Patriots QB News (1 Viewer)

[David Yudkin]

I'm hearing the Patriots like Kevin O'Connell way more than Matt Cassel and IF THINGS DON'T CHANGE O'Connell should be ready to start 10/26 at home against the Rams.

Of course, Cassel could start moving the offense and the team could start putting up way more points between now and then (I doubt it, but it could happen).

I'm also hearing that the Pats are not actively looking to acquire another QB at the moment, and if they are it is being done incredibly hush hush.

Don't shoot me, I'm only the messenger.

 

[kd1]

i understand that you're the team insider, but the oct 26 date defies logic to me.

they gave o'connel some reps last week when cassel stunk up the joint. i'd imagine if cassel were to do the same this week, there's no reason that they wouldnt give o'connel a shot as early as week 6.

either way, it doesn't make sense that the pats would just be resigned to letting cassel fail miserably for 3 more games in a row before making the switch, especially if they are that high on o'connell.

 

[David Yudkin]

i understand that you're the team insider, but the oct 26 date defies logic to me. they gave o'connel some reps last week when cassel stunk up the joint. i'd imagine if cassel were to do the same this week, there's no reason that they wouldnt give o'connel a shot as early as week 6.either way, it doesn't make sense that the pats would just be resigned to letting cassel fail miserably for 3 more games in a row before making the switch, especially if they are that high on o'connell.

As I prefaced, a lot will depend on what happens between now and then. If they lose miserably against SF and get crushed by SD, then O'Connell could start against Denver (which was the game I projected him at awhile ago). He needs to continue to learn the playbook and hardly had any reps in training camp (as few thought he would need to play at all this year).But I am BEING TOLD that the target date is mostly the Rams game. So that is not merely my opinion.

 

[davearm]

Curious how the Pats coaches can pinpoint 4 weeks at the time needed to prepare this guy to start. Why not 3? Or 5? Just kinda odd.

Also odd is that the guy wouldn't be good to go, basically now. He's been in the system for a while, right?

 

[SeniorVBDStudent]

Curious how the Pats coaches can pinpoint 4 weeks at the time needed to prepare this guy to start. Why not 3? Or 5? Just kinda odd.Also odd is that the guy wouldn't be good to go, basically now. He's been in the system for a while, right?

Are you talking about the rookie? If so, ....

 

[David Yudkin]

Curious how the Pats coaches can pinpoint 4 weeks at the time needed to prepare this guy to start. Why not 3? Or 5? Just kinda odd.Also odd is that the guy wouldn't be good to go, basically now. He's been in the system for a while, right?

O'Connell is a rookie that got limited time in training camp, as Cassel and Gutierrez were battling for the backup spot. O'Connell looked the best of the tree in preseason camps and apparently is looking the best of the three in practice.To answer your hypothetical question, I do not believe the coaching staff has an air tight agenda that says PLAYER X will need 4 weeks to prepare. I would think they have a point where that player knows enough plays to get by to be able to start. When they feel he can absorb enough to be able to game plan around, then he would be a candidate to start.IIRC, the Pats rotated around 30 offensive plays that they used in the preseason. I believe they gameplan 125-130 plays each week tailored against each specific opponent. So it's not as easy at is sounds to be able to run the Pats offense.

 

[EBF]

I grabbed O'Connell in a lot of my rookie drafts this year. He's a good developmental prospect, but I doubt he's ready to start yet.

On the plus side, he's a good athlete and he has a lot of experience running for his life after being a multi year starter at SDSU.

 

[TommyGilmore]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:

- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)

- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)

- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)

- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)

- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)

Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

 

[fruity pebbles]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

Reason his numbers look decent is he never throws the ball more than 5 yards downfield.

 

[prymetyme25]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

I like Cassel to but come on you got Randy Moss. Read the sig............

 

[tombonneau]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

I think Cassel is a fine backup QB. He's shown that he is capable of winning a couple of games if the starter goes down. And if Brady were coming back after the bye, that would be just fine; however, that isn't happening and the jury is still out if Cassel has what it takes to be a full-time NFL starting QB.Unfortunately, very few teams have the luxury of a backup QB who is a capable of being full-time NFL starter. In fact, there are several teams in the league who entered the season with starting QBs that aren't capable of being full-time NFL starters.I agree with DY that in a few weeks, if Cassel cannot move the offense and get the team consistently scoring 20+ points, they will have to make a move. The timeline above seems to make sense.

 

[blake]

looking at o'connell in my league now with palmer not looking so good...thank you for this thread.

 

[David Yudkin]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

All that matters is how many points get on the scoreboard. They rank tied for 29th in points per game and 28th in ypg. All this against teams that were a collective 9-39 last year.I am pretty sure they did not expect video game numbers like last year. But their scoring is down 55%, their yardage is down 34%, and time of possession has fallen by 3 minutes a game.

 

[Road Warriors]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

Looking beyond the QB stats, has he moved the offense? Led scoring drives? Converted 3rd downs?David Carr, for years, had one of the highest completion %s, lowest interception ratios, etc, but was an awful NFL QB, because he would complete 3 yard passes on 3rd and 5. At the end of the day, its about production, and Cassel hasn't shown much production.From what limited viewing I've had, Cassel looks timid and indecisive. Maybe thats to be expected of a backup QB, especially one with Cassel's resume, but NE has elite offensive talent at other positions, and should be able to be a productive offense, but they haven't been yet. If the coaching staff thinks the kid looks better, I'm inclined to trust their judgement. He may be no better, but they'll have a hard time winning games with the offense as it appears to be under Cassel, so why not give it a try.

 

[Phlash]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

Those numbers seem good, but he's been incapable of moving the ball downfield. Obviously, no one can replace Tom Brady, but Cassell throws few passes beyond 15-20 yards, and its those plays that open up the running lanes and room for Wes and Faulk. His 6.2 ypa are indicative of how poorly he's stretching the field. He hasn't put up a 20+ point performance yet, which is really worrying considering the weapons he has on offense. Guys like Moss, Welker, Watson, Gaffney, Faulk, Maroney, and Morris provide a good set of weapons that a somewhat competent quarterback would be able to score at least a few touchdowns a game with. Less than 20 points a game is not going to cut it in this league.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

I'm really surprised at the Cassel hate, both here and on the Patriots staff. He's performing as well as can be expected for a backup QB:- completing 66.7% of passes (5th in NFL)- 1 INT for every 72 passes thrown (8th in NFL)- 1 TD per every 36 passes thrown (middle of the pack)- 2:1 TD/INT ratio (11th in NFL)- 87.0 passer rating (middle of the pack)Sure, he gets sacked a lot and hasn't thrown very many TD passes.....but that's par for the course with a backup QB.

Good data, but we're talking about the Patriots. Middle of the pack, few TD passes and getting sacked a lot might fly in Atlanta, but not New England. They're going to be looking for the guy that can excel if/when they need him to step up imo. Cassel had an enviable job for quite a while now. Maybe now it's a somewhat unfair position. But decent isn't good enough.

 

[ourmanflint]

Can O'Connell be that much worse than Flacco or Matt Ryan?

Hell at least those guys will wing it down field a few times a game.

I wonder how many bombs Ryan would have completed by now to Moss.

 

[Raider Nation]

Thanks, DY. Picked up O'Connell last week when you tipped us off about him in the Moss thread.

Speaking of Moss, now I have to hope that he hasn't mentally shut it down after losing Brady.

 

[CommuterMan]

I'm hearing the Patriots like Kevin O'Connell way more than Matt Cassel and IF THINGS DON'T CHANGE O'Connell should be ready to start 10/26 at home against the Rams.

Of course, Cassel could start moving the offense and the team could start putting up way more points between now and then (I doubt it, but it could happen).

I'm also hearing that the Pats are not actively looking to acquire another QB at the moment, and if they are it is being done incredibly hush hush.

Don't shoot me, I'm only the messenger.

Any speculation on who that QB might be? FA or possible trade acquisition? The Pats seemed pretty indifferent to the FA out there a few weeks ago and I'd be curious as to what changed their mindset.

 

[NFL Sunday Ticket]

I'm hearing the Patriots like Kevin O'Connell way more than Matt Cassel and IF THINGS DON'T CHANGE O'Connell should be ready to start 10/26 at home against the Rams.

Of course, Cassel could start moving the offense and the team could start putting up way more points between now and then (I doubt it, but it could happen).

I'm also hearing that the Pats are not actively looking to acquire another QB at the moment, and if they are it is being done incredibly hush hush.

Don't shoot me, I'm only the messenger.

Any speculation on who that QB might be? FA or possible trade acquisition? The Pats seemed pretty indifferent to the FA out there a few weeks ago and I'd be curious as to what changed their mindset.

speculation on who that qb may be that they are not actively looking at?

 

[yellowdog]

I'm hearing the Patriots like Kevin O'Connell way more than Matt Cassel and IF THINGS DON'T CHANGE O'Connell should be ready to start 10/26 at home against the Rams.

Of course, Cassel could start moving the offense and the team could start putting up way more points between now and then (I doubt it, but it could happen).

I'm also hearing that the Pats are not actively looking to acquire another QB at the moment, and if they are it is being done incredibly hush hush.

Don't shoot me, I'm only the messenger.

Any speculation on who that QB might be? FA or possible trade acquisition? The Pats seemed pretty indifferent to the FA out there a few weeks ago and I'd be curious as to what changed their mindset.

 

[Bermuda_Chub]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

 

[NFL Sunday Ticket]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

well, hopefully bill reads this or he may make the worst decision of his career...

 

[Bermuda_Chub]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

well, hopefully bill reads this or he may make the worst decision of his career...

Maybe Yudkin can email him the link.

 

[David Yudkin]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

I agree that overall O'Connell didn't do gangbusters in the preseason, but on a few plays he did look good and threw a couple of nice passes. He did not look like the second coming of Brett Favre or Dan Marino, that's for sure.His totals were 15 for 32 for 140 yards with 1 TD and 2 INT, but that was playing almost excusively with 2nd and 3rd stringers and guys not even on the roster anymore. He did add a slight spark by scrambling, gaining 46 yards on 7 carries.Apparently the Pats like what they see in practice.I suspect that the Pats master plan was that Cassel would have been OK had Brady gotten dinged up and they needed someone for part of a game or an isolated start. But I'm pretty sure they are not thrilled at the prospect of having Cassel be an every game starter.

 

[David Yudkin]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

well, hopefully bill reads this or he may make the worst decision of his career...

Maybe Yudkin can email him the link.

I can't get to Bill, but I have had questions asked to and answered by Pats players before (which is kinda cool).

 

[RenegadeGM]

I look at this in terms of dynasty or redraft.

If you have a dead roster spot in a redraft, maybe O'Connell is worth a shot. Problem is, with bye weeks in full swing, those roster spots become valuable. So maybe you try to wait a few weeks and gamble nobody else is reading DY's threads, as I haven't seen the news anywhere else yet. Maybe you can get him in, say, two weeks.

In a dynasty, O'Connell is a tough add. Even if he comes in and does reasonably well for the last half of the season, he's not starting next year. Unless you're a Brady owner, chances are you'd have to cut him loose after next year's rookie/FA draft, so he'd be a tough guy to roster... unless you're desperate for immediate help at the QB position.

Great info as always, David.

 

[Ron_Mexico]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

I don't think anyone can make a sound judgment on O'Connellbased on the equivalent of one preseason game worth of statistics..

 

[Bermuda_Chub]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

I don't think anyone can make a sound judgment on O'Connellbased on the equivalent of one preseason game worth of statistics..

Fair enough, but he didn't look like he belonged at the Dog Show. If you know what I mean, Ron.

 

[Ron_Mexico]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

I don't think anyone can make a sound judgment on O'Connellbased on the equivalent of one preseason game worth of statistics..

Fair enough, but he didn't look like he belonged at the Dog Show. If you know what I mean, Ron.

I do understand, Chubby.Here is some fresh news on the issue...Published Tue Sep 30 9:40:41 a.m. PT 2008(KFFL) New England Patriots head coach Bill Belichick said Tuesday, Sept. 30, that he remains confident in QB Matt Cassel leading the team for the rest of the season. "I think Matt had a good week last week, and had a good practice yesterday," Belichick said. "Offensively, collectively, we just have to do everything a little bit better. I'm confident in all the players we put out there.".Probably just rhetoric.

 

[David Yudkin]

Strike me down for blaspheming the QB projection powers of the Patriots, but I didn't think O'Connell looked better than pedestrian in the preseason.

I don't think anyone can make a sound judgment on O'Connellbased on the equivalent of one preseason game worth of statistics..

Fair enough, but he didn't look like he belonged at the Dog Show. If you know what I mean, Ron.

I do understand, Chubby.Here is some fresh news on the issue...Published Tue Sep 30 9:40:41 a.m. PT 2008(KFFL) New England Patriots head coach Bill Belichick said Tuesday, Sept. 30, that he remains confident in QB Matt Cassel leading the team for the rest of the season. "I think Matt had a good week last week, and had a good practice yesterday," Belichick said. "Offensively, collectively, we just have to do everything a little bit better. I'm confident in all the players we put out there.".Probably just rhetoric.

Run through the Belichick coach speak translator: "If we win all our games, we will stick with Cassel. If we are losing and offensively we don't start doing a lot better, then we will make a change."It's a bit like a husband not telling his wife he is going to have an affair. He can't come out and say his wife isn't cutting it, so he says everything is fine and then goes and looks for other options.Cassel will either have to step up or they will give O'Connell a shot.

 

[blake]

I look at this in terms of dynasty or redraft.If you have a dead roster spot in a redraft, maybe O'Connell is worth a shot. Problem is, with bye weeks in full swing, those roster spots become valuable. So maybe you try to wait a few weeks and gamble nobody else is reading DY's threads, as I haven't seen the news anywhere else yet. Maybe you can get him in, say, two weeks.In a dynasty, O'Connell is a tough add. Even if he comes in and does reasonably well for the last half of the season, he's not starting next year. Unless you're a Brady owner, chances are you'd have to cut him loose after next year's rookie/FA draft, so he'd be a tough guy to roster... unless you're desperate for immediate help at the QB position.Great info as always, David.

couldn't agree more. i'm in a bye week scramble as well and i have carson palmer taking up a roster spot, so now i'm looking for a 3rd QB. problem is, i don't really have the roster space with the bye weeks and i'd like to try to gamble on some other fliers too, so it makes it tough. i can only hope the patriots don't make any kind of an announcement for a few weeks.also agreed - thanks for this thread.

 

[Bermuda_Chub]

This will be the most interesting regular season Patriots game in a long time. I have no idea what to expect of them. Going over the Dolphins game film for two weeks must have been like Clockwork Orange.

 

[Ron_Mexico]

This will be the most interesting regular season Patriots game in a long time. I have no idea what to expect of them. Going over the Dolphins game film for two weeks must have been like Clockwork Orange.

I'm heading to SF for the game this weekend.As a lifelong Pats fan, I am very intrigued by this game..

 

[blake]

curious about people's ideas about O'Connell's value now as opposed to someone like, say, Joe Flacco. Flacco isn't great, but at least he is playing now, but the QB position is the only thing that has changed in NE's offense from last year to this. With those weapons (Moss, Welker, Gaffney, etc.), maybe O'Connell's value is the same as Flacco's if you can afford to wait 4 weeks?

 

[tombonneau]

This will be the most interesting regular season Patriots game in a long time. I have no idea what to expect of them. Going over the Dolphins game film for two weeks must have been like Clockwork Orange.

I'm heading to SF for the game this weekend.As a lifelong Pats fan, I am very intrigued by this game..

Another lifelong fan who will be attending as well. Like it or not, this SF game will probably dictate the course of the season. If they look bad & lose, I'd say they are cooked in SD as well and it's 2-3 and on the outside looking in; however, if they look, good, move the ball on offense and win, the playoffs are still well within reach.Can't say I thought when the schedule came out that Wk 5 @ SF was a make or break game, but that's the way it's looking ...

 

[David Yudkin]

Can't say I thought when the schedule came out that Wk 5 @ SF was a make or break game, but that's the way it's looking ...

I think we are getting ahead of ourselves and getting a bit overdramatic. It remains to be seen if Buffalo is for real, and if the Pats win ugly and the Bills get beat by the Cards (which is what the odds are set at currently), then the Pats are right back to a tie for first (at least in the loss column).At this point, Pats fans should be more concerned by the defense than the offense. No one is hurt on the defense and they got smoked by the Phins. I am willing to give them a mulligan because they have had trouble with Miami in the past, but they need to bounce back to their allowing teens ofr points or they will be in for a long season.

 

[Bri]

Star

On another team in 2009 after a trade

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

Have a feeling that, after Cassell's 22/32 259/1/2 performance, bringing O'Connell as the new savior of this club is more of an unrealistic notion.

Not saying Cassell is playing like a world-beater; but if he can put up average numbers and continue to find Moss, he gives this team the best chance to win. It's not as if the running game, or even the defense -- with only one sack today -- can say they greatly contributed to today's win vs the 49ers.

We'll see how Cassell fares against a tougher opponent, but I really can't see how O'Connell takes the reins without Cassell being gawd-awful, rather than just mediocre.

 

[-baller]

It's not as if the running game, or even the defense -- with only one sack today -- can say they greatly contributed to today's win vs the 49ers.

 

[Bri]

Have a feeling that, after Cassell's 22/32 259/1/2 performance, bringing O'Connell as the new savior of this club is more of an unrealistic notion. Not saying Cassell is playing like a world-beater; but if he can put up average numbers and continue to find Moss, he gives this team the best chance to win. It's not as if the running game, or even the defense -- with only one sack today -- can say they greatly contributed to today's win vs the 49ers.We'll see how Cassell fares against a tougher opponent, but I really can't see how O'Connell takes the reins without Cassell being gawd-awful, rather than just mediocre.

the 2 INTs were early, he settled down well.O'Connell has to cool his jets now

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

It's not as if the running game, or even the defense -- with only one sack today -- can say they greatly contributed to today's win vs the 49ers.

Perhaps you'd care to enlighten me? Hard to gauge any meaningful contribution you thought you were giving here without actual verbiage.Didn't see the game, but it seems that this game was won on offense -- looks like the Pats took the bye week to rework some variance into their offensive playcalling, including some direct snaps that led to at least one Faulk TD, rekeying the deep pass to Moss in the gameplan, and offensive ball control -- the Pats seemingly had the ball for 32 minutes through the first three quarters.With O'Sullivan not being able to be incredibly efficient on converting 3rd downs, still looks like he hung 3 TDs on the Pats.So, Sage of the Smilies, what did you see in this game that apparently told you that the the Pats stellar running game and D were the conclusive deciding factor here, rather than an overall balanced offensive effort that controlled the clock once Cassell and Moss put decisive points on the board?

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

Interested to hear if Yudkin has any input after this week's game...

 

[Ron_Mexico]

This will be the most interesting regular season Patriots game in a long time. I have no idea what to expect of them. Going over the Dolphins game film for two weeks must have been like Clockwork Orange.

I'm heading to SF for the game this weekend.As a lifelong Pats fan, I am very intrigued by this game..

Another lifelong fan who will be attending as well. Like it or not, this SF game will probably dictate the course of the season. If they look bad & lose, I'd say they are cooked in SD as well and it's 2-3 and on the outside looking in; however, if they look, good, move the ball on offense and win, the playoffs are still well within reach.Can't say I thought when the schedule came out that Wk 5 @ SF was a make or break game, but that's the way it's looking ...

Great game.Freaking weather was awesome.Cassell was pressured quite a bit,especially in the first half. I thought he handled himself well,and definitely bought himself some more time as the starter.The Kevin O'Connell experiment may be on the back burner for a little while, imo..

 

[Grigs Allmoon]

Interested to hear if Yudkin has any input after this week's game...

 

[David Yudkin]

Interested to hear if Yudkin has any input after this week's game...

I don't think anything really changed. O'Connell still getting ramped up to be able to take over if needed. We'll have to see where the team is in a few weeks and how Cassel is doing then. If the team is still whatever and one loss and he is playing well then they would be foolish to make a change. But they would be equally foolish to not get O'Connell more practice either way.

 

[ItsOnlytheRiver]

Interested to hear if Yudkin has any input after this week's game...

I don't think anything really changed. O'Connell still getting ramped up to be able to take over if needed. We'll have to see where the team is in a few weeks and how Cassel is doing then. If the team is still whatever and one loss and he is playing well then they would be foolish to make a change. But they would be equally foolish to not get O'Connell more practice either way.

Thanks, keep us posted if you can!