rae, Tommy Smyth and Gray should be solid. If they team Healy and Gray together it should be perfect.

I prefer the American Rae to the Scottish Rae but thats just my opinion. If you have ever met him, he can turn on and off the Scottish accent at will. Its an impressive talent.

Both Healy and Rae did Revolution games in the past before moving on to ESPN.

We used to play then when I played premier....best defensive formation I've ever played....that's why most teams do.Gray knows his stuff. He should be good.

 

[B Maverick]

There are some organizations looking to help improve the soccer programs and provide access to club teams abroad for those talented individuals.

Check out these sites:

Top Drawer Soccer

USFC

 

[ffldrew]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight.

Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18.

I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I don't know if you have been to some youth soccer tourneys lately - but it's not that bad. My daughter plays competitive here in Colorado and I've been to State Cup and some big tourneys they run in the summer at ****'s Sporting Goods Park(home of Rapids) and I drift away to watch the boys games at various levels and there is some major talent in those levels. It's getting pretty good - enough that a former co-worker of mine who's son play on ODP was asked to come overseas to play there instead of at college level. The talent levels are good enough to match what a young football high school or basketball player in the US has in terms of athleticism. These kids are also coming from all places as far as I can tell, black, white, hispanic, poor, rich - once they are getting to the top it is so competitive and the clubs are instilling that now at younger and younger ages. And these kids are playing at this high level for their entire youth - there are more kids playing soccer than football for sure and probably basketball but I'm not sure on that. There are so many soccer complexes of 10-20+ fields going up in this state it is amazing, world class complexes(they better with the number of kids parents paying 1,500+ a year for soccer) - so give it just a bit longer, but it won't be that long, the feeder programs are just fine.

The bolded statement is what makes Brad Friedel's academy in Columbus so important. The kids get there on soccer merit alone, not because their parents can afford it.

The reason it is that high is that some of that money goes to the club for subsidizing the talented kids that can't afford it - if you show promise at an early age there are plenty of clubs that will take you in, even for free.

This is excellent to hear. I am not in touch with the club system outside of a niece and nephew who play in it.Are the clubs doing a good job at finding the talent? I can't help but wonder with the millions of hispanic kids running around playing that many of them are being missed.

MLS starting up its own youth programs is going to be critical. They should be able to cheery pick the best of the best out of the clubs and get the kids in a pro environment as soon as they can. I fear all too often parents are looking at club soccer as a way to gain a college scholarship. MLS can help overcome that.

The growing club system and pro youth structure won't show benefits for probably another decade or so but I am confident we will be better off for it as a soccer playing nation.

Try stealing talent - it is ruthless at some clubs. There are some pretty good wars here in Colorado, I'm sure California is easily as bad.MLS Rapids are staying out of it for this very reason and for the most part run camps and tourneys- you don't want to piss off a club that has 10,000 + potential fans by stealing and cherry picking their talent.

Club soccer is the #1 way(and maybe only way) to gain a college scholarship - I am not aware of any other way to do it. I see no reason to get kids "out of the clubs" - it is a big, big business. A club here in Colorado touts they just hired April Heinrichs as their girls director.

 

[TLEF316]

Its good to hear the positive accounts of youth soccer from the various places. As someone who stopped playing soccer around age 9 or so, i never really got into the club scene (i wasnt very good and only played in the local rec league)

I have no doubt that we have some good kids coming up the pipeline. There are just too many kids playing for it not to happen. I just wonder how goods those kids actually are. Are they good enough to get a scholarship to an elite D1 program? (obviously some are) Are they good enough to go right into MLS? (probably) But are they good enough to be impact players in Europe at a young age? (Like a Rooney or C. Ronaldo were) I'm not so sure, and frankly, i'd be surprised.

These are the type of players we'll need to hang with the powers that be. Now, obviously, we can be competitive without guys at that level. But having 1 or 2 elite type players that other squads had to game plan for would do wonders for our attack. Right now, we dont have those guys, which is why we have to rely so heavily on counters and set pieces to score.

The point about hispanic players is interesting. The hispanic population is huge and will obviously continue to grow. I have to believe that there will be some talented kids. Just have to identify them early and get them into an advanced program with a goal of getting them to the international stage (not just college or MLS)

 

[andy_b]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight.

Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18.

I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I don't know if you have been to some youth soccer tourneys lately - but it's not that bad. My daughter plays competitive here in Colorado and I've been to State Cup and some big tourneys they run in the summer at ****'s Sporting Goods Park(home of Rapids) and I drift away to watch the boys games at various levels and there is some major talent in those levels. It's getting pretty good - enough that a former co-worker of mine who's son play on ODP was asked to come overseas to play there instead of at college level. The talent levels are good enough to match what a young football high school or basketball player in the US has in terms of athleticism. These kids are also coming from all places as far as I can tell, black, white, hispanic, poor, rich - once they are getting to the top it is so competitive and the clubs are instilling that now at younger and younger ages. And these kids are playing at this high level for their entire youth - there are more kids playing soccer than football for sure and probably basketball but I'm not sure on that. There are so many soccer complexes of 10-20+ fields going up in this state it is amazing, world class complexes(they better with the number of kids parents paying 1,500+ a year for soccer) - so give it just a bit longer, but it won't be that long, the feeder programs are just fine.

The bolded statement is what makes Brad Friedel's academy in Columbus so important. The kids get there on soccer merit alone, not because their parents can afford it.

The reason it is that high is that some of that money goes to the club for subsidizing the talented kids that can't afford it - if you show promise at an early age there are plenty of clubs that will take you in, even for free.

This is excellent to hear. I am not in touch with the club system outside of a niece and nephew who play in it.Are the clubs doing a good job at finding the talent? I can't help but wonder with the millions of hispanic kids running around playing that many of them are being missed.

MLS starting up its own youth programs is going to be critical. They should be able to cheery pick the best of the best out of the clubs and get the kids in a pro environment as soon as they can. I fear all too often parents are looking at club soccer as a way to gain a college scholarship. MLS can help overcome that.

The growing club system and pro youth structure won't show benefits for probably another decade or so but I am confident we will be better off for it as a soccer playing nation.

Try stealing talent - it is ruthless at some clubs. There are some pretty good wars here in Colorado, I'm sure California is easily as bad.MLS Rapids are staying out of it for this very reason and for the most part run camps and tourneys- you don't want to piss off a club that has 10,000 + potential fans by stealing and cherry picking their talent.

Club soccer is the #1 way(and maybe only way) to gain a college scholarship - I am not aware of any other way to do it. I see no reason to get kids "out of the clubs" - it is a big, big business. A club here in Colorado touts they just hired April Heinrichs as their girls director.

From a professional pyramid stand point the best players should be cherry picked and put into a professional environment as early as possible if this kid has pro desires. This is the only way to help us close the gap with other countries.The MLS sides will have no problems getting kids to move to their teams once the setup is mature. They will be able to offer parents a free ride and in some cases will be able to actually have small payments to kids (like they do overseas), which parents will jump at instead of having to pay $1500.

MLS will not be risking anything. I don't see how giving a kid a chance at a pro environment is going to turn anyone off. Its not logical. In fact you will see clubs going out of their way to promote the fact that kids have graduated from their teams to the pro side much the way a college coach can sell his program to high school kids by showing how his kids have progressed to the pro level.

The numbers the MLS teams will be taking are microscopic in comparison to the nationwide network of players and would not even make a ripple in the $'s flowing into the clubs. In fact it would serve to open more opportunities at the club level. Once it is ingrained (in 10-15 years) what the path is to the pros, the club system will be even bigger than it is today IMO.

 

[andy_b]

I have no doubt that we have some good kids coming up the pipeline. There are just too many kids playing for it not to happen. I just wonder how goods those kids actually are. Are they good enough to get a scholarship to an elite D1 program? (obviously some are) Are they good enough to go right into MLS? (probably) But are they good enough to be impact players in Europe at a young age? (Like a Rooney or C. Ronaldo were) I'm not so sure, and frankly, i'd be surprised.

While not at that level of Ronaldo (which is like saying that K States Beasely is not at the level of Jordon), Micheal Bradley was the #1 rated midfielder in the Dutch first division this year, scoring 20 goals in all competitions and he is only 20 years old. Granted he cut his teeth in MLS first but many players cut their teeth in their home leagues before moving on. Even a wonder kid like C Ro played at Sporting before moving on to Man United.

 

[ffldrew]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

Why not?One side is picking the absolute cream of their athletic crop. They put them in what amount to soccer school from when they are like 5 years old. The other side loses all its best athletes to at least 3 other sports (hoops, football, baseball) and doesn't have anywhere near the type of feeder programs. It's just not a fair fight.

Bottom line: If you are a 6 year old kid in England who is gonna grow up to be 6'2, run a 4.5 40 yard dash and be blessed with the quickness, instincts and vision of a world class athlete, you play soccer exclusivly for you entire life. In the US, you likely play basketball and football before finally settling on one when you are 18.

I dont want to be negative, but i just dont see an opening. I'm really starting to get into soccer (hopefully taking in a game at Old Trafford next year) but its just really hard to be all that excited about the future of US soccer on the international stage. The deck is so stacked against us.

I don't know if you have been to some youth soccer tourneys lately - but it's not that bad. My daughter plays competitive here in Colorado and I've been to State Cup and some big tourneys they run in the summer at ****'s Sporting Goods Park(home of Rapids) and I drift away to watch the boys games at various levels and there is some major talent in those levels. It's getting pretty good - enough that a former co-worker of mine who's son play on ODP was asked to come overseas to play there instead of at college level. The talent levels are good enough to match what a young football high school or basketball player in the US has in terms of athleticism. These kids are also coming from all places as far as I can tell, black, white, hispanic, poor, rich - once they are getting to the top it is so competitive and the clubs are instilling that now at younger and younger ages. And these kids are playing at this high level for their entire youth - there are more kids playing soccer than football for sure and probably basketball but I'm not sure on that. There are so many soccer complexes of 10-20+ fields going up in this state it is amazing, world class complexes(they better with the number of kids parents paying 1,500+ a year for soccer) - so give it just a bit longer, but it won't be that long, the feeder programs are just fine.

The bolded statement is what makes Brad Friedel's academy in Columbus so important. The kids get there on soccer merit alone, not because their parents can afford it.

The reason it is that high is that some of that money goes to the club for subsidizing the talented kids that can't afford it - if you show promise at an early age there are plenty of clubs that will take you in, even for free.

This is excellent to hear. I am not in touch with the club system outside of a niece and nephew who play in it.Are the clubs doing a good job at finding the talent? I can't help but wonder with the millions of hispanic kids running around playing that many of them are being missed.

MLS starting up its own youth programs is going to be critical. They should be able to cheery pick the best of the best out of the clubs and get the kids in a pro environment as soon as they can. I fear all too often parents are looking at club soccer as a way to gain a college scholarship. MLS can help overcome that.

The growing club system and pro youth structure won't show benefits for probably another decade or so but I am confident we will be better off for it as a soccer playing nation.

Try stealing talent - it is ruthless at some clubs. There are some pretty good wars here in Colorado, I'm sure California is easily as bad.MLS Rapids are staying out of it for this very reason and for the most part run camps and tourneys- you don't want to piss off a club that has 10,000 + potential fans by stealing and cherry picking their talent.

Club soccer is the #1 way(and maybe only way) to gain a college scholarship - I am not aware of any other way to do it. I see no reason to get kids "out of the clubs" - it is a big, big business. A club here in Colorado touts they just hired April Heinrichs as their girls director.

From a professional pyramid stand point the best players should be cherry picked and put into a professional environment as early as possible if this kid has pro desires. This is the only way to help us close the gap with other countries.The MLS sides will have no problems getting kids to move to their teams once the setup is mature. They will be able to offer parents a free ride and in some cases will be able to actually have small payments to kids (like they do overseas), which parents will jump at instead of having to pay $1500.

MLS will not be risking anything. I don't see how giving a kid a chance at a pro environment is going to turn anyone off. Its not logical. In fact you will see clubs going out of their way to promote the fact that kids have graduated from their teams to the pro side much the way a college coach can sell his program to high school kids by showing how his kids have progressed to the pro level.

The numbers the MLS teams will be taking are microscopic in comparison to the nationwide network of players and would not even make a ripple in the $'s flowing into the clubs. In fact it would serve to open more opportunities at the club level. Once it is ingrained (in 10-15 years) what the path is to the pros, the club system will be even bigger than it is today IMO.

Hey AndyI know you don't have kids - so it is hard to see without being in the mix. When you have a child and they get involved at the competitive level you will understand.

#1) Club soccer is at a very, very very professional level in the US today, some club coaches and directors are making at or near 6 figure salaries- it doesn't need the MLS, the MLS needs the clubs. I've seen Club coaches that I would rather have as a coach than say Clauvio from the Rapids. Here is a job opening for a 40-50K job just to run U15-18.

#2) The point that "you will see clubs going out of their way to promote" - it happens now with the current clubs.

#3) High School soccer has 0% to do with college level - High school soccer is the off season for these kids.

#4) Many parents are beginning to be faced with sending their kids to Europe - today!

#5) I've seen many kids with potential burn out or fade as they get older - I've seen older kids all of a sudden fit back into their body after growth spurts and excel. Getting kids early isn't that big of a deal.

#6) Kids of today want to grow up and play for Man U, Chelsea, Milan, Real Madrid - not for the MLS. They know it is minor league. They know.

#7) There are multiple clubs in England and academies that feed their system - we do to. The more - the better, it sets up a higher competitive level among clubs, coaches and players.

Read this and look at their home page - read the announcements. It is big - real big and real professional.

 

[Christo]

This friendly was only meaningless for England.

The friendly held more meaning for England than for the US IMO.If this was a real game, both Donovan and Altidore would have been present and both would have replaced Wolff and Johnson who IMO struggled yesterday.

No way England puts out there best squad if the game was meaningless to them IMO. They would have experimented much more especially considering they have no real games coming up.

Totally agree. I also think people are discounting not having Donovan in there. England without their top player would be a totally different team too. This was a totally meaningless friendly for all but a few guys looking for contracts and it showed.

 

[Christo]

England's manager can basically pick an 11, roll out the ball, go get a sandwich and still beat the US. Unless the Chris Paul and Ladanian Tomlinson type US athletes start playing soccer, i dont see it happening.

Oh, I don't agree with this at all.

I do.

 

[andy_b]

I know you don't have kids - so it is hard to see without being in the mix. When you have a child and they get involved at the competitive level you will understand.

I do have a child, she does not play soccer though (a dancer).My niece and nephew belong to the top club team in our state and I see roughly 10 of there games every year so I am very familiar with the level of play and organization.

#1) Club soccer is at a very, very very professional level in the US today, some club coaches and directors are making at or near 6 figure salaries- it doesn't need the MLS, the MLS needs the clubs. I've seen Club coaches that I would rather have as a coach than say Clauvio from the Rapids. Here is a job opening for a 40-50K job just to run U15-18.

Respectfully, you do not understand what a professional environment is then for the kids.There is almost no comparison between the best club teams in the US and a professional "full time" soccer environment like say what the kids in the Ajax system go through.

Having 2 practices a week and a game followed by tournaments is not in any way shape or form a professional soccer environment as they have in Europe for the elite kids.

The only thing we have close to it in the US is Breadenton and that is arguably 10-20 times too small, which is why that level will be transfered to the hopefully soon 18 team MLS.

99.999999999% of the players in our club system today will not be pros. The best of those players are not being allowed to achieve their maximum levels by not being placed with the other elite players.

I am not in any way advocating the removal of the club system. It serves a fantastic purpose in the base of the pyramid and frankly is something that has been great lacking for a long time in this country.

What I am advocating is creating the next level of the pyramid between the club teams and the MLS sides. That can be accomplished by removing the best of the best (say the top 300 players in the country at a certain age group) and if they have pro aspirations, offering them the chance for a full time pro environment where they need to be mature and work a specific school schedule around a full time soccer program.

Much of what I write will take 15-20 years to fully take hold. MLS is just laying the embryonic patterns today into their rules (such as a club being able to hold on to any player they have in their system and not have him be placed in a draft), that will help facilitate this process growth in the coming decades.

Having the club system become stronger while this tectonic like change occurs at the highest level is going to be needed to keep our level of play steady.

 

[Steve Tasker]

Page 3? Damn

 

[andy_b]

Page 3? Damn

??

 

[andy_b]

Here is the preliminary roster for the US Spain game. It is unknown whether Landon will join the team. He has rejoined the Galaxy for the Toronto game this weekend.

U.S. Roster

GOALKEEPERS (3): Dominic Cervi (out of contract), Brad Guzan (Chivas USA), Tim Howard (Everton FC)

DEFENDERS (9): Carlos Bocanegra (out of contract), Dan Califf (FC Midtjylland), Steve Cherundolo (Hannover 96), Jay DeMerit (Watford FC), Frankie Hejduk (Columbus Crew), Oguchi Onyewu (Standard de Liege), Michael Orozco (San Luis), Heath Pearce (Hansa Rostock), Jonathan Spector (West Ham United)

MIDFIELDERS (7): Freddy Adu (SL Benfica), DaMarcus Beasley (Glasgow Rangers), Michael Bradley (SC Heerenveen), Ricardo Clark (Houston Dynamo), Maurice Edu (Toronto FC), Eddie Lewis (Derby County), Pablo Mastroeni (Colorado Rapids)

FORWARDS (5): Clint Dempsey (Fulham FC), Landon Donovan (Los Angeles Galaxy), Nate Jaqua (out of contract), Eddie Johnson (Fulham FC), Josh Wolff (out of contract)

 

[Steve Tasker]

Page 3? Damn

??

It was on Page 3 when I bumped it last night.

 

[eagles2007]

Anyone have a link for the TV schedule for Euro 2008? I noticed Friday's game isn't on, Saturday's are on ESPN CLASSIC and Sunday's are on ESPN2. But beyond that, I wonder how many games I won't be able to see since I don't have ESPN CLASSIC.

 

[andy_b]

Looks like only 4 games are on ESPN Classic. And 2 of them are due to simultaneous game start times which always happens on the last game of the opening rounds so that no teams have an advantage of knowing what they need to do.

=====================================================

Round Robin Phase:

Saturday 6/07

11:50 a.m.- Switzerland vs. Czech Republic A (ESPN Classic, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Portugal vs. Turkey A (ESPN Classic, ESPN Deportes)

Sunday 6/08

11:50 a.m.- Austria vs. Croatia B (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Germany vs. Poland B (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Monday 6/09

11:50 a.m.- Romania vs. France C (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Netherlands vs. Italy C (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Tuesday 6/10

11:50 a.m.- Spain vs. Russia D (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Greece vs. Sweden D (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Wednesday 6/11

11:50 a.m.- Czech Republic vs. Portugal A (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Switzerland vs. Turkey A (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Thursday 6/12

11:50 a.m.- Croatia vs. Germany B (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Austria vs. Poland B (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Friday 6/13

11:50 a.m.- Italy vs. Romania C (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Netherlands vs. France C (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Saturday 6/14

11:50 a.m.- Sweden vs. Spain D (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Greece vs. Russia D (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Sunday 6/15

2:30 p.m.- Switzerland vs. Portugal A (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Turkey vs. Czech Republic A (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

5 p.m.- Turkey vs. Czech Republic (ESPN Deportes)

Monday 6/16

2:30 p.m.- Poland vs. Croatia B (ESPN Classic)

2:30 p.m.- Austria vs. Germany B (ESPN, ESPN Deportes)

5 p.m.- Poland vs. Croatia (ESPN Deportes)

Tuesday 6/17

2:30 p.m.- Netherlands vs. Romania C (ESPN Classic)

2:30 p.m.- France vs. Italy C (ESPN, ESPN Deportes)

5 p.m.- Netherlands vs. Romania (ESPN Deportes)

Wednesday 6/18

2:30 p.m.- Greece vs. Spain D (ESPN, ESPN Deportes)

2:30 p.m.- Russia vs. Sweden D (ESPN2)

7 p.m.- Russia vs. Sweden (ESPN Deportes)

Quarterfinals Stage:

Thursday 6/19 2:30 p.m.- 1st Group A vs. 2nd Group B (ESPN, ESPN Deportes)

Friday 6/20 2:30 p.m.- 1st Group B vs. 2nd Group A (ESPN, ESPN Deportes)

Saturday 6/21 2:30 p.m.- 1st Group C vs. 2nd Group D (ABC)

Sunday 6/22 2:55 p.m.- 1st Group D vs. 2nd Group C (ESPN, ESPN Deportes)

Semifinals Stage:

Wednesday 6/25 2:30 p.m.- Winners (ESPN, ESPN Deportes)

Thursday 6/26 2:30 p.m.- Winners (ESPN2, ESPN Deportes)

Finals:

Sunday 6/29 2:30 p.m. - Euro 2008 Title Match from Vienna (ABC)

 

[eagles2007]

thanks

 

[Steve Tasker]

TFC on at 3:30 on CBC today.

CBC has this really cool feature called Soccer Day in Canada (similar to Hockey Night in Canada, for you hockey fans). For the past few hours, they've been showing 12 and 14-year old youth teams playing in big cities around the country. The quality of play isn't great, but they have 12 year commentators and everything.....it's pretty cool. I would have loved to do this when I was a kid.

 

[Desert_Power]

Looks like I might be seeing the US and Spain play on Wed. Sure glad I brought my US jersey to Spain.

 

[Steve Tasker]

Looks like I might be seeing the US and Spain play on Wed. Sure glad I brought my US jersey to Spain.

That's awesome. Don't get killed.

 

[Steve Tasker]

Julius James with a great header goal in his MLS debut for TFC. 1-0

 

[Steve Tasker]

Julius James with a great header goal in his MLS debut for TFC. 1-0

2-0 win, very very convincing. I'm not sure if it was because LA is so bad or TFC is good. I'm thinking more of the former. In either case, it's very nice to see TFC continue to win.3-0-3 at home this season.

 

[eagles2007]

saw a good bit of germany-belarus last night ... germany not looking great for euro 2008. blew a 2-0 lead.