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Rookies of the Year (1 Viewer)

cracKer

Shawn Culcasi
Merriman and/or Ware are playing well while D.J. has slowed down. Either of those guys should push Thurman.

 

GRIDIRON ASSASSIN

Footballguy
Kyle Orton, Bears
Statistically, Orton has been less than spectacular.But other than Dan Marino and Ben Roethlesberger, I can't think of any other rookie QB that has started and won eight games. ....and other than being pulled at 'junk time' of the Lions blowout, Orton has taken every snap.

 

Bri

Footballguy
Kyle Orton, Bears
Statistically, Orton has been less than spectacular.But other than Dan Marino and Ben Roethlesberger, I can't think of any other rookie QB that has started and won eight games. ....and other than being pulled at 'junk time' of the Lions blowout, Orton has taken every snap.
Shaun King?
 

AhrnCityPahnder

Yinz-o-riffic
Kyle Orton and Odell Thurmannedit -- just remembered Demarcus Ware -- from what little I have seen of him he's been a monster too. Has he been solid all year or just the occasional highlight reel?

 
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-OZ-

Footballguy
Offense is either Brown or Orton, my vote goes to Orton.Defense is more debateable - an argument could be made for Ware, Merriman, Thurman, Tatupu, DJ, and Darent Williams. I'll vote for Tatupu, but could easily see Thurman or Williams.

 

Wadsworth

Footballguy
Kyle Orton, Bears
I've only seen the Bears play a few times and Orton looked pretty bad in those games. What is it that he's doing that is so impressive?54.5%

5.22 YPA

9 TD

12 INT

62.3 passer rating

 

-OZ-

Footballguy
Kyle Orton, Bears
I've only seen the Bears play a few times and Orton looked pretty bad in those games. What is it that he's doing that is so impressive?54.5%

5.22 YPA

9 TD

12 INT

62.3 passer rating
WINNINGIt's debateable whether he's helping them win, or they're winning despite him, but QBs always get credit/blame for the record.2

 

Wadsworth

Footballguy
Kyle Orton, Bears
I've only seen the Bears play a few times and Orton looked pretty bad in those games. What is it that he's doing that is so impressive?54.5%

5.22 YPA

9 TD

12 INT

62.3 passer rating
WINNINGIt's debateable whether he's helping them win, or they're winning despite him, but QBs always get credit/blame for the record.2
As soon as I posted I thought about it and knew someone would come back with "winning". I guess no one else is running away with it. But was hoping someone could tell me something I don't yet know about his play that is impressive. It looks like the bears will sit Grosman even when he's healthy, if so that's a pretty big statement from the coaches about Orton. His numbers look pretty averge for a rookie QB. Right in line with Harrington, Carr, Boller, a little better than Eli, but worse than Ramsey, Leftwich and of course Big Ben.

 
Kyle Orton.........then Caddy Williams.I just think Caddy will have a strong finish which will impress some voters and R. Brown will be playing 2nd fiddle to R. Williams.So often how you finish in these close races sways the voters and I just don't see Brown tearing it up down the stretch.

 

Please See Mine

Footballguy
Kyle Orton.........then Caddy Williams.

I just think Caddy will have a strong finish which will impress some voters and R. Brown will be playing 2nd fiddle to R. Williams.

So often how you finish in these close races sways the voters and I just don't see Brown tearing it up down the stretch.
Thank you. Finally a vote for Caddy. I would take him as the pick now because he looks to be gettnig his stride back.
 

Lord Lucan

Footballguy
Kyle Orton, Bears
The leading rookie QB is certain to garner strong consideration.The trouble is, if we look at TDs as a measure of this, Orton might finish up second to the boy from Harvard.

 

-OZ-

Footballguy
Kyle Orton, Bears
I've only seen the Bears play a few times and Orton looked pretty bad in those games. What is it that he's doing that is so impressive?54.5%

5.22 YPA

9 TD

12 INT

62.3 passer rating
WINNINGIt's debateable whether he's helping them win, or they're winning despite him, but QBs always get credit/blame for the record.2
As soon as I posted I thought about it and knew someone would come back with "winning". I guess no one else is running away with it. But was hoping someone could tell me something I don't yet know about his play that is impressive. It looks like the bears will sit Grosman even when he's healthy, if so that's a pretty big statement from the coaches about Orton. His numbers look pretty averge for a rookie QB. Right in line with Harrington, Carr, Boller, a little better than Eli, but worse than Ramsey, Leftwich and of course Big Ben.
I guess my answer to this question is, there isn't another good reason.Maybe the lack of another rookie producing at a high level? Brown has Williams in town, Caddy and Braylon got injured, Jones is now hampered by a lesser QB, etc.

My darkhorse canidate is Reggie Brown, if he can correct a couple mental mistakes and make those big plays from this point on, he may get some votes.

 
There is a big difference between Orton and Ben R IMO.Ben R looked good on the field AND statistically while he was winning (until the end of the year when he sorta faded). Ben had a 67% completion%, 8.03 YPA and 10:4 TD:INT ratio in his starts through week 12. Orton isn't even on the same football field statistically.If your sole criteria of ROY if being on a winning team, than sure Orton will have a chance at the award, but if your criteria includes more than that, he has no chance whatsoever. There's a reason why RBs have won 7 of the last 10 awards and it's because they have the easiest path to putting up good stats. Only 2 QBs have won ROY and Dan Marino wasn't even one of them (of course that Eric Dickerson guy had a decent rookie year I hear).Aside from competing with Caddy and Ronnie Brown for ROY honors, let's not forget Fitzpatrick and Gado who have recently thrown their hat in the ring.

 
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daanswr4

Footballguy
Right now Id say Lofa Tatupu & Kyle Orton.
:goodposting: Lofa is a leader already of that defense that's vastly improved and Orton just keeps winning ballgames... although from time to time it seems like he may be trying to lose them. He really is playing much better than he was at the beginning of the year though.
 

bshipper

Footballguy
Since DROY seems to have more choices, lets look at a few of them.Odell ThurmanTackles = 64Sacks = 1Ints = 4FF/FR = 3/1TDs = 1Pass Def = 3Shawne MerrimanTackles = 33Sacks = 7Ints = 0FF/FR = 2/0TDs = 0Pass Def = 3Lofa TatupuTackles = 81Sacks = 3.5Ints = 1FF/FR = 0/0TDs = 0Pass Def = 1DeMarcus WareTackles = 36Sacks = 4Ints = 0FF/FR = 0/0TDs = 0Pass Def = 1Derrick JohnsonTackles = 68Sacks = 1Ints = 0FF/FR = 2/1TDs = 0Pass Def = 4Darrent WilliamsTackles = 46Sacks = 1Ints = 1FF/FR = 1/1TDs = 1Pass Def = 7Thurman and Johnson are very similar, except for Thurman's 4 INTs. Tatupu has more tackles but fewer TOs created. Merriman and Ware are very similar, much fewer tackles than the others but more sacks. Williams is the only non-LB, so he is tough to compare based on stats.

 

Bloom

Moderator
Since DROY seems to have more choices, lets look at a few of them.

Odell Thurman

Tackles = 64

Sacks = 1

Ints = 4

FF/FR = 3/1

TDs = 1

Pass Def = 3

Shawne Merriman

Tackles = 33

Sacks = 7

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 2/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 3

Lofa Tatupu

Tackles = 81

Sacks = 3.5

Ints = 1

FF/FR = 0/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 1

DeMarcus Ware

Tackles = 36

Sacks = 4

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 0/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 1

Derrick Johnson

Tackles = 68

Sacks = 1

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 2/1

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 4

Darrent Williams

Tackles = 46

Sacks = 1

Ints = 1

FF/FR = 1/1

TDs = 1

Pass Def = 7

Thurman and Johnson are very similar, except for Thurman's 4 INTs. Tatupu has more tackles but fewer TOs created. Merriman and Ware are very similar, much fewer tackles than the others but more sacks. Williams is the only non-LB, so he is tough to compare based on stats.
However, Looking beyond the stats, Tatupu has also taken on a ton of responsibility and revitalized a defense that was seriously lagging last year. I don't think any of those other guys has lifted up the level of the play of his teammates as much as Tatupu has. From a straight up individual play standpoint, Merriman has probably outshone Tatupu.
 

Wadsworth

Footballguy
No mention of Heath Miller? Only Shockey and Gates have more TE TDs. A few more TDs and he'll be hard to ignore.As far as Matt Jones, I don't even think he's the ROY on the Jags. Khalif Barnes has stepped in and done a very good job at LT. But I can't imagine a O-lineman winning offensive ROY. Has it ever happened?

 

Banger

Footballguy
Matt Jones
LOL. Orton not because he's been good but none of the other offensive rook's have done anything to warrant the nod. At least Orton is the QB on a winning team.
 

Gargoylez

Footballguy
There is a big difference between Orton and Ben R IMO.

Ben R looked good on the field AND statistically while he was winning (until the end of the year when he sorta faded). Ben had a 67% completion%, 8.03 YPA and 10:4 TD:INT ratio in his starts through week 12. Orton isn't even on the same football field statistically.

If your sole criteria of ROY if being on a winning team, than sure Orton will have a chance at the award, but if your criteria includes more than that, he has no chance whatsoever. There's a reason why RBs have won 7 of the last 10 awards and it's because they have the easiest path to putting up good stats. Only 2 QBs have won ROY and Dan Marino wasn't even one of them (of course that Eric Dickerson guy had a decent rookie year I hear).

Aside from competing with Caddy and Ronnie Brown for ROY honors, let's not forget Fitzpatrick and Gado who have recently thrown their hat in the ring.
Lets revisit 2001 shall we (I think 2001)?Anthony THomas or Ladanian Tomlinson.

Thomas wins rookie of the year. Why?

Not better stats but a winning record for the team he played for.

Its all about hype and the sexy pick. Orten looks to be the sexy pick because he babysits an offense that barely gets by while the defense does everything.

Brown or Caddy should get the nod, but Orten may get it instead.

Looking back now.... Thomas rookie of the year is LAUGHABLE. The award doesn't mean much to me now, it can be VERY flawed.

 

cstu

Footballguy
Since DROY seems to have more choices, lets look at a few of them.

Odell Thurman

Tackles = 64

Sacks = 1

Ints = 4

FF/FR = 3/1

TDs = 1

Pass Def = 3

Shawne Merriman

Tackles = 33

Sacks = 7

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 2/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 3

Lofa Tatupu

Tackles = 81

Sacks = 3.5

Ints = 1

FF/FR = 0/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 1

DeMarcus Ware

Tackles = 36

Sacks = 4

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 0/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 1

Derrick Johnson

Tackles = 68

Sacks = 1

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 2/1

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 4

Darrent Williams

Tackles = 46

Sacks = 1

Ints = 1

FF/FR = 1/1

TDs = 1

Pass Def = 7

Thurman and Johnson are very similar, except for Thurman's 4 INTs. Tatupu has more tackles but fewer TOs created. Merriman and Ware are very similar, much fewer tackles than the others but more sacks. Williams is the only non-LB, so he is tough to compare based on stats.
However, Looking beyond the stats, Tatupu has also taken on a ton of responsibility and revitalized a defense that was seriously lagging last year. I don't think any of those other guys has lifted up the level of the play of his teammates as much as Tatupu has. From a straight up individual play standpoint, Merriman has probably outshone Tatupu.
I'd like Merriman to get it since he's made a huge impact for the Chargers, but Thurman has done everything except get a lot of sacks. Right now it's a toss up between Merriman and Thurman statistically and the team impact of Tatupu.
 
Lets revisit 2001 shall we (I think 2001)?

Anthony THomas or Ladanian Tomlinson.

Thomas wins rookie of the year. Why?

Not better stats but a winning record for the team he played for.

Its all about hype and the sexy pick. Orten looks to be the sexy pick because he babysits an offense that barely gets by while the defense does everything.

Brown or Caddy should get the nod, but Orten may get it instead.

Looking back now.... Thomas rookie of the year is LAUGHABLE. The award doesn't mean much to me now, it can be VERY flawed.
It's laughable in hindsight because of what we know about those players NOW.However, in 2001, they had remarkably similar rushing stats. The only difference was, LT started from week 1 and A-Train didn't start until around week 6 (James Allen was starting).

So A-Train was a RB who came on later in the season and put up the same stats as LT in about 5-6 fewer games. Being 13-3 didn't hurt either, but even taking wins out of the equation, you can obviously see a strong performance/statistical reason for taking A-Train over LT in 2001.

Caddy is on a winning team and if he finishes the season they way he started it, he will get the OROY vote.

There's no way the same people who thought Ben R was ROY in 2004 could look at Orton and think he is comparable. Of course, if all you look at is wins (flawed thinking), then maybe some people will vote for him.

I don't see a lot of hype about Orton compared to Ben R last year.

In the hypothetical...

If Fitzpatrick leads the Rams to say.. 3-2 their last five games and puts up typical Rams QB numbers, he'd be the "sexy" pick.

 
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ren hoek

Footballguy
Kyle Orton.........then Caddy Williams.

I just think Caddy will have a strong finish which will impress some voters and R. Brown will be playing 2nd fiddle to R. Williams.

So often how you finish in these close races sways the voters and I just don't see Brown tearing it up down the stretch.
Thank you. Finally a vote for Caddy. I would take him as the pick now because he looks to be gettnig his stride back.
Yeah, but he already lost the war.
 

jeremyx13

Footballguy
Since DROY seems to have more choices, lets look at a few of them.

Odell Thurman

Tackles = 64

Sacks = 1

Ints = 4

FF/FR = 3/1

TDs = 1

Pass Def = 3

Shawne Merriman

Tackles = 33

Sacks = 7

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 2/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 3

Lofa Tatupu

Tackles = 81

Sacks = 3.5

Ints = 1

FF/FR = 0/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 1

DeMarcus Ware

Tackles = 36

Sacks = 4

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 0/0

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 1

Derrick Johnson

Tackles = 68

Sacks = 1

Ints = 0

FF/FR = 2/1

TDs = 0

Pass Def = 4

Darrent Williams

Tackles = 46

Sacks = 1

Ints = 1

FF/FR = 1/1

TDs = 1

Pass Def = 7

Thurman and Johnson are very similar, except for Thurman's 4 INTs.  Tatupu has more tackles but fewer TOs created.  Merriman and Ware are very similar, much fewer tackles than the others but more sacks.  Williams is the only non-LB, so he is tough to compare based on stats.
However, Looking beyond the stats, Tatupu has also taken on a ton of responsibility and revitalized a defense that was seriously lagging last year. I don't think any of those other guys has lifted up the level of the play of his teammates as much as Tatupu has. From a straight up individual play standpoint, Merriman has probably outshone Tatupu.
I'd like Merriman to get it since he's made a huge impact for the Chargers, but Thurman has done everything except get a lot of sacks. Right now it's a toss up between Merriman and Thurman statistically and the team impact of Tatupu.
One impressive fact about Darrant Williams is that the Broncos D is blitzing 3 out of every 4 plays which puts the CB's in alot of one-on-one situations. Williams has held his own most of the time. Not bad for a rookie. I have heard that corner is one of the hardest positions to be great at early on in a career. He has a good start, plus he returns kicks. Wouldn't it be nice to see a different position win the award than an average QB who happens to have a GREAT Defense or a RB who hits the wall after 10-12 weeks. Just my opinion.
 

Bri

Footballguy
Kyle Orton and Odell Thurmann

edit -- just remembered Demarcus Ware -- from what little I have seen of him he's been a monster too. Has he been solid all year or just the occasional highlight reel?
since about week 2 or 3
 

Bri

Footballguy
Since LT, I've always been a sucker for a LBer catching a WR or RB from behind. In theory, they shouldn't be fast enough to catch the RB or WR running to the opposite side of the field. DJ does it with some regularity and ....well I'm a sucker for that sorta play, it's quite impressive.

 

abe froman

Footballguy
Orton because of the wins- mostly due to their defenseThurman because he earns it and because of their record.

 

Wadsworth

Footballguy
You guys still think Orton is the guy?60.2 QB rating13 INTS11 fumbles, lost 59 TDsHe's on place for 12 TDs and 24 INT/lost fumbles.

 
T

trader jake

Guest
offense:cadillac williamsronnie browndefense:lofa tatupudarrent williams

 

Donnybrook

Footballguy
Droy, IMO is a two man race. Thurman or Tatupu. Thurman’s pick this week may not have been as spectacular as Tatupu’s but it was probably had more direct effect on the outcome of the Cinci/Pitt game. It is hard to choose between them right now. But if I had to choose at this moment I would say Tatupu because Seattle has been searching for years for some to fill the void in the middle of their defense. This kid continues to exceed expectations.

 

Bri

Footballguy
Lofa Tatupu stealing votes...
perfect night and time to "put on a show" last night. I wish we could poll voters. I bet he landed a good amount last night. Thurman, DJ, etc are going to have to have an especially good game now to sway things back their way. I think last night was huge for Lofa.
 

SoFresh&SoClean

Footballguy
10 tackles, INT, FF, Pass defensed against the Steelers to gain control of AFC North isn't a huge game?

 
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