FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I am the biggest Akers hater on this board.Was offered Cam Akers in a Dynasty trade
What are you getting asking for for Harris?
I would still take that in an instant.
I am the biggest Akers hater on this board.Was offered Cam Akers in a Dynasty trade
What are you getting asking for for Harris?
Agreed. It's basically rinse and repeat every year trying to decipher the Pats backfield to no avail.The reasons I will let others spend waiver money on Harris:(in no particular order)
Coach Bill
Rex Burkhead
James White
Sony Michel
Cam Newton
JJ Taylor
We still don't know if Harris can pass protect or catch, which are both primary components to having a three down skill set. Cam is still going to steal the majority of goal line looks and a decent number of carries. White is still going to be their primary receiving back, and Burkhead is still a Swiss army knife that can do a lot of things. If I had to guess, Harris most likely wont see as much work in a "normal" game with Cam, a healthy OL, and a full stable of RBs. But it was a decent first game overall.Agreed. It's basically rinse and repeat every year trying to decipher the Pats backfield to no avail.
It does seem like Harris is the first guy in awhile that has a true three-down skill set, although I don't see Bill morphing from his mix and match usage of RBs.
must italicize to come trueBig believer in Damien Harris. This feels different.
That's bc he is different. Harris has the best pedigree of any rb NE has rostered in a very long timeBig believer in Damien Harris. This feels different.
i get history... and it could very well repeat.That's bc he is different. Harris has the best pedigree of any rb NE has rostered in a very long time
Feet dont lie
I was a big believer in his talent too - he looked special in college.Big believer in Damien Harris. This feels different.
https://twitter.com/markdanielspj/status/1313556112415887361?s=21Mark Daniels @MarkDanielsPJ
On Damien Harris
Belichick: He ran hard. Broke some tackles. It was good to have him back out there.
...which is super weird timing coming off of Michel's best game in a year.In the new era of board protocol on citing sources, radio personality and reporter for Patriots Weekly Andy Hart has a unique perspective. His hot take is that Sony Michel is NOT injured and the Patriots put him on IR to give Harris a chance to win the starting RB job in NE. His perspective is the Patriots are done with Michel and it’s Harris’ job moving forward and they won’t look back. To clarify, Hart is the only one floating this and his lack of support for Michel is well documented. For the record, I have not been a fan of Michel running the football in the past, but his blitz picking has been stellar, which makes him valuable. And he seems to have done a little better running this season. I still think it will be RBBC moving forward if everyone is healthy.
Thats probably the issue. It was his best game in forever. They know what he is. He has good games way too infrequently. It took him 32 games to pop a run over 40 yards. Harris did it in his first game. The timeline is that Harris was eligible to come off the IR....which is super weird timing coming off of Michel's best game in a year.![]()
Color me skeptical of this narrative. The timeline just doesn't add up.
If I had to put them in order...Agreed. It's basically rinse and repeat every year trying to decipher the Pats backfield to no avail.
It does seem like Harris is the first guy in awhile that has a true three-down skill set, although I don't see Bill morphing from his mix and match usage of RBs.
We’ll see. I remain skeptical.Thats probably the issue. It was his best game in forever. They know what he is. He has good games way too infrequently. It took him 32 games to pop a run over 40 yards. Harris did it in his first game. The timeline is that Harris was eligible to come off the IR.
I’m skeptical too about the reporter’s speculation but I’m equally skeptical that one good game would have changed the Patriots opinion of Michel if that were the case.We’ll see. I remain skeptical.
Who knows. It’s the Patriots. Next week Harris will get 6 carries and Burkhead will go 107 yards on 16 carries with 5/40 with 2 TDs.I’m skeptical too about the reporter’s speculation but I’m equally skeptical that one good game would have changed the Patriots opinion of Michel if that were the case.
Herein lies the big question. A lot more goes into football than just natural ability to run the football. People hate on Michel for not being a great runner (myself included). But he is as reliable as they come in blitz pickup, he can even block defensive lineman, and he can do that on his own and not part of a tag team blocking scheme. He doesn't chip rushers . . . he locks them up and has been giving Cam a lot more time and creates running lanes. Michel also holds onto the football, basically only coughing it up once roughly every 200 touches.Teezee said:Harris is not an elite level talent but he is head and shoulders above Michel or any other rb on the roster when it comes to pure, natural ability of running the ball.
Like I just posted, necessity is the mother of invention. If you need a warm body, Harris is about as good an option there is if you are out of options and the waiver wire is bare. He was always more of a lottery pick than a sure thing, and I saw him drafted all over the place in redraft leagues. He will most likely be part of the RB mix in NE. So maybe he's an upgrade to Michel and gets 10 or 12 carries for a little more yardage . . . but probably not a lot of red zone opportunities or receiving targets. That probably puts him the RB3 / flex range. Obviously some weeks better, some weeks worse. If Michel stays hurt or someone else gets hurt, then you will be on to something (provided Cam gets back in the line up soon).^ I love your Patriots take my man but due to injuries and byes coming up he is sliding into my starting slot based on sheer necessity. Glad I held on to him and I am sure there are others in the same spot and glad the timing is working out
Against conventional wisdom, I am sticking my neck out and saying he will be. I am more of a proactive than a reactive guy, I shoot my shotsTo be clear, I am not suggesting people to roster Harris, I am only wondering aloud how much fantasy impact he will have. For people with injury, bye week, or COVID issues, Harris certainly would be a decent option. But I am not ready to suggest that he will be a plug and play RB2 moving forward.
"Harris has shown some receiving ability at training camp, Phil Perry of NBC Sports Boston reports."Sorry no link but i had read where NE beat reporters were praising Harris for his pass catching ability in camp. Can anyone confirm?
Not that I am aware of. I do know Burkhead had the most passes and chemistry with Cam. Maybe someone had something on Harris and I missed it.Sorry no link but i had read where NE beat reporters were praising Harris for his pass catching ability in camp. Can anyone confirm?
I would suggest that this article tells a piece of the story but not the whole story. For example, multiple players for NE did not suit up at the beginning of training camp, so someone suggesting Harris was the most targeted player the first 4 practices doesn't really mean a whole lot. Edelman missed the start of camp but ended up the most targeted player. Burkhead was the most targeted RB. As I have mentioned several times, NE uses camp a little bit differently than other teams. They frequently have guys get a lot of work just to get some practice, so they can better evaluate players, and limit the workload of the actual starters. Once Michel came back, after a couple of shared practices working with the starters, Harris went back to working with the second unit and Michel took over regular work with the first team offense. And I will hold fast on my assessment that most of training camp was not full contact, and it's pretty easy to catch 5 yard swing passes when there's no tackling and no pass rush. Did Harris by most accounts have a good camp? Yes. Does that mean he jumps to the front of the line and grabs a ton of touches? Maybe . . . but maybe not.
If you said this every year since Cory Dillon was there, you'd have been right.maybe I’ll be wrong. It’s hard to get excited about a Patriots RB.
I’m reasonably certain that I have.If you said this every year since Cory Dillon was there, you'd have been right.
A little tongue and cheek but I do believe there is truth in this- Michel's ability to pick up the blitz's was MUCH more valuable when they had Tom Brady than now. I don't put that aspect into the equation nearly as much as before.Anarchy99 said:In the new era of board protocol on citing sources, radio personality and reporter for Patriots Weekly Andy Hart has a unique perspective. His hot take is that Sony Michel is NOT injured and the Patriots put him on IR to give Harris a chance to win the starting RB job in NE. His perspective is the Patriots are done with Michel and it’s Harris’ job moving forward and they won’t look back. To clarify, Hart is the only one floating this and his lack of support for Michel is well documented. For the record, I have not been a fan of Michel running the football in the past, but his blitz picking has been stellar, which makes him valuable. And he seems to have done a little better running this season. I still think it will be RBBC moving forward if everyone is healthy.
Because Cam is better at evading the pass rush, or because they don't care if Cam gets hit?A little tongue and cheek but I do believe there is truth in this- Michel's ability to pick up the blitz's was MUCH more valuable when they had Tom Brady than now. I don't put that aspect into the equation nearly as much as before.
Yes. To both.Because Cam is better at evading the pass rush, or because they don't care if Cam gets hit?![]()
I've never heard of a team not prioritizing blitz pickup for a RB. I can recall a number of otherwise talented backs getting less use, getting benched outright or having shorter careers for lacking that ability.
The Pats have long had a short leash for RBs who failed to pick up the blitz. I always assumed that was a BB thing more than a TB thing.
I have posted the actual production numbers and the salaries for the NE backfield over the years. RBBC has worked exceptionally well in NE (usually Top 5 in RB production) and cost wise (usually not near the top in amount paid to RBs). That is basically about as good as you can get in terms of outcomes. That being said, if a RB shows up that is leaps and bounds better than the other options and can pass protect, hold onto the football, catch passes, and stay healthy, then BB might consider giving that player a much bigger workload. But for years now I don't think Bill has been looking for that out of a RB. The rest of us may find that odd, but to BB, that seems to be a normal approach to team roster construction.The Patriots are just not going to Hitch their wagon to a RB , ever.
I will give you maybe "slightly less important", but I would say it's still really, really important. Cam got pummeled at times in CAR. If a QB drops back to pass and gets mauled by a completely missed blocking assignment, I don't care who it is, that QB is at risk of an injury. Cam might be able to avoid the first blitzer better than TB12, but I think Brady might be better avoiding bad hits than Cam has been. Tom on occasion dropped to the ground for phantom pass rushers and may have taken some sacks that he may not have had to. Cam seems like he will fight harder to keep the play alive and perhaps leaves himself more exposed than Brady did. Either way, teams won't get far if they leave guys running full speed unabated to the QB.Yes. To both.
Honestly, with TB12, it was priority 1,2, and 3 to keep him safe and able to do what he did. With anyone else, it's just not as important. With Cam, who is as likely to use his legs as almost anyone, the importance is not as "important" if he's not in the pocket anyway.
Now, of course, blitz pickup is a fundamental important thing to any team but since it's not TB12, I think if the HC sees a talented player, he is more willing now than before to say " let's put him out there" and be willing to teach as they go a bit more than they would be if it were Brady back there.
Important, but less so, given the situation.
Except Pederson came out in the off-season and said he wanted to feature Sanders. So I'm not sure who was still saying that. They were misinformed.I did hear a lot of the same “they just will always want an rbbc” talk about the Eagles, and now Sanders is a workhorse.
These things are mutually exclusive. BB can be a smart coach, and BB can still not use a RB the way you think he should or want him to. it is what it is. He hasn't for years and it's produced spectacular numbers. A smart coach also doesn't stop doing what's worked.Belichick is a smart coach, and if a back is head and shoulders above the rest they’ll likely play. I just don’t know whether Harris is that guy or not
I believe we are talking about different things. I agree that pass protection is important..very. but the underlying point is Bill can win in many ways. Tom Brady was a unique situation in terms of perceived loyalty and building a team around him because, well, he's Tom Brady. But EVERYONE else...bill just says "whatev" and moves on. He would like his qb to stay upright but he's not married to a 30+ year old, first year qb with injury history that wasn't on the team until late. If Bill can find better TEAM value by playing a player who happens to not be Ann all-pro pass protector, he's going that way. Like the bigmRussian said "if he dies, he dies". Lol.I will give you maybe "slightly less important", but I would say it's still really, really important. Cam got pummeled at times in CAR. If a QB drops back to pass and gets mauled by a completely missed blocking assignment, I don't care who it is, that QB is at risk of an injury. Cam might be able to avoid the first blitzer better than TB12, but I think Brady might be better avoiding bad hits than Cam has been. Tom on occasion dropped to the ground for phantom pass rushers and may have taken some sacks that he may not have had to. Cam seems like he will fight harder to keep the play alive and perhaps leaves himself more exposed than Brady did. Either way, teams won't get far if they leave guys running full speed unabated to the QB.
This. Brady also had/has that 6th sense - he "feels" pressure. His mental clock is legendary. Dude just senses when defenders are getting close. It has at times appeared almost supernatural how he takes a 1/2 step forward just out of the grasp of a blitzer & completes a pass.I will give you maybe "slightly less important", but I would say it's still really, really important. Cam got pummeled at times in CAR. If a QB drops back to pass and gets mauled by a completely missed blocking assignment, I don't care who it is, that QB is at risk of an injury. Cam might be able to avoid the first blitzer better than TB12, but I think Brady might be better avoiding bad hits than Cam has been. Tom on occasion dropped to the ground for phantom pass rushers and may have taken some sacks that he may not have had to. Cam seems like he will fight harder to keep the play alive and perhaps leaves himself more exposed than Brady did. Either way, teams won't get far if they leave guys running full speed unabated to the QB.
To clarify I was referencing the off-season after sanders was drafted, not people still saying that this past offseason. My point was more, that’s only ever the pattern until they get a guy worth making it not.Except Pederson came out in the off-season and said he wanted to feature Sanders. So I'm not sure who was still saying that. They were misinformed.
The following is not the best illustration, as a better comparison would be to list things by coaches and offensive coordinators, but that would take way too long (and this will essentially show what I want it to show, so it will do). Number of RBs since 2005 to have 250 or more touches in a season (15 total seasons).I did hear a lot of the same “they just will always want an rbbc” talk about the Eagles, and now Sanders is a workhorse.
Belichick is a smart coach, and if a back is head and shoulders above the rest they’ll likely play. I just don’t know whether Harris is that guy or not