Ok.....since Brandon Marshall (1 Viewer)

[THE UNDERCOVER BROTHA]

Why dont i see him going and any of the 1st 3 rounds of most NFL mock drafts......

Curious to why most mocks have other wr's going over him aside from Chad-Holmes-Moss

Whats with this?

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Because he's very raw after playing on the defensive side of the ball a couple of years ago. He's a longer term project than most of the top 6-9 WRs coming out and, generally, NFL teams are much less interested in drafting projects than us fantasy football players unless they have 4.3 speed like Matt Jones. I personally think he can develop into a very good receiver, but I'm not sure he's explosive enough to ever rival TO and if you're drafting him before the mid-3rd of a dynasty rookie draft, you're probably making a mistake.

 

[Bizkiteer]

I think drafted players are getting compared to stars too much these days. I know that the analyst job to try and let you know what type of player they are, but many people in FF get overly excited when a stud name gets dropped.

I heard it mentioned that Marshall will probably get drafted 4th to later rounds, probably more likely the 5th. I don't see him being taken too high in FF rookie drafts and like it was mentioned before...you could very well be sorry if he's taken too high because he a work in progress. If it takes WR normally three years, what does it take a project WR??? Ouch!

 

[Sigmund Bloom]

Rob Rang said he lacked speed and agility (runs in the 4.5s for a 6'4" 225 guy doesnt seem like a problem to me, he also does not play stiff whatsoever). He did bring up a concern that I share, which is that he manhandled DBs and he might not be able to do that in the NFL. Still, what I love about this guy is his size/speed/athelticism combo, and his physical "my ball" mentality. Watching him late in the year, if a DB tried to jam him, he just threw them to the ground. Its the instincts to play physical that I love.

I dare you to watch the tape of him in the Hawaii Bowl and Hula Bowl and not walk away completely sold.

 

[Rovers]

Rob Rang said he lacked speed and agility (runs in the 4.5s for a 6'4" 225 guy doesnt seem like a problem to me, he also does not play stiff whatsoever). He did bring up a concern that I share, which is that he manhandled DBs and he might not be able to do that in the NFL. Still, what I love about this guy is his size/speed/athelticism combo, and his physical "my ball" mentality. Watching him late in the year, if a DB tried to jam him, he just threw them to the ground. Its the instincts to play physical that I love.

I dare you to watch the tape of him in the Hawaii Bowl and Hula Bowl and not walk away completely sold.

I watched both of those games too, and I have seen Marshall creeping up in some mocks, but I'd be very surprised if he fell any further than somewhere in the third round. He showed more than adequate speed for his size, and very good hands. He made a one handed catch and took it to the house for 51 yards.... and yes, I do think he has what it takes, potentially, to be a very good to elite NFL WR. In fact, I think his upside is better than any WR in the entire draft.

 

[Sigmund Bloom]

Rob Rang said he lacked speed and agility (runs in the 4.5s for a 6'4" 225 guy doesnt seem like a problem to me, he also does not play stiff whatsoever). He did bring up a concern that I share, which is that he manhandled DBs and he might not be able to do that in the NFL. Still, what I love about this guy is his size/speed/athelticism combo, and his physical "my ball" mentality. Watching him late in the year, if a DB tried to jam him, he just threw them to the ground. Its the instincts to play physical that I love.

I dare you to watch the tape of him in the Hawaii Bowl and Hula Bowl and not walk away completely sold.

I watched both of those games too, and I have seen Marshall creeping up in some mocks, but I'd be very surprised if he fell any further than somewhere in the third round. He showed more than adequate speed for his size, and very good hands. He made a one handed catch and took it to the house for 51 yards.... and yes, I do think he has what it takes, potentially, to be a very good to elite NFL WR. In fact, I think his upside is better than any WR in the entire draft.

that was another thing that stood out. for a guy who was playing safety a year ago, he was very good at "plucking" the ball out of the air instead of letting it get to his body. I also agree that he has the highest upside of any WR in the draft.

 

[FUBAR]

Rob Rang said he lacked speed and agility (runs in the 4.5s for a 6'4" 225 guy doesnt seem like a problem to me, he also does not play stiff whatsoever). He did bring up a concern that I share, which is that he manhandled DBs and he might not be able to do that in the NFL. Still, what I love about this guy is his size/speed/athelticism combo, and his physical "my ball" mentality. Watching him late in the year, if a DB tried to jam him, he just threw them to the ground. Its the instincts to play physical that I love.

I dare you to watch the tape of him in the Hawaii Bowl and Hula Bowl and not walk away completely sold.

I watched both of those games too, and I have seen Marshall creeping up in some mocks, but I'd be very surprised if he fell any further than somewhere in the third round. He showed more than adequate speed for his size, and very good hands. He made a one handed catch and took it to the house for 51 yards.... and yes, I do think he has what it takes, potentially, to be a very good to elite NFL WR. In fact, I think his upside is better than any WR in the entire draft.

that was another thing that stood out. for a guy who was playing safety a year ago, he was very good at "plucking" the ball out of the air instead of letting it get to his body. I also agree that he has the highest upside of any WR in the draft.

Good hands and the next TO should not be used to describe the same player.TO has many talents, his hands are not one of them.

 

[Jous]

I disagree. I've seen him drop some easy passes, but I've also seen him make some extraordinary catches....and it's not as if he drops an easy one eveyr game. He probbaly does it once every 4 games...which is a pretty good ratio if you ask me.

 

[TME]

Is it me or there a "next TO" in every draft the past three years or so? It seems to revolve around finding a crazy athletic and big WR from a small school and you can find someone like that every year, but chances of that guy being the next TO are slim to none.

Can anyone recant the list of recent "Next TO's?" I would be interested. It would include guys like Tyron Calico...was Vincent Jackson one? Clarence Moore possibly? I cannot keep track of them all.

 

[Sigmund Bloom]

Is it me or there a "next TO" in every draft the past three years or so? It seems to revolve around finding a crazy athletic and big WR from a small school and you can find someone like that every year, but chances of that guy being the next TO are slim to none.

Can anyone recant the list of recent "Next TO's?" I would be interested. It would include guys like Tyron Calico...was Vincent Jackson one? Clarence Moore possibly? I cannot keep track of them all.

Have you seen Marshall play?

 

[-OZ-]

Is it me or there a "next TO" in every draft the past three years or so? It seems to revolve around finding a crazy athletic and big WR from a small school and you can find someone like that every year, but chances of that guy being the next TO are slim to none.

Can anyone recant the list of recent "Next TO's?" I would be interested. It would include guys like Tyron Calico...was Vincent Jackson one? Clarence Moore possibly? I cannot keep track of them all.

Have you seen Marshall play?

FWIW Bloom, I haven't, but I did see Calico play a few times. He looked every bit the part as the next TO. Inconsistent, but skills were there.

 

[Chaos Commish]

It's quite possible (I mean quite possible) that Bloom, I, Matt Waldman and others have this wrong. Maybe Marshall was just very exceptional the few times we watched him. Maybe that left us with an impression more thorough scouts rightfully do not share.

I like the Calico observation. He did look the part of a potential TO very briefly. Big, fast, strong, athletic-- not one of those tall skinny guys, but physical and dominant. That hasn't worked out. Even without the injuries it probably was too much praise. It's probably too much praise for Marshall. He probably won't be like TO.

Nevertheless, there is a reason to compare to known commodities. That process almost always looks at the best case scenario. Bush is Faulk. Williams is Tomlinson. Marshall is TO.

Here's my take on Marshall. He pretty much came from nowhere this year. Scouts and online wannabes don't like that. They're already telling us who next years best players are, and the year after that, and if you dig, even the year after that. Marshall hasn't been on their honor rolls.

He's been an interesting safety in Conference USA with unusual measureables. A little too tall for the prototype. A big hitter with a nice nose for the ball who used his length to break up deep balls and supported the run impressively. He looked a like a probable UFA project with nice upside for special teams if he was willing to work on it. Something like a future Kassim Osgood but coming from the defensive side of the ball.

So the season starts and unbeknownst to all but those paying close attention, he's now a starting wide receiver-- WR2 for the Golden Knights. Not even their go to guy. WR1 was a nice prospect named Mike Walker, who's still a nice prospect.

So Marshall starts the season with a 10 catch 100 yard game against Ko Simpson, Johnathan Joseph and South Carolina. Who's this guy? Some safety. Probably a fluke.

Midway through the season, he's had a few more nice games and few duds. A 2-22 and 4-39, iirc, were not too impressive. Walker is the teams #1 WR, but Marshall is pushing him. A Golden Knights fan told me that something clicked with Marshall after a blow out loss to Southern Miss and in the Tulane game. Walker wasn't the #1 guy anymore and Marshall was just a stud all of a sudden. Walker was still good, but Marshall went on to finish 10th in the nation in yards, averaging over 16 yards per catch and scoring 11 Tds. Not bad for a converted safety new to the position and a wr2.

Walker missed the last couple games of the year, but Marshall just took over. His last two performances literally looked like a man among boys. TO comparisons are about the only ones that applied.

He was like a one year old German Shepherd last year. He was already the biggest and baddest dog on the block, but he didn't know it. He had some puppy left in him. The position was new to him. Then he got in a few tough scraps and emerged as king of the hill.

He was the Florida state triple jump champion in high school. He was a big hitter as a safety. He's got deceptive deep speed. He has great hops. He has very soft hands, even has some sick one handers on his resume. But the things that really stand out are physically strong he is. He manhandled cornerbacks, and the way he goes for the ball like he's intercepting it, not receiving it. Great instincts when the ball is in flight.

 

[Tick]

I'm getting a Kelley Washington feel from this guy... all the physical skills, no route running. That's a pretty weak impression, though - I haven't seen any tape of him.

 

[Chaos Commish]

I'm getting a Kelley Washington feel from this guy... all the physical skills, no route running. That's a pretty weak impression, though - I haven't seen any tape of him.

You'd love the "route" he ran in the Hula Bowl. The corner jammed him. He threw the corner off the field (literally), scooted into the endzone, caught the ball, handed it to the ref, then checked on the corner.

 

[Bruno2]

If I were to compare Marshall to anyone in the NFL, it would be Jerry Porter. Both were converted safeties in college and considered "projects" with good athletic ability for their size (they're both about the same height & weight). It took Porter three years (plus playing behind two future HOFers) to become a solid WR2/3 for the Raiders. Plus he played tougher competition than Marshall did at UWV, I figure it will be at least three years before Marshall becomes an everydown starter.

 

[Chaos Commish]

If I were to compare Marshall to anyone in the NFL, it would be Jerry Porter. Both were converted safeties in college and considered "projects" with good athletic ability for their size (they're both about the same height & weight). It took Porter three years (plus playing behind two future HOFers) to become a solid WR2/3 for the Raiders. Plus he played tougher competition than Marshall did at UWV, I figure it will be at least three years before Marshall becomes an everydown starter.

Very realistic. And if Marshall looks as good in the NFL as Porter (but healthy), then that has to be considered a success. Rang has him as WR23 in this draft. I've seen him lower. He's usually between 18-23. Those guys ranked down there rarely make it in the league. Crazy Mike Mayock ranks him seventh and that's as high as you'll see in the mainstream.

I think he has as much upside as Holmes or Jackson. If a WR I watched had an "it factor" going, it was Marshall.

 

[ConstruxBoy]

If I were to compare Marshall to anyone in the NFL, it would be Jerry Porter. Both were converted safeties in college and considered "projects" with good athletic ability for their size (they're both about the same height & weight). It took Porter three years (plus playing behind two future HOFers) to become a solid WR2/3 for the Raiders. Plus he played tougher competition than Marshall did at UWV, I figure it will be at least three years before Marshall becomes an everydown starter.

Very realistic. And if Marshall looks as good in the NFL as Porter (but healthy), then that has to be considered a success. Rang has him as WR23 in this draft. I've seen him lower. He's usually between 18-23. Those guys ranked down there rarely make it in the league. Crazy Mike Mayock ranks him seventh and that's as high as you'll see in the mainstream.

I think he has as much upside as Holmes or Jackson. If a WR I watched had an "it factor" going, it was Marshall.

PFW has him 6th.

 

[Chaos Commish]

If I were to compare Marshall to anyone in the NFL, it would be Jerry Porter. Both were converted safeties in college and considered "projects" with good athletic ability for their size (they're both about the same height & weight). It took Porter three years (plus playing behind two future HOFers) to become a solid WR2/3 for the Raiders. Plus he played tougher competition than Marshall did at UWV, I figure it will be at least three years before Marshall becomes an everydown starter.

Very realistic. And if Marshall looks as good in the NFL as Porter (but healthy), then that has to be considered a success. Rang has him as WR23 in this draft. I've seen him lower. He's usually between 18-23. Those guys ranked down there rarely make it in the league. Crazy Mike Mayock ranks him seventh and that's as high as you'll see in the mainstream.

I think he has as much upside as Holmes or Jackson. If a WR I watched had an "it factor" going, it was Marshall.

PFW has him 6th.

Thanks. I hadn't seen that. Is there any player with more scattered ratings. From sixth at Coyle's place to 23rd at Rang's?

 

[rabidfireweasel]

Is it me or there a "next TO" in every draft the past three years or so?  It seems to revolve around finding a crazy athletic and big WR from a small school and you can find someone like that every year, but chances of that guy being the next TO are slim to none.

Can anyone recant the list of recent "Next TO's?"  I would be interested.  It would include guys like Tyron Calico...was Vincent Jackson one?  Clarence Moore possibly?  I cannot keep track of them all.

Have you seen Marshall play?

FWIW Bloom, I haven't, but I did see Calico play a few times. He looked every bit the part as the next TO. Inconsistent, but skills were there.

I never liked the Calico to TO reference. Calico never produced numbers at the college level despite playing at a small school against less althetic db's. I don't think he ever sniffed 800 receiving yards in a season in college. Even in a run first offense, that should not have been hard at Middle Tennessee. He did not play well or physically in post season practices. He was not physical and did not fight for the ball. Many got way way to worked up about his measurables. In a draft that featured the far more physical Andre Johnson and Anquan Boldin, anyone who was calling Calico the next TO was tryiing to hard to be brilliant.

 

[DrJ]

If I were to compare Marshall to anyone in the NFL, it would be Jerry Porter. Both were converted safeties in college and considered "projects" with good athletic ability for their size (they're both about the same height & weight). It took Porter three years (plus playing behind two future HOFers) to become a solid WR2/3 for the Raiders. Plus he played tougher competition than Marshall did at UWV, I figure it will be at least three years before Marshall becomes an everydown starter.

The one problem with the Porter comparison is that Porter is just a freak physically. He has the size, but also has great speed and a HUGE vertical. He was about a 4.45 guy. At this point, I don't think he's progressed all that much as a WR, but gets by at times on that freakish physical ability.If Marshall is more like 4.5 - 4.6, is he really going to be able to get by on that physical ability? He needs to progress as a WR more than Porter has to be successful, in all liklihood.

 

[Chaos Commish]

If I were to compare Marshall to anyone in the NFL, it would be Jerry Porter. Both were converted safeties in college and considered "projects" with good athletic ability for their size (they're both about the same height & weight). It took Porter three years (plus playing behind two future HOFers) to become a solid WR2/3 for the Raiders. Plus he played tougher competition than Marshall did at UWV, I figure it will be at least three years before Marshall becomes an everydown starter.

The one problem with the Porter comparison is that Porter is just a freak physically. He has the size, but also has great speed and a HUGE vertical. He was about a 4.45 guy. At this point, I don't think he's progressed all that much as a WR, but gets by at times on that freakish physical ability.If Marshall is more like 4.5 - 4.6, is he really going to be able to get by on that physical ability? He needs to progress as a WR more than Porter has to be successful, in all liklihood.

Marshall ran a 4.45 at his pro day.

 

[Texasmouth]

I thought Chad jackson was the next T.O.? How many next T.O.'s are there?

 

[-OZ-]

Is it me or there a "next TO" in every draft the past three years or so? It seems to revolve around finding a crazy athletic and big WR from a small school and you can find someone like that every year, but chances of that guy being the next TO are slim to none.

Can anyone recant the list of recent "Next TO's?" I would be interested. It would include guys like Tyron Calico...was Vincent Jackson one? Clarence Moore possibly? I cannot keep track of them all.

Have you seen Marshall play?

FWIW Bloom, I haven't, but I did see Calico play a few times. He looked every bit the part as the next TO. Inconsistent, but skills were there.

I never liked the Calico to TO reference. Calico never produced numbers at the college level despite playing at a small school against less althetic db's. I don't think he ever sniffed 800 receiving yards in a season in college. Even in a run first offense, that should not have been hard at Middle Tennessee. He did not play well or physically in post season practices. He was not physical and did not fight for the ball. Many got way way to worked up about his measurables. In a draft that featured the far more physical Andre Johnson and Anquan Boldin, anyone who was calling Calico the next TO was tryiing to hard to be brilliant.

Could have something to do with the "smaller Tennessee school" connection. BTW, has anyone seen this: http://www.bigcatchcalico.com

 

[Kai's Hero]

Why dont i see him going and any of the 1st 3 rounds of most NFL mock drafts......

Curious to why most mocks have other wr's going over him aside from Chad-Holmes-Moss

Whats with this?

Because who the hell would want another T.O.???