Pennington to stay in NY? (1 Viewer)

[Z-Dog]

Newsday (might require registration) is reporting that Pennington has told his agent, Tom Condon, to do what it takes to keep him in green - Jets green that is, no $$$ green.

 

[Reaper]

Jets new OC says he doesn't like the Dink and Dunk game and wants to have a more wide open offense....

I can't see Chad winning the QB spot in a wide open offense before the 1st surgery...

He's learning like his 5th offense in 6 years and now it looks like the worst one to match his "abilities"....

I think he's nothing more than a liabilty on the books right now that they need to write off.

Or... Maybe they can trade him for a 1st round pick

 

[Evilgrin 72]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit. I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

 

[Z-Dog]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit. I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

Trading him would have the same cap hit as cutting him.

 

[Reaper]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit.  I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

Trading him would have the same cap hit as cutting him.

Yup - It just doesn't matter...It's a rebuilding year - EAT IT NOW.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit.  I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

Trading him would have the same cap hit as cutting him.

However, if they have given up on him as their QB, taking the cap hit would be more palatable if they gain something of value in return.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit.  I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

Trading him would have the same cap hit as cutting him.

However, if they have given up on him as their QB, taking the cap hit would be more palatable if they gain something of value in return.

There isn't one team that would be willing to take a chance on him at his current salary, let alone give up anything for him in return.

 

[Reaper]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit.  I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

Trading him would have the same cap hit as cutting him.

However, if they have given up on him as their QB, taking the cap hit would be more palatable if they gain something of value in return.

How could they possibly get something of value for Pennington.What would you suggest? a 7th round pick?

 

[Evilgrin 72]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit.  I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

Trading him would have the same cap hit as cutting him.

However, if they have given up on him as their QB, taking the cap hit would be more palatable if they gain something of value in return.

There isn't one team that would be willing to take a chance on him at his current salary, let alone give up anything for him in return.

Hence, the (good luck) at the end of that sentence. It can't hurt to shop him if you're just going to cut him anyway - if there's even an infintesimal chance that another team might look at him as someone who can contribute, it's worth at least exploring.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

If they cut him, they take a $10 million cap hit.  I don't see how they can do that, he either has to restructure or they have to trade him (good luck)

Trading him would have the same cap hit as cutting him.

However, if they have given up on him as their QB, taking the cap hit would be more palatable if they gain something of value in return.

How could they possibly get something of value for Pennington.What would you suggest? a 7th round pick?

If the decision is made to cut him, would you rather do that or take the same cap hit by trading him and get a 7th round pick back?Something > nothing.

 

[David Yudkin]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him? Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

 

[Evilgrin 72]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him? Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

I imagine the NFLPA would immediately file a grievance, and the negative publicity generated by such a move would all but preclude the Jets from ever being able to renegotiate a contract or sign another free agent for about the next decade.

 

[diesel7982]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him?  Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

I imagine the NFLPA would immediately file a grievance, and the negative publicity generated by such a move would all but preclude the Jets from ever being able to renegotiate a contract or sign another free agent for about the next decade.

That, and if they did restructure, Penny would probably get his salary(at the lowered level) guaranteed for the next few years.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him?  Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

I imagine the NFLPA would immediately file a grievance, and the negative publicity generated by such a move would all but preclude the Jets from ever being able to renegotiate a contract or sign another free agent for about the next decade.

That, and if they did restructure, Penny would probably get his salary(at the lowered level) guaranteed for the next few years.

Absolutely. I imagine that would be a prerequisite to any re-negotiation to begin with.

 

[David Yudkin]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him?  Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

I imagine the NFLPA would immediately file a grievance, and the negative publicity generated by such a move would all but preclude the Jets from ever being able to renegotiate a contract or sign another free agent for about the next decade.

Let's say, hypothetically, they did renegotiate but then decided to cut him in training camp--even if he had GUARANTEED money coming. Give him a new deal now at a $1 million a year guaranteed for three years with incentives. If my math is right, that would still be a better cap hit than if they just cut him now--and it might not even be a premeditated manuever.

 

[Warpig]

I don't understand why everyone is so eager just to kick this guy to the curb. He has shown in the past when he's able to stay healthy he's a good qb. Sure, he's had some bad luck the last two years with injury but plenty of other good players have had a few injury years as well. If he is willing to restructure and stay with NY why not keep him? There isn't a single qb available out there that is head and shoulders better than he is. Drew Brees? He has shoulder issues of his own. Patrick Ramsey? He couldn't even keep an old Mark Brunell on the bench. Same for Volek and the others. It seems like everyone is so anxious to replace Pennington with a career backup qb. Now if they were to draft a qb I wouldn't be surprised. But anything else wouldn't be an upgrade at the position.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I don't understand why everyone is so eager just to kick this guy to the curb. He has shown in the past when he's able to stay healthy he's a good qb. Sure, he's had some bad luck the last two years with injury but plenty of other good players have had a few injury years as well. If he is willing to restructure and stay with NY why not keep him? There isn't a single qb available out there that is head and shoulders better than he is. Drew Brees? He has shoulder issues of his own. Patrick Ramsey? He couldn't even keep an old Mark Brunell on the bench. Same for Volek and the others. It seems like everyone is so anxious to replace Pennington with a career backup qb. Now if they were to draft a qb I wouldn't be surprised. But anything else wouldn't be an upgrade at the position.

Two rotator cuff tears and surgeries for a QB who didn't have alot of arm strength already = toast.I just don't see a chance of Chad ever getting his form back. I hope I am wrong, but I think he'll be forced to call it a career.

 

[Righetti]

as a Jet fan.. i'd rather see Jay Fiedler as the starting QB next year and taking the cap hit to cut penny this year... rebuild and do so by drafting the Brickshaw with 1.04

 

[Warpig]

Two rotator cuff tears and surgeries for a QB who didn't have alot of arm strength already = toast.

I just don't see a chance of Chad ever getting his form back. I hope I am wrong, but I think he'll be forced to call it a career.

Haven't there been MLB pitchers that have come back from numerous shoulder surgeries (rotator cuff)? Have there been any quotes by doctors that have said two rotator cuff surgeries pretty much will end an athlete's career? If a RB can come back from numerous knee surgeries, why not a qb with shoulder surgeries? I guess I'm just being optimistic for the guy. I don't see why, if he gets therapy and proper training, that he wouldn't be able to make a comeback.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

as a Jet fan.. i'd rather see Jay Fiedler as the starting QB next year and taking the cap hit to cut penny this year... rebuild and do so by drafting the Brickshaw with 1.04

The Jets already cut Fiedler. If they really wanted him to play the position, wouldn't they have re-structured instead?

 

[Z-Dog]

Two rotator cuff tears and surgeries for a QB who didn't have alot of arm strength already = toast.

I just don't see a chance of Chad ever getting his form back. I hope I am wrong, but I think he'll be forced to call it a career.

Haven't there been MLB pitchers that have come back from numerous shoulder surgeries (rotator cuff)? Have there been any quotes by doctors that have said two rotator cuff surgeries pretty much will end an athlete's career? If a RB can come back from numerous knee surgeries, why not a qb with shoulder surgeries? I guess I'm just being optimistic for the guy. I don't see why, if he gets therapy and proper training, that he wouldn't be able to make a comeback.

Rotator cuff tears are rare for QBs, but iirc, it's what essentially ended Don Majikowski and Jim McMahon's career.

 

[Righetti]

as a Jet fan.. i'd rather see Jay Fiedler as the starting QB next year and taking the cap hit to cut penny this year...  rebuild and do so by drafting the Brickshaw with 1.04

The Jets already cut Fiedler. If they really wanted him to play the position, wouldn't they have re-structured instead?

you are right.. i wasn't making a predictionI was only saying what i would have wanted them to do

 

[stbugs]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him?  Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

I imagine the NFLPA would immediately file a grievance, and the negative publicity generated by such a move would all but preclude the Jets from ever being able to renegotiate a contract or sign another free agent for about the next decade.

Let's say, hypothetically, they did renegotiate but then decided to cut him in training camp--even if he had GUARANTEED money coming. Give him a new deal now at a $1 million a year guaranteed for three years with incentives. If my math is right, that would still be a better cap hit than if they just cut him now--and it might not even be a premeditated manuever.

Doesn't the 2006 "salary" always count against the 2006 cap? I am not sure how reducing 2006 salary helps with the cap if they release him before the 2006 season (aside from the June 1st date - which is only to get the prorated bonus on the 2006 books as well) since that would mean they never paid him any 2006 salary.I think the cap hit only applies to any bonuses that are prorated over the life of the contract and because of that, no restructuring of future salaries will have any impact on salary cap hits if they release him/trade him. The only way cap hits get reduced is if the salary is restructured and the team keeps the player for future years. I don't think there is any way to wiggle out of a salary cap hit in 2006 for 2002/2003/2004/2005 bonuses if you release the player in 2006.

 

[David Yudkin]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him?  Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

I imagine the NFLPA would immediately file a grievance, and the negative publicity generated by such a move would all but preclude the Jets from ever being able to renegotiate a contract or sign another free agent for about the next decade.

Let's say, hypothetically, they did renegotiate but then decided to cut him in training camp--even if he had GUARANTEED money coming. Give him a new deal now at a $1 million a year guaranteed for three years with incentives. If my math is right, that would still be a better cap hit than if they just cut him now--and it might not even be a premeditated manuever.

Doesn't the 2006 "salary" always count against the 2006 cap? I am not sure how reducing 2006 salary helps with the cap if they release him before the 2006 season (aside from the June 1st date - which is only to get the prorated bonus on the 2006 books as well) since that would mean they never paid him any 2006 salary.I think the cap hit only applies to any bonuses that are prorated over the life of the contract and because of that, no restructuring of future salaries will have any impact on salary cap hits if they release him/trade him. The only way cap hits get reduced is if the salary is restructured and the team keeps the player for future years. I don't think there is any way to wiggle out of a salary cap hit in 2006 for 2002/2003/2004/2005 bonuses if you release the player in 2006.

Ways to eliminate salary cap charges . . .- Eliminate roster bonuses (which IIRC Pennington is due)

- Extend length of contract (thus increasing number of years to prorate signing bonus)

- Reduce the annual salary (which for Pennington is also high)

Add it all up, if the contract were to be renegotiated, theoretically the cap hit could be set up to be reduced IF they were to cut him AFTER they renegotiated--but could they get away with cutting him after they renegotiated?

 

[garyd]

There is NO way out of the approx $12 million cap hit the Jets will take in 2006 if they release Chad. That is the total amount left of unamortized signing bonus he has already received under the new contract. If he is cut or traded the whole amount hits the cap in '06. I repeat, there is NO way out of that. What all the posturing is about now is to reduce his cap charge for 2006 so they can keep him on the roster and not take the big hit. This needs to be done by March 2 at 4:00pm. For starters, he needs to postpone/defer the $3 million roster bonus due in March and agree to a lower salary than the $6 milllion he is due now.

 

[stbugs]

Out of curiousity, could the Jets sucker Pennington to renegotiate at a much lower salary say a $1 million a year, extending his contract with no upfront money, and THEN release him?  Would that get the team from eating a $10 million cap hit that they would otherwise have had to take if they cut him now?

I imagine the NFLPA would immediately file a grievance, and the negative publicity generated by such a move would all but preclude the Jets from ever being able to renegotiate a contract or sign another free agent for about the next decade.

Let's say, hypothetically, they did renegotiate but then decided to cut him in training camp--even if he had GUARANTEED money coming. Give him a new deal now at a $1 million a year guaranteed for three years with incentives. If my math is right, that would still be a better cap hit than if they just cut him now--and it might not even be a premeditated manuever.

Doesn't the 2006 "salary" always count against the 2006 cap? I am not sure how reducing 2006 salary helps with the cap if they release him before the 2006 season (aside from the June 1st date - which is only to get the prorated bonus on the 2006 books as well) since that would mean they never paid him any 2006 salary.I think the cap hit only applies to any bonuses that are prorated over the life of the contract and because of that, no restructuring of future salaries will have any impact on salary cap hits if they release him/trade him. The only way cap hits get reduced is if the salary is restructured and the team keeps the player for future years. I don't think there is any way to wiggle out of a salary cap hit in 2006 for 2002/2003/2004/2005 bonuses if you release the player in 2006.

Ways to eliminate salary cap charges . . .- Eliminate roster bonuses (which IIRC Pennington is due)

- Extend length of contract (thus increasing number of years to prorate signing bonus)

- Reduce the annual salary (which for Pennington is also high)

Add it all up, if the contract were to be renegotiated, theoretically the cap hit could be set up to be reduced IF they were to cut him AFTER they renegotiated--but could they get away with cutting him after they renegotiated?

I think it is the cutting part that is the problem. Forget about the 1st one, eliminating the roster bonus with a renegotiaion and then releasing the player isn't any different then just not paying the roster bonus because you release the player. The second one, extending the contract, should only work if you keep the player, but in this case releasing after renegotiation wouldn't work because the player contract years didn not actually increase. Same thing with the third one, if you release him then the salary for 2006 is 0, no matter whether you renegotiate or not.Again, barring the June 1st date and assuming that the player gets no new money, I don't think any amount of renegotiation will do anything. June 1st helps extend that since it counts as another year for the prorating of the bonus, i.e. a cut after June 1st means the player "played" in 2006.

I just don't think there are loop holes because at the point of release, the amount of money you have to accelerate is exactly the same and the actual time of the contract is the same.

 

[stbugs]

There is NO way out of the approx $12 million cap hit the Jets will take in 2006 if they release Chad. That is the total amount left of unamortized signing bonus he has already received under the new contract. If he is cut or traded the whole amount hits the cap in '06. I repeat, there is NO way out of that. What all the posturing is about now is to reduce his cap charge for 2006 so they can keep him on the roster and not take the big hit. This needs to be done by March 2 at 4:00pm. For starters, he needs to postpone/defer the $3 million roster bonus due in March and agree to a lower salary than the $6 milllion he is due now.

If he is not on the roster, the hit comes in 2006 no matter what the Jets do. The only way to ease the pain is if he is on the roster in 2006. The problem is that he will cost a lot of money to do that unless he renegotiates.

If Pennington feels that he is done/won't get good money elsewhere, then he may renegotiate because at least with the Jets, he can help them out cap wise. In return, the Jets may pay him more than he would get on the street as a FA in exchange for the cap help and he has time to rehab and try to win the job.

To be honest if the Jets think he is done, they should just dump him now, take the cap hit and get younger/take a dive and get another high pick next year. With the Dolphins looking better and the Pats getting healthy, the Jets will not be in a good position to compete for a couple years. Take the hit now and stop wasting money if you think he is loss, otherwise you have a cap hit for him in 2007 or beyond.

 

[trader jake]

How could they possibly get something of value for Pennington.What would you suggest? a 7th round pick?

If the decision is made to cut him, would you rather do that or take the same cap hit by trading him and get a 7th round pick back?Something > nothing.

for example: trading herm edwards for a 4th pennington = cap killer. take the hit in 06' and move forward in 07' with a clean slate