Liquid Tension
Footballguy
It is pretty much the consensus that this guy is the best player and all you hear is "can't miss" and things like the "best player to...in 20 years”
After watching him in the title game I was not too impressed (the lateral showed some lack of awareness but big deal). Yes, - he is elusive in the open field and fast (but as far as I have not even the fastest back in the draft. At 5’11” and 201 lbs can he be a feature back?
What happens when there isn’t so much space when he gets to the pros? What happens when 245 lb defensive players run a 4.5 and don’t allow him to get to the corner, let alone turn it? He does not seem like the type of guy who can lower his shoulder and run HARD. Even Portis can run hard and has always had the heart if not the size. More on Portis in a little bit.
Let’s just take the assumption that the only thing that could hold back Bush is his size. The size may impact his durability as he has been able to share the load in college. Both Caddy and Ronnie Brown broke down a little bit last year and they were in the same type of boat (granted this may not be statistically meaningful) as Bush until they got to the pros. If the size is THE issue, who is a close comp and have these other guys been able to pack on some weight to make them more “pro ready?”
As I list some of these guys I need to note that my own personal belief is that if a guy is only going to weigh 205 pounds or so, I would rather him be short and hold that weight rather than 5’11” or taller carrying the same weight. The lower center of gravity should give the player more power rather than spreading the weight over more height.
Westbrook was a great playmaker in college and he came out at 5’8” 200 and has only put on about 3-4 pounds since. Westbrook is still a great playmaker and perhaps the best open field runner in the game. Again I would rather my player be 5’8” and 205 than 5’11” and 205 (assuming Bush can add 3-4 pounds in the first 3 years in the league) Please keep in mind that some scouts say he is already maxed out bulk wise based on how ripped he is and adding fat wouldn’t help.
Lower weight guys who have been successful:
Portis because he is perhaps the best comp in terms of size, even though Portis is 10 pounds heavier now. Portis is 5’11” and 213. This weight is acceptable but Portis is still a little lean.
Tiki Barber 5’10 and 200 weight has increased 3 pounds – Another good example of a light guy playing well, although Tiki is more like 5’8” than 5’10” IMO
D. Davis 5’9” 216. – Has 15 more pounds packed into a less tall frame.
Priest Holmes – 5’9” 205 – Again packed into a smaller frame.
Lower weight guys with a little success:
Maurice Morris – Not in the same league in talent but was a 2nd round pick. Was 5’11” and 202 coming out of college and has remained at the same weight.
Julius Jones – 5’10” 205 – Has had trouble staying healthy.
Tatum Bell is 5’11” and 213 put on 4 pounds according to my records
Willie Parker – 5’10” and 209. Still 8 pounds heavier than Bush and an inch shorter to pack that weight into.
Lower weight guys with very little success:
JJ Arrington is 5’9” and 214 and people call him too light? If Bush were doing what he has done with this size I wouldn’t be writing this.
Maurice Hicks is 5’11” and 200 lbs – so this is the closest in size and Hicks is a fast back. Is this the best comp? Think about the stature of Hicks on the field and he looks like he will get pushed around
Reno Mahe – 5’10” 212. This is a guy people are saying is too light?
Lee Suggs – 6’0” and 206.
Amos Zereoue – 5’10” and 200
Moe Williams – 6’1” 210
I am not saying that Bush will or won’t be good. What I am saying is that we need to look at the negatives that could materialize. If, and it is a big if he can pack on 12 pounds and not lose too much speed, he would be the same size as Portis and Tatum Bell; guys that you wouldn’t mistake for power guys.
Bottom line is that I couldn’t find ANY guys who are 5’11” or above that weigh less than 210 lbs or less who have been very successful who are still playing. I am sure there are some out there (please find them) but it is a small set. Moe Williams and Lee Suggs are the only people who have had some success.
Doesn’t this scare you?
After watching him in the title game I was not too impressed (the lateral showed some lack of awareness but big deal). Yes, - he is elusive in the open field and fast (but as far as I have not even the fastest back in the draft. At 5’11” and 201 lbs can he be a feature back?
What happens when there isn’t so much space when he gets to the pros? What happens when 245 lb defensive players run a 4.5 and don’t allow him to get to the corner, let alone turn it? He does not seem like the type of guy who can lower his shoulder and run HARD. Even Portis can run hard and has always had the heart if not the size. More on Portis in a little bit.
Let’s just take the assumption that the only thing that could hold back Bush is his size. The size may impact his durability as he has been able to share the load in college. Both Caddy and Ronnie Brown broke down a little bit last year and they were in the same type of boat (granted this may not be statistically meaningful) as Bush until they got to the pros. If the size is THE issue, who is a close comp and have these other guys been able to pack on some weight to make them more “pro ready?”
As I list some of these guys I need to note that my own personal belief is that if a guy is only going to weigh 205 pounds or so, I would rather him be short and hold that weight rather than 5’11” or taller carrying the same weight. The lower center of gravity should give the player more power rather than spreading the weight over more height.
Westbrook was a great playmaker in college and he came out at 5’8” 200 and has only put on about 3-4 pounds since. Westbrook is still a great playmaker and perhaps the best open field runner in the game. Again I would rather my player be 5’8” and 205 than 5’11” and 205 (assuming Bush can add 3-4 pounds in the first 3 years in the league) Please keep in mind that some scouts say he is already maxed out bulk wise based on how ripped he is and adding fat wouldn’t help.
Lower weight guys who have been successful:
Portis because he is perhaps the best comp in terms of size, even though Portis is 10 pounds heavier now. Portis is 5’11” and 213. This weight is acceptable but Portis is still a little lean.
Tiki Barber 5’10 and 200 weight has increased 3 pounds – Another good example of a light guy playing well, although Tiki is more like 5’8” than 5’10” IMO
D. Davis 5’9” 216. – Has 15 more pounds packed into a less tall frame.
Priest Holmes – 5’9” 205 – Again packed into a smaller frame.
Lower weight guys with a little success:
Maurice Morris – Not in the same league in talent but was a 2nd round pick. Was 5’11” and 202 coming out of college and has remained at the same weight.
Julius Jones – 5’10” 205 – Has had trouble staying healthy.
Tatum Bell is 5’11” and 213 put on 4 pounds according to my records
Willie Parker – 5’10” and 209. Still 8 pounds heavier than Bush and an inch shorter to pack that weight into.
Lower weight guys with very little success:
JJ Arrington is 5’9” and 214 and people call him too light? If Bush were doing what he has done with this size I wouldn’t be writing this.
Maurice Hicks is 5’11” and 200 lbs – so this is the closest in size and Hicks is a fast back. Is this the best comp? Think about the stature of Hicks on the field and he looks like he will get pushed around
Reno Mahe – 5’10” 212. This is a guy people are saying is too light?
Lee Suggs – 6’0” and 206.
Amos Zereoue – 5’10” and 200
Moe Williams – 6’1” 210
I am not saying that Bush will or won’t be good. What I am saying is that we need to look at the negatives that could materialize. If, and it is a big if he can pack on 12 pounds and not lose too much speed, he would be the same size as Portis and Tatum Bell; guys that you wouldn’t mistake for power guys.
Bottom line is that I couldn’t find ANY guys who are 5’11” or above that weigh less than 210 lbs or less who have been very successful who are still playing. I am sure there are some out there (please find them) but it is a small set. Moe Williams and Lee Suggs are the only people who have had some success.
Doesn’t this scare you?
, just a touch.
Even if that is true, I guarantee you it's not that big of a difference. The Colts still draft shrimp defensive players.
Maybe I should have said under 208 
Good job, that is one I missed. I did say that there had to be a few, but it is pretty rare. Martin has been a warrior and a great player.
But when we are all making an analysis we need to go into it with our eyes open that it is rare this type of body is successful. Could he be the 2nd or 3rd in the era, sure, but we have to acknowledge that the odds are aginst him (and that is with him adding 9 pounds)
I guess I expected more from some of the people on this board. The sad part is that we do agree and this is why I traded a lot for the 1st pick in the draft.
