Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Pierre Thomas or Shon Greene (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter tfreiboth
- Start date
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
Green. Easy. NO will probably be a passing team until Thomas retires. Green is on a Defensive, hard-nosed team.
Mario Kart
Footballguy
Trade them both for Tomlinson and sit back and laugh as you win season after season.
remote controller
Footballguy
Cuckoo!
ATC1
Footballguy
I wouldn't say replaceable, but certain RBs will be used in the New Orleans offense for certain plays.
Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
I agree, Thomas would be a stud with 20 touches a game but that will never happen in NO. Too many weapons and a pass happy offense. Mike Bell would be a stud with 20 touches a game in that offense.I wouldn't say replaceable, but certain RBs will be used in the New Orleans offense for certain plays.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
Shon
The Carnage
Footballguy
I have Thomas and would gladly swap him for Greene.
Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
I wouldn't be so quick to give this to Greene.
They are essentially the same age, with PT being 8 months older.
Greene has 1 career reception, and looks to be a 2 down back going forward. PT has 87 career receptions. (43 of them this season). If Reggie Bush leaves, as many think he will, PT is the best receiver out of the backfield on the Saints. He could get the lions share of Bush's receptions in 2010 (51 this year).
The Jets offense passed the ball 393 times in 2009. That was last in the NFL by 48 attempts. They ran the ball 607 times. Thats 82 more than any other team in the NFL.
While the Jets may remain a run first team in 2010, things most likely will come back to the normal range amonst NFL teams especially if Sanchez improves.
I realize that Greene has looked very good these past couple of games, and this board is very what have you done for me lately. I like Greene, and think he will be a good RB in the NFL. I just don't think his limitations are being considered here. Another poster pointed out that Greene is running with fresh legs against defenses that have played a full season plus. If you include the preseason, Greene finished the regular season with 119 carries. That's 6 carries/game. Thomas Jones had logged 362 carries using the same timeframe. Jones averaged over 20 carries a game throughout the regular season.
I just see 2010 being a year where Thomas Jones still gets over 200 carries making Greene a very mediocre option.
2010 could be a career year for PT if the Saints decide not to pay Reggie Bush the 8 million they owe him.
They are essentially the same age, with PT being 8 months older.
Greene has 1 career reception, and looks to be a 2 down back going forward. PT has 87 career receptions. (43 of them this season). If Reggie Bush leaves, as many think he will, PT is the best receiver out of the backfield on the Saints. He could get the lions share of Bush's receptions in 2010 (51 this year).
The Jets offense passed the ball 393 times in 2009. That was last in the NFL by 48 attempts. They ran the ball 607 times. Thats 82 more than any other team in the NFL.
While the Jets may remain a run first team in 2010, things most likely will come back to the normal range amonst NFL teams especially if Sanchez improves.
I realize that Greene has looked very good these past couple of games, and this board is very what have you done for me lately. I like Greene, and think he will be a good RB in the NFL. I just don't think his limitations are being considered here. Another poster pointed out that Greene is running with fresh legs against defenses that have played a full season plus. If you include the preseason, Greene finished the regular season with 119 carries. That's 6 carries/game. Thomas Jones had logged 362 carries using the same timeframe. Jones averaged over 20 carries a game throughout the regular season.
I just see 2010 being a year where Thomas Jones still gets over 200 carries making Greene a very mediocre option.
2010 could be a career year for PT if the Saints decide not to pay Reggie Bush the 8 million they owe him.
Mister CIA
Footballguy
Interesting question because the few times I've seen Shonn Greene play I've thought he plays with a running style much like Pierre Thomas. All in all, I give Thomas the edge here, somewhere along the lines of 55/45 (assuming PPR).
Thomas touch count through three seasons: 69, 160, 186. Career 5.1 ypc on 336 carries. In PPR, he finished this season ranked as #14 RB on only 186 touches. Granted the ball has to be divided many ways in New Orleans, but if I'm the coach I'd try to get the ball in his hands even more. Thomas finishes well once they are near the red zone too, scoring from 34, 19, 1, 22, 1, 10, 18 and 8 yards out.
Ultimately it comes down to touch count. If Thomas' touch count ramps up even just a little next year, then I think he puts up the better numbers. Things could be entirely different in 2011.
Thomas touch count through three seasons: 69, 160, 186. Career 5.1 ypc on 336 carries. In PPR, he finished this season ranked as #14 RB on only 186 touches. Granted the ball has to be divided many ways in New Orleans, but if I'm the coach I'd try to get the ball in his hands even more. Thomas finishes well once they are near the red zone too, scoring from 34, 19, 1, 22, 1, 10, 18 and 8 yards out.
Ultimately it comes down to touch count. If Thomas' touch count ramps up even just a little next year, then I think he puts up the better numbers. Things could be entirely different in 2011.
footballsavvy
Footballguy
Since it's all speculation at this point I would say PT in a PPR league and Shonn in a non-PPR leage. that is the only down side of Shonn Green is that he is very likely to get even less than the league average for receptions, where PT very likely to always have above the league average in receptions.
For arguments sake, lets assume Shonn ends up with 20 receptions for 120 yds and PT has 50 receptions for 375 yds and 2 TDs then thats a difference of 67 fantasy points just in the receiveing game. That means Shonn Green would have you out rush Pt by 670 yards to be the better fantasy back. Granted, those numbers are simply very quick projections - but I think that's where you have to start. Come up with some realistic projections based on how the backs will be used and compare.
For arguments sake, lets assume Shonn ends up with 20 receptions for 120 yds and PT has 50 receptions for 375 yds and 2 TDs then thats a difference of 67 fantasy points just in the receiveing game. That means Shonn Green would have you out rush Pt by 670 yards to be the better fantasy back. Granted, those numbers are simply very quick projections - but I think that's where you have to start. Come up with some realistic projections based on how the backs will be used and compare.
CaptainHook
Footballguy
green is bad
thomas is good
end of story
thomas is good
end of story
Harrassment Panda
Footballguy
I'd go with Pierre Thomas here. Unless Bush really goes nuts for the rest of the postseason and the Saints win the Superbowl, they are probably going to cut ties with him in the offseason. I like Bush, think he's valuable, but he's not 8 million dollars valuable, or whatever he is scheduled to make next year.
That puts Pierre in a tandem with Bell where he will be getting at least 60% of the carries and practically all of the receptions.
That puts Pierre in a tandem with Bell where he will be getting at least 60% of the carries and practically all of the receptions.
Last edited by a moderator:
editor47
Footballguy
you think the saints sit idle all offseason if they let bush go and go into 2010 with thomas and bell? no way. maybe they bring in a FA or a high draft pick who they like better than thomas. they clearly don't think thomas is a no. 1 back. does he put up good fantasy numbers? sure. but not elite. part of that is the offense, but part of that is because they clearly don't trust him to carry even 65 percent of the load.fyi 2009 regular season touches:thomas 147, 39bell 172, 4bush 70, 47that's 389 carries and 90 receptions. a total of 479 touches for the 3 RBs. thomas had 186, bell had 176 and bush had 117. that's about 40 percent each for thomas and bell.
Last edited by a moderator:
Mr. Retukes
Footballguy
Greene is the only one who plays in an offense capable of producing a 1500-yard RB. But there are lots of unanswered questions with him:
- will he ever become a pass catcher? (if not, Thomas wins hands down)
- does Thomas Jones have anything left in the tank?
- what about Leon Washington?
- what if the Jets are one-year wonders?
- what if Sanchez blossoms next year and the Jets become a pass-oriented team?
- will he ever become a pass catcher? (if not, Thomas wins hands down)
- does Thomas Jones have anything left in the tank?
- what about Leon Washington?
- what if the Jets are one-year wonders?
- what if Sanchez blossoms next year and the Jets become a pass-oriented team?
Breesisdaman
Footballguy
Too early to tell as far as PT is concerned. Bush may not be traded if he keeps playing like he is and he is showing that he is at least healthy for the first time in a long time. Secondly, If they do trade Bush I expect them to draft a RB because of Sean Payton's RBBC Philosophy.
Doug B
Footballguy
I could go with "replaceable" in the sense that I could see the Saints drafting a 2nd-round or later back either this year or next. Sean Payton's backfield could see a steady churn as long as Brees is productive.I wouldn't say replaceable, but certain RBs will be used in the New Orleans offense for certain plays.
Doug B
Footballguy
Uncapped year is throwing a monkey wrench into these kinds of analyses league-wide. Bush's esteem in New Orleans is changing rapidly ... IMHO he's a lot more likely to stay than go now. I couldn't have said that two months ago.
