People are going ape crazy over last years rookies (1 Viewer)

[RustyFA2]

I was just reading through the assistant coach and could not believe some of the deals people were talking about. These are by respected posters for the most part and I just cannot fathom some of them. Am I just behind the times and living in the past on these dynasty trades?

Maclin for Welker

Harvin for Turner

Sanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco (there were other peices but this is the jist of it)

Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3

Harvin for Peyton Manning

So from the HA3 rookie draft this year if you loaded up on rookie picks it seems you could have traded 1.6, 1.8, 1.12, and 3.13 for Welker, Palmer, Ocho Cinco, Royal, a 2nd rounder, and either P Manning or Turner. Crazy stuff.

 

[MAC_32]

The only one of those deals that leaves me scratching my head is Harvin for Manning, I can see a rhyme to the reason for all of the other ones.

 

[Goldalene]

Welker has lost a huge amount of value due to the injury. Anytime your player might never come back the same and you can get a guy with solid potential like Maclin you have to consider it.

That said, Harvin for Manning is insane.

 

[Balco]

The only one of those deals that leaves me scratching my head is Harvin for Manning, I can see a rhyme to the reason for all of the other ones.

Those are dynasty leagues, and they make plenty of sense (except Harvin for Manning). I wouldn't personally make all of those trades, but they make sense. For example, Welker just had major reconstructive surgery and is not young. Maclin looked very good for a rookie at a position that takes a while to pick up in the pros. I wouldn't think twice if two teams made that deal in my league.

 

[comfortably numb]

I sent Harvin to Borbely in a 16 team IDP league for Rudd and 2.13

 

[Donnybrook]

I wonder why? http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...9&hl=harvin

 

[Ned]

I sent Harvin to Borbely in a 16 team IDP league for Rudd and 2.13

 

[jwb]

Maclin for Welker - Welker had a real bad injury. He may never be the same. Worthy risk.

Harvin for Turner - How many more useful years does Turner have left? Are we looking at Lamont Jordan here? 2-3 years of production then gone? Maybe. Harvin is electric. Fair trade.

Sanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco - This one's a bit overpriced, but again, if someone thinks Sanchez can be a QB1, I can see it.

Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3 - Personally, I'd much rather have Royal and 2.3. But some people have completely bailed on Royal. Wallace quietly had a very nice rookie year.

Harvin for Peyton Manning - Depends - Let's say it's 4pt qb TD's, PPR, start 3 wr plus a flex. Does that make it look better?

 

[Jake22]

Maclin for Welker - Welker had a real bad injury. He may never be the same. Worthy risk.

Harvin for Turner - How many more useful years does Turner have left? Are we looking at Lamont Jordan here? 2-3 years of production then gone? Maybe. Harvin is electric. Fair trade.

Sanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco - This one's a bit overpriced, but again, if someone thinks Sanchez can be a QB1, I can see it.

Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3 - Personally, I'd much rather have Royal and 2.3. But some people have completely bailed on Royal. Wallace quietly had a very nice rookie year.

Harvin for Peyton Manning - Depends - Let's say it's 4pt qb TD's, PPR, start 3 wr plus a flex. Does that make it look better?

Harvin for Turner...No way is that a fair trade, Harvin is like the 4th or 5th option on that team (AP, rice, berrian, shianco) and he pretty much catches short passes, nothing long, so distance leagues suffer, believe me I know, with his speed i drafted him in a distance league and waited all year for a couple long TD's (on offense, not special teams) and it never happened, not sure he's that "electric" after watching him catch dump offs all year from Favre gaining only 7 or 8 yards. Turner on the OTOH is first option on a run first team, this one is not even close.Harvin for the best QB in the league??? not even close either...not sure how any one could spin that one, no matter what league your in, unless QB TD's are worth 2 points, even then i'll take Manning over a slot WR who is 4th option in his offense.

 

[Balco]

Maclin for Welker - Welker had a real bad injury. He may never be the same. Worthy risk.

Harvin for Turner - How many more useful years does Turner have left? Are we looking at Lamont Jordan here? 2-3 years of production then gone? Maybe. Harvin is electric. Fair trade.

Sanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco - This one's a bit overpriced, but again, if someone thinks Sanchez can be a QB1, I can see it.

Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3 - Personally, I'd much rather have Royal and 2.3. But some people have completely bailed on Royal. Wallace quietly had a very nice rookie year.

Harvin for Peyton Manning - Depends - Let's say it's 4pt qb TD's, PPR, start 3 wr plus a flex. Does that make it look better?

Harvin for Turner...No way is that a fair trade, Harvin is like the 4th or 5th option on that team (AP, rice, berrian, shianco) and he pretty much catches short passes, nothing long, so distance leagues suffer, believe me I know, with his speed i drafted him in a distance league and waited all year for a couple long TD's (on offense, not special teams) and it never happened, not sure he's that "electric" after watching him catch dump offs all year from Favre gaining only 7 or 8 yards. Turner on the OTOH is first option on a run first team, this one is not even close.Harvin for the best QB in the league??? not even close either...not sure how any one could spin that one, no matter what league your in, unless QB TD's are worth 2 points, even then i'll take Manning over a slot WR who is 4th option in his offense.

THese are dynasty trades. Harvin-Manning deal is obviously ridiculous, but the TUrner-Harvin deal is fine.

 

[EBF]

People go crazy for promising sophomores in dynasty leagues. It has always been this way.

Try to find a Maclin/Crabtree/Nicks/Harvin/Britt owner who's convinced that his player isn't destined to become a reliable starter. There aren't any. If you want Beanie Wells or Shonn Greene, you will have to pay through the nose.

There's a tendency amongst dynasty players to assume that every player who flashes elite talent will be able to put it all together and keep it together. In reality, it doesn't work that way. Some prospects never take the next step. Others manage to put up one or two quality seasons before fading away.

 

[BigTex]

People go crazy for promising sophomores in dynasty leagues. It has always been this way.Try to find a Maclin/Crabtree/Nicks/Harvin/Britt owner who's convinced that his player isn't destined to become a reliable starter. There aren't any. If you want Beanie Wells or Shonn Greene, you will have to pay through the nose. There's a tendency amongst dynasty players to assume that every player who flashes elite talent will be able to put it all together and keep it together. In reality, it doesn't work that way. Some prospects never take the next step. Others manage to put up one or two quality seasons before fading away.

I have Crabtree/Nicks/Britt and firmly believe they'll bring me greatness.

 

[Couch Potato]

Try to find a Maclin/Crabtree/Nicks/Harvin/Britt owner who's convinced that his player isn't destined to become a reliable starter. There aren't any. If you want Beanie Wells or Shonn Greene, you will have to pay through the nose.

Itsnot worth it.

 

[FUBAR]

People go crazy for promising sophomores in dynasty leagues. It has always been this way.Try to find a Maclin/Crabtree/Nicks/Harvin/Britt owner who's convinced that his player isn't destined to become a reliable starter. There aren't any. If you want Beanie Wells or Shonn Greene, you will have to pay through the nose. There's a tendency amongst dynasty players to assume that every player who flashes elite talent will be able to put it all together and keep it together. In reality, it doesn't work that way. Some prospects never take the next step. Others manage to put up one or two quality seasons before fading away.

I have Crabtree/Nicks/Britt and firmly believe they'll bring me greatness.

I have Maclin and feel the same. I'd trade him for Crabtree but not the others.

 

[FUBAR]

Maclin for Welker - Welker had a real bad injury. He may never be the same. Worthy risk.

Harvin for Turner - How many more useful years does Turner have left? Are we looking at Lamont Jordan here? 2-3 years of production then gone? Maybe. Harvin is electric. Fair trade.

Sanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco - This one's a bit overpriced, but again, if someone thinks Sanchez can be a QB1, I can see it.

Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3 - Personally, I'd much rather have Royal and 2.3. But some people have completely bailed on Royal. Wallace quietly had a very nice rookie year.

Harvin for Peyton Manning - Depends - Let's say it's 4pt qb TD's, PPR, start 3 wr plus a flex. Does that make it look better?

Harvin for Turner...No way is that a fair trade, Harvin is like the 4th or 5th option on that team (AP, rice, berrian, shianco) and he pretty much catches short passes, nothing long, so distance leagues suffer, believe me I know, with his speed i drafted him in a distance league and waited all year for a couple long TD's (on offense, not special teams) and it never happened, not sure he's that "electric" after watching him catch dump offs all year from Favre gaining only 7 or 8 yards. Turner on the OTOH is first option on a run first team, this one is not even close.Harvin for the best QB in the league??? not even close either...not sure how any one could spin that one, no matter what league your in, unless QB TD's are worth 2 points, even then i'll take Manning over a slot WR who is 4th option in his offense.

THese are dynasty trades. Harvin-Manning deal is obviously ridiculous, but the TUrner-Harvin deal is fine.

The Peyton deal smells like someone REALLY wanted Harvin and the other guy knew it. I agree on the Wallace deal - the guy plainly doesn't like Royal and the 2.03 is worth a bit less than Wallace so Royal made the difference. The rest just look like teams rebuilding.

 

[Sammy Traveller]

Welker has lost a huge amount of value due to the injury. Anytime your player might never come back the same and you can get a guy with solid potential like Maclin you have to consider it.

That said, Harvin for Manning is insane.

that trade would give everyone migraine headaches.

 

[Michael Fox Fan]

People go crazy for promising sophomores in dynasty leagues. It has always been this way.Try to find a Maclin/Crabtree/Nicks/Harvin/Britt owner who's convinced that his player isn't destined to become a reliable starter. There aren't any. If you want Beanie Wells or Shonn Greene, you will have to pay through the nose. There's a tendency amongst dynasty players to assume that every player who flashes elite talent will be able to put it all together and keep it together. In reality, it doesn't work that way. Some prospects never take the next step. Others manage to put up one or two quality seasons before fading away.

Curious EBF, what type of veteran WR would you be willing to accept in exchange for giving up Nicks?

 

[grapeape]

people are crazy over this year's rookies too. I offered Gore for 1.1 and was turned down. Gore is 26 and a top 5 back in most everyone's rankings.

 

[FUBAR]

people are crazy over this year's rookies too. I offered Gore for 1.1 and was turned down. Gore is 26 and a top 5 back in most everyone's rankings.

If he's crazy to have rejected, aren't you crazy for offering?ETA: if I'm rebuilding or wouldn't start Gore, I wouldn't take it either. Of course if you wouldn't start Gore, you're not likely to have the 1.01.

 

[grapeape]

I have a ton of depth/talent in this league. Some weeks I never start Gore. But my point is, the odds of a rookie RB being a top 5 producer like Gore, who's still young, is probably statistically much less likely than likely. Sure, we get our AP's and CJ3's from time to time, but how many times does that happen? Last year was a great example, I traded away 1.1/Moreno and a throw away WR for CJ3 (who had proven he was elite after his 1st year) Sometimes we are all guilty of wanting that shinny new toy when we have a young proven stud right in front of us. (and yes, CJ3 won me the SB in that league last year)

 

[FUBAR]

I have a ton of depth/talent in this league. Some weeks I never start Gore. But my point is, the odds of a rookie RB being a top 5 producer like Gore, who's still young, is probably statistically much less likely than likely. Sure, we get our AP's and CJ3's from time to time, but how many times does that happen? Last year was a great example, I traded away 1.1/Moreno and a throw away WR for CJ3 (who had proven he was elite after his 1st year) Sometimes we are all guilty of wanting that shinny new toy when we have a young proven stud right in front of us. (and yes, CJ3 won me the SB in that league last year)

You hit on one reason to prefer the 1.01, the other is the team with 1.01 usually is building and isn't likely to contend for 2-3 years. Unless he's able to make a series of trades to get better immediately, Gore doesn't do him much good except maybe get him to average. There are always exceptions to this, but the odds usually aren't good that the worst team in the league becomes one of the best in one off-season without significant maneuvering. You're certainly right that Gore, objectively, is worth more than the pick. I'm just saying there are many reasons why Gore won't help that team (he could always trade him after acquiring, but many teams don't work that way)

 

[Jake22]

Maclin for Welker - Welker had a real bad injury. He may never be the same. Worthy risk.

Harvin for Turner - How many more useful years does Turner have left? Are we looking at Lamont Jordan here? 2-3 years of production then gone? Maybe. Harvin is electric. Fair trade.

Sanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco - This one's a bit overpriced, but again, if someone thinks Sanchez can be a QB1, I can see it.

Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3 - Personally, I'd much rather have Royal and 2.3. But some people have completely bailed on Royal. Wallace quietly had a very nice rookie year.

Harvin for Peyton Manning - Depends - Let's say it's 4pt qb TD's, PPR, start 3 wr plus a flex. Does that make it look better?

Harvin for Turner...No way is that a fair trade, Harvin is like the 4th or 5th option on that team (AP, rice, berrian, shianco) and he pretty much catches short passes, nothing long, so distance leagues suffer, believe me I know, with his speed i drafted him in a distance league and waited all year for a couple long TD's (on offense, not special teams) and it never happened, not sure he's that "electric" after watching him catch dump offs all year from Favre gaining only 7 or 8 yards. Turner on the OTOH is first option on a run first team, this one is not even close.Harvin for the best QB in the league??? not even close either...not sure how any one could spin that one, no matter what league your in, unless QB TD's are worth 2 points, even then i'll take Manning over a slot WR who is 4th option in his offense.

THese are dynasty trades. Harvin-Manning deal is obviously ridiculous, but the TUrner-Harvin deal is fine.

When i said it wasn't a fair trade, i guess what i meant was that i would'nt make that deal no matter what type of league, if someone else wants to that's fine, i wouldn't veto it in dynasty, but unless the Turner owner has two other stud RB's, I wouldn't be making that deal. I guess it's nice to be a Harvin owner right now, although I think he is alittle overrated (depending on league scoring for returns, my league does not count returns so I always look at players from that angle).

 

[Ernol]

I was just reading through the assistant coach and could not believe some of the deals people were talking about. These are by respected posters for the most part and I just cannot fathom some of them. Am I just behind the times and living in the past on these dynasty trades?Maclin for WelkerHarvin for TurnerSanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco (there were other peices but this is the jist of it)Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3Harvin for Peyton ManningSo from the HA3 rookie draft this year if you loaded up on rookie picks it seems you could have traded 1.6, 1.8, 1.12, and 3.13 for Welker, Palmer, Ocho Cinco, Royal, a 2nd rounder, and either P Manning or Turner. Crazy stuff.

May seem crazy now, but in 2-6 months when startups get rolling, I would expect it to be commonplace to see Harvin and Maclin get drafted ahead of Turner (due to injury issues and age), Manning (not the #1 QB in dynasty) and Welker (due to the injury).

 

[EBF]

People go crazy for promising sophomores in dynasty leagues. It has always been this way.Try to find a Maclin/Crabtree/Nicks/Harvin/Britt owner who's convinced that his player isn't destined to become a reliable starter. There aren't any. If you want Beanie Wells or Shonn Greene, you will have to pay through the nose. There's a tendency amongst dynasty players to assume that every player who flashes elite talent will be able to put it all together and keep it together. In reality, it doesn't work that way. Some prospects never take the next step. Others manage to put up one or two quality seasons before fading away.

Curious EBF, what type of veteran WR would you be willing to accept in exchange for giving up Nicks?

I have him rated near the likes of MSW, Bowe, Royal, and Cotchery. I would say his value is pretty comparable to that of Bowe and MSW. There's a little more upside because he's younger.

 

[MDSkinner]

Maclin for Welker - Welker had a real bad injury. He may never be the same. Worthy risk.

Harvin for Turner - How many more useful years does Turner have left? Are we looking at Lamont Jordan here? 2-3 years of production then gone? Maybe. Harvin is electric. Fair trade.

Sanchez for Palmer and OchoCinco - This one's a bit overpriced, but again, if someone thinks Sanchez can be a QB1, I can see it.

Mike Wallace for Royal and 2.3 - Personally, I'd much rather have Royal and 2.3. But some people have completely bailed on Royal. Wallace quietly had a very nice rookie year.

Harvin for Peyton Manning - Depends - Let's say it's 4pt qb TD's, PPR, start 3 wr plus a flex. Does that make it look better?

Agree on all of this and just to add to the Harvin for Manning deal...what if the guy trading away Manning also happens to have an Aaron Rodgers or someone of that nature on their roster? Very possible in Dynasty and clearly they could see it as gaining in one area and just losing depth in another.