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RB Deon Jackson, CLE (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Taylor and Hines out. Jackson looked decent last week. Decent play against jax?
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
He looked great last week. Is it confirmed that Hines & Taylor are both out?
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Yep, schefty says it too.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
I don’t know for sure, but he outsnapped Lindsay 46-30 and looked better and theoretically you would think they are more invested in him as a potential part of the future. That’s the case for Jackson.
I guess the case for Lindsay would be that he has gotten more comfortable with the system and the staff would prefer a vet who is theoretically safer.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Finally cut Allen Robinson for him. 
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Per @dwainmcfarland
Deon Jackson & Phillip Lindsay Utilization in Week 5 without Jonathan Taylor and Nyheim Hines:
Snaps: 58%, 38%
Rush Atts: 50%, 42%
Route Participation: 49%, 25%
Targets: 11%, 11%
Short yardage: 75%, 25%
Long down distance: 56%, 38%
Two-minute offense: 83%, 38%
Jackson > Lindsay
Deon Jackson & Phillip Lindsay Utilization in Week 5 without Jonathan Taylor and Nyheim Hines:
Snaps: 58%, 38%
Rush Atts: 50%, 42%
Route Participation: 49%, 25%
Targets: 11%, 11%
Short yardage: 75%, 25%
Long down distance: 56%, 38%
Two-minute offense: 83%, 38%
Jackson > Lindsay
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Thank god for Matt’s dump offs to neon deon because this colts offense looks like just about the worst thing I’ve ever seen
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Michael Carter had a couple of games like this. 8 receptions for 77 at the half
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
I did the same and in one day, jackson has equaled Robinson’s production for the year.Finally cut Allen Robinson for him.
Down Under
Footballguy
As a Taylor owner, now I'll feel obligated to carry Jackson all year long. 
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Injured on the play? Noooooooo
I’m at work - how bad?
I’m at work - how bad?
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
He’s fine
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Or not. Done for the day with the quad injury
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Back to the bench anyway next week. I look for both Taylor and Hines to be back.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I only have him in the league I’m trying to go 0-17, so he helped me with his injury.
I’m just glad it doesn’t sound severe. Now I can try to get a pick from the Taylor owner for him.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
He will probably wait for you to drop him after he’s third string again. Everyone had to know this was short lived. He will go back to the waiver wire in most leaguesI only have him in the league I’m trying to go 0-17, so he helped me with his injury.
I’m just glad it doesn’t sound severe. Now I can try to get a pick from the Taylor owner for him.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I’m trading him Monday morning dammitHe will probably wait for you to drop him after he’s third string again. Everyone had to know this was short lived. He will go back to the waiver wire in most leaguesI only have him in the league I’m trying to go 0-17, so he helped me with his injury.
I’m just glad it doesn’t sound severe. Now I can try to get a pick from the Taylor owner for him.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Regardless of what else happens, it was a glorious day
Chaka
Footballguy
You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
couldn't he take over Hines's role and be even more effective because defenses have more to worry about with him in the backfield than Hines?
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JohnnyU
Footballguy
Had Hines not gotten hurt Jackson would have received a lot less work. If healthy, Hines is still the handcuff to Taylor.You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
Chaka
Footballguy
I completely understand that point and I hope it didn't seem like I was unclear that Hines came into this season as the clear back up to Taylor.Had Hines not gotten hurt Jackson would have received a lot less work. If healthy, Hines is still the handcuff to Taylor.You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
However hasn't Jackson shown enough to at least challenge a, I don't want to say JAG but, not special, running back like Hines?
I mean if we were talking about a guy like Herbert who even though he looks like a better runner than Montgomery clearly the Bears are hesitant to open up the entire playbook for him, I would understand that, But with Jackson it doesn't seem like the Colts are hesitant to open up the entire playbook for him. So why do we believe that a fifth year running back who has been pretty good but not great, and more likely, average will automatically hold on to a backup running back job when there's a guy who they can do more with and as performed better?
Sam Quentin
Footballguy
Had Hines not gotten hurt Jackson would have received a lot less work. If healthy, Hines is still the handcuff to Taylor.You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
Jackson > Hines
if we see it, the coaches see it. It is just a matter of trust and personal politics now.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
I wouldn’t call Jackson special either. He went undrafted for a reason. Jackson may be better than we all thought. If no Taylor they might go to Jackson on early downs and keep Hines in his original role with Taylor.I completely understand that point and I hope it didn't seem like I was unclear that Hines came into this season as the clear back up to Taylor.Had Hines not gotten hurt Jackson would have received a lot less work. If healthy, Hines is still the handcuff to Taylor.You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
However hasn't Jackson shown enough to at least challenge a, I don't want to say JAG but, not special, running back like Hines?
I mean if we were talking about a guy like Herbert who even though he looks like a better runner than Montgomery clearly the Bears are hesitant to open up the entire playbook for him, I would understand that, But with Jackson it doesn't seem like the Colts are hesitant to open up the entire playbook for him. So why do we believe that a fifth year running back who has been pretty good but not great, and more likely, average will automatically hold on to a backup running back job when there's a guy who they can do more with and as performed better?
JohnnyU
Footballguy
You make that determination on one game?Had Hines not gotten hurt Jackson would have received a lot less work. If healthy, Hines is still the handcuff to Taylor.You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
Jackson > Hines
if we see it, the coaches see it. It is just a matter of trust and personal politics now.
Chaka
Footballguy
I could not disagree with this more. We do not remotely see what the coaches see.
And I don't think politics plays into it nearly as much as past protection. However in this situation it seems like the Colts trust Jackson in past protection, at least far more than they do Lindsay. I can't speak to how they feel about his performance relative to Hines.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
Jackson is probably a better all around back, but nowhere near as effective in open space as a receiver as Hines is. As a complement for taylor, Hines makes a lot more senseHad Hines not gotten hurt Jackson would have received a lot less work. If healthy, Hines is still the handcuff to Taylor.You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
Jackson > Hines
if we see it, the coaches see it. It is just a matter of trust and personal politics now.
Chaka
Footballguy
But, again if you look at what Jackson did today, 10 receptions 80 plus yards you know I just don't see why he couldn't supplant a guy like Hines. I mean, we all read what Frank Reich said about Hines in the preseason but none of that has actually developed over the first five games. At this point we are at the push comes to shove stage so why wouldn't Reich hang his hat on a guy like Jackson who has performed better than a guy like Hines?
All this to say that no one is supplanting Jonathan Taylor but why can't Jackson be the de facto backup over Hines?
Seriously, what has Hines ever done?
All this to say that no one is supplanting Jonathan Taylor but why can't Jackson be the de facto backup over Hines?
Seriously, what has Hines ever done?
Chaka
Footballguy
Yeah, that's the narrative but where's the proof? The numbers don't support that contention.Jackson is probably a better all around back, but nowhere near as effective in open space as a receiver as Hines is. As a complement for taylor, Hines makes a lot more senseHad Hines not gotten hurt Jackson would have received a lot less work. If healthy, Hines is still the handcuff to Taylor.You're probably right about Hines but...man it seems like the whole playbook is open for Deon. Hines, IMO, can't carry the load if something happens to Taylor. Deon can... at least more than Hines IMO.
I mean, Hines is a 5th year guy, I think he is what we have seen him to be. Is Hines really unreplaceable? It's not like he has been some dynamic Ekeler or Sproles guy. He's just okay. Is he locked into his role? Because Deon has been incredibly effective in the passing game and, unlike Hines he's built like a
Jackson > Hines
if we see it, the coaches see it. It is just a matter of trust and personal politics now.
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Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
I mean just based on watching them, Hines is shiftier and seems more elusive and can more easily grab and go.
I take your point about jackson possibly being more effective ultimately because defenses have to respect more of the playbook
I take your point about jackson possibly being more effective ultimately because defenses have to respect more of the playbook
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Maybe what it boils down to is that Jackson is a better Taylor than Hines is a Taylor and Hines is a better Hines than Jackson is. So in other words, Jackson will sit the bench as long as Taylor is healthy, but will have a better role than Hines if Taylor is out. I’m flexible enough to see it that way. The Colts may decide to keep Hines in his original role.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
I wouldn't even look at Hines as the cuff to Taylor at this point. Don't think his role would change much if Taylor went down. Think Jackson earned a much larger role if Taylor goes down. Probably not the original plan but Jackson seized the opportunities the last 2 games.
Hines hadn't shown anything as a rusher in 5 seasons. I guess he could be valued as something like a McKissic. I have Hines multiple PPR leagues and likely to consider dropping (something I wasn't considering before Jackson's performances)
Hines probably has more weekly value if Taylor/him are healthy. If Taylor goes down, I'll take Jackson myself
Hines hadn't shown anything as a rusher in 5 seasons. I guess he could be valued as something like a McKissic. I have Hines multiple PPR leagues and likely to consider dropping (something I wasn't considering before Jackson's performances)
Hines probably has more weekly value if Taylor/him are healthy. If Taylor goes down, I'll take Jackson myself
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Chaka
Footballguy
@Long Ball Larry @JohnnyU @Craig_MiamiFL
Yeah, I agree with all of what you said. My only point contention is why is Hines role secure when Taylor is healthy?
After five seasons he's a career 4.1 y/rush, 7.3 y/reception guy. I was completely on board with Reich's talk this off season but it has amounted to more of what Hines has always been.
To be clear, I am not saying Jackson is special, Taylor's job is 100% secure IMO, but he seems to be at least as good as Hines and probably better.
Yeah, I agree with all of what you said. My only point contention is why is Hines role secure when Taylor is healthy?
After five seasons he's a career 4.1 y/rush, 7.3 y/reception guy. I was completely on board with Reich's talk this off season but it has amounted to more of what Hines has always been.
To be clear, I am not saying Jackson is special, Taylor's job is 100% secure IMO, but he seems to be at least as good as Hines and probably better.
barackdhouse
Footballguy
That was fun. Zero RB doing well for me in this young season.
Chaka
Footballguy
I look at in a similar way as I do Khalil Herbert. He seems like a much better runner than Montgomery but, clearly the Bears (this regime or the last) feel he is lacking in most other, non running aspects relative to Monty. So the playbook is more condensed.
But that doesn't seem to be the case here. It feels like Jackson can do everything Hines can and possibly more. I mean, think about Jackson's TD, he absolutely blasted his way into the end zone, would the Colts even have considered running that play with Hines? I doubt it.
Am I crazy to think that?
But that doesn't seem to be the case here. It feels like Jackson can do everything Hines can and possibly more. I mean, think about Jackson's TD, he absolutely blasted his way into the end zone, would the Colts even have considered running that play with Hines? I doubt it.
Am I crazy to think that?
barackdhouse
Footballguy
Well he definitely has protoypical RB size compared to Hines, but Hines is a dual-threat playmaker and will likely keep a role no matter what. Jackson may have earned the legit handcuff role though. He balled out last week and then obviously today.
Chaka
Footballguy
Yes, but hasn't Jackson demonstrated he is also a dual threat playmaker?
And what kind of playmaker has Hines shown himself to be? Is he really a playmaker? Why do we believe he has any kind of special juke ability that he hasn't demonstrated in his first four seasons?
barackdhouse
Footballguy
Yes I'm agreeing with you about Deon. I'm simply stating Hines is actually pretty good. And he absolutely has demonstrated it. But he is small so IMO they should give Deon the clear #2 role. That's all.
rockaction
Footballguy
Uh, yes. Pretty clearly.
