Punting saves (1 Viewer)

[shuke]

In a 5x5 14 teamer. This is my first year, so admittedly I didn't really know what I was doing in the draft. I took Hoffman and Lidge. Also drafted Piniero hoping he'd get the Boston job and Howry hoping he'd get a shot at Dempster's job.

Well, I've cut Piniero. I picked up Mike Stanton early on word that he and Weathers were going to split closing duties, but that doesn't look like it's going to happen.

So basically all I've got is Hoffman.

Here is the saves distribution in my league through Tuesday:

16

12

10

9

9

7

6

6

6

5

4

4

3 - me

1

What are the thoughts on punting saves? I'm sure I could get good value for Hoffman.

 

[fred_1_15301]

In a 5x5 14 teamer. This is my first year, so admittedly I didn't really know what I was doing in the draft. I took Hoffman and Lidge. Also drafted Piniero hoping he'd get the Boston job and Howry hoping he'd get a shot at Dempster's job. Well, I've cut Piniero. I picked up Mike Stanton early on word that he and Weathers were going to split closing duties, but that doesn't look like it's going to happen.So basically all I've got is Hoffman.Here is the saves distribution in my league through Tuesday:1612109976665443 - me1What are the thoughts on punting saves? I'm sure I could get good value for Hoffman.

Well the thing is closers get hurt often. I would never advise completely punting an entire category. Actually, considering your situation, you're still not that far behind some of the other teams. Just be ready to yank a backup when one of the closers gets hurt.

 

[Funkley]

Good idea imo. You can only lose 1 more point in saves but the player(s) you get for Hoffman will certainly help you elsewhere.

 

[The Houston Stallions]

In a 5x5 14 teamer. This is my first year, so admittedly I didn't really know what I was doing in the draft. I took Hoffman and Lidge. Also drafted Piniero hoping he'd get the Boston job and Howry hoping he'd get a shot at Dempster's job. Well, I've cut Piniero. I picked up Mike Stanton early on word that he and Weathers were going to split closing duties, but that doesn't look like it's going to happen.So basically all I've got is Hoffman.Here is the saves distribution in my league through Tuesday:1612109976665443 - me1What are the thoughts on punting saves? I'm sure I could get good value for Hoffman.

Well the thing is closers get hurt often. I would never advise completely punting an entire category. Actually, considering your situation, you're still not that far behind some of the other teams. Just be ready to yank a backup when one of the closers gets hurt.

Just think, since the season started we've gotten about 6 teams that have changed their closer. We'll get some more. Try and pick up guys that are next in line. In my 16 teamer, I didn't even draft a closer. And now I have 3. I traded for Street (gave up El Duque and Chavez) and picked up Soria and Owens. I just missed getting Frasor.

 

[guru_007]

What place are you in? If you're in first, sure go ahead and punt. But I kind of think you're not in first. If you get 5 more saves, you can jump 7 spots. Saves are probably the easiest and most predictable category to score. Also, in bigger leagues you should really have already rostered at least one solid middle reliever to snag some saves and wins and help your ratios.

Closers go down, and you can snag saves off the waiver wire fairly easily.

So far this year alone:

Al Reyes

David Weathers

Jason Frasor

Joakim Soria

these are all waiver wire guys who can easily contribute at least 10 saves this year. There are still some iffy situations, such as Florida's closer....and Salomon Torres in Pittsburgh doesn't look too good right now either.

Furthermore, who are you going to replace a closer with? A mid-crappy starter, that's who. Someone that's going to get you a few wins and k's and wreck your ratios.

I've seen people punt saves and win leagues before. But in general, I never recommend punting any category unless there are extenuating circumstances.

just my opinion

 

[wilked]

Even if you make playoffs, you are gonna get smoked.

 

[Funkley]

What place are you in? If you're in first, sure go ahead and punt. But I kind of think you're not in first. If you get 5 more saves, you can jump 7 spots. Saves are probably the easiest and most predictable category to score. Also, in bigger leagues you should really have already rostered at least one solid middle reliever to snag some saves and wins and help your ratios.Closers go down, and you can snag saves off the waiver wire fairly easily.So far this year alone:Al ReyesDavid WeathersJason FrasorJoakim Soriathese are all waiver wire guys who can easily contribute at least 10 saves this year. There are still some iffy situations, such as Florida's closer....and Salomon Torres in Pittsburgh doesn't look too good right now either.Furthermore, who are you going to replace a closer with? A mid-crappy starter, that's who. Someone that's going to get you a few wins and k's and wreck your ratios.I've seen people punt saves and win leagues before. But in general, I never recommend punting any category unless there are extenuating circumstances.just my opinion

In this league, most of the possible closer types are already rostered. If they aren't you then have to beat Jethro to the computer and try to get them first. Gllllll with that.

 

[guru_007]

What place are you in? If you're in first, sure go ahead and punt. But I kind of think you're not in first. If you get 5 more saves, you can jump 7 spots. Saves are probably the easiest and most predictable category to score. Also, in bigger leagues you should really have already rostered at least one solid middle reliever to snag some saves and wins and help your ratios.Closers go down, and you can snag saves off the waiver wire fairly easily.So far this year alone:Al ReyesDavid WeathersJason FrasorJoakim Soriathese are all waiver wire guys who can easily contribute at least 10 saves this year. There are still some iffy situations, such as Florida's closer....and Salomon Torres in Pittsburgh doesn't look too good right now either.Furthermore, who are you going to replace a closer with? A mid-crappy starter, that's who. Someone that's going to get you a few wins and k's and wreck your ratios.I've seen people punt saves and win leagues before. But in general, I never recommend punting any category unless there are extenuating circumstances.just my opinion

In this league, most of the possible closer types are already rostered. If they aren't you then have to beat Jethro to the computer and try to get them first. Gllllll with that.

While that may be, closers can be acquired via trade too. Saves are generally cheap, so long as you aren't chasing after the top notch guys.I stand by my opinion of not punting saves. As mentioned, for most novice roto league players, they often replace a reliever with a crappy starter chasing wins or strikeouts. This is a worse strategy than punting saves, as it hurts two categories instead of one. If you're going to punt a category, you'd better be damn good at the other 9.

 

[Fla\/\/ed]

It's too early and I've never seen the "tanking" a category strategy work well. Don't do it!

You can obtain closers via trade and at this point of the season there should be some waiver pickups that will put up saves.

 

[Angry Beavers]

I agree with Flawed. Punting a category in 5x5 in never a good idea. Keep an active eye on the waiver wire, roster some folks who could get saves along the way and make a low key trade if need be.

 

[Patoons]

I was thinking of doing the same.

I really don't have much of a choice with Ryan on the DL, but in a 5x5 AL only (12 teams)... there are no closers on the wire.

Anyone won while doing this? (I am currently in first, but losing Ryan will get me absolutely no saves) - I've put the feelers out there for a closer and guys want to give me players like Gagne or Al Reyes and aren't asking for peanuts in return.

 

[shuke]

What place are you in? If you're in first, sure go ahead and punt. But I kind of think you're not in first. If you get 5 more saves, you can jump 7 spots.

That would have to be 5 saves by Hoffman with the 7 guys in front of me not getting 5 from their 2 guys. Highly unlikely.

Saves are probably the easiest and most predictable category to score. Also, in bigger leagues you should really have already rostered at least one solid middle reliever to snag some saves and wins and help your ratios.

I've got 5 relievers in my lineup: Hoffman, Lidge, Neshek, Stanton, Howry.

Closers go down, and you can snag saves off the waiver wire fairly easily.So far this year alone:Al ReyesDavid WeathersJason FrasorJoakim Soriathese are all waiver wire guys who can easily contribute at least 10 saves this year. There are still some iffy situations, such as Florida's closer....and Salomon Torres in Pittsburgh doesn't look too good right now either.

This is a 14 team league. Weathers was drafted. Snagging those other guys off the WW was not "easy", or I'd have hall three of them.

Furthermore, who are you going to replace a closer with? A mid-crappy starter, that's who. Someone that's going to get you a few wins and k's and wreck your ratios.

Actually, I'd replace him with another reliever with a low ERA/WHIP.

 

[Capella]

just an FYI for the class -- shuke is in a very competitive league with a lot of experienced owners. so he's not just going to find closers on the WW -- or guys like Broxton, Zumaya, etc who may step in.

 

[dutch]

just an FYI for the class -- shuke is in a very competitive league with a lot of experienced owners. so he's not just going to find closers on the WW -- or guys like Broxton, Zumaya, etc who may step in.

What about shields or Linebrink? Or turnbow or Marte?

 

[Capella]

just an FYI for the class -- shuke is in a very competitive league with a lot of experienced owners. so he's not just going to find closers on the WW -- or guys like Broxton, Zumaya, etc who may step in.

What about shields or Linebrink? Or turnbow or Marte?

no to the first three.

 

[dutch]

just an FYI for the class -- shuke is in a very competitive league with a lot of experienced owners. so he's not just going to find closers on the WW -- or guys like Broxton, Zumaya, etc who may step in.

What about shields or Linebrink? Or turnbow or Marte?

no to the first three.

damn. There's got to be Some vultures out there.

 

[Capella]

just an FYI for the class -- shuke is in a very competitive league with a lot of experienced owners. so he's not just going to find closers on the WW -- or guys like Broxton, Zumaya, etc who may step in.

What about shields or Linebrink? Or turnbow or Marte?

no to the first three.

damn. There's got to be Some vultures out there.

not a lot man.

 

[Fla\/\/ed]

just an FYI for the class -- shuke is in a very competitive league with a lot of experienced owners. so he's not just going to find closers on the WW -- or guys like Broxton, Zumaya, etc who may step in.

So you are saying that all the pitchers that could pick up saves in 2007 are on rosters in your league? Can't Shuke try and trade for a closer? If the league is that competitive it is even more reason that tanking saves isn't a good idea.

 

[Capella]

So you are saying that all the pitchers that could pick up saves in 2007 are on rosters in your league? Can't Shuke try and trade for a closer? If the league is that competitive it is even more reason that tanking saves isn't a good idea.

-- No, not saying that -- just that most of the likely saves are gone.-- Sure he can.-- I would tend to agree.

 

[guru_007]

Closers go down, and you can snag saves off the waiver wire fairly easily.So far this year alone:Al ReyesDavid WeathersJason FrasorJoakim Soriathese are all waiver wire guys who can easily contribute at least 10 saves this year. There are still some iffy situations, such as Florida's closer....and Salomon Torres in Pittsburgh doesn't look too good right now either.

This is a 14 team league. Weathers was drafted. Snagging those other guys off the WW was not "easy", or I'd have hall three of them.

Furthermore, who are you going to replace a closer with? A mid-crappy starter, that's who. Someone that's going to get you a few wins and k's and wreck your ratios.

Actually, I'd replace him with another reliever with a low ERA/WHIP.

From the information given, I answered the best I could. I already mentioned you could try trading for a mid-tier reliever, a guy like Bob Wickman for instance. Without knowing the parameters of your league, I obviously have no idea who is available. Is Matt Capps available for instance? I'll assume Mike Gonzalez is gone? If it's a deep league with big benches, you may have to watch the wire intently. Owners always throw off potential closers when they have offensive injury problems.Either way, you said you'd bench Hoffman for another reliever? This makes no sense to me whatsoever. Drop a closer for a mid-reliever? No, you bench a mid-tier starter for a good mid-reliever, not a closer. I'm obviously not familiar with the rest of your roster, but if you feel punting saves is beneficial, go for it. From what you posted, it sounded like a very bad idea to me. There are 5 pitching categories, and most leagues only have 9 pitchers active. Saves is by far the easiest to go after. As I've mentioned, I've seen people punt saves and win leagues. However, this is very, very rare. Best advice I ever read is to try not to win any category, but come in the top 2 in ever category. Never seen anyone lose a league that came in second in every category. Basically what that is saying is try to win as many points as you can everywhere without dominating one category. It's the second week of the league, and already you're blowing off one category. To me that would mean you'll need to win at least 4 other categories to make up for that shortcoming. If you can, do it. g'luck

 

[dutch]

Closers go down, and you can snag saves off the waiver wire fairly easily.So far this year alone:Al ReyesDavid WeathersJason FrasorJoakim Soriathese are all waiver wire guys who can easily contribute at least 10 saves this year. There are still some iffy situations, such as Florida's closer....and Salomon Torres in Pittsburgh doesn't look too good right now either.

This is a 14 team league. Weathers was drafted. Snagging those other guys off the WW was not "easy", or I'd have hall three of them.

Furthermore, who are you going to replace a closer with? A mid-crappy starter, that's who. Someone that's going to get you a few wins and k's and wreck your ratios.

Actually, I'd replace him with another reliever with a low ERA/WHIP.

From the information given, I answered the best I could. I already mentioned you could try trading for a mid-tier reliever, a guy like Bob Wickman for instance. Without knowing the parameters of your league, I obviously have no idea who is available. Is Matt Capps available for instance? I'll assume Mike Gonzalez is gone? If it's a deep league with big benches, you may have to watch the wire intently. Owners always throw off potential closers when they have offensive injury problems.Either way, you said you'd bench Hoffman for another reliever? This makes no sense to me whatsoever. Drop a closer for a mid-reliever? No, you bench a mid-tier starter for a good mid-reliever, not a closer. I'm obviously not familiar with the rest of your roster, but if you feel punting saves is beneficial, go for it. From what you posted, it sounded like a very bad idea to me. There are 5 pitching categories, and most leagues only have 9 pitchers active. Saves is by far the easiest to go after. As I've mentioned, I've seen people punt saves and win leagues. However, this is very, very rare. Best advice I ever read is to try not to win any category, but come in the top 2 in ever category. Never seen anyone lose a league that came in second in every category. Basically what that is saying is try to win as many points as you can everywhere without dominating one category. It's the second week of the league, and already you're blowing off one category. To me that would mean you'll need to win at least 4 other categories to make up for that shortcoming. If you can, do it. g'luck

yup. And Dempster has a nasty habit of imploding and I'm not certain he's for real just yet so keep watching and be ready to snag even if it's a no-namer. And there's more situations like that out there so be ready.

 

[shuke]

Closers go down, and you can snag saves off the waiver wire fairly easily.So far this year alone:Al ReyesDavid WeathersJason FrasorJoakim Soriathese are all waiver wire guys who can easily contribute at least 10 saves this year. There are still some iffy situations, such as Florida's closer....and Salomon Torres in Pittsburgh doesn't look too good right now either.

This is a 14 team league. Weathers was drafted. Snagging those other guys off the WW was not "easy", or I'd have hall three of them.

Furthermore, who are you going to replace a closer with? A mid-crappy starter, that's who. Someone that's going to get you a few wins and k's and wreck your ratios.

Actually, I'd replace him with another reliever with a low ERA/WHIP.

From the information given, I answered the best I could. I already mentioned you could try trading for a mid-tier reliever, a guy like Bob Wickman for instance. Without knowing the parameters of your league, I obviously have no idea who is available. Is Matt Capps available for instance? I'll assume Mike Gonzalez is gone? If it's a deep league with big benches, you may have to watch the wire intently. Owners always throw off potential closers when they have offensive injury problems.Either way, you said you'd bench Hoffman for another reliever? This makes no sense to me whatsoever. Drop a closer for a mid-reliever? No, you bench a mid-tier starter for a good mid-reliever, not a closer.

I'm saying that if I traded Hoffman I'd put a middle reliever in his spot. We have a 1250 innings max, I wouldn't want to put a 5th starter in my lineup.

 

[guru_007]

I'm saying that if I traded Hoffman I'd put a middle reliever in his spot. We have a 1250 innings max, I wouldn't want to put a 5th starter in my lineup.

What are you getting for Hoffman in return? Have you ever thought about how many points you need to cash/win? This is a roto league, right, not head to head? I have been assuming it's a rotoleague this whole thread, if I'm wrong, well, my posts are not well suited for your league. Assuming 14 team, 5x5 roto league, you should be shooting for 90 points to cash, 110 or so to win. If you are taking a 1 in saves, that means you need 109 in the other 9 categories....average of 12, or third place in every other category. You really need at least 60 points in offense to make this strategy effective....65 would be better. Where are you at now? If you trade Hoffman, you need to maximize the return you'll get on him. If you're just middle of the pack in offense, well, trading Hoffman is not a real good idea. Honestly, from what you've posted, you have Lidge....borderline head case, and not real good right now. Howry is so-so. Stanton is near worthless. I really don't think Hoffman will fetch you decent value in return. What do you expect to get in return may be a better question here.

 

[Funkley]

It really depends on the deal and the ground you think you can make up. I tend to agree that 'punting' doesn't work but when you're already in 2nd to last place in saves the player(s) you get for Hoffman will likely earn you more points than just keeping Hoffman.

Also, you don't necessarily have to punt saves by trading Hoffman. You're just trading the most likely source of saves but not the only source.

In this particular instance I think it's a valid option.

 

[shuke]

Also, you don't necessarily have to punt saves by trading Hoffman. You're just trading the most likely source of saves but not the only source.

Do I sense an offer from you forthcoming?

 

[Funkley]

Also, you don't necessarily have to punt saves by trading Hoffman. You're just trading the most likely source of saves but not the only source.

Do I sense an offer from you forthcoming?

I've already got two closers but I've considered it. Had to wait for so many of my GD hitters to start hitting before getting serious about any moves.

 

[shuke]

For those keeping score at home, I'm currently in 4th place out of 14, but am only getting 2 points for saves.

I picked up Accardo, which looks like a great move.

And I just picked up Jorge Julio with Owens heading to the DL.

I also still have Lidge on my bench, but he is starting to look better recently. Maybe he'll get another shot.

 

[Funkley]

For those keeping score at home, I'm currently in 4th place out of 14, but am only getting 2 points for saves.I picked up Accardo, which looks like a great move. And I just picked up Jorge Julio with Owens heading to the DL.I also still have Lidge on my bench, but he is starting to look better recently. Maybe he'll get another shot.

Sniped me on Accardo f**k. I'll pray for you if you end up using Julio.

 

[fred_1_15301]

For those keeping score at home, I'm currently in 4th place out of 14, but am only getting 2 points for saves.I picked up Accardo, which looks like a great move. And I just picked up Jorge Julio with Owens heading to the DL.I also still have Lidge on my bench, but he is starting to look better recently. Maybe he'll get another shot.

Sniped me on Accardo f**k. I'll pray for you if you end up using Julio.

Accardo is good but the real question is will he get any opportunities in toronto?

 

[Your Mother]

For those keeping score at home, I'm currently in 4th place out of 14, but am only getting 2 points for saves.I picked up Accardo, which looks like a great move. And I just picked up Jorge Julio with Owens heading to the DL.I also still have Lidge on my bench, but he is starting to look better recently. Maybe he'll get another shot.

Lidge could very well get traded somewhere else and close this year. Be careful with Julio, obviously. Hoffman and Accardo should at least keep you in the mix.

 

[shuke]

I just want to thank everyone telling me not to punt this category. Up to 7.5 points in the category and 2nd place overall.

 

[RedRaiders]

Embree has been awesome. I have him in all my other leagues.

 

[shuke]

I owe the following a beer:

fred_1_15301

The Houston Stallions

guru_007

Fla\/\/ed

Angry Beavers

dutch

Your Mother

Up to first place in saves and first overall.

 

[RedRaiders]

Good idea imo. You can only lose 1 more point in saves but the player(s) you get for Hoffman will certainly help you elsewhere.

He has to be shticking. It's APRIL 18th!Good job shuke.