Prowler
Footballguy
Denver has reached agreement with TE Owen Daniels, per sources. (Adam SchefterVerified account @AdamSchefter 4m4 minutes ago )
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Owen Daniels Signs with Denver (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Prowler
- Start date
Shutout
Footballguy
seriously?
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Green is going to remain the main blocking TE. I could easily see Daniels being at least a low-end TE1 with Manning, considering how he looked for BAL last year. Do you not remember Jacob Tamme?
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JohnnyU
Footballguy
Pwingles
Footballguy
Ill just have to trade him in my dyno for whatever i can get before then lol
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Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
fantasy points to be had as DEN pass catching TE.....Green should keep same minimal role as last year....heading into a fantasy year with some questions at TE after Gronk and Graham I could see Daniels TE ADP creeping up very quickly.....I could see him being drafted in top 10 and putting up stats to back it up....thats quite a leap from bordering on being undrafted in some leagues.......
Mr. Irrelevant
IBL Representative
Have to hand it to ya, Ref, you absolutely nailed this one in the WSLs. Orange Julius out, Daniels takes his place, just like you predicted ... bravo.
Oh, and bump Pitta.
Shutout
Footballguy
Yeah, I remember. I just don't
Think these Broncos are going to be what we have become accustomed to the past few years.
Yeah, Manning's TE's have always been huge, but 17 years isn't really a trend you can feel comfortable gambling on.
Shutout
Footballguy
Just saying Father Time is undefeated and we saw signs of change last year. New coaching staff, emergence of a rb that appears ideal for that new coaching staff, and, not least on the list, Owen Daniels isn't julius Thomas. It's not like they just got a jimmy graham type talent. They got a 32 year old tight end who is a clear #4 option.Freelove said:
In years past, he was the legit #2 receiving option. Last year he played with Torrey smith and Steve smith. Now he's playing with slightly better receiving options.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Then you have a terrible memory. From weeks 8-17 in 2010 (the weeks he started) he was the #2 scoring TE.
Now the TE landscape has changed but my point was that Manning can make anyone into a TE1.
lod01
Footballguy
There is no doubt that if he survives Manning hanging him out to dry, he will catch plenty of TDs. Kubiak is the HC and the TE always gets a lot of redzone TD looks.
It was tongue in cheek, I actually picked up that scrub that year.
My point is that this isn't "huge", unless you had him at the end of your roster in 2 TE leagues or something.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Then you're not good at being tongue-in-cheek.
I'm not saying Daniels is a star now. But he's rostered everywhere, pretty much was free, and now he could easily be a low-end TE1. That is important, even if it doesn't meet your definition of "huge" (which was someone else's description, not mine).
ILUVBEER99
Footballguy
DropKick
Footballguy
I agree... Granted Manning was hurt but we saw a more balanced offense down the stretch last season. They ran the ball and very well. Elway finally won his two SBs with a running game and I wouldn't be surprised if we see a more conservative offense next year. With Thomas and Sanders and maybe a young receiver stepping up, I don't know that we can automatically assume Manning's TE is a fantasy stud.
You responded to someone who didn't agree with the "huge" post.
He's certainly not rostered everywhere, but I won't try to stop you from getting all tingly about him.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
I wouldn't expect a stud without injuries at WR. I'd say a low-end TE1 finish is realistic. 60-600-6 or so. Hopefully better.All I've said is that considering he's rostered everywhere and was probably picked up for free, he could easily become a free low-end TE1. There's such an hodge-podge of guys in that range, and the young hyped TE's so rarely actually break out, that you could move a more "valuable" name for help elsewhere and have a replacement-level TE on your roster already.
You've basically got:
Gronk
Graham
Kelce
Bennett/Gates/JT?/Cameron??
And then like 15 guys. One of these will be Daniels and he's basically free.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Don't try to exaggerate what I'm saying.
He's certainly not rostered everywhere, but I won't try to stop you from getting all tingly about him.
He's rostered in every one of my leagues, only by me in two. They're deep leagues but not ridiculously so.
nightmare
Footballguy
Goal line is just one part of the red zone. He could be terrible on the rest of the field
and still be FF relevent.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
See, this is the point I was making in this thread. From free on the ww to startable TE just like that.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
32 y/o TE's on the decline don't magically resurrect their careers no matter who their QB is. Green has always been a stab in the dark if Julius left. Now that he has age and upside win the value argument. What you have in your hands is MAYBE a bye week fill in TE. If you guys are going that nuts over him you need to see if others in your league feel the same and unload him fast. As for Green owners being pissed, c'mon. You knew they weren't going to walk into the season with just him, just like when they brought in Tamme and Joel Dreesen when Manning arrived. Manning TE's have high upside but I would not be betting on Daniels as that guy. If anything I am more comfortable with trying to hold onto Green now because they aren't trying to go get Charles Clay, bring back JT, sign Jordan Cameron or trade for Jimmy Graham.
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
He's never caught 8 TD's his whole career, he only caught over 800 yds once. I must be taking crazy pills if I'm starting to think that's going to happen at 32. Lets come back down to earth. Guy is no better than John Carlson starting in Arizona last year.
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
its really more about the system than just saying he is the 4th best "talent/option" on the team....in Kubiak's offense the TE may be a higher option even if not the most talented receiver on the team......bottom line....Kubiak offense plus Manning history of liking TE has Daniel's ceiling pretty darn high....this offense will score points and Daniels is likely to get a pretty signifiicant piece of that pie....
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
there is so much wrong with thiis post.....Green was resigned because he is one of the best blocking TE's in the league.....and that is why he was getting looks from other teams......it wasn't because of his pass catching.......if you can't see that Daniels was brought in to be THE move TE/pass catcher, that is your mistake....the math adds up here.....if you think Daniels is done at 32 and in decline, thats your call, but I can tell you one organization took less than 5 minutes of free agency to disagree with you.....
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
you seem to give very little credit to change in situation.......Julius Thomas probably still good for averaging 12 TD's a year huh...?
Hmmm...and Green was signed for more. I wonder what that means? Ref, you rely on the Broncos management disagreeing with the other posters views. Any chance, in disagreeing with yours, that Broncos management sees more receiving in Green's future? Maybe.
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
if you chose to base your projections for fantasy stats on the amount of money they are signed for.....go for it.......
Green struggles with the route tree and was resigned here in DEN because he can block.....really well.....odds are he will improve on his 6 receptions from last year......hard to go backwards......and that was with Julius missing a ton of time.....Daniels was not brought in for his blocking.....you do the math.......there are fantasy points here and one could argue daniels is in line for one of his best fantasy seasons ever.....guarantee his ADP will start reflecting that no matter how his bank account looks compared to Green's.....
Daniels lacks that ability to get hit, get up, and move on like nothing happened. It's oddly common how many NFL TEs can take a huge hit and shake it off like nothing happened. Daniels is....well, he's probably normal. In a TEs world though that makes him almost not tough.
The Ravens went through some bad injuries with their talented TEs and the Texans started to have their share when he was finishing up there. I think Kubiak may be aware of this problem.
Last I looked Charles Clay was available and I don't figure he's uber expensive. To use him as an example, I think the Broncos replace Thomas with a couple TEs and not just one and hope he makes it through.
Daniels has an excellent understanding of offense and is a very good player at times. I think Kubiak is aware of his limitations though
nightmare
Footballguy
Z Miller was making insane money in Seattle as the blocking TE. Daniels has
limitations and 800 yards is probably his ceiling but at the goal line you have to
like his chances. That is the one place on the field where receivers don't get beat up
compared to trying to get extra yards after the catch.
limitations and 800 yards is probably his ceiling but at the goal line you have to
like his chances. That is the one place on the field where receivers don't get beat up
compared to trying to get extra yards after the catch.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Bojang0301
Omar4Heisman
We'll revisit whether it was crazy in a year or so I suppose. TE's crash harder than RB's do. Daniels is quality depth to the Broncos. No more, no less. If Green does ride pine or stay in blocking these were Jacob Tamme's numbers without the emergence of JT I expect no better from Daniels. He'll hold value until he reaches the season because of the mystique of Manning TE's but consider yourself lucky if you grabbed him cheap and sell him for all you can get, hell, whatever you can get.
16 52 85 555 10.7 36 2
BoltzNBrew
Footballguy
What is his value in terms of Rookie picks?
chad in Indy
Footballguy
I haven't watched Green play much, but his measurables are slightly better than Thomas in almost every category. One inch shorter, but heavier in weight, better 40, vertical, broad jump, and cone drill.
Some have stated he struggles with the route tree. If that is true, and he can improve, he should be able to step in to Thomas' vacated role very well. Actually, even more so since he would most likely be on the field more due to his superior blocking skills (more opportunity for when Manning audibles out of a run).
I won't draft either to be my starting TE, so I'd rather take a shot on Green with a late round flyer than pick up Daniels.
Some have stated he struggles with the route tree. If that is true, and he can improve, he should be able to step in to Thomas' vacated role very well. Actually, even more so since he would most likely be on the field more due to his superior blocking skills (more opportunity for when Manning audibles out of a run).
I won't draft either to be my starting TE, so I'd rather take a shot on Green with a late round flyer than pick up Daniels.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I'm not saying Daniels will be anything special, but I'd be willing to bet a fairly large sum that he puts up better numbers than John Carlson did with Arizona.
Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
Denver is basically out of $$$$$ at this point unless they cut somebody and free up some cash......any more moves they make will be pretty minor......Clay is in demand, that would not be a minor move....unlike last year (and because of last year) what you see is basically what you get right now in DEN.....the focus will be things like replacing Franklin on the o line and Pot Roast on D....
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This is what I'm getting at. Yes, his value certainly increased and this is probably the best-case-scenario for owners, but it increased from worthless to next to worthless (speaking in terms of trade value- he has more value as your back-up TE, but that's just not worth much of anything to other owners).
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Stinkin Ref
IBL Representative
throwing out numbers for guys like Tamme or Dressen or whoever means nothing here......with Thomas and his skill set out the game plan at TE changed for DEN.....and you have to remember that was also under a different coaching staff than the one that is in place now.....Kubiak and his system is very TE friendly and they brought in a guy that knows it like the back of his hand.....I'm not saying Daniels is the end all be all but right now I think you can do worse....in a 12 team league, Daniels is a TE1.....and his ADP will start going up......if you can find a Daniels owner that believes like some in here do that Green is sliding into those TE stats.....I'd snag Daniels from him and you will have at minimum a low end TE1 with a ceiling that could creep into the upper half....
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