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Players who would do much better... (1 Viewer)

Sinrman

Footballguy
I call it "Lamon Jordan Disease," when he backed up Curtis Martin for years. I saw in him a starting role, but he was continuously held back because he backed up a future Hall of Famer. As long as Martin was around, and continued to produce, Jordan would continue to be held back and be a backup. Then he finally moves to Oakland, and does very well...

Others I think could do much better on other teams (whether they are a current starter on a bad team or a backup):

Matt Schaub -- has shown flashes of brilliance when filling in for Vick; could be huge elsewhere, if he's ever given the chance; I could see him bolting Atlanta at the first opportunity

Roy Williams -- unbelieveable talent, but is held back by the ineptness of the Detroit "pass attack" -- just imagine what he could do if he had a decent QB throwing to him?

TJ Duckett -- I, like many others, was a bit surprised when Atlanta drafted him in 2002; he has his mortal days, but has shown flashes of brilliance, too; if he moved elsewhere, and given a chance at starting, I think he could do very, very well, if in the right system

Derrick Mason -- Still consistent as ever, even on an inept offense; just imagine if he had signed on with a better team that could use a #1 or #1a WR?

Eric Moulds -- I still think he's got skills; many have given up on him, but I think a lot of it is because their offense has been total crap; if he were to move to a better team with more balance, he would be a steal

Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance

Chris Chambers -- Just imagine what he could do if he had a real QB throwing to him?

Laverneus Coles -- Another one who has shown that he has the skills, but is on a very bad offensive team

Any others you can think of?

 
I call it "Lamon Jordan Disease," when he backed up Curtis Martin for years. I saw in him a starting role, but he was continuously held back because he backed up a future Hall of Famer. As long as Martin was around, and continued to produce, Jordan would continue to be held back and be a backup. Then he finally moves to Oakland, and does very well...

Others I think could do much better on other teams (whether they are a current starter on a bad team or a backup):

Matt Schaub -- has shown flashes of brilliance when filling in for Vick; could be huge elsewhere, if he's ever given the chance; I could see him bolting Atlanta at the first opportunity

Roy Williams -- unbelieveable talent, but is held back by the ineptness of the Detroit "pass attack" -- just imagine what he could do if he had a decent QB throwing to him?

TJ Duckett -- I, like many others, was a bit surprised when Atlanta drafted him in 2002; he has his mortal days, but has shown flashes of brilliance, too; if he moved elsewhere, and given a chance at starting, I think he could do very, very well, if in the right system

Derrick Mason -- Still consistent as ever, even on an inept offense; just imagine if he had signed on with a better team that could use a #1 or #1a WR?

Eric Moulds -- I still think he's got skills; many have given up on him, but I think a lot of it is because their offense has been total crap; if he were to move to a better team with more balance, he would be a steal

Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance

Chris Chambers -- Just imagine what he could do if he had a real QB throwing to him?

Laverneus Coles -- Another one who has shown that he has the skills, but is on a very bad offensive team

Any others you can think of?
In my opinion, Kevan Barlow heads this list.He was awesome with Garica, Owens, and a half decent offensive line. They lost Garcia, Owens, and 3/5 of the line, didn't replace them, and he struggled. Suprised?

By most accounts he ran very well this year just to get what he did, and he had a 5 game stretch in the middle of the year against Dallas, Arizona, Indianapolis, Washington, and Tampa Bay where he averaged over over 70 yards rushing and 4.5 YPC.

People want to talk about how Gore finished the year against Jacksonville, Houston, and St. Louis, but Barlow's stretch in the middle of the year was more impressive than anything Gore did all year. That's not a knock on Gore, because he might be decent if he's given the chance.

I'm hoping that Barlow gets released or traded and lands in a better situation. God knows it can't be any worse.

 
David Givens ~ he could be a 1200 yard/8-10 touchdown receiver in the right offensive system.

 
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Kevin Jones will be much better. Still really young and Mooch killed him...just give him the ball and let him go.

I think Ronnie Brown will do very well next year as well.

Cedric Benson is another guy who will do better.

Chris Perry should get more work as well.

Ahman Green and Deuce McCallister will be better :P

 
Kevin Jones will be much better. Still really young and Mooch killed him...just give him the ball and let him go.

I think Ronnie Brown will do very well next year as well.

Cedric Benson is another guy who will do better.

Chris Perry should get more work as well.

Ahman Green and Deuce McCallister will be better :P
Pardon my response. You asked if they played for a different team and my first response in Kevin Jones was correct. The others were more guys with upside.
 
Cadillac Williams could use a better line. Same for Lee Suggs.

Disagree on Dominic Davis....he won't get that many carries for run minded coaches in Houston.

 
Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance
I think this is the best pick of the bunch. David Carr has been getting a pass for the last few years because his offensive line allows him to get battered. Doesn't Dunn play behind that same atrocious line? Imagine this guy playing in Denver with their line and blocking system. He's better than anyone they've got by a longshot.
 
On top of this list has to be Chris Perry.

Andre Johnson is a good answer as well.

Michael Turner :thumbup:

David Carr

Brandon Lloyd

Willis McGahee

Any RB not on the Chiefs, Broncos or Seahawks - if they went to those teams.

 
Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance
I think this is the best pick of the bunch. David Carr has been getting a pass for the last few years because his offensive line allows him to get battered. Doesn't Dunn play behind that same atrocious line? Imagine this guy playing in Denver with their line and blocking system. He's better than anyone they've got by a longshot.
Yeah, I dunno wtf people's problem with DD is..... he's a 2000 yard all purpose back with good TD production..... behind a terrible OL.People are like "yeah well he can't stay healthy..." can you name one person who blocks for him?

 
Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance
I think this is the best pick of the bunch. David Carr has been getting a pass for the last few years because his offensive line allows him to get battered. Doesn't Dunn play behind that same atrocious line? Imagine this guy playing in Denver with their line and blocking system. He's better than anyone they've got by a longshot.
Yeah, I dunno wtf people's problem with DD is..... he's a 2000 yard all purpose back with good TD production..... behind a terrible OL.People are like "yeah well he can't stay healthy..." can you name one person who blocks for him?
Yes, but only because we've been drafting his OL over in the Build a franchise thread (be sure to ignore Andy's BS title)
 
Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance
I think this is the best pick of the bunch. David Carr has been getting a pass for the last few years because his offensive line allows him to get battered. Doesn't Dunn play behind that same atrocious line? Imagine this guy playing in Denver with their line and blocking system. He's better than anyone they've got by a longshot.
Yeah, I dunno wtf people's problem with DD is..... he's a 2000 yard all purpose back with good TD production..... behind a terrible OL.People are like "yeah well he can't stay healthy..." can you name one person who blocks for him?
Actually, its quite the opposite, Dom Davis has been in a system where when healthy he recieved touches as though he were an elite back and showed that he is solid starter, but not a special talent. More than any player on that squad he benefitted from a conservative offense that funneled everything through the RB. His offensive line could run block well enough, but were horrible at protecting the QB.
 
I think this is the best pick of the bunch. David Carr has been getting a pass for the last few years because his offensive line allows him to get battered. Doesn't Dunn play behind that same atrocious line? Imagine this guy playing in Denver with their line and blocking system. He's better than anyone they've got by a longshot.

Couldn't we say that almost any rb would play better in Denver then they would were they are right now? I think Davis is a good not great rb and he might be a little better somewhere else but nothing great and I think Carr, and would both be better on another team. I think Duckett would be the player I choose.

 
Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance
I think this is the best pick of the bunch. David Carr has been getting a pass for the last few years because his offensive line allows him to get battered. Doesn't Dunn play behind that same atrocious line? Imagine this guy playing in Denver with their line and blocking system. He's better than anyone they've got by a longshot.
Yeah, I dunno wtf people's problem with DD is..... he's a 2000 yard all purpose back with good TD production..... behind a terrible OL.People are like "yeah well he can't stay healthy..." can you name one person who blocks for him?
I hate to druge up a worn out topic, but this Davis thing kills me.http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/395946

He's not that bad, folks! 4.2, 3.9, 4.3 YPC his first three seasons. 976 yards in 11 games in 2005, 1188 yards in 15 games in 2004, and 1031 yards in 10 games started (14 played). 6, 14, 8 total TDs his first three seasons. And his one of the better receiving RBs in the league. Sure, he gets dinged a bit, and I agree that this detracts a little from him, but what RB doesn't get dinged? Only a few RBs can play in every game during a season, or have decent backups who can help keep them fresh/healthy (like Duckett to Dunn; Bell to Anderson; Ricky to Brown).

Not to mention he's still relatively young, not turning 26 until October.

What more you want from a guy behind THE worst O-line in the NFL? Sure, Bush COULD do better, because he is a supreme talent, but he will certainly have his struggles until and if they fix that O-line. This is why I mentioned in this thread Davis fitting better in a different system, and could produce even better. Is he a top 5 or even 10 RB? Not really, but possibly could if given the opportunity behind at least a half-way decent line..

 
Andre Johnson - I think he'd be a nice fit in Philly
What he said.....Carr is a pile of crapola.
I definitely agree with those of you on Andre Johnson. Great talent wasting away in Houston. Get a #1a or GOOD #2 WR and a better O-line to give your QB time to throw the ball, and this guy puts up 1,400+ yards/10+ TDs every year...
 
I call it "Lamon Jordan Disease," when he backed up Curtis Martin for years.  I saw in him a starting role, but he was continuously held back because he backed up a future Hall of Famer.  As long as Martin was around, and continued to produce, Jordan would continue to be held back and be a backup.  Then he finally moves to Oakland, and does very well...

Others I think could do much better on other teams (whether they are a current starter on a bad team or a backup):

Matt Schaub -- has shown flashes of brilliance when filling in for Vick; could be huge elsewhere, if he's ever given the chance;  I could see him bolting Atlanta at the first opportunity

Roy Williams -- unbelieveable talent, but is held back by the ineptness of the Detroit "pass attack" -- just imagine what he could do if he had a decent QB throwing to him?

TJ Duckett -- I, like many others, was a bit surprised when Atlanta drafted him in 2002;  he has his mortal days, but has shown flashes of brilliance, too; if he moved elsewhere, and given a chance at starting, I think he could do very, very well, if in the right system

Derrick Mason -- Still consistent as ever, even on an inept offense; just imagine if he had signed on with a better team that could use a #1 or #1a WR?

Eric Moulds -- I still think he's got skills; many have given up on him, but I think a lot of it is because their offense has been total crap; if he were to move to a better team with more balance, he would be a steal

Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance

Chris Chambers -- Just imagine what he could do if he had a real QB throwing to him?

Laverneus Coles -- Another one who has shown that he has the skills, but is on a very bad offensive team

Any others you can think of?
In my opinion, Kevan Barlow heads this list.He was awesome with Garica, Owens, and a half decent offensive line. They lost Garcia, Owens, and 3/5 of the line, didn't replace them, and he struggled. Suprised?

By most accounts he ran very well this year just to get what he did, and he had a 5 game stretch in the middle of the year against Dallas, Arizona, Indianapolis, Washington, and Tampa Bay where he averaged over over 70 yards rushing and 4.5 YPC.

People want to talk about how Gore finished the year against Jacksonville, Houston, and St. Louis, but Barlow's stretch in the middle of the year was more impressive than anything Gore did all year. That's not a knock on Gore, because he might be decent if he's given the chance.

I'm hoping that Barlow gets released or traded and lands in a better situation. God knows it can't be any worse.
Actually, Barlow is a great choice as well. He was another one that I viewed like Lamont Jordan -- wasting away behind another player, and finally being given the chance to start. He has struggled immensely since becoming the starter, but it's certainly not all his fault. That offense is HORRIBLE. A sub-par O-line, a QB who can't even hold on to the ball, and bad play calling all hurt. Their receivers aren't too bad, and could do even better if they also had better things going on though..
 
Dominick Davis -- people knock him a lot, and with the likely reality that Bush will be drafted, he might be on his way out; if he's not moved, he'll be stuck behind Bush, and wasting away; I firmly believe he could produce elsewhere if given the chance
I think this is the best pick of the bunch. David Carr has been getting a pass for the last few years because his offensive line allows him to get battered. Doesn't Dunn play behind that same atrocious line? Imagine this guy playing in Denver with their line and blocking system. He's better than anyone they've got by a longshot.
Yeah, I dunno wtf people's problem with DD is..... he's a 2000 yard all purpose back with good TD production..... behind a terrible OL.People are like "yeah well he can't stay healthy..." can you name one person who blocks for him?
I hate to druge up a worn out topic, but this Davis thing kills me.http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/395946

He's not that bad, folks! 4.2, 3.9, 4.3 YPC his first three seasons. 976 yards in 11 games in 2005, 1188 yards in 15 games in 2004, and 1031 yards in 10 games started (14 played). 6, 14, 8 total TDs his first three seasons. And his one of the better receiving RBs in the league. Sure, he gets dinged a bit, and I agree that this detracts a little from him, but what RB doesn't get dinged? Only a few RBs can play in every game during a season, or have decent backups who can help keep them fresh/healthy (like Duckett to Dunn; Bell to Anderson; Ricky to Brown).

Not to mention he's still relatively young, not turning 26 until October.

What more you want from a guy behind THE worst O-line in the NFL? Sure, Bush COULD do better, because he is a supreme talent, but he will certainly have his struggles until and if they fix that O-line. This is why I mentioned in this thread Davis fitting better in a different system, and could produce even better. Is he a top 5 or even 10 RB? Not really, but possibly could if given the opportunity behind at least a half-way decent line..
This topic when ends when people will be able to put thier mind around the concept that RUN blocking and PASS blocking are two different things. The texans are decent to solid run blocking unit. DomDavis has gotten enough touches in RB friendly offense to show what exactly he is. A solid middle of the pack starting RB. He would not do significantly better under any other system.
 
This topic when ends when people will be able to put thier mind around the concept that RUN blocking and PASS blocking are two different things. The texans are decent to solid run blocking unit. DomDavis has gotten enough touches in RB friendly offense to show what exactly he is. A solid middle of the pack starting RB. He would not do significantly better under any other system.
They may be different, but they are not mutually exclusive. Many of the techniques necessary to be a good run blocker are also necessary to be a good pass blocker. They aren't as different as, say, pass rushing vs. pass coverage is on defense. I can't see how the same unit that is the absolute worst in one type of blocking can be even above average at another type. That doesn't even make sense when you consider how similar the skills are.
 
This topic when ends when people will be able to put thier mind around the concept that RUN blocking and PASS blocking are two different things. The texans are decent to solid run blocking unit. DomDavis has gotten enough touches in RB friendly offense to show what exactly he is. A solid middle of the pack starting RB. He would not do significantly better under any other system.
They may be different, but they are not mutually exclusive. Many of the techniques necessary to be a good run blocker are also necessary to be a good pass blocker. They aren't as different as, say, pass rushing vs. pass coverage is on defense. I can't see how the same unit that is the absolute worst in one type of blocking can be even above average at another type. That doesn't even make sense when you consider how similar the skills are.
True, but this reminds me of the Chargers a few years back. While Dom is not LT, the Chargers line blocked pretty well for him, but couldn't protect the QB well at all. It's rare that a line would be exceptionally great in one area and exceptionally poor in the other, but it's not hard to believe that the line can be average or slightly better in run blocking and horrible in pass.

Besides, Dom barely gets 80 yards per game (decent, no doubt) on the ground, while he gets a large share of his FF value with his receptions. Which are in large part due to Carr having little time to set back and the WRs to get open.

 
True, but this reminds me of the Chargers a few years back. While Dom is not LT, the Chargers line blocked pretty well for him, but couldn't protect the QB well at all.
They may not have been protecting their QB very well, but he wasn't getting plastered like Carr has been the past few years. We're talking about two very different levels of inability here.
 
Eric Moulds -- I still think he's got skills; many have given up on him, but I think a lot of it is because their offense has been total crap; if he were to move to a better team with more balance, he would be a steal
Eric Moulds is the first name that came to my mind. if he doesn't rework his contract this offseason, he will most certainly be playing someplace else....and most Bills fans fear that will be for the Patriots where they will have to face him twice a year. Moulds + Patriots = Pro Bowl.
 
Lee Suggs? That guy sucks. He is hurt every two minutes. Droughns had a good season on the same team. If Suggs were any good we would have seen it by now.

 
I'll say Michael Vick. If he were the slot receiver on Pittsburgh we'd be talking about what an exciting playmaker he was.

 
Tom Brady would have won FOUR SB rings by now if he played for the Colts...most definitely including THIS year. Those scrubs in New England are only holding him down....

 
Funny how Dom Davis, Carr and Andre Johnson are all called out in this thread.

Houston.. we have a problem!

Chris Perry, Michael Turner and ... Mark Clayton. Someone give that team a QB!

 
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This topic when ends when people will be able to put thier mind around the concept that RUN  blocking and PASS blocking are two different things. The texans are decent to solid run blocking unit.  DomDavis has gotten enough touches in RB friendly offense to show what exactly he is. A solid middle of the pack starting RB. He would not do significantly better under any other system.
They may be different, but they are not mutually exclusive. Many of the techniques necessary to be a good run blocker are also necessary to be a good pass blocker. They aren't as different as, say, pass rushing vs. pass coverage is on defense. I can't see how the same unit that is the absolute worst in one type of blocking can be even above average at another type. That doesn't even make sense when you consider how similar the skills are.
Run Blocking and pass blocking are different skills. yes there are some similarities, but MANY lineman are good at one at bad at another. Guys like Kareen McKenzie who are road graders for the run and turnstiles for the pass are fairly common.
 
Mason turned down the PATS for BAL last year.

It's his own fault.

His wife wanted BAL!!! WHIPPED!!!

 
This may seem silly, but Tomlinson made more from nothing last year than any player I can remember (and he was hurting for weeks on end). His OL didn't run block as well as Houston's. I'm serious. Put him in another situation and he has no competition in this league. Put him in Denver, Pitt, Seattle or KC... and :excited:

 
I am interested in this thread, if only for the fact that I just drafted in a dynasty league and got Duckett, Perry, and Turner.

Anyone know the chances these guys are on different teams in the near future?

 
Chambers has done more with less for many years now. Anyone that does not think he would benifit from an upgrade at QB is looney.

Drops passes that hit him on the hands... :boxing: ....they all do.

 

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