TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Huge day game today. If the Nats can walk away with a three game lead and Werth/Zim/Rendon close to returning (with Span and Strasburg hopefully to follow in a couple weeks) I'd feel fairly comfortable.
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***OFFICIAL*** Washington Nationals ongoing thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter JZilla
- Start date
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Escobar re-injured his wrist. Doesn't look good.
I've never seen anything like this. They may have to change their plans and bring back Rendon sooner than expected.
I've never seen anything like this. They may have to change their plans and bring back Rendon sooner than expected.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
That's what they're doing for the duration of this one, but it doesn't solve the problem of only having two or three major league quality bats left in the lineup.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Desi starting to show signs of life this series. Maybe the Cal Ripken pep talk will turn his season around, bringing our total number of major league quality bats to three.
Either way, the regulars should be back soon. And in the meantime we have Scherzer on Friday and the Mets have to deal with Kershaw vs Colon and Greinke vs Niese the next two nights, so hopefully we'll still be in good shape when the band gets back together next week.
Swing 51
Footballguy
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
On today's episode of "How the #### Is This Team in First Place":
Taylor CF
Espinosa 3B
Harper RF
Ramos C
Robinson LF
Desmond SS
Uggla 2B
Moore 1B
Fister RHP
I count three guys with OBPs over .300, two of whom are Clint Robinson and Danny Espinosa.
Absolutely amazing. It's a testament to how good Harper has been, really.
Taylor CF
Espinosa 3B
Harper RF
Ramos C
Robinson LF
Desmond SS
Uggla 2B
Moore 1B
Fister RHP
I count three guys with OBPs over .300, two of whom are Clint Robinson and Danny Espinosa.
Absolutely amazing. It's a testament to how good Harper has been, really.
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
The division is the worst in baseball, that helps. The Mets are the only contender and they are bottom five in every offensive category in baseball, it's just too easy. Nats have had an inordinate amount of injuries this year, but the competition within the division is non existent. It's the old, they could win this division with one hand tied behind their back mantra. No credit is due to the Nationals here, even with the injuries they are superior to every team in the east.TobiasFunke said:
Yeah because Storen's 1.73 ERA is way out of control.
Storen ain't the problem, they need some setup help since they rarely let their pitchers go 6+ innings and moving him back to setup to get Papelbon is not a good idea.
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Looking for a setup guy to get to storen and probably some playoff insurance too
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
I could see trading for Chapman, they could use him in a Betances role getting some saves but pitching the 7th and 8th when most needed. Chapman is a guy that can go five, six, seven batters. Papelbon would make little sense unless you are getting him for little in return. Papelbon would have an expectation to close and that in itself would be problematic. But Chapman is better than Storen for sure, if you can get a guy like that you do it IMO.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Werth and Zim reportedly returning today. Our long Nationals nightmare is almost over. Jose Fernandez today and the Mets' top three again over the weekend- if they can get out of Queens with any kind of division lead or even a tie I'll feel very good about their chances.
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Yeah I'm with you, I don't get this "get a setup man" thing either. If they get a better closer, Storen and his 1.73 ERA move to the 8th. Setup problem solved.
That said I don't like Papelbon. He might make sense and come a lot cheaper than Kimbrel and Chapman but the fans won't like him, which will create tension with Storen (who I assume would understand ceding his role to a Kimbrel/Chapman type), and his insistence that he be allowed to close is not great. Someone getting rescued from that mess in Philly and thrown into a pennant chase should be thankful even if he's doing mopup work, not acting like he holds all the cards.
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Once again, they signed a new closer and moved Storen to setup guy before. Storen imploded, was sent to the minor, and worked his way back. The following year, he did well as the set up guy and then moved back to the closer role.
So can Storen seamlessly move to set up guy or does he have transition issues like last time?
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Nats can tell papelbon whatever they want but if he falters then storen should close in October. Storen needs to get outs whatever inning it is. Grow a pair. One reason this trade is happening is Storens post season history.
Whatever Williams needs to figure out bullpen roles. And figure a damn lineup that hopefully has someone batting over .210 protecting Harper.
Whatever Williams needs to figure out bullpen roles. And figure a damn lineup that hopefully has someone batting over .210 protecting Harper.
Limp Ditka
Footballguy
Paps deal is done
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Yeah agree with RW, Storen is going to have to do his job, whatever that may be. Papeldoosh has pitched in two of the toughest cities, he's feeling no pressure in mild mannered DC.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I don't know, but it's a risk you have to take. If Storen can't handle the 8th inning behind Papelbon he probably couldn't handle it behind Chapman or Kimbrel. And they had to do something to bolster the back end of the bullpen. A setup guy would have been OK, but it's far better to have two closer-quality guys there.Marvelous said:
My only quarrel with this at the moment is that they didn't wait until the deadline. Barry Svrluga said the Padres and Reds were both asking for two of Turner, Taylor, Giolito, Lopez, and Ross. Obviously that's not happening, and Giolito is completely off the table. But who's to say the price wouldn't have dropped as the teams got closer to the deadline?
Anyway, the much bigger problem is the Mets. They have a very soft schedule over the last part of the season. Ten more games against the Phillies (now without a closer and likely without Hamels), six of their remaining nine against the Nats in Queens, just two or three other series against other contending clubs. They're not going away. I think the Nats are gonna have to beat them head to head over the final 9 games to win the division, and the pitching matchups this weekend are not a good way to start. I wouldn't mind if they pushed Scherzer back to Friday and gave someone else a start on Thursday afternoon- he seems like he could use a little rest anyway.
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TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I like this situation. We either get wins in close games or we get to vent our frustration on Papelbon. Win-win.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I still like our chances, but Matt Williams is a real problem. He's a horrendous tactician. No excuse to send Ross out in the 7th on Saturday, no excuse to play two one-run games, including one that goes 12 innings, and not have your two best relievers throw a pitch. No excuse to play six games against the team chasing you out of the ASB and not have your best starter face them twice. Just mistake after mistake after mistake.
Other than Williams' awfulness I chalk this mini-collapse over the last three weeks up to bad luck and bad scheduling breaks. I've never seen a run of opposing starters like the one the Nats just ran through, a run that's thankfully done at least until we get to LA in a couple weeks. And of course the Mets get to duck Jose Fernandez in Miami this week and have ten games left against the now Hamels-less Phillies.
Other than Williams' awfulness I chalk this mini-collapse over the last three weeks up to bad luck and bad scheduling breaks. I've never seen a run of opposing starters like the one the Nats just ran through, a run that's thankfully done at least until we get to LA in a couple weeks. And of course the Mets get to duck Jose Fernandez in Miami this week and have ten games left against the now Hamels-less Phillies.
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Williams had been terrible but it may also be time to admit the best rotation ever is the second best in the division.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I think most Nats fans would have admitted that a month ago.
The saving grace is that the Mets guys are young and their innings counts are climbing. Harvey is less than 30 innings from the mark where the Nats shut down Strasburg in his TJ rehab year, and anyone who was around for that season remember how he faltered in his last couple starts before the shutdown. I would be somewhat surprised if Harvey is effective in September. Collins is already talking about how they may use some other guys in spot starts and use Matz to go to a full six-man rotation when he returns.
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
When Stras returns, they need to move Fister to the pen. He's really terrible.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Agree, and the club may agree too. Not sure it's a coincidence that Strasburg pitched his final rehab game the same day as a Fister start.
The only hiccup is that Joe Ross has thrown 120ish innings each of the last two seasons and he's already at like 110 in 2015. Figure he's got like 40ish left, so I don't know if they can use him every five days the rest of the way. Maybe they can set up a Joe Ross/Tanner Roark duo where Ross throws 4-5 innings and they always make sure they have Roark ready to step in for long relief after that.
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Off the the park!
Scherzer+ :rendongnome: =
Scherzer+ :rendongnome: =
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Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Oops, :rendongnome: not tonight.
Doctor Detroit
Please remove your headgear
Send it to Posty since he never leaves his basement and is unable to get any Nats swag.
The_Man
Footballguy
Boswell started banging the drum about Williams' inepditude on Twitter midway through last season. I'm in Baltimore and an Orioles fan, so I don't watch a ton of Nats games and wasn't really aware of the situation until Bos started alluding to it. Bos knows so much baseball and is generally so circumspect that it really caught my attention - for him to be talking about it, I thought, Williams must really be bad. Then there was so much attention called to his tactics in last year's playoffs, and now it's out there for everyone to see - he is really a liability to the team.
I might have missed it, but I don't think Boswell has really taken Wiliams to task in a column yet. I'm looking forward to when he does, because I'm sure it will be a phenomenal piece of sportswriting.
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TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I think Kilgore nailed it in a tweet last night- the problem here isn't that they're 2 games back with 55 or so to play. The problem is that they're just not very good in any aspect of the game. Starting lineup, bench bats, rotation, defense, bullpen ... are any of them above average? Maybe the rotation and the bench bats now that everyone is healthy, but they're hardly elite.
Maybe this is the Strasburg hero moment we've been waiting on. Maybe he comes back and dominates over his last ten or so starts, making the rotation elite again. That's about all I've got right now.
Although I do like the Nats' chances of making up ground this weekend, with Zim-Stras-Scherzer at home vs Colorado while the Mets go to an AL park and face a decent team, including their ace on Sunday. Of course after that we head west while they come home and get that Colorado team, so we pretty much have to make up at least a little ground this weekend if we want to keep this close.
Maybe this is the Strasburg hero moment we've been waiting on. Maybe he comes back and dominates over his last ten or so starts, making the rotation elite again. That's about all I've got right now.
Although I do like the Nats' chances of making up ground this weekend, with Zim-Stras-Scherzer at home vs Colorado while the Mets go to an AL park and face a decent team, including their ace on Sunday. Of course after that we head west while they come home and get that Colorado team, so we pretty much have to make up at least a little ground this weekend if we want to keep this close.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Yesterday he let Gio hit in the bottom of the 5th and then yanked him one batter into the next inning even though he'd been fairly sharp: 95 pitches, 7 Ks, 1 BB, 1R, no extra-base hits. Which of course pissed off Gio considerably. He then replaced him with a righty with confidence issues in a tight spot instead of a relatively solid lefty who was also warm, to face a switch-hitter and the only lefty in their starting lineup. There's baffling moves like that almost every day.
Don Quixote
Footballguy
After Williams pulled Gio for Barrett like that, Jonah Keri tweeted something along the lines of that it's like Williams is trying to think ahead for something even weirder to do every day. So, it's getting to the point where even national guys are picking up on it.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
It's one thing when fans, talk radio, and eternally grumpy guys like Keith Law are on his case. But if a guy like Jonah Keri is picking up on how bad he's been, you know it's been really bad.
The_Man
Footballguy
[SIZE=10pt]Thomas Boswell [/SIZE]@ThomasBoswellWP [SIZE=7.5pt]May 6 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]In-game managing is ALWAYS anticipating what can go wrong. Williams assumed Scherzer cruising. Could've stalled to get Roark hot & in. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]Thomas Boswell [/SIZE]@ThomasBoswellWP [SIZE=7.5pt]Jul 4 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]In a 9-3 game, 6-1 early by 6th, Williams got Carpenter, Trienan and Rivera warm without bringing them in.[/SIZE]
Quick Twitter search didn't yield much, but found a couple tweets. I really thought Bos was going to get on him after the Mets series but I think he was at the golf tournament and not on the road in NY.
One of the things I love about Boswell - and there are many - is that he is the opposite of a "hot takes" guy. If/when he writes an anti-Williams piece, it will come after he's been with the team for a number of games, actually doing shoe leather reporting to find out what people in the Nats' and opposing clubhouses are quietly whispering, and after he's looked Williams in the eye and asked him about a number of these baffling decisions. It won't be some hit and run piece ripped from the sports talk airwaves. And that, combined with Boswell's stature, is what will make it so devastating.
The other thing about Boswell is that after the piece runs in the morning paper, he'll be in the clubhouse that afternoon, where Wiliams or anyone else in the organization that has a problem with what he's written will know where to find him if they are so inclined. That's one of the reason he is so respected - he won't say anything in print that he's not willing to stand behind, face-to-face.
[SIZE=10pt]In-game managing is ALWAYS anticipating what can go wrong. Williams assumed Scherzer cruising. Could've stalled to get Roark hot & in. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]Thomas Boswell [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]In a 9-3 game, 6-1 early by 6th, Williams got Carpenter, Trienan and Rivera warm without bringing them in.[/SIZE]
Quick Twitter search didn't yield much, but found a couple tweets. I really thought Bos was going to get on him after the Mets series but I think he was at the golf tournament and not on the road in NY.
One of the things I love about Boswell - and there are many - is that he is the opposite of a "hot takes" guy. If/when he writes an anti-Williams piece, it will come after he's been with the team for a number of games, actually doing shoe leather reporting to find out what people in the Nats' and opposing clubhouses are quietly whispering, and after he's looked Williams in the eye and asked him about a number of these baffling decisions. It won't be some hit and run piece ripped from the sports talk airwaves. And that, combined with Boswell's stature, is what will make it so devastating.
The other thing about Boswell is that after the piece runs in the morning paper, he'll be in the clubhouse that afternoon, where Wiliams or anyone else in the organization that has a problem with what he's written will know where to find him if they are so inclined. That's one of the reason he is so respected - he won't say anything in print that he's not willing to stand behind, face-to-face.
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Barrett down and Treinen back up.
On ESPN 980, Sheehan/Lavarro mentioned that it made no sense to have Gio bat in the fifth inning and then pull him one batter into the sixth. But worse, they said that Barrett barely had time to warm up.
I recall earlier this season that a reliever came into a game with little warm ups, was lit up, and then sent to the minors. It may have been Treinen. If Williams does not let his relievers fully warm up, there really is some bad bullpen management.
TobiasFunke
Footballguy
Strasburg basically confirmed as the starter for Saturday (would be Fister's spot) and the TV broadcast just showed Fister in the bullpen, so there you go. Possible they just push everyone back a day, but that seems unlikely. They need wins and they need them now.
In other news it looks like we face both Greinke and Kershaw again next week in Los Angeles, because of course we do.
Don Quixote
Footballguy
Ross officially staying in the rotation. Glad to see they made the right move.
