POLL: Should Daughter Leave Husband Behind For Grad School? (1 Viewer)

[El Floppo]

Another note for Columbia and NYC. 

Some thoughts:

He's young. Any work experience is good at this point- hopefully it'll be closer to what he wants to be doing, which should have lots of opportunities in NYc. 

Getting to live a couple years in NYC living in Columbia grad housing can't be be under sold here. It's not cheap, but it's way under market rate, which in and of itself is a huge opportunity for a young couple. As is supporting your wife's dream. 

This seems way more obvious to me than getting married at twenty.

 

[Long Ball Larry]

At $55k he needs to do whatever she wants as his job isn't paying that much.  Get a job with dod as an actuarial.  Decent pay, solid benefits, and opportunities to move around.  May not have opportunities at those exact locations, but should be pretty close.

I think that the short-term point is that they need money to live and there is a concern about him moving with no job and then they have no income.  which i get, but that's why i think the overall financial details of all of these decisions would need to be factored in.  But I agree that it doesn't seem to be a serious reason not to be planning to move to NY if they decide the Columbia is the best thing for her.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Another note for Columbia and NYC. 

Some thoughts:

He's young. Any work experience is good at this point- hopefully it'll be closer to what he wants to be doing, which should have lots of opportunities in NYc. 

Getting to live a couple years in NYC living in Columbia grad housing can't be be under sold here. It's not cheap, but it's way under market rate, which in and of itself is a huge opportunity for a young couple. As is supporting your wife's dream. 

This seems way more obvious to me than getting married at twenty.

Great data point.

If you love urban living - & the OP said his daughter does - ya gotta at a minimum give NYC a shot for a couple years. Especially if you can do it while you are young & before you have children.

 

[LAUNCH]

Who is footing the bill?  Her tuition cost is basically what he is earning in a year.  Throw in the cost of living in NYC it would seem that getting the next job in the city you want to live in  after this makes more sense.  Obviously if money isnt an issue..then go where she really wants.

 

[Sinn Fein]

MSW?  My wife has a MSW - thats not the type of degree where the name of the school really matters...

Sounds like daughter just wants an adventure - and if she does not want hubby along, then its time to part company.   Either choice seems like she is trying to get away. 

 

[TripItUp]

Is a masters of social work at columbia something that you get your money back on?

What does your daughter want to do? 

Seems like one of the bad investment degrees we often hear about. Especially if getting it before having a job. 

Particularly with NY living expenses...no way I would take this.   

Terrible degree if money is not plentiful.

 

[eoMMan]

MSW?  My wife has a MSW - thats not the type of degree where the name of the school really matters...

Sounds like daughter just wants an adventure - and if she does not want hubby along, then its time to part company.   Either choice seems like she is trying to get away. 

I wonder if she regrets marrying so young and not living it up in the city first.

 

[Psychopav]

Actuary working for a huge insurance company in NJ. I can check what openings we have on Monday. As a matter of fact I think my team has an opening although not sure what level it is. 

With his bona fides, moving with her to the NYC area so she can go to Columbia should be a viable option.  There are companies there like Shady's which have actuarial programs that will support him and give him the opportunity to study for future exams as well.

They're young enough and he's not in his dream job imo he should go with her and they should stick together.

 

[Rattle and Hum]

I wanted to thank those who chimed in with their valuable input. I was surprised with the 85% number in favor of moving. Tells me that I'm likely looking at this way too conservatively. My daughter and SIL also expressed their appreciation.

Some asked about them marrying too young. Our children mostly grew up in a 70-home development in the country. Her husband also grew up in that development. The two had been hanging out since age 10 and dated for at least 4 years before marriage. They both graduated from MSU. Both top 10 in their HS class of 400+. A lot in common. They knew each other very well so they felt comfortable with marrying young.

 

[Foosball God]

I'm also for the move.  I do have a question in relation to the Son in Law looking for work.  Is he looking for an Actuarial job that pays what he's making now?  The reason I ask is that if he hasn't been in that field yet then he needs to make sure his reality on the type of job he'll start out with is matching up with the real world.  Not assuming here so maybe he is looking at complete entry level position and still isn't finding anything, but just trying to understand.

 

[shadyridr]

Ok so all the available actuarial positions in my company require experience. There is an actuarial rotation program for students but they generally take those candidates from interns. So that leaves summer internship program, which pays btw. I think he'd be looking at something like that. The 2019 program isn't available yet but if he's interested I can PM you my company and he can keep an eye on internship. It's a great opportunity!

 

[Rattle and Hum]

I'm also for the move.  I do have a question in relation to the Son in Law looking for work.  Is he looking for an Actuarial job that pays what he's making now?  The reason I ask is that if he hasn't been in that field yet then he needs to make sure his reality on the type of job he'll start out with is matching up with the real world.  Not assuming here so maybe he is looking at complete entry level position and still isn't finding anything, but just trying to understand.

So, I'm trying to let them own the decision as much as possible but guess that he would need to make similar money or more to live in/near Manhattan or Chicago. I'm trying to avoid the money aspects unless they ask my opinion. Not sure how far they would have to commute to make Columbia work on a $50K-ish salary plus whatever she can make.. At what point does a long commute and work/school hours exceed the benefits of big city living? Could they simply agree to vacation in Manhattan once a year to fulfill their desires for big city experience? I've always felt big city life is different than big city vacationing.  I, personally, question whether Columbia tuition makes sense for a MSW but it's their journey and I don't have a clue if a degree from Columbia in that field improves salary or career mobility. It sounds kick-butt...I do know that. I'm admittedly too practical and that's worked out OK for me but who knows what I've missed out on with that approach.

 

[Foosball God]

So, I'm trying to let them own the decision as much as possible but guess that he would need to make similar money or more to live in/near Manhattan or Chicago. I'm trying to avoid the money aspects unless they ask my opinion. Not sure how far they would have to commute to make Columbia work on a $50K-ish salary plus whatever she can make.. At what point does a long commute and work/school hours exceed the benefits of big city living? Could they simply agree to vacation in Manhattan once a year to fulfill their desires for big city experience? I've always felt big city life is different than big city vacationing.  I, personally, question whether Columbia tuition makes sense for a MSW but it's their journey and I don't have a clue if a degree from Columbia in that field improves salary or career mobility. It sounds kick-butt...I do know that. I'm admittedly too practical and that's worked out OK for me but who knows what I've missed out on with that approach.

It might be worth it just for them to find out if big city life is really what they want.  They are young, no kids, now is exactly the time to find out what they really want.  On the degree front, most times I would say it doesn't matter, but Columbia definitely has a certain cachet that will get people's attention when looking at resumes so it very well might be worth it.

 

[RUSF18]

FWIW I think going to Columbia makes sense only if she is planning on going back home or settling down somewhere that isn't the NYC area when it's time to actually work.

Reason being there are a whole lot of people going after social work jobs in the city that come from schools that are as strong or reasonably close to Columbia in terms of quality, whether those schools are local as well or all over the country. 

She'll likely stand out much better with that degree in other parts of the country, IMO. 

If the expensive degree makes sense for a career that isn't exactly high paying is a completely different argument.  

 

[El Floppo]

I wanted to thank those who chimed in with their valuable input. I was surprised with the 85% number in favor of moving. Tells me that I'm likely looking at this way too conservatively. My daughter and SIL also expressed their appreciation.

Some asked about them marrying too young. Our children mostly grew up in a 70-home development in the country. Her husband also grew up in that development. The two had been hanging out since age 10 and dated for at least 4 years before marriage. They both graduated from MSU. Both top 10 in their HS class of 400+. A lot in common. They knew each other very well so they felt comfortable with marrying young.

Imo, life is about experiencing as much as possible- so making opportunities to live in different places, experience different cultures and do different things is big (that includes dating different types of people...but I'd never get in the way of "true love"- no guarantees any method works out or doesn't) ...especially while young and without work/children obligations.

 

[El Floppo]

FWIW I think going to Columbia makes sense only if she is planning on going back home or settling down somewhere that isn't the NYC area when it's time to actually work.

Reason being there are a whole lot of people going after social work jobs in the city that come from schools that are as strong or reasonably close to Columbia in terms of quality, whether those schools are local as well or all over the country. 

She'll likely stand out much better with that degree in other parts of the country, IMO. 

If the expensive degree makes sense for a career that isn't exactly high paying is a completely different argument.  

Huh. I'd assume the opposite held up here. Columbia degree will open lot of doors here in NYC, possibly even through direct faculty contacts. Will probably do ok elsewhere too, but likely less immediate alum or faculty connections.

 

[bushdocda]

Good luck to them. 20s in NYC for me would have ended any relationship I was in. 

 

[Mookie]

I see the choice being your SIL's on whether they live apart.  She wants/needs that degree.  His career is portable.  Yes, it may take him a little while to find a job, and it could be harder than the current situation.  It's up to him to sacrifice for the betterment of the family unit, and he should suck it up and support her.

Where does she want to be long-term?  If she wants to eventually closer to home, she should go to Chicago. That could also give him more flexibility in looking for a job in Chicago and they could transition into their move easier.

 

[eoMMan]

I see the choice being your SIL's on whether they live apart.  She wants/needs that degree.  His career is portable.  Yes, it may take him a little while to find a job, and it could be harder than the current situation.  It's up to him to sacrifice for the betterment of the family unit, and he should suck it up and support her.

Where does she want to be long-term?  If she wants to eventually closer to home, she should go to Chicago. That could also give him more flexibility in looking for a job in Chicago and they could transition into their move easier.

She?  Shouldn't it be "they" even if she's making more money?

 

[Mookie]

She?  Shouldn't it be "they" even if she's making more money?

Yes.  It should be a joint decision, but she has to weigh the strengths and weaknesses of the respective school and the programs she will be studying.  They will also have to weigh financial aid, cost of living, and quality of life issues as well.

 

[jonessed]

There is a high likelihood that their relationship will fail if she leaves alone for either one of those locations.  She should go to Columbia and he should go with her.

 

[Gally]

How do they know they will like "big city living"?  She vacationed there once in her teens?  That is a lot different than living there.  Coming from a small mid-western area and jumping in will be huge eye opening experiences to add to the stress of little money, school pressures, married pressures etc.  No matter what it will be difficult and any doubt will just add to any struggles and make it that much harder. 

The only right answer is picking and jumping in all in together.  Any doubt and things probably don't work out. 

 

[Rattle and Hum]

How do they know they will like "big city living"?  She vacationed there once in her teens?  That is a lot different than living there.  Coming from a small mid-western area and jumping in will be huge eye opening experiences to add to the stress of little money, school pressures, married pressures etc.  No matter what it will be difficult and any doubt will just add to any struggles and make it that much harder. 

The only right answer is picking and jumping in all in together.  Any doubt and things probably don't work out. 

I feel it's a thing they both want to do and get out of their system before kids and responsibilities come along ...whether it sticks is a whole different thing but we'd support them either way.

 

[El Floppo]

I feel it's a thing they both want to do and get out of their system before kids and responsibilities come along ...whether it sticks is a whole different thing but we'd support them either way.

Fwiw... NYC is full of kids their age from non-cities, and never been safer. If there was a time in the history of this city to move here as a bumpkin... This is it. And being here in school provides built-in housing, community and opportunity. 

If it moves this route, let us NYC people know and we'll do our best to help answer any questions.

 

[eoMMan]

UPDATE?!?!?!??!?!?!?!??

@Rattle and Hum

 

[Rattle and Hum]

SIL interviewing at a couple places...one in Chicago and one in NY so far. Daughter has a few weeks before she has to commit to Loyola or Columbia. They have not given up on trying to make this next move together. I do not believe "Plan B" has been determined just yet.

 

[Rove!]

Why don't they just both move to NYC? He can wait tables until a job lands. You're only young once. Live it up.

This....unemployment is very low right now, especially for college grads....he should be able to find something in NYC or Chicago...

 

[ZenoRazon]

If he is cool with her leaving then they have a phone relationship for awhile. And when they do see each other,  nothing but good times. 

 

[Rattle and Hum]

So, just learned our daughter has to inform Columbia by this Monday. She is going to choose Columbia and hopes her husband finds somehing close. She said she would never forgive herself if she didn't go there. I support her, of course. Looks like a $35k/year nut for two years. I told her to start hiding money.

 

[Jobber]

NY is the only choice here, IMO.

 

[Binky The Doormat]

people change ...so much, the turnover is almost every 3-5 years at that age.  

she needs to go where she needs to go - if the relationship is there, it'll last. 

likely won't - all for the best. 

 

[Arizona Ron]

As someone that does a lot of hiring, I never make serious offers to entry level people that need to relocate first.  I've been burned too many times.

He has his degree and a bit of experience, get moved into the city then look for a job.  As others have said, he can always wait tables for a bit until something happens.

If they don't take this opportunity, she will bring it up when they're arguing.  

"I STAYED IN THIS #### SMALL TOWN FOR YOU AND...(insert whatever they're struggling with)"

 

[bigbottom]

For what it’s worth, my wife and I got married relatively young and we moved to NYC together when I went to grad school (law school). It was the time of our lives and we cherish our years there together. However, we took on quite a bit of debt to make it happen, but my wife had a good job in finance, and I was getting a degree that would pay me well upon graduation. Still, it was six figures and took a long time to pay off. Given our experience, I am definitely in the go to Columbia camp, but there is a very real chance that they will be saddled with debt for decades. I don’t see how they avoid racking up six figures at a minimum. 

 

[eoMMan]

As someone that does a lot of hiring, I never make serious offers to entry level people that need to relocate first.  I've been burned too many times.

He has his degree and a bit of experience, get moved into the city then look for a job.  As others have said, he can always wait tables for a bit until something happens.

If they don't take this opportunity, she will bring it up when they're arguing.  

"I STAYED IN THIS #### SMALL TOWN FOR YOU AND...(insert whatever they're struggling with)"

"Oh, so now you're mad at me for being unemployed?!?!? I didn't even want to move to NYC. I'm miserable living in our 400 square foot apartment! After your schooling, we're out of this good awful city!"

 

[ghostguy123]

How often will she even need to go to campus? I have heard quite a bit of grad school can be accomplished from home in certain fields.  If this is the case with her particular field, maybe they look somewhere about an hour commute to campus.

 

[ghostguy123]

Oh yeah, and make sure she isnt pregnant before going, and double protect while there.  

 

[cheese]

It’s putting a ton of strain on the marriage to move away, potentially live apart, and take on massive debt.  It’s one thing to be supportive, but this guy is being put in a tough spot. Unfortunately, I think the consensus is right that once she’s set on something, telling her No isn’t much of an option either. If she could be content where she is 55k plus her current degree and no kids for now in the Midwest probably means they can live pretty much however they want within reason. 

Going means she might eventually get an even better job (hello pressure) and eventually pay off their debt and hopefully the marriage survives. 

I dont suggest it and I wouldn’t do it, but this honestly comes down to contentment vs bitterness. 

 

[Psychopav]

Put her in touch with shady imo and pursue the internship.  If he gets in as a student at an established carrier that could easily turn into a career job.

 

[parasaurolophus]

For what it’s worth, my wife and I got married relatively young and we moved to NYC together when I went to grad school (law school). It was the time of our lives and we cherish our years there together. However, we took on quite a bit of debt to make it happen, but my wife had a good job in finance, and I was getting a degree that would pay me well upon graduation. Still, it was six figures and took a long time to pay off. Given our experience, I am definitely in the go to Columbia camp, but there is a very real chance that they will be saddled with debt for decades. I don’t see how they avoid racking up six figures at a minimum. 

Good job in  finance and law school>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>no job and social work. Should have more arrows, but trying to be considerate of mobile users. 

 

[ghostguy123]

What is she going to grad school for, and why does it need to be so far away?

 

[El Floppo]

What is she going to grad school for, and why does it need to be so far away?

You didn't read any of this thread, did you?

 

[Judge Smails]

Columbia—no brainer. It turns out NYC has a few jobs available, I’m sure he’ll find something. 

Agree with this.  Thought it really should be between them.  As other posters said, this had to be discussed during the application process as a possibility.  The commitment to move should have been made then.  Husband should be supportive of his partner getting an opportunity like this.  I'm sure if it was reversed she would have moved to advance his career/opportunities.

Agree that it it is easier getting a job in NYC if you are there.  They are skeptical of people making the move with COL, etc.  My youngest daughter pulled it off (she also had a dream to work in NYC) but it took a lot of work, searching and killing Skype interviews.  She flew out on Tuesday and starts Monday!

 

[ghostguy123]

You didn't read any of this thread, did you?

Wasnt in original post. I am lazy

 

[Johnny Rock]

Still wondering what she’ll earn in social work with a masters vs. undergrad in relation to loan debt from Columbia. 

 

[Rattle and Hum]

Still wondering what she’ll earn in social work with a masters vs. undergrad in relation to loan debt from Columbia. 

I believe her goal right now is to someday be able to counsel folks: this seemed to be the quickest route to that goal while leaving options open to do other work in the field. Whether Columbia MSW is worth the tuition & COL bump over other schools is TBD. It's expensive but they are giving her $25k/year supposedly. $35-40k/yr still sounds like a lot to me for an MSW. She'll prob get done with about $40k debt; Prob not too much if it helps them fulfill a dream of living there and hopefully advancing his career.

 

[Jayrod]

No matter what, they should not live separately. Absence makes the heart grow fonder only works for about a week or two.  After a few months, they will start to drift apart.

There are way too many options to put in the poll. At that age with no kids, their options are almost unlimited.

 

[bigbottom]

I believe her goal right now is to someday be able to counsel folks: this seemed to be the quickest route to that goal while leaving options open to do other work in the field. Whether Columbia MSW is worth the tuition & COL bump over other schools is TBD. It's expensive but they are giving her $25k/year supposedly. $35-40k/yr still sounds like a lot to me for an MSW. She'll prob get done with about $40k debt; Prob not too much if it helps them fulfill a dream of living there and hopefully advancing his career.

Does $35-40k per year include all her living expenses as well as tuition/books?  And given that it’s a 2 year program, does she have $40k in the bank or from you to pay towards tuition?  If not, she’s likely looking at $100,000 in debt over 2 years. 

 

[bigbottom]

As for living apart, I would think that would hinder rather than help their living expenses as they’d have to pay rent at two places.

 

[Rattle and Hum]

Does $35-40k per year include all her living expenses as well as tuition/books?  And given that it’s a 2 year program, does she have $40k in the bank or from you to pay towards tuition?  If not, she’s likely looking at $100,000 in debt over 2 years. 

My opinion is they are underestimating COL. I'm trying not to get involved in the finances since it's their journey. If they end up with $100k in debt then they do. He has an honorary degree from a Big 10 school so should do alright eventually...just maybe not in the NE? He works in that same college town so there are cheap co-living options. Also, both parents are 60-85 minutes from him for weekend life should he choose.

 

[cheese]

My opinion is they are underestimating COL. I'm trying not to get involved in the finances since it's their journey. If they end up with $100k in debt then they do. He has an honorary degree from a Big 10 school so should do alright eventually...just maybe not in the NE? He works in that same college town so there are cheap co-living options. Also, both parents are 60-85 minutes from him for weekend life should he choose.

Agree with your decision to sit this one out. Another angle I suggest is that IF this thing lands on any flavor of the “daughter moves somewhere for more school” plan and they stay together, it’s an opportunity for you to make a big deal out of what son in law is doing for her. Honestly, he belongs in the son in law hall of fame if he makes this work for her and you should be buying his drinks.