badmojo1006
Footballguy
I see Carol/Herschel/Merle in the column of not counting on Season 4 residuals
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
***OFFICIAL 'The Walking Dead' TV Series Thread*** (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter goonsquad
- Start date
bigbottom
Footballguy
You may be right. But killing both antagonists in the finale will likely not get me amped for next season.
Tackling Dummies
Footballguy
'bigbottom said:
IIRC from a Kirkman interview, they "move on" from the prison is season 4, so my 2c is on the Gov. meeting his end
JoeSteeler
Footballguy
am i the only one that thinks (on the show) that he is a dead ringer for John Ritter?
eta-no pun intended
Last edited by a moderator:
pollardsvision
Footballguy
That was one of my favorite episodes of the series. Not sure how any fan of the show wouldn't like it.
The 3 meetings going on at "the meeting" were all great.
Andrea's still terrible, but she was before this episode.
For the Gov knowing about ammo, I assume Tyrese's crew or somebody is watching around the prison or outgoing road. Maybe Merle's a spy, but I doubt it.
Rick's indecision was king of troubling at first, but I think it's just a man struggling with hope that he be able to keep his kids out of a war, even if he knows it's impossible. It's an irrational emotion messing with what he knows to be true.
Anyway, it's obvious he won't give up Michonne. Absolutely no chance. Maybe they could've skipped the indecisive part, but I'm fine with it. It offered a nice moment with Hershel.
The 3 meetings going on at "the meeting" were all great.
Andrea's still terrible, but she was before this episode.
For the Gov knowing about ammo, I assume Tyrese's crew or somebody is watching around the prison or outgoing road. Maybe Merle's a spy, but I doubt it.
Rick's indecision was king of troubling at first, but I think it's just a man struggling with hope that he be able to keep his kids out of a war, even if he knows it's impossible. It's an irrational emotion messing with what he knows to be true.
Anyway, it's obvious he won't give up Michonne. Absolutely no chance. Maybe they could've skipped the indecisive part, but I'm fine with it. It offered a nice moment with Hershel.
bigbottom
Footballguy
Precisely.
packersfan
Footballguy
Thought it was a strong scene too. Hershel has become Rick's consiglieri and I think that's something Rick badly needs right now. When you look at the two leaders, that's really the one thing Rick has that the Governor doesn't. He has Hershel there to help him weigh the difficult decisions. The Governor is acting strictly on impulse. Milton is a very weak version of Hershel and even if he was stronger the Governor would probably kill him rather than rely on him. Perhaps it'll be that difference which spells the difference when the two sides go to war.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I kind of figured that and I havent read the comics. This war will take a toll on the prison to where they can't go back...maybe it burns down or something?...Dont tell me lol
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
While they may not go this way, I would think that the difference should weigh in the result. Rick's crew would fight to the death for each other, even Merle for Daryl. The key guys who help the governor will absolutely fight for him, but would they actually die to protect him and fight to the death? Most of the townspeople wanted to leave until Andrea kept them grounded. All they saw was psycho governor disappear when the #### hit the fan and saw him kill their bitten neighbor with no feeling. Rick killed Sophia because he didn't want anyone else in his group to have to live with that and he felt for Carol. The difference between the two leaders should have a big impact on any war.I'm looking forward to the last three episodes and it will be nice to find out what's next and who's still around.My money for deaths is on the Governor, Martinez, lots of Woodbury fighters, Andrea, Merle and one of Glen, Maggie or Herschel. I really hope the last four (I like Merle in the show) make it, but I think either Glen will have to be Maggie's everything due to losing Herschel or Glen/Maggie will have to deal without the other. The other wildcards are Carol and the rest of Tyrese's crew. I just can't see Rick, Carl, Michonne, Beth or Judith taking a dirt nap. I even think Milton will be safe and may end up being the Herschel after nutting up.
packersfan
Footballguy
Beth can't die until her dream of becoming Mrs. Rick Grimes becomes a reality - even if it's only for a fleeting moment.
LOL, true. Also, just in case, I have never read the comics, just thinking about who will die. I think most will survive and by most I am talking more about people we really know, not red shirts or people that have said one line.
packersfan
Footballguy
I think Rick, Daryl, Glen, Maggie, Carl and Michonne are safe. I think at least one and maybe two from everyone else (not including the Governor, who I expect to be killed) will die. My top choices are Andrea and Hershel. The writers were originally going to kill off Hershel in the Season 2 finale but changed that plan at the last minute. I could see them following through with it this season.
I could definitely see that and I almost think with Herschel's meeting with Milton that he may have turned Milton onto the road of becoming a Herschel, i.e. a guy who calmly thinks through scenarios. Herschel was a nice guy, but a little nutty (not believing walkers were really dead and then going back to drinking) in the beginning, but since he lost his leg he really has turned into a respected decision maker. I think Milton was a little naive in thinking the governor cared and Andrea and now Herschel have seemed to open his eyes so that he can be a smart guy that isn't so naive and sort of non-caring.
Notorious T.R.E.
Showdown!™ Administrator
Because it was filled with idiocy.
pollardsvision
Footballguy
What did you find idiotic?
tdoss
Footballguy
I can't stand that episode because it's so against what I'd do.
If I'm Rick and the gov says all he wants is our surrender. BAM! I blow his head off.
But...let's say I'm in a good mood that day...I let him speak his mind. As soon as he says that he wants Michonne. BAM! I blow his head off.
How does he not see how this goes down? You give up Michonne, then basically you'll give in to his demands anytime he threatens. What's to stop him from demanding the hottie next? You just gonna give up your people each time he asks? How does anyone follow you if you offer up Michonne? I wouldn't...there's no way I have faith in your leadership...you'll sell me out to save yourself and your kids. Screw you. This isn't rocket science.
So, you're left to ponder his demand. You either give up Michonne and hope for the best. You don't give up Michonne and you're at war. Or your don't give up Michonne and you're on the run. Because of my earlier reasoning...giving up Michonne just is NOT an option. So...I'm left to war or run. I ain't running. There's always going to be bullies...time to take a stand. So...if I'm going to fight...why wait until the governor can plan to take me out? Just shoot his @zz right then and there. I'd trust that Daryl can take care of his guy...Hershel shouldn't have to worry about Poindexter...maybe he can help with gov's henchman. Andrea is a waste and no concern.
Shoot gov then and there...then go back and formulate a plan for any retaliation by Woodbury.
Other notes: I don't like that gov knows about my weapons. Spy or traitor, both?
Andrea got back in with the gov so we could have the scene with her gathering Tyrese and his girl to help out. Only way we get them back on board. Sloppy writing. Also, maybe Andrea will finally come through and take out gov...but will probably end up being Poindexter finally driving the nail home.
I absolutely hated the love scene. It just ain't happening. We're the only defense...Merle is trying to gather guns and leave...anyone could be attacking at any moment. Let's close the door and get banging.
Why haven't they fortified their positions at the prison? Make it impossible for anyone to sneak into those towers. Put up plate infront of the stupid firing hole that Glenn made in the fence...how does it make sense to stand in the open with only a fence to protect you? Put up some damn plate.
My son and I were discussing what we'd do...he'd hunker down at the prison and wait for the attack. I like it, if they fortified...but they didn't...it's dumb. No one gets attacked at their fort and decides to not change a single thing. Can't stand that...even the dumbest person knows that they'll just do it again. I'd take the attack to the town. When they're expecting me to be at the meet in two days...I'm assaulting the town...taking it over and using their mounted weapons against them when they return wondering why I didn't show up at the meet.
If I'm Rick and the gov says all he wants is our surrender. BAM! I blow his head off.
But...let's say I'm in a good mood that day...I let him speak his mind. As soon as he says that he wants Michonne. BAM! I blow his head off.
How does he not see how this goes down? You give up Michonne, then basically you'll give in to his demands anytime he threatens. What's to stop him from demanding the hottie next? You just gonna give up your people each time he asks? How does anyone follow you if you offer up Michonne? I wouldn't...there's no way I have faith in your leadership...you'll sell me out to save yourself and your kids. Screw you. This isn't rocket science.
So, you're left to ponder his demand. You either give up Michonne and hope for the best. You don't give up Michonne and you're at war. Or your don't give up Michonne and you're on the run. Because of my earlier reasoning...giving up Michonne just is NOT an option. So...I'm left to war or run. I ain't running. There's always going to be bullies...time to take a stand. So...if I'm going to fight...why wait until the governor can plan to take me out? Just shoot his @zz right then and there. I'd trust that Daryl can take care of his guy...Hershel shouldn't have to worry about Poindexter...maybe he can help with gov's henchman. Andrea is a waste and no concern.
Shoot gov then and there...then go back and formulate a plan for any retaliation by Woodbury.
Other notes: I don't like that gov knows about my weapons. Spy or traitor, both?
Andrea got back in with the gov so we could have the scene with her gathering Tyrese and his girl to help out. Only way we get them back on board. Sloppy writing. Also, maybe Andrea will finally come through and take out gov...but will probably end up being Poindexter finally driving the nail home.
I absolutely hated the love scene. It just ain't happening. We're the only defense...Merle is trying to gather guns and leave...anyone could be attacking at any moment. Let's close the door and get banging.
Why haven't they fortified their positions at the prison? Make it impossible for anyone to sneak into those towers. Put up plate infront of the stupid firing hole that Glenn made in the fence...how does it make sense to stand in the open with only a fence to protect you? Put up some damn plate.
My son and I were discussing what we'd do...he'd hunker down at the prison and wait for the attack. I like it, if they fortified...but they didn't...it's dumb. No one gets attacked at their fort and decides to not change a single thing. Can't stand that...even the dumbest person knows that they'll just do it again. I'd take the attack to the town. When they're expecting me to be at the meet in two days...I'm assaulting the town...taking it over and using their mounted weapons against them when they return wondering why I didn't show up at the meet.
Tackling Dummies
Footballguy
Something is hitting the fan in episode 15. I'm going with Carl getting dropped like a bag of dirt.
Not making it to season 4
Merle
Gov
Herschel
Switches teams
Milton
Andrea
Tyrese & his sister, the other 2 guys get clipped
Not making it to season 4
Merle
Gov
Herschel
Switches teams
Milton
Andrea
Tyrese & his sister, the other 2 guys get clipped
Last edited by a moderator:
pollardsvision
Footballguy
I think she already has a couple of times.
mr roboto
Footballguy
Lets say Rick killed the Gov. Lets also say Darryl and Herschel were able to take/kill Rodriguez and Milton.
Then what? Rick becomes Sheriff of Woodbury? Does Rick know that the Gov doesn't have another guy back at the town that would pick up right where he left off?
According to the townspeople, the Gov is at least running things for their interest. And the prison group are terrorists. So I don't think killing the Gov is going to solve anything b
Then what? Rick becomes Sheriff of Woodbury? Does Rick know that the Gov doesn't have another guy back at the town that would pick up right where he left off?
According to the townspeople, the Gov is at least running things for their interest. And the prison group are terrorists. So I don't think killing the Gov is going to solve anything b
pollardsvision
Footballguy
Oh, I see. If you just accept that there's no way he's giving up Michonne, and that he really knows that there's no chance, everything seems better about the episode.He immediately came back to tell the group they were going to war, without mentioning any deal. He voiced a private moment of indecision to Hershel, but in the end, it won't matter.About not killing the Gov. right there, sure, I get it. I posted about absurdity of Rick not killing him during the invasion during the Merle/Daryl fight and the absurdity of the Gov. not killing them all at the prison shootout. I've just accepted that they are dragging it out for the big war. This meeting was far more forgivable than the other instances, imo.Rick had real hopes to broker a peace, so he didn't bring the calvary to the meeting. I would've shot the Gov., but I could see where Rick might not have thought it best. If they were going to squeeze in one more set-up for the war, I think this is a fine way to do it. Especially, as it set-up the meeting of Hershel and the Butler, which will be the key to this whole thing at some point. The meeting of Darryl and the baseball bat guy probably will too.They are outnumbered, but now the Gov's 3 most trusted people are somewhat sympathetic to Rick's group. Hearts and minds!
Last edited by a moderator:
packersfan
Footballguy
Rick not killing the Governor in cold blood may have been a storytelling device but it felt realistic to me. Rick's not a murderer and if he thought there was any way to make peace without more people dying that strikes me as the move he would first make. There also may have been a part of him that wanted to meet this guy face-to-face who had done so many awful things to people he cares about.
Plus I think the Governor did a good job of working on Rick's psyche and making him possibly reconsider his position. I thought those scenes were extremely well done. So while I can agree things are being dragged out to get to a likely big dramatic showdown it felt entirely realistic to me and at no point did I think the characters were being contorted to fit the storytelling.
Plus I think the Governor did a good job of working on Rick's psyche and making him possibly reconsider his position. I thought those scenes were extremely well done. So while I can agree things are being dragged out to get to a likely big dramatic showdown it felt entirely realistic to me and at no point did I think the characters were being contorted to fit the storytelling.
badmojo1006
Footballguy
I see...You are Scott in the Austin Powers movies
Jules Winnfield
Footballguy
So why didn't he pick up the hitch hiker from last episode?He cannot possible think that this small little group will be how he sees them surviving from here on out. Eventually he has to realize they need more people for strength and survival.
He doesn't have a problem killing anyone in cold blood if it means the survival of his group.
packersfan
Footballguy
That was before he saw Morgan. I think that meeting pushed him back to being the person he was before he started to lose his marbles. If he had the meeting with the Governor before meeting Morgan he probably would've gone in guns blazing. That's my take anyway.
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Really? You are one of the few who does not like this season. I think it is the best overall
The Big Guy
Fear the Blitz
Let's not forget that Rick is a sheriff and sitting across a table from your enemy is nothing new to him. Getting the guy to talk, lie to you, tell you the truth by omission etc should all be in his bag of tricks, even as a small town sheriff. He went there in hopes of working out a truce, but knowing that it would be unlikely.
Imagine if Rick has all the true info on the Gov from Merle, like the Gov has on him from Andrea. There is no way this meeting takes place if he hears the story of the cold blooded murder and looting of the troops that they did. Andrea has told him everything and this meeting helped Rick level that information playing field.
Now--as to the fence and zombies. Go fix the outer fence and kill/get rid of the zombies in the inner fence. All it does is leave them that much closer to you and make your life harder to do anything.
I assume that the Gov has someone on watch to check on their comings and going, learn their defenses and weaknesses etc and that person told him about their gun run that they took. Rick had the guns and ammo in a duffel bag, so it is more then likely that he took an educated guess about what was being brought in with that bag.
Imagine if Rick has all the true info on the Gov from Merle, like the Gov has on him from Andrea. There is no way this meeting takes place if he hears the story of the cold blooded murder and looting of the troops that they did. Andrea has told him everything and this meeting helped Rick level that information playing field.
Now--as to the fence and zombies. Go fix the outer fence and kill/get rid of the zombies in the inner fence. All it does is leave them that much closer to you and make your life harder to do anything.
I assume that the Gov has someone on watch to check on their comings and going, learn their defenses and weaknesses etc and that person told him about their gun run that they took. Rick had the guns and ammo in a duffel bag, so it is more then likely that he took an educated guess about what was being brought in with that bag.
Last edited by a moderator:
Thunderlips
Footballguy
That's kind of my biggest gripe about the whole thing. It's a prison. If you want to defend it...you can make Woodbury pay in blood for every inch. Sure you'd need to clear out (or corral to use to your advantage)the Walkers in the prison...but in the end, The Gov is at a significant disadvantage in trying to take it.
Of course, the limited manpower and Rick going off the reservation for a little bit are legit excuses as to not doing this.
Thunderlips
Footballguy
I was actually kind of hoping that the camera would pan to a "zombie" walking around in the yard or nearby and it being a Woodbury spy. That's one of the major disadvantages (and IMO, showing the lack of tactics of Ricks side)of having those walkers there and not killing them. Perfect disguise.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I actually think its smart by keeping them there just for the security in case they try to sneak up or come through he gates.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
The Big Guy
Fear the Blitz
I am not talking about killing every last walker. I am talking about fixing the exterior fence and giving yourself that little buffer back that you had before. Keep the walkers outside that secondary fence and if the Gov and his boys come again, they have to go through two levels of fencing and the zombies have to see that and figure that part out too. plus, if the spy is doing a zombie walk, do you want him at the outer fence or the inner fence? Why give a free run to cutting the inner fence to anyone?
Thunderlips
Footballguy
It's a trade off though as it makes it easier for a Woodbury spy to "shamble" right up to the fence. Sure it's a good zombie moat.....but I think thinking outside of the box (the zombie bomb that the Governor had drive up being the perfect example) is the key to utilizing zombies.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I have no clue. Maybe they don't want to be out in the open or something?I do think they need to make better use of those towers though and even the roof tops if they can get up there.
Thunderlips
Footballguy
Lighting it on fire is a counterproductive to keeping it for your own use or even making sure that the people you're trying to kill are dead. Nevermind that it would be a pretty big damn fire (something they might not have the resources to build) and it could attract any number of walkers or human survivors.
A prison is probably the closest thing to a modern day castle....it really doesn't seem like Rick and Co. are seeing it as such. You could defend it from cell block to cell block; falling back and always having the advantage of knowing the terrain and the superior firing locations. It's not like The Gov has an innumerable army or a bunch of crack commandos. Once a couple of his major players (Martinez) get shot trying to lead an assault....I'm expect Sally HouseWife and Johnny Lunchpail to get scared and run.
biggamer3
Footballguy
Thunderlips
Footballguy
Yeah...that's about right.
cstu
Footballguy
Rick knows the Gov is a psycho but the talk with Herschel showed how desperate to keep his son (primarily IMO) alive.'snogger said:I liked the first statement where the writers made it seem he realized the Gov is'Tackling Dummies said:Because he's conflicted?'snogger said:I hope you are right as I liked everything about the episode except the ending.. Seemed weak to me for the writers to switch from Rick realizing that The Gov was going to kill them either way to.. "Please talk me out of giving up Michone"..
and no matter what he said about "give me Michone and I'll leave you alone" was
and he saw through it.IMO, THAT would have been the best way to leave it..
Jules Winnfield
Footballguy
I bet he would have picked up the hitchhiker if it was your avatar
Thunderlips
Footballguy
Honestly, I think it was a plot device to F with the viewer. There's no rational explanation for Rick to turn her over. I think it's a bit of forced drama.Rick knows the Gov is a psycho but the talk with Herschel showed how desperate to keep his son (primarily IMO) alive.'snogger said:I liked the first statement where the writers made it seem he realized the Gov is'Tackling Dummies said:Because he's conflicted?'snogger said:I hope you are right as I liked everything about the episode except the ending.. Seemed weak to me for the writers to switch from Rick realizing that The Gov was going to kill them either way to.. "Please talk me out of giving up Michone"..
Mile High
Footballguy
When she was getting into the truck she made eye contact with Herschel and it looked like he gave her a nod. I don't think we got to hear their whole conversation.
Last edited by a moderator:
Mario Kart
Footballguy
I think the Governor is full of crap when he said he knows about the guns. I don't think there is a spy of any kind.
What I do think is that the Governor overplayed his hand. He was the one talking, trying to get Rick to flinch at something, anything. The Governor kept up the banter while Rick stayed, oddly, cool with a couple outbursts but he never flinched. The Governor did though.
What I do think is that the Governor overplayed his hand. He was the one talking, trying to get Rick to flinch at something, anything. The Governor kept up the banter while Rick stayed, oddly, cool with a couple outbursts but he never flinched. The Governor did though.
Thunderlips
Footballguy
So the payoff is when Rick utilizes the Governor's obsession with Michonne? That's kind of the only think I think he could have taken from it.
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
He must be using his cellphone to call the Governor'BigJohn said:
