Judge Smails
Footballguy
What's up? Looks like that Atlanta game last year. Nothing on it..
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Peyton's floating the ball again... (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Judge Smails
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Dizzy
Footballguy
In the presser a reporter asked Manning if the Mathis hit had an effect on his arm strength since it seemed like that play started the switch to floaters. Peyton played it off (joking that he throws a lot of wobbly passes... and wobbly TD's too), but you could tell the question bothered him a bit.
Interesting.
Interesting.
Hoss Style
Footballguy
Well, since it got worse after he got the crap knocked out of his arm, I'd say it has something to do with the crap being knocked out of his arm. Maybe I'm just crazy.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
I think clearly playing vs Indy in Indy was a little in peytons head.
he's fine, however that offensive line is in shambles.
he's fine, however that offensive line is in shambles.
habsfan
Footballguy
It's been interesting for some time how the most fastidious QB in the history of football throws one of the ugliest balls in the NFL.
althepostman
Footballguy
Gotta love overraction.
Guy put up 350+ and 3 tds in a bad game. We are spoiled people.
Guy put up 350+ and 3 tds in a bad game. We are spoiled people.
T with T
Footballguy
It's not to hard to get in peytons head, how about have a game that's not REGULAR SEASON and means something... what's his playoff record again? It's funny how Manning get's a pass but yet everyone hated On Lebron James and he is clearly the best player now or ever but gets #### on because people can't be analytical or want to hold on to the past and their daddies favorite players or can't get out of the 80's. Similar situation here, Peyton is the GREATEST regular season qb ever but when the games Matter Manning shrinks.
T with T
Footballguy
DocHolliday
Footballguy
I wish I had Peyton as my QB. That being said, maybe his age is catching up to him? He is getting "old" by NFL standards.
Otis
Footballguy
simey
Footballguy
I don't think he did, but based on your posts in this thread (especially post #16), it seems like you have some bizarre misplaced anger towards Manning.
habsfan
Footballguy
Last night was the most I've seen of him. I wouldn't worry about "wobbly" but some of those balls looked like they were tipped (and they weren't). That would worry me.
tdhartis
Footballguy
I know he's always thrown ducks, but the end of the Dallas game and almost the entirety of this game something seemed...off. Not only did he not seem as comfortable throwing the deep to immediate pass, the balls had no velocity behind them and were very often under-thrown. His ducks in the past were assuredely ugly, but most of the time they got there.
Not only that, but the play calling and reliance upon Moreno that we haven't seen in previous games only reinforced my belief that something may be wrong with either his neck or arm. In the first five games they came out guns blazing and didn't really look to the run unless the situation called for it or they had a comfortable lead. There were check downs and runs galore, when in the past that wouldn't have been the play. Considering they were behind for most of the game and never had a sizable lead, it seemed off.
It's amazing he came away with the stats he did IMHO, and it's only because they turned out that way that people aren't talking about this more. I guess a 75% Manning is better than most.
Not only that, but the play calling and reliance upon Moreno that we haven't seen in previous games only reinforced my belief that something may be wrong with either his neck or arm. In the first five games they came out guns blazing and didn't really look to the run unless the situation called for it or they had a comfortable lead. There were check downs and runs galore, when in the past that wouldn't have been the play. Considering they were behind for most of the game and never had a sizable lead, it seemed off.
It's amazing he came away with the stats he did IMHO, and it's only because they turned out that way that people aren't talking about this more. I guess a 75% Manning is better than most.
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Call me crazy, but I told everybody who would listen that something wasn't right about his passes during his 7 td opening night game.
That said, I thought he got it straightened out the few ensuing games. Last night looked the same as game 1 to me. And I thought he looked like that before the mathis hit, not just after.
That said, I thought he got it straightened out the few ensuing games. Last night looked the same as game 1 to me. And I thought he looked like that before the mathis hit, not just after.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Do you not recall all the talk before he won a Super Bowl?
FIrst they couldn't win a playoff game...then after several years they did...then it was he could not win on the road...then they did.
Then it was, he could not win it all...and they did.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
You get constant pressure with a 4 man rush and every quarterback is going to struggle. His numbers don't tell the whole story because he got a lot of yards and one of his touchdowns during the comeback try. While his passes haven't been great all year, they looked a lot worse last night, it is something to be mildly concerned about, I wouldn't go selling your Broncos just yet.
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JohnnyU
Footballguy
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bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
JohnnyU
Footballguy
buck naked
Footballguy
msudaisy26
Footballguy
I always thought that about the way Rivers throws the ball, but the ball itself is a nice tight spiral. The arm motion is the ugly part.
Warrior
Footballguy
his stats will cover it up but last night was very worrying. he had zip on his passes for the start of the season and last night he simply didn't. lots of rainbows toward coverage hoping his WR would make a play and plenty of passes that as soon as they came out of his hand just looked wrong. he has a bye week and maybe can regain the strength but if he comes out in week 9 with the same problem and puts up good numbers, I'd trade him to someone who thinks they are getting early-season Peyton.
no matter what he should still put up good QB1 numbers but this could signal the end of the massive advantage over every other player in the fantasy world he previously had
no matter what he should still put up good QB1 numbers but this could signal the end of the massive advantage over every other player in the fantasy world he previously had
tdhartis
Footballguy
Adam Harstad
Moderator
1) Peyton Manning doesn't get a pass.
2) Hating on Peyton is every bit as stupid as hating on Lebron was, and for exactly the same reasons.
MoveToSkypager
Footballguy
Adam Harstad
Moderator
Manning's entire season has been checkdowns. The deep pass has been largely absent from his game, and if it seems like he threw a lot more bad deep passes than usual against Indy, that's because he threw a lot more deep passes PERIOD than usual. Demaryius Thomas, in particular, probably came close to doubling his number of targets 20+ yards down the field for the season.I know he's always thrown ducks, but the end of the Dallas game and almost the entirety of this game something seemed...off. Not only did he not seem as comfortable throwing the deep to immediate pass, the balls had no velocity behind them and were very often under-thrown. His ducks in the past were assuredely ugly, but most of the time they got there.
Not only that, but the play calling and reliance upon Moreno that we haven't seen in previous games only reinforced my belief that something may be wrong with either his neck or arm. In the first five games they came out guns blazing and didn't really look to the run unless the situation called for it or they had a comfortable lead. There were check downs and runs galore, when in the past that wouldn't have been the play. Considering they were behind for most of the game and never had a sizable lead, it seemed off.
It's amazing he came away with the stats he did IMHO, and it's only because they turned out that way that people aren't talking about this more. I guess a 75% Manning is better than most.
Manning definitely looked like the situation and the pass rush were both in his head last night, but I also think that over a small sample size you're going to get a lot of variance. Sometimes that variance is good and you throw 7 TDs. Sometimes that variance is bad and... well, you still throw 3 TDs. I would be a lot more concerned with Manning today if he hadn't come out on fire in the fourth quarter and moved the ball at will (at least, when Hillman wasn't fumbling it and JT wasn't getting used as a turnstile). As it stands, yesterday's game reminds me a lot more of Atlanta/New England/Houston/San Diego last year, where Manning suffered some really bad stretches early and turned on the jets late.
All in all, I view it as something to watch going forward, but not yet a serious cause for concern. Another week or two of this level of play, and absolutely I'm going to be worried.
Man of Zen
Footballguy
Man of Zen
Footballguy
I don't think anyone's reacting negatively to the stats.
They're worried that DEN still hasn't played a killer defense, and Peyton's getting killed out there...and they've got a run of much nastier defenses coming up. The concern about whether he can survive to keep doing it is legit.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Adam Harstad
Moderator
No, he does not. A lot of deep passes falling off of his fingertips this season. He certainly doesn't have the ball skills of, say, an AJ Green. He's really good at slipping behind the defense, though, as he demonstrated on his TD. Manning and Demaryius had the deep ball hitting like clockwork over the last 10 or so games of 2012. They haven't been able to get on the same page yet in 2013.
donkshow
Footballguy
He's thrown wobbly passes his entire career.
Adam Harstad
Moderator
More information.
Through 6 weeks, Peyton had attempted 40 deep passes (15+ yards beyond the LoS) on 240 attempts. His 16.7% deep passing rate ranked behind every regular starter at QB except for Romo, Ryan, and Alex Smith.
Against Indianapolis, Peyton attempted 19 deep passes on 49 attempts. His 38.8% deep passing rate ranked ahead of every other QB in week 7 except for Geno Smith.
I question how much of Peyton Manning's seeming struggles were a result of anything he was doing differently, and how much were just from the fact that Peyton's been off on the deep ball all year, but this was the first time Denver opted to feature it, so this is the first time we've seen him struggle with it over a large sample. Through 6 weeks, Manning was averaging a hair under 7 deep attempts per game. Yesterday, he attempted nearly three times that.
It's odd, because Peyton was one of the top 5 deep passers in the league last year by pretty much any measure. Still, maybe this is just who Manning is now. He's still perfectly capable of destroying defenses with the short-to-intermediate passing game (see: week 1-6.)
Then again, maybe playing in Indy was just getting to Manning, and he'll be fine going forward again.
Through 6 weeks, Peyton had attempted 40 deep passes (15+ yards beyond the LoS) on 240 attempts. His 16.7% deep passing rate ranked behind every regular starter at QB except for Romo, Ryan, and Alex Smith.
Against Indianapolis, Peyton attempted 19 deep passes on 49 attempts. His 38.8% deep passing rate ranked ahead of every other QB in week 7 except for Geno Smith.
I question how much of Peyton Manning's seeming struggles were a result of anything he was doing differently, and how much were just from the fact that Peyton's been off on the deep ball all year, but this was the first time Denver opted to feature it, so this is the first time we've seen him struggle with it over a large sample. Through 6 weeks, Manning was averaging a hair under 7 deep attempts per game. Yesterday, he attempted nearly three times that.
It's odd, because Peyton was one of the top 5 deep passers in the league last year by pretty much any measure. Still, maybe this is just who Manning is now. He's still perfectly capable of destroying defenses with the short-to-intermediate passing game (see: week 1-6.)
Then again, maybe playing in Indy was just getting to Manning, and he'll be fine going forward again.
Assuming that you've watched most/all of Broncos' games this year (I haven't seen all of them): were the Colts doing anything differently on defense to force Manning to go deep? Watching last night, it seemed they were using a lot of press coverage, taking away the short throws that Manning has thrived on so far. Rotating between Cover 2 and 1. Vontae Davis had a very good game, and not every team has a good CB, but did the Colts perhaps give a blueprint of sorts?
moleculo
Footballguy
IMO, the issue was the constant pressure, keeping Manning from getting his feet set. I think that he compensated for decreased arm strength with better footwork/mechanics, but under constant duress he isn't able to get comfortable. When things aren't ideal and he has to rely on arm strength alone, he struggles. Certainly doesn't help that Broncos only have 2 of 5 pre-season starters healthy, one of whom is playing out of position.
That doesn't bode well for games against great pass-rush teams, especially on the road. playing in Mile High will help neutralize the pass rush, especially with lack of crowd noise. This week will be an interesting match-up - Wasington can get after the QB, ranked 7th in sack % but allowing really high QB rating so far.
That doesn't bode well for games against great pass-rush teams, especially on the road. playing in Mile High will help neutralize the pass rush, especially with lack of crowd noise. This week will be an interesting match-up - Wasington can get after the QB, ranked 7th in sack % but allowing really high QB rating so far.
