Raider message board rumor (1 Viewer)

[LawFitz]

On several Raider message boards today, posters claim to have seen JP rip Art Shell in an interview last night. Here is one blurb...

In an interview last night JP was asked what he thought of Art shell. He said that he wished we had gotten Martz because he would have made "us the greatest show on grass." He said but Shell comes in here trying to install this "tuff Guy" BS. He said that he didn"t think that last year"s team was undisiciplined, and that last year"s team was better than this one. IS HE NUTS!!!? Or is he trying to get traded?

Has anyone here heard anything about this?

If true, the guy is obviously trying to force a trade.

Looks like that JP for TO trade rumored last year would have been more even than thought (at least off the field).

 

[Jous]

Sounds more like something Joey Porter would say rather than Jerry Porter.

And for the record, yes, he is saying this because he wants to get traded. It's been no secret that he's wanted out for a couple years now.

 

[trader jake]

as soon as jerry porter has a 1,000 yard season i'll consider listening to his nonsense. quit complaining about a coach "making" you and do it yourself. porter's ability is much greater than his production at this point. also, the raiders were an undisciplined team last year...and they could use a dose of that "tuff guy bs" he is yapping against

 

[Ozymandias]

The problem is, he knows he's going to be the #2 as long as Moss is there. So he wants to go somewhere else.

Good luck, but it doesn't always work out well to go around dissing your coach. Those who might be interested in trading for him will have some doubts about how happy he'll be.

 

[AnonymousBob]

Jerry Porter has the stats to back up his talk. When he says something you can bet everybody pays attention.

 

[trader jake]

Jerry Porter has the stats to back up his talk. When he says something you can bet everybody pays attention.

 

[perry147]

Sounds more like something Joey Porter would say rather than Jerry Porter.

And for the record, yes, he is saying this because he wants to get traded. It's been no secret that he's wanted out for a couple years now.

Since Gruden wsa there he has wanted out.Gruden didn't like him and didn't play his lazy ###.

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

On several Raider message boards today, posters claim to have seen JP rip Art Shell in an interview last night. Here is one blurb...

In an interview last night JP was asked what he thought of Art shell. He said that he wished we had gotten Martz because he would have made "us the greatest show on grass." He said but Shell comes in here trying to install this "tuff Guy" BS. He said that he didn"t think that last year"s team was undisiciplined, and that last year"s team was better than this one. IS HE NUTS!!!? Or is he trying to get traded?

Has anyone here heard anything about this?

If true, the guy is obviously trying to force a trade.

Looks like that JP for TO trade rumored last year would have been more even than thought (at least off the field).

Hanging softball there.I think the Raiders were much better than their record last year. They were averagely efficient at moving the ball down the field and preventing the ball being moved down the field. It didn't show up on the scoreboard on either end though. I haven't looked into it too deeply, but I suspect they had a poor RZ offense/defense last year.

Not sure what that had to do with anything, but it was my initial thoughts about the Raiders.

Arty might not be too far off saying last year's team was better than this year's.

 

[P Boy]

Hanging softball there.I think the Raiders were much better than their record last year. They were averagely efficient at moving the ball down the field and preventing the ball being moved down the field.

The Raiders would have finished 5th in D in a 6 team Pop Warner league last season.

 

[T Man]

Sounds more like something Joey Porter would say rather than Jerry Porter.

And for the record, yes, he is saying this because he wants to get traded. It's been no secret that he's wanted out for a couple years now.

IIRC he signed a contract extension last year before the trade for Moss. If he wanted out so badly, he shouldn't have signed the deal.

 

[aDingoAteMyBaby]

The problem is, he knows he's going to be the #2 as long as Moss is there. So he wants to go somewhere else.

Good luck, but it doesn't always work out well to go around dissing your coach. Those who might be interested in trading for him will have some doubts about how happy he'll be.

The thing is, in the same interview where be bashed Art, he admitted that he signed his latest contract knowing that the Raiders were bringing in Randy Moss. He accepted being #2 before signing. I don't know what's going on in this guys head, other than it must be a lot since it's so damn big.How about Donte Stallworth for Porter straight up?

 

[SammyJankis]

Here's an article from a week ago eluding to problems between Shell and Porter: Mercury News Article

It didn't take long for Raiders Coach Art Shell to let people know who is boss.

Shell began face-to-face chats with players soon after his hiring, on Feb. 11. In one instance, wide receiver Jerry Porter's get-to-know-you meeting turned into a war of words and ended with Shell booting Porter from his office.

``Attitudes and things like that will have to be changed somewhat,'' Shell said. ``I have to set the tone. I expect to set the tone.''

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

Sounds more like something Joey Porter would say rather than Jerry Porter.

And for the record, yes, he is saying this because he wants to get traded. It's been no secret that he's wanted out for a couple years now.

IIRC he signed a contract extension last year before the trade for Moss. If he wanted out so badly, he shouldn't have signed the deal.

Corey Dillon Part II: Electric Bugaloo

 

[LawFitz]

I know we've got a lot of avid sports fans on this board... did anyone else actually see this interview. Can anyone confirm these rumors???

 

[SSOG]

I think the Raiders were much better than their record last year. They were averagely efficient at moving the ball down the field and preventing the ball being moved down the field. It didn't show up on the scoreboard on either end though. I haven't looked into it too deeply, but I suspect they had a poor RZ offense/defense last year.

Not sure what that had to do with anything, but it was my initial thoughts about the Raiders.

Arty might not be too far off saying last year's team was better than this year's.

I will get a LOT of flak for this, but I have long believed that if you take New England and Oakland and switch their divisions last season, New England would have finished last in the AFC West and the AFC East would have come down to a week 17 game between Oakland and Miami.With that said, it's not like the AFC West has gotten any softer this season (aside from the switch to Rivers), so I doubt Oakland's going to improve that much, in the end.

 

[Bizkiteer]

Ring ring...Ring ring...

Al Davis: (picking up the phone) Hello?

Andy Reid: Hey, Al! I'm in the market for a WR because we really have none and I hear Porter wants out.

Al: What are you offering, he won't come cheap

Andy: How about next year's 4th rounder and my kids poodle for Porter?

Al: Is that a black poodle?

Andy: Yep, he's got a Silver leash and ran a 4.3 fourty too.

Al: The 4th is not enough by itself. Hmmm...I doubt the poodle will be able to tackle, cover, run, catch or do much of anything else, but boyyyyyyyyy I do love speed on my team.

Andy: The best part he's fixed too...

Al: Oh that's perfect, he'll fit right in. DEAL it is!!!

 

[SSOG]

Ring ring...Ring ring...

Al Davis: (picking up the phone) Hello?

Andy Reid: Hey, Al! I'm in the market for a WR because we really have none and I hear Porter wants out.

Al: What are you offering, he won't come cheap

Andy: How about next year's 4th rounder and my kids poodle for Porter?

Al: Is that a black poodle?

Andy: Yep, he's got a Silver leash and ran a 4.3 fourty too.

Al: The 4th is not enough by itself. Hmmm...I doubt the poodle will be able to tackle, cover, run, catch or do much of anything else, but boyyyyyyyyy I do love speed on my team.

Andy: The best part he's fixed too...

Al: Oh that's perfect, he'll fit right in. DEAL it is!!!

Where did you get this information? Do you have a link? If it's true, and that poodle really can run a 4.3, then the Raiders have just drastically upgraded their defensive backfield.

 

[Couch Potato]

Jerry Porter wasn't as good as an ancient Jerry Rice. Then when Rice moved on and Porter was supposed to be the #1, he was outplayed by Curry. He can't even carry Randy Moss's jock. He ought to shut up and be thrilled he's so grossly overpaid.

He's a punk without the game to back up his mouth.

 

[JohnnyU]

Jerry Porter wasn't as good as an ancient Jerry Rice. Then when Rice moved on and Porter was supposed to be the #1, he was outplayed by Curry. He can't even carry Randy Moss's jock. He ought to shut up and be thrilled he's so grossly overpaid.

He's a punk without the game to back up his mouth.

As I recall, Art Shell was no world beater as a coach either. He has a .527 winning % and is 2-3 in the playoffs.

 

[Wadsworth]

Jerry Porter wasn't as good as an ancient Jerry Rice.  Then when Rice moved on and Porter was supposed to be the #1, he was outplayed by Curry.  He can't even carry Randy Moss's jock.  He ought to shut up and be thrilled he's so grossly overpaid.

He's a punk without the game to back up his mouth.

As I recall, Art Shell was no world beater as a coach either. He has a .527 winning % and is 2-3 in the playoffs.

Yea, but he is the coach. Even if Porter had the game to back up his mouth he doesn't need to be getting face to face with his coach like that.

 

[Raider Nation]

Porter is a dog and a cancer. Don't let the door hit ya.....

 

[SSOG]

Jerry Porter wasn't as good as an ancient Jerry Rice. Then when Rice moved on and Porter was supposed to be the #1, he was outplayed by Curry. He can't even carry Randy Moss's jock. He ought to shut up and be thrilled he's so grossly overpaid.

He's a punk without the game to back up his mouth.

As I recall, Art Shell was no world beater as a coach either. He has a .527 winning % and is 2-3 in the playoffs.

3 years before Art Shell:20-27. 0 winning seasons. 0 playoff appearances. The coaches were Mike Shanahan and Tom Flores- you might have heard of them.

The year Art Shell took over:

Mike Shanahan, 1-3. Art Shell, 7-5.

The 5 years of Art Shell's tenure:

47-33, 4 winning seasons vs. 1 losing season, 3 playoff appearances.

The 3 years after Art Shell:

19-29, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances.

Art Shell has a RIDICULOUS 58.7% regular season winning percentage (ridiculous given the fact that he was coaching some mediocre Raiders teams). Art Shell's teams have made the playoffs in 60% of his (full) seasons (and would have made the playoffs in his partial season if you project his winning percentage over the 4 Shanahan games). Art Shell has had a winning record in 83% of his seasons.

Here is a list of coaches who can't TOUCH those numbers for Shell (58.7%, 60%, 83%):

Bill Bellichick (56.25%, 45.5%, 54.5%)

Jeff Fisher (53.3%, 33%, 33%)

**** Vermeil (52.4%, 40%, 46.7%)

Tom Coughlin (53%, 50%, 50%)

John Gruden (57%, 50%, 50%)

Bear in mind that these are guys considered among the best in the entire coaching profession.

Finally, here's a brief list of some coaches who have been hired since Art Shell was fired by the Raiders after the 1994 season:

Mike White, Joe Bugel, Bill Calahan, Norv Turner, **** LeBeau, Bruce Coslet, Chris Palmer, Butch Davis, Lindy Infante, Dave Wannstadt, Rich Kotite, Mike Riley. Every single one of those deadbeats has a career losing record. AND THAT'S JUST IN THE AFC.

The fact that Shell hasn't gotten a single interview in almost a decade, *ESPECIALLY IN A LEAGUE THAT MANDATES ALL TEAMS MAKE AT LEAST ONE MINORITY INTERVIEW*, is perhaps the biggest joke, the biggest oversight, in the entire NFL. I mean, it's literally LAUGHABLE. And the fact that, in the end, he wound up in Oakland again, possibly the most dysfunctional franchise in the league, the place where careers go to die, the worst coaching position in the NFL, is a shame. Nay, a travesty.

So in other words, don't go bashing Art Shell. Not only has he had to put up with more injustice than any individual should have to deal with, but he's also got a fantastic resume that will put to the lie anything that you could possibly say about him.

I mean, heck, you want to know what the difference was between Art Shell, this guy you're saying was "no world beater", and John Gruden, the whiz-kid savior of the Raiders franchise?

Art Shell- 58.7% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-3 in playoffs.

John Gruden- 59.4% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-2 in playoffs.

And yet Gruden was worth 2 first and 2 second round draft choices, while Art Shell couldn't even get a mercy interview for a decade. Explain that one to me, please.

 

[blkgolf23]

Jerry Porter wasn't as good as an ancient Jerry Rice.  Then when Rice moved on and Porter was supposed to be the #1, he was outplayed by Curry.  He can't even carry Randy Moss's jock.  He ought to shut up and be thrilled he's so grossly overpaid.

He's a punk without the game to back up his mouth.

As I recall, Art Shell was no world beater as a coach either. He has a .527 winning % and is 2-3 in the playoffs.

3 years before Art Shell:20-27. 0 winning seasons. 0 playoff appearances. The coaches were Mike Shanahan and Tom Flores- you might have heard of them.

The year Art Shell took over:

Mike Shanahan, 1-3. Art Shell, 7-5.

The 5 years of Art Shell's tenure:

47-33, 4 winning seasons vs. 1 losing season, 3 playoff appearances.

The 3 years after Art Shell:

19-29, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances.

Art Shell has a RIDICULOUS 58.7% regular season winning percentage (ridiculous given the fact that he was coaching some mediocre Raiders teams). Art Shell's teams have made the playoffs in 60% of his (full) seasons (and would have made the playoffs in his partial season if you project his winning percentage over the 4 Shanahan games). Art Shell has had a winning record in 83% of his seasons.

Here is a list of coaches who can't TOUCH those numbers for Shell (58.7%, 60%, 83%):

Bill Bellichick (56.25%, 45.5%, 54.5%)

Jeff Fisher (53.3%, 33%, 33%)

**** Vermeil (52.4%, 40%, 46.7%)

Tom Coughlin (53%, 50%, 50%)

John Gruden (57%, 50%, 50%)

Bear in mind that these are guys considered among the best in the entire coaching profession.

Finally, here's a brief list of some coaches who have been hired since Art Shell was fired by the Raiders after the 1994 season:

Mike White, Joe Bugel, Bill Calahan, Norv Turner, **** LeBeau, Bruce Coslet, Chris Palmer, Butch Davis, Lindy Infante, Dave Wannstadt, Rich Kotite, Mike Riley. Every single one of those deadbeats has a career losing record. AND THAT'S JUST IN THE AFC.

The fact that Shell hasn't gotten a single interview in almost a decade, *ESPECIALLY IN A LEAGUE THAT MANDATES ALL TEAMS MAKE AT LEAST ONE MINORITY INTERVIEW*, is perhaps the biggest joke, the biggest oversight, in the entire NFL. I mean, it's literally LAUGHABLE. And the fact that, in the end, he wound up in Oakland again, possibly the most dysfunctional franchise in the league, the place where careers go to die, the worst coaching position in the NFL, is a shame. Nay, a travesty.

So in other words, don't go bashing Art Shell. Not only has he had to put up with more injustice than any individual should have to deal with, but he's also got a fantastic resume that will put to the lie anything that you could possibly say about him.

I mean, heck, you want to know what the difference was between Art Shell, this guy you're saying was "no world beater", and John Gruden, the whiz-kid savior of the Raiders franchise?

Art Shell- 58.7% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-3 in playoffs.

John Gruden- 59.4% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-2 in playoffs.

And yet Gruden was worth 2 first and 2 second round draft choices, while Art Shell couldn't even get a mercy interview for a decade. Explain that one to me, please.

 

[Steelers]

"I know Art Shell Sir, and you are No ART SHELL!"

 

[psychobillies]

How about Donte Stallworth for Porter straight up?

No Thanks!

 

[GregR_2]

Ring ring...Ring ring...

Al Davis: (picking up the phone) Hello?

Andy Reid: Hey, Al! I'm in the market for a WR because we really have none and I hear Porter wants out.

Al: What are you offering, he won't come cheap

Andy: How about next year's 4th rounder and my kids poodle for Porter?

Al: Is that a black poodle?

Andy: Yep, he's got a Silver leash and ran a 4.3 fourty too.

Al: The 4th is not enough by itself. Hmmm...I doubt the poodle will be able to tackle, cover, run, catch or do much of anything else, but boyyyyyyyyy I do love speed on my team.

Andy: The best part he's fixed too...

Al: Oh that's perfect, he'll fit right in. DEAL it is!!!

Where did you get this information? Do you have a link? If it's true, and that poodle really can run a 4.3, then the Raiders have just drastically upgraded their defensive backfield.

Thank God Charlie Casselry is gone or he'd offer a 2nd and a 3rd for the poodle.Of course, the poodle probably tackles better than Phillip Buchanon, so it at least would be an upgrade.

 

[beachbum]

i've got $20 on shell if it comes to blows

 

[perry147]

Jerry Porter wasn't as good as an ancient Jerry Rice. Then when Rice moved on and Porter was supposed to be the #1, he was outplayed by Curry. He can't even carry Randy Moss's jock. He ought to shut up and be thrilled he's so grossly overpaid.

He's a punk without the game to back up his mouth.

As I recall, Art Shell was no world beater as a coach either. He has a .527 winning % and is 2-3 in the playoffs.

3 years before Art Shell:20-27. 0 winning seasons. 0 playoff appearances. The coaches were Mike Shanahan and Tom Flores- you might have heard of them.

The year Art Shell took over:

Mike Shanahan, 1-3. Art Shell, 7-5.

The 5 years of Art Shell's tenure:

47-33, 4 winning seasons vs. 1 losing season, 3 playoff appearances.

The 3 years after Art Shell:

19-29, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances.

Art Shell has a RIDICULOUS 58.7% regular season winning percentage (ridiculous given the fact that he was coaching some mediocre Raiders teams). Art Shell's teams have made the playoffs in 60% of his (full) seasons (and would have made the playoffs in his partial season if you project his winning percentage over the 4 Shanahan games). Art Shell has had a winning record in 83% of his seasons.

Here is a list of coaches who can't TOUCH those numbers for Shell (58.7%, 60%, 83%):

Bill Bellichick (56.25%, 45.5%, 54.5%)

Jeff Fisher (53.3%, 33%, 33%)

**** Vermeil (52.4%, 40%, 46.7%)

Tom Coughlin (53%, 50%, 50%)

John Gruden (57%, 50%, 50%)

Bear in mind that these are guys considered among the best in the entire coaching profession.

Finally, here's a brief list of some coaches who have been hired since Art Shell was fired by the Raiders after the 1994 season:

Mike White, Joe Bugel, Bill Calahan, Norv Turner, **** LeBeau, Bruce Coslet, Chris Palmer, Butch Davis, Lindy Infante, Dave Wannstadt, Rich Kotite, Mike Riley. Every single one of those deadbeats has a career losing record. AND THAT'S JUST IN THE AFC.

The fact that Shell hasn't gotten a single interview in almost a decade, *ESPECIALLY IN A LEAGUE THAT MANDATES ALL TEAMS MAKE AT LEAST ONE MINORITY INTERVIEW*, is perhaps the biggest joke, the biggest oversight, in the entire NFL. I mean, it's literally LAUGHABLE. And the fact that, in the end, he wound up in Oakland again, possibly the most dysfunctional franchise in the league, the place where careers go to die, the worst coaching position in the NFL, is a shame. Nay, a travesty.

So in other words, don't go bashing Art Shell. Not only has he had to put up with more injustice than any individual should have to deal with, but he's also got a fantastic resume that will put to the lie anything that you could possibly say about him.

I mean, heck, you want to know what the difference was between Art Shell, this guy you're saying was "no world beater", and John Gruden, the whiz-kid savior of the Raiders franchise?

Art Shell- 58.7% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-3 in playoffs.

John Gruden- 59.4% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-2 in playoffs.

And yet Gruden was worth 2 first and 2 second round draft choices, while Art Shell couldn't even get a mercy interview for a decade. Explain that one to me, please.

There is some kind of game played at the end of each year..I forget what it is called.OH SUPERBOWL -which btw Gruden won and Shell has not sniffed as a coach ever.

Art Shell is one of the greatest OL in the history of the NFl without a doubt, but as a head coach he has been lacking.

 

[trader jake]

art shell is a better NFL head coach than jerry porter is an NFL wide receiver

 

[Cookiemonster]

3 years before Art Shell:

20-27. 0 winning seasons. 0 playoff appearances. The coaches were Mike Shanahan and Tom Flores- you might have heard of them.

The year Art Shell took over:

Mike Shanahan, 1-3. Art Shell, 7-5.

The 5 years of Art Shell's tenure:

47-33, 4 winning seasons vs. 1 losing season, 3 playoff appearances.

The 3 years after Art Shell:

19-29, 0 winning seasons, 0 playoff appearances.

Art Shell has a RIDICULOUS 58.7% regular season winning percentage (ridiculous given the fact that he was coaching some mediocre Raiders teams). Art Shell's teams have made the playoffs in 60% of his (full) seasons (and would have made the playoffs in his partial season if you project his winning percentage over the 4 Shanahan games). Art Shell has had a winning record in 83% of his seasons.

Here is a list of coaches who can't TOUCH those numbers for Shell (58.7%, 60%, 83%):

Bill Bellichick (56.25%, 45.5%, 54.5%)

Jeff Fisher (53.3%, 33%, 33%)

**** Vermeil (52.4%, 40%, 46.7%)

Tom Coughlin (53%, 50%, 50%)

John Gruden (57%, 50%, 50%)

Bear in mind that these are guys considered among the best in the entire coaching profession.

Finally, here's a brief list of some coaches who have been hired since Art Shell was fired by the Raiders after the 1994 season:

Mike White, Joe Bugel, Bill Calahan, Norv Turner, **** LeBeau, Bruce Coslet, Chris Palmer, Butch Davis, Lindy Infante, Dave Wannstadt, Rich Kotite, Mike Riley. Every single one of those deadbeats has a career losing record. AND THAT'S JUST IN THE AFC.

The fact that Shell hasn't gotten a single interview in almost a decade, *ESPECIALLY IN A LEAGUE THAT MANDATES ALL TEAMS MAKE AT LEAST ONE MINORITY INTERVIEW*, is perhaps the biggest joke, the biggest oversight, in the entire NFL. I mean, it's literally LAUGHABLE. And the fact that, in the end, he wound up in Oakland again, possibly the most dysfunctional franchise in the league, the place where careers go to die, the worst coaching position in the NFL, is a shame. Nay, a travesty.

So in other words, don't go bashing Art Shell. Not only has he had to put up with more injustice than any individual should have to deal with, but he's also got a fantastic resume that will put to the lie anything that you could possibly say about him.

I mean, heck, you want to know what the difference was between Art Shell, this guy you're saying was "no world beater", and John Gruden, the whiz-kid savior of the Raiders franchise?

Art Shell- 58.7% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-3 in playoffs.

John Gruden- 59.4% regular season winning percentage, 50% playoff appearance rate, 2-2 in playoffs.

And yet Gruden was worth 2 first and 2 second round draft choices, while Art Shell couldn't even get a mercy interview for a decade. Explain that one to me, please.

SSOG, very impressive coming from one of the biggest Bronco fans on this board, and right on. Shell has had some very mediocre talent to work with aside from Bo, M.Allen and T.Brown. QBs given were terrible. Good CBs on otherwise poor defenses, and yet he did take them to the AFC title game (where they got that pitiful 53-3 beat-down by the Bills). As far as this year's team, he'll get an O-line w/ average talent to overachieve. Brooks to Moss should work fairly well, and now that the DE playing OLB experiment is over the D will improve. They played the run better than most people remember last year but the stats don't back it up 'cause teams were up on them so quickly last year following the Moss demolition at the hands of S.D.. The young stable of DBs began showing some promise in the last 5 or so games. I don't believe this team will be much better than last years, but most don't remember how well they played early in the year before Moss' injury, keeping tight games w/ K.C., N.E. and Philly while T.O. and McNabb were full strength.As for Porter, Gabriel is my favorite behind Moss w/ Curry a close 3rd. Porter has more ability than both of those two combined, and should play behind them both on the depth chart. Shell has every right to try and coach this team, and Porter is lucky to get so much P.T.. Maybe that changes this year...

 

[SSOG]

There is some kind of game played at the end of each year..I forget what it is called.

OH SUPERBOWL -which btw Gruden won and Shell has not sniffed as a coach ever.

Art Shell is one of the greatest OL in the history of the NFl without a doubt, but as a head coach he has been lacking.

John Gruden did not win a Superbowl with the Raiders. He was 2-2 in the playoffs (to Shell's 2-3). The furthest he had ever gotten in the playoffs was the AFC Championship game (same with Shell).Look at Gruden's numbers with Oakland, and then look at Shell's numbers with Oakland. Then explain to me, if you will, why Gruden's numbers were so good that they warrented 2 first-rounders and 2 second-rounders, while Shell's numbers were so bad that they warrented getting fired. Please.

Also, LOL at saying that Shell was "lacking" as a head coach because he didn't win a superbowl in his first 6 seasons as a head coach.

Here's another list of coaches who are widely considered "pretty good", followed in parenthesis by how many years it was before they won a superbowl (or n/a if they haven't yet).

George Allen (n/a), Bill Bellichick (7), Don Coryell (n/a), Bill Cowher (14!), Tony Dungy (n/a), Jeff Fisher (n/a), Bud Grant (n/a), Denny Green (n/a), Chuck Nox (n/a), Tom Landry (12!), Marv Levy (n/a), John Madden (8), Jim Mora (n/a), etc. Were these guys all "lacking" as a head coach because they didn't win a Superbowl in their first 6 years with a team?

How many coaches have been HIRED since Art Shell has been fired who have won superbowls? 4, 5? Not many. The fact that Art Shell couldn't even get an INTERVIEW was *ridiculous*. ESPECIALLY SINCE THE NFL MANDATES THAT TEAMS INTERVIEW AT LEAST ONE MINORITY. I have no idea what the hell is up with that. I mean, did he sleep with every single owner's wife or something? What is the deal?