NewlyRetired
Footballguy
It must be awful following a team with a passionate fan base, an owner willing to spend, a gorgeous stadium, being relevant in your community.....rustycolts said:
count your blessings, you have no idea what brutal is
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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (5 Viewers)
- Thread starter Ramsay Hunt Experience
- Start date
The Z Machine
Footballguy
Neither of those guys are signed though, right? Also, IMO both a pretty big step down from Neymar. The biggest issue for Barça right now is midfield and center back / right back performance. With the decline of Iniesta the precision passing game is waning there. Losing Neymar would result in a less dynamic team, which is exactly the reason they won some of their games last season.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
rustycolts
Footballguy
Posted that after a bunch of beers.Feel a little better today still bummed though.I haven't lived and died with a team in a long time.If you had of told me 5 years ago that I would get so worked up over soccer I would have told you that you were crazy.Really enjoying the game.We fell below the red line tonight with the Crews win.Guess I am just going to have to be patient team will get better with time.Problem is I am 60 I don't even buy green bananas anymore.It must be awful following a team with a passionate fan base, an owner willing to spend, a gorgeous stadium, being relevant in your community.....
count your blessings, you have no idea what brutal is
Sebowski
Footballguy
The Z Machine
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
goodness this is an amazing topic.
SBJ (Sports Business Journal) has just written a fascinating nugget on MLS.
MP & Silva is an international media rights company based in London, with 13 offices around the globe. They own a TON of sports properties including the WC. They are one of the biggest companies in the world in their field if not the biggest.
MP and Silva offered MLS a $4 billion dollar, 10 year deal for its Global Media rights which would be an ENORMOUS increase from what they have now. This would be a complete game changer for the league in terms of being able to buy players.
But MLS supposedly rebuffed this offer according to the article because MP and Silva asked for the one thing MLS owners can never agree to. They wanted promotion and relegation to be in place by the time the deal started (6 years from now).
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I need to digest this more. At this level of money, it had to have made MLS think at least a little of usurping the USL and creating MLS2 with some form of limited promotion and relegation.
SBJ (Sports Business Journal) has just written a fascinating nugget on MLS.
MP & Silva is an international media rights company based in London, with 13 offices around the globe. They own a TON of sports properties including the WC. They are one of the biggest companies in the world in their field if not the biggest.
MP and Silva offered MLS a $4 billion dollar, 10 year deal for its Global Media rights which would be an ENORMOUS increase from what they have now. This would be a complete game changer for the league in terms of being able to buy players.
But MLS supposedly rebuffed this offer according to the article because MP and Silva asked for the one thing MLS owners can never agree to. They wanted promotion and relegation to be in place by the time the deal started (6 years from now).
===============
I need to digest this more. At this level of money, it had to have made MLS think at least a little of usurping the USL and creating MLS2 with some form of limited promotion and relegation.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
one more piece has come out. MLS seems to be afraid to surrender all domestic rights for a decade. Once the rights are sold, MLS no longer has any say on their domestic broadcast partners.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
yeah, $400 million a year quadruples the current media rights.
I am sure this might lower expansion fee values but it seems like in the long run it would make up for it. I am still trying to digest all the twitter talking points. Lots of good points both ways.
One concern I have is that there is always a worry that the media rights bubble will burst and by rejecting this now, MLS may find a significantly smaller amount available when they try and sell the rights a few years from now.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
At least this now tells us what Riccardo Silva was doing at MLS headquarters recently since that sighting was causing lots of speculation.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
It is interesting that the media people who work for ESPN and Fox are saying MLS is right to turn this down.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Official response from MLS
===============
Jeff Carlisle from ESPN has the following statement from Dan Courtemanche, MLS executive vice president of communications.
“As was stated to Mr. Silva both in person and in a subsequent letter, Major League Soccer is prohibited contractually from engaging in discussions about our media rights with other distributors. We are not in a position, nor are we interested, in engaging with Mr. Silva on his proposal.”
“It is also important to note that since its inception, MLS, like the other North American leagues, has dealt directly with its domestic broadcast partners, rather than through agents and brokers. This ensures that the league and its partners can structure an agreement that addresses all elements, such as scheduling, marketing and digital distribution, that are required for a successful partnership.”
===============
Jeff Carlisle from ESPN has the following statement from Dan Courtemanche, MLS executive vice president of communications.
“As was stated to Mr. Silva both in person and in a subsequent letter, Major League Soccer is prohibited contractually from engaging in discussions about our media rights with other distributors. We are not in a position, nor are we interested, in engaging with Mr. Silva on his proposal.”
“It is also important to note that since its inception, MLS, like the other North American leagues, has dealt directly with its domestic broadcast partners, rather than through agents and brokers. This ensures that the league and its partners can structure an agreement that addresses all elements, such as scheduling, marketing and digital distribution, that are required for a successful partnership.”
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
The Galaxy really need this signing. They are brutally bad. Even my horrendous Revs dropped 4 on them this weekend.
===========================
Taylor TwellmanVerified account @TaylorTwellman
.@LAGalaxy currently negotiating with @jona2santos to be their 3rd DP and arguably the best midfielder in @MLS. #MLS
===========================
Taylor TwellmanVerified account @TaylorTwellman
.@LAGalaxy currently negotiating with @jona2santos to be their 3rd DP and arguably the best midfielder in @MLS. #MLS
El Floppo
Footballguy
whoa... he was the best player in Russia for Mex, IMO. while his brother has plateaued.. he's taken it a step higher IMO. would be huge for LA. have they ever played together for club? I can't remember.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
yes, they crossed paths at Villareal I think in the 2014-2015 time frame.
This would be a Giovinco level signing IMO getting a player in his dead prime of 27.
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El Floppo
Footballguy
I don't have a sense that JDS ever hit the heights in spain that Giovinco did in Italy, but definitely a big signing of a high quality young player. Plus the marketing of another mexican starlet in the US would be pretty big. and whatever reality tv show they make about the brothers.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Giovinco was a good player in Italy but he was never a star at the highest level. He was mostly a bench player for Juventus at the end. I think he only had 24 league appearances in the last two seasons combined for Juve. His best season was on loan to Parma many years ago if memory serves.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
Hopefully this time they are able to negotiate a media rights deal that doesn't have exclusive negotiation rights. Maybe that's more common than I realize, but it seems like something that would severely depress value of the next agreement. From the ESPN summary:
Definitely agree with the notion that its asking alot for a league to give up all its media rights for 10 years in return for cash. Especially true where that company has an ownership interest in one of the franchises.
El Floppo
Footballguy
yeah- I knew he had tapered off... but there was a stretch when he was in the national side and scoring goals in serie A. that's the height I was talking about. JDS... don't know his resume well enough in spain- just had a sense he hadn't hit that level.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
hard to compare I guess with a defensive midfielder vs a striker.
JDS was basically an unused player at Barca (no shocker there considering the talent) and a key member of Villareal.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This is one of those "if I had a crystal ball" times that would be interesting.
Are you sure Silva is involved in MLS? For some reason I thought he was part of the Miami FC ownership group.
CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
Its Miami FC, yes. They are in one of the lower tiers, but I assume under USSoccer?
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
yes they are under US Soccer. I mistakenly thought you were talking about a franchise in MLS.
I did not see the details of the deal but it is probably logical to think the rights are for both MLS and US Soccer combined as they have always been. But in saying that, there is a ton of cross over between US Soccer and MLS via SUM but there is almost no cross over between US Soccer and the NASL.
roadkill1292
Footballguy
Altoona boner.
Ramsay Hunt Experience
Footballguy
Jonathan started out as a more attacking midfielder too. Always liked his willingness to try other positions to get into the team, eventually DM is what stuck. Gave me the impression he was mature/grounded than his older brother. That is my guess to why he is the one who keeps getting better.
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El Floppo
Footballguy
He can really play anywhere in the midfield, and even at RB. Yellow Submarine mixes up formations a lot. My impression is he has been playing in one of the two deep midfielder roles more frequently, but have seen him as the RM in a 4-4-2 as well.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
I have not seen him play a lot at club level but his goal scoring record indicates he plays a deeper role.
0 goals for Mexico, 6 goals for Barca B (81 games), 0 goals for Barca (28 games), 7 goals for Villareal (121)
all told 13 goals in 255 matches.
El Floppo
Footballguy
feel like when I see him for mexico, he's playing just below the forwards- but really all over the field.
I don't really watch spanish soccer, so there ya go. was going off el-tri and not really hearing much about him the times I read up on la liga.
Yeah.
All I was really trying to say is that I think he does better in the deeper roles and I've always liked his versatility
His brother is more of a winger/forward
El Floppo
Footballguy
fwiw- wasn't trying to be contrarian... I genuinely don't know much about him other than what I see for el tri and what I don't read in the news (much of anything about him). but the latter certainly makes sense if he's playing the less glamorous holding/defensive mf role.
Since I'm here, this Neymar saga is pretty dumb. I would be surprised if he leaves (or if PSG can even pay that much).
His inconsistency in scoring has been frustrating, but few players can hit the highs he does. He has gotten much better at tracking back recently.
Would be sad to see him go, but also very interesting to see what Barcelona could do with that cash.
His inconsistency in scoring has been frustrating, but few players can hit the highs he does. He has gotten much better at tracking back recently.
Would be sad to see him go, but also very interesting to see what Barcelona could do with that cash.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
in any case, I think if he signs, he instantly becomes one of the best technical players in MLS which means he can likely be used any where they want. Between him, Gio and Allesandrini, they can probably make Zardes useful again.
fwiw- wasn't trying to be contrarian... I genuinely don't know much about him other than what I see for el tri and what I don't read in the news (much of anything about him). but the latter certainly makes sense if he's playing the less glamorous holding/defensive mf role.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
so true. But that being said, Keane and Landon did figure out how to make him useful when they were there.
El Floppo
Footballguy
roadkill1292
Footballguy
roadkill1292
Footballguy
Andy, what reasons are they giving?
Don't worry about me getting on my soapbox, everyone. I'll just leave it at the Altoona joke.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
1) MLS can not legally engage in these talks until 2021. Silva asked for the meeting but did not say he was going to make this type of presentation.
2) The single most valuable part of MLS (and the reason MLS exists today) is SUM. What Silva was offering would be in direct contrast to the in house SUM model
3) If MLS sold rights to Silva they lose all control domestically of where the games will be broadcast. For anyone who is a US Soccer fan and hates trying to find out how to watch US away qualifiers on tv, that is an indication of how bad this can get when you have no control of where the games are shown.
4) The deals with ESPN/NBC/Fox/Univision are all carefully crafted to try and find windows that work for the league and broadcaster together. This helps MLS with scheduling. This control is lost once the rights to a 3rd party are sold.
5) Since the new deal would not start for 6 years, and the fact that it was a 10 year program, that means MLS would be in the position of looking 15-16 years into the future to determine if ~$14m more per team would be worth it.
My guess is that even if #1 in this list did not exist, MLS would likely have rejected this proposal on merit.
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CletiusMaximus
Footballguy
El Floppo
Footballguy
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
it is interesting that there is no mention of US Soccer (mens and womens national teams) tied up in that offer.
It is also strange that the deal seems to consider solidarity payments a financial issue instead of a legal issue. Until US Soccer can find a way around the US child labor laws, they are always going to tred lightly on that topic even if I wish we could just get it settled once and for all.
