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Rumor: Moss to Big D (2 Viewers)

David Yudkin

Footballguy
Switz once again paints his brush from the paint of glittering generalities.Points allowed per game in the post-season:2007: 16.33 (lost SB)2006: 25.00 (lost AFCC)2005: 15.00 (lost Divisional round)2004: 17.00 (won SB)2003: 19.00 (won SB)2001: 15.67 (won SB)NE's post season defense allowed fewer points than two of their SB teams (and allowed only 2 more points total than the other). Bottom line, the Pats could have allowed 10 ppg in the regular season and it would not have made any difference against hte Giants, so the claims of great offense, terrible defense are way overhyped.And FWIW, a team scoring only 14 points has won exactly one SB title (ironically enough the 72 Dolphins). People can try to spin it htat the defense lost the title, but the offense didn't show up against the Giants (and the NY defense had a lot to do with that).
Nice subtle personal attack there Yudkin...Aren't you ignoring the opponents? And why are we limiting our conversation to the postseason? And the context of the games? As I said, with their high octane offense, they forced most of their opponents into a one-dimensional offense. When you do that, you are able to hide many of your defensive weaknesses.I think it's rather evident that in 2006 without the powerful offense, their defensive deficiencies were apparent, and that is one of the main reasons that the FO went out and built the powerful offense in '07. It was easier for them to add three WRs than to cover all the weak areas of their defense. I'm really surprised that you, with your tremendous football acumen, can't acknowledge that. Disappointed.
We've had this debate for the past 6 months. You can point to whatever numbers, explanations, opponent's injuries, or whatever else you want.The Pats were ahead by 4 TDs most games in the first half of the season. Wouldn't be only natural for the defense to not really care a whole heck of a lot if the opposition moved the ball and cut the score to only 3 TD?NE has lived on the theory of let the opponent move the ball but not get TDs. This mantra has not changed in many years.Here were the breakdowns for NE this year:Pre bye week: 16.33 ppg allowedPost bye week: 18.14 ppg allowedPost season: 16.33 ppg allowedI don't see where they collapsed defensively this year. They went 18-1. How people can suggest that they are done (on defense) surprises me. THey had guys starting in SB wins that no one had ever heard of and were on the street a few weeks earlier.I agree that as of today they are weak at LB and they need someone to replace Samuel. But the season doesn't start for another 6-7 months.And since we are on the subject about beating injured competitors, why is it that the Pats could beat a banged up SD but the Colts couldn't? Yet no one is saying how suspect the Colts defense is (they gave up 28 points to SD when NE gave up 12).
 

switz

Footballguy
Switz once again paints his brush from the paint of glittering generalities.

Points allowed per game in the post-season:

2007: 16.33 (lost SB)

2006: 25.00 (lost AFCC)

2005: 15.00 (lost Divisional round)

2004: 17.00 (won SB)

2003: 19.00 (won SB)

2001: 15.67 (won SB)

NE's post season defense allowed fewer points than two of their SB teams (and allowed only 2 more points total than the other). Bottom line, the Pats could have allowed 10 ppg in the regular season and it would not have made any difference against hte Giants, so the claims of great offense, terrible defense are way overhyped.

And FWIW, a team scoring only 14 points has won exactly one SB title (ironically enough the 72 Dolphins). People can try to spin it htat the defense lost the title, but the offense didn't show up against the Giants (and the NY defense had a lot to do with that).
Nice subtle personal attack there Yudkin...Aren't you ignoring the opponents? And why are we limiting our conversation to the postseason? And the context of the games? As I said, with their high octane offense, they forced most of their opponents into a one-dimensional offense. When you do that, you are able to hide many of your defensive weaknesses.

I think it's rather evident that in 2006 without the powerful offense, their defensive deficiencies were apparent, and that is one of the main reasons that the FO went out and built the powerful offense in '07. It was easier for them to add three WRs than to cover all the weak areas of their defense. I'm really surprised that you, with your tremendous football acumen, can't acknowledge that. Disappointed.
We've had this debate for the past 6 months. You can point to whatever numbers, explanations, opponent's injuries, or whatever else you want.The Pats were ahead by 4 TDs most games in the first half of the season. Wouldn't be only natural for the defense to not really care a whole heck of a lot if the opposition moved the ball and cut the score to only 3 TD?

NE has lived on the theory of let the opponent move the ball but not get TDs. This mantra has not changed in many years.

Here were the breakdowns for NE this year:

Pre bye week: 16.33 ppg allowed

Post bye week: 18.14 ppg allowed

Post season: 16.33 ppg allowed

I don't see where they collapsed defensively this year. They went 18-1. How people can suggest that they are done (on defense) surprises me. THey had guys starting in SB wins that no one had ever heard of and were on the street a few weeks earlier.

I agree that as of today they are weak at LB and they need someone to replace Samuel. But the season doesn't start for another 6-7 months.
Really? Are you serious? Come on David. No, why would the defense relax? The bigger the lead, the more panicked the offense, the easier to defend. It covered their defensive weaknesses. And you even acknowledge some of their weaknesses, but then insist they didn't have a bad defense?? Contradictory...There's really nothing wrong in acknowledging that your team is not good in one area. The Pats were amazing on O, good on ST, but weak/bad on D. That doesn't mean they sucked as a team.

And since we are on the subject about beating injured competitors, why is it that the Pats could beat a banged up SD but the Colts couldn't? Yet no one is saying how suspect the Colts defense is (they gave up 28 points to SD when NE gave up 12).
Well it probably hasn't been mentioned here because this isn't a thread about INDY. However, I would agree, and have been saying for years, that Indy's defense is their weakness. Heck, most people said after last year, that the reason the Colts won, is because their defense finally stepped it up.As for the game against SD... SD had all their offensive players play most of that game. Regardless, the Colts D stunk.

In the playoffs this year they were missing Freeny, and Sanders was injured. Those are really the only two good players on defense. The Colts FO has an abysmal record of addressing defensive needs.

I'm not sure how the status of the Colts D has anything to do with NE's D. Both are bad.

 

3nOut

Footballguy

David Yudkin

Footballguy
I'm not sure how the status of the Colts D has anything to do with NE's D. Both are bad.
See, here's what I don't get. If the Colts and Pats both had bad defenses this year . . . then this year there just weren't any good defenses.The Colts ranked #1 in fewest points allowed (with 262). The Pats gave up 274 and ranked 4th. The Giants (who obviosuly went on to win the SB) raned 1th at 351. In the post season, the Pats "terrible" defense allowed 16.33 ppg. The "great" Giants defense allowed 16.25.
 

Big Daddy Kane

Footballguy
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
:yucky: to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
In case you haven't gotten it by now...David Yudkin doesn't have to follow the rules around here. He can personally attack Switz and post things as fact even when they are pure speculation. He can also make posts disappear if he doesn't like them. This post will only be up for about 3 minutes, so somebody quote it. That is all.
 

David Yudkin

Footballguy
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
:yucky: to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
 

switz

Footballguy
I'm not sure how the status of the Colts D has anything to do with NE's D. Both are bad.
See, here's what I don't get. If the Colts and Pats both had bad defenses this year . . . then this year there just weren't any good defenses.The Colts ranked #1 in fewest points allowed (with 262). The Pats gave up 274 and ranked 4th. The Giants (who obviosuly went on to win the SB) raned 1th at 351. In the post season, the Pats "terrible" defense allowed 16.33 ppg. The "great" Giants defense allowed 16.25.
The Colts and Pats both played similar schemes this year, good offense masks weaker D. However, the Colts defense was terrible in the playoffs, and much of that had to do with injuries on that side of the ball, as I had stated.
 

Big Daddy Kane

Footballguy
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
:shrug: to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
You are speculating there. When New England did not franchise tag Moss, the chance of him going elsewhere increased way more than 0.000001
 

Workhorse

Footballguy
I mean come on, if they can't win one after a perfect season then when can they win one?
2001, 2003, and 2004?
They were cheating then....No, seriously.. their defense won for them those years, and now they've changed their personnel to be an offensive juggernaut. Problem is that offensive juggernauts with bad defenses usually don't win the big game.
You'd be hard pressed to call the 2007 Patriots defense "bad", by any stretch of the imagination.
Nope, they were pretty bad. They benefitted greatly from the pressure their offense put on the opponent. Most of the Patriots opponents became one dimensional, which is much easier to defend. However, as a defense alone, they were not very good.
In 3 playoff games, where their offense was less effective, the Patriots defense allowed a total of 4 TDs and an average of 16 ppg. They allowed over 17 ppg in the regular season when their offense was "putting pressure on opponents". Not sure what your point is here... :goodposting:
JAX - not a great offense, put up 20 points (the "less effective" offense put up 31)SD - without it's key players, w/ an injured QB - not exactly how you measure a defenses ability... heck the fact SD scored at all makes NE's D look badNYG - Eli Manning beat them... is there anything else to say?I wouldn't use those playoff games as a measure of the defenses ability at all... they face 3 weak/injured offenses
First of all, Jacksonville was a "weak offense"? 6th in points scored, 7th in yards gained.Second, here's their playoff opponents PPG averages and what the NE defense held them to in the playoffs:Jacksonville - 25.7 ppg, NE defense held them to 20. (-5.7)San Diego - 25.8 ppg, NE defense held them to 12 (-13.8)NY Giants - 23.3 ppg, NE defense held them to 17 (-6.3)Overall, the New England defense performed VERY well in the playoffs, despite their offense being largely shut down in the postseason. Qualify it all you want, but the stats tell the story.
 

switz

Footballguy
I mean come on, if they can't win one after a perfect season then when can they win one?
2001, 2003, and 2004?
They were cheating then....No, seriously.. their defense won for them those years, and now they've changed their personnel to be an offensive juggernaut. Problem is that offensive juggernauts with bad defenses usually don't win the big game.
You'd be hard pressed to call the 2007 Patriots defense "bad", by any stretch of the imagination.
Nope, they were pretty bad. They benefitted greatly from the pressure their offense put on the opponent. Most of the Patriots opponents became one dimensional, which is much easier to defend. However, as a defense alone, they were not very good.
In 3 playoff games, where their offense was less effective, the Patriots defense allowed a total of 4 TDs and an average of 16 ppg. They allowed over 17 ppg in the regular season when their offense was "putting pressure on opponents". Not sure what your point is here... :confused:
JAX - not a great offense, put up 20 points (the "less effective" offense put up 31)SD - without it's key players, w/ an injured QB - not exactly how you measure a defenses ability... heck the fact SD scored at all makes NE's D look bad

NYG - Eli Manning beat them... is there anything else to say?

I wouldn't use those playoff games as a measure of the defenses ability at all... they face 3 weak/injured offenses
First of all, Jacksonville was a "weak offense"? 6th in points scored, 7th in yards gained.Second, here's their playoff opponents PPG averages and what the NE defense held them to in the playoffs:

Jacksonville - 25.7 ppg, NE defense held them to 20. (-5.7)

San Diego - 25.8 ppg, NE defense held them to 12 (-13.8)

NY Giants - 23.3 ppg, NE defense held them to 17 (-6.3)

Overall, the New England defense performed VERY well in the playoffs, despite their offense being largely shut down in the postseason. Qualify it all you want, but the stats tell the story.
No, the stats only tell part of the story...
 

Bick

Footballguy
Hmmm. Maybe this isn't as far fetched as some would like to believe... :useless:

-- Patriots Blowing It with Randy Moss? --

Fri Feb 29, 2008 --from FFMastermind.com

ESPN's John Clayton reports free-agent WR Randy Moss and the Patriots are not close to agreeing on a new contract. In addition, Moss is now listening to other offers, most notably the Cowboys. Apparently, the Patriots don't even have an offer on the table for Moss.

 

Chadstroma

Footballguy
It seems insane to think of Moss going to Dallas, but isn't this exactly the type of splash that Jerry Jones likes to do? Plus we know Moss wants to be on a winner and Dallas is that. It might even be a boost to his ego if he can be the big boost to Dallas as he was to the Patriots.

 

Bankerguy

Footballguy
Cowboys would have to get real creative with the deal and the cap. They are not strapped, but not a ton of monet there either. I don't see it happening.

 

Bizkiteer

Footballguy
Cowboys would have to get real creative with the deal and the cap. They are not strapped, but not a ton of monet there either. I don't see it happening.
Even if they could, how would they all co-exist in DAL? There isn't enough footballs to go around. TO surely would not want to take a back seat and he would be a distraction...I'd say the same could be said about Randy too. Haven't even mentioned Witten...If it happened, they might need to hire a personal shrink for Romo.
 

PhD

Footballguy
I mean come on, if they can't win one after a perfect season then when can they win one?
2001, 2003, and 2004?
They were cheating then....No, seriously.. their defense won for them those years, and now they've changed their personnel to be an offensive juggernaut. Problem is that offensive juggernauts with bad defenses usually don't win the big game.
You'd be hard pressed to call the 2007 Patriots defense "bad", by any stretch of the imagination.
Nope, they were pretty bad. They benefitted greatly from the pressure their offense put on the opponent. Most of the Patriots opponents became one dimensional, which is much easier to defend. However, as a defense alone, they were not very good.
In 3 playoff games, where their offense was less effective, the Patriots defense allowed a total of 4 TDs and an average of 16 ppg. They allowed over 17 ppg in the regular season when their offense was "putting pressure on opponents". Not sure what your point is here... :thumbdown:
JAX - not a great offense, put up 20 points (the "less effective" offense put up 31)SD - without it's key players, w/ an injured QB - not exactly how you measure a defenses ability... heck the fact SD scored at all makes NE's D look bad

NYG - Eli Manning beat them... is there anything else to say?

I wouldn't use those playoff games as a measure of the defenses ability at all... they face 3 weak/injured offenses
First of all, Jacksonville was a "weak offense"? 6th in points scored, 7th in yards gained.Second, here's their playoff opponents PPG averages and what the NE defense held them to in the playoffs:

Jacksonville - 25.7 ppg, NE defense held them to 20. (-5.7)

San Diego - 25.8 ppg, NE defense held them to 12 (-13.8)

NY Giants - 23.3 ppg, NE defense held them to 17 (-6.3)

Overall, the New England defense performed VERY well in the playoffs, despite their offense being largely shut down in the postseason. Qualify it all you want, but the stats tell the story.
No, the stats only tell part of the story...
And therin lies the rub for the fantasy freaks of the world. Stats only tell part of the story and becasue of that they lie. After all, the wise man says there are three kinds of liars in the world: liars, damned liars and statisticians.
 

Bick

Footballguy
Chadstroma said:
It seems insane to think of Moss going to Dallas, but isn't this exactly the type of splash that Jerry Jones likes to do? Plus we know Moss wants to be on a winner and Dallas is that. It might even be a boost to his ego if he can be the big boost to Dallas as he was to the Patriots.
This makes total sense. Heck, they might be the first team to be on EVERY MNF telecast.
 

Mookie Blaylock

Footballguy
Chadstroma said:
It seems insane to think of Moss going to Dallas, but isn't this exactly the type of splash that Jerry Jones likes to do? Plus we know Moss wants to be on a winner and Dallas is that. It might even be a boost to his ego if he can be the big boost to Dallas as he was to the Patriots.
This makes total sense. Heck, they might be the first team to be on EVERY MNF telecast.
No way. Only espn would do something like...
 

BigTex

Don't mess with Texas
Bizkiteer said:
Bankerguy said:
Cowboys would have to get real creative with the deal and the cap. They are not strapped, but not a ton of monet there either. I don't see it happening.
Even if they could, how would they all co-exist in DAL? There isn't enough footballs to go around. TO surely would not want to take a back seat and he would be a distraction...I'd say the same could be said about Randy too. Haven't even mentioned Witten...If it happened, they might need to hire a personal shrink for Romo.
TO will get an extension soon and all will be well, possibly a three year extension. :thumbup:
 

fasteddie_21

2006 NM Poker Champ
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
:link: to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
Ok, can we now?
Bick said:
Hmmm. Maybe this isn't as far fetched as some would like to believe... :popcorn: -- Patriots Blowing It with Randy Moss? --Fri Feb 29, 2008 --from FFMastermind.comESPN's John Clayton reports free-agent WR Randy Moss and the Patriots are not close to agreeing on a new contract. In addition, Moss is now listening to other offers, most notably the Cowboys. Apparently, the Patriots don't even have an offer on the table for Moss.
 

cstu

Footballguy
Moss has always wanted to play for the Cowboys and was pissed that they passed on him in the draft. I don't know why everyone thinks Moss going back to NE is a slam dunk since I think it will be a tough year mentally for the Pats after the SB collapse. I don't see Randy wanting to go through that.

 

cstu

Footballguy
Bizkiteer said:
Bankerguy said:
Cowboys would have to get real creative with the deal and the cap. They are not strapped, but not a ton of monet there either. I don't see it happening.
Even if they could, how would they all co-exist in DAL? There isn't enough footballs to go around. TO surely would not want to take a back seat and he would be a distraction...I'd say the same could be said about Randy too. Haven't even mentioned Witten...If it happened, they might need to hire a personal shrink for Romo.
TO will get an extension soon and all will be well, possibly a three year extension. :football:
If they sign Moss they say :bye: to TO.It may sound crazy, but I think they'd be better off cutting him and saving the $7M to sign Moss and Walker. I just don't understand the logic of keeping TO who is going to want a big extension when he's already 35 this year. Even the immortal Jerry Rice could barely crack the top 10 after 35.
 
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BigTex

Don't mess with Texas
Bizkiteer said:
Bankerguy said:
Cowboys would have to get real creative with the deal and the cap. They are not strapped, but not a ton of monet there either. I don't see it happening.
Even if they could, how would they all co-exist in DAL? There isn't enough footballs to go around. TO surely would not want to take a back seat and he would be a distraction...I'd say the same could be said about Randy too. Haven't even mentioned Witten...If it happened, they might need to hire a personal shrink for Romo.
TO will get an extension soon and all will be well, possibly a three year extension. :football:
If they sign Moss they say :bye: to TO.It may sound crazy, but I think they'd be better off cutting him and saving the $7M to sign Moss and Walker. I just don't understand the logic of keeping TO who is going to want a big extension when he's already 35 this year. Even the immortal Jerry Rice could barely crack the top 10 after 35.
They've already picked up his option for this year.
 

Rig24

Footballguy
Bizkiteer said:
Bankerguy said:
Cowboys would have to get real creative with the deal and the cap. They are not strapped, but not a ton of monet there either. I don't see it happening.
Even if they could, how would they all co-exist in DAL? There isn't enough footballs to go around. TO surely would not want to take a back seat and he would be a distraction...I'd say the same could be said about Randy too. Haven't even mentioned Witten...If it happened, they might need to hire a personal shrink for Romo.
TO will get an extension soon and all will be well, possibly a three year extension. :excited:
If they sign Moss they say ;) to TO.It may sound crazy, but I think they'd be better off cutting him and saving the $7M to sign Moss and Walker. I just don't understand the logic of keeping TO who is going to want a big extension when he's already 35 this year. Even the immortal Jerry Rice could barely crack the top 10 after 35.
They've already picked up his option for this year.
Owens is due a roster bonus in June. That hasn't been payed yet so they could drop him with no negative effect on the cap. Jerry has stated that he plans on keeping him on though. I suspect he will be on the Cowboys roster this year.
 

Andy Herron

Footballguy
Let me just copy a portion of what I posted in the "Cowboys Offseason Thread":

Meanwhile, although it's very speculative, don't rule out Randy Moss. I'm just saying. The fact that he has yet to sign with the Patriots is very indicative that he's listening to and considering other offers. Forget about the T.O. thing. They both have their sights set on the same thing, and to do it together as Dallas Cowboys would be bigger than anything they ever dreamed of.

And don't tell me it couldn't be done. All you have to do is look at the receiving corp New England put together last offseason.

If anybody can do it, Jerry can. Those outside of Dallas still haven't gotten it through their head that this is not the same T.O. He's a team player in Dallas, whether you want to believe it or not. I wouldn't be surprised if he and Moss have already had phone conversations.

Everybody was so certain that Moss would have been re-signed by New England by now. Hasn't happened. I wonder why?

 

rzrback77

IBL Representative
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
:( to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
Ok, can we now?
Bick said:
Hmmm. Maybe this isn't as far fetched as some would like to believe... :excited: -- Patriots Blowing It with Randy Moss? --Fri Feb 29, 2008 --from FFMastermind.comESPN's John Clayton reports free-agent WR Randy Moss and the Patriots are not close to agreeing on a new contract. In addition, Moss is now listening to other offers, most notably the Cowboys. Apparently, the Patriots don't even have an offer on the table for Moss.
Quoted so it doesn't get hidden. Assuming that the percentage is at least down to 90% that he signs with the Pats now. Was the non-tag move a tactical error? Was there a deal in place, but Moss jilted? Or are the Pats willing to gamble?
 

Johnny Ice

Footballguy
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
:excited: to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
:goodposting:
 

Black

Footballguy
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
Does staying the true #1 with a HoF QB give him: 1) more chance to build stats/wins and make the HoF himself?2) more chance to get a ring3) better quality of life...they love him there, he loves Brady? I'm just thinking...at some point you have enough $ and maybe want a life and a place you have stabiltiy
 

BigTex

Don't mess with Texas
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
;) to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
<_<
Is David a NE fan? He's very touchy on this subject...............almost woman like.Just asking. ;)
 

Pat Patriot

Footballguy
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
;) to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
<_<
Is David a NE fan? He's very touchy on this subject...............almost woman like.Just asking. ;)
Yudkin is definitely a Pats fan.
 

BigTex

Don't mess with Texas
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
;) to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
<_<
Is David a NE fan? He's very touchy on this subject...............almost woman like.Just asking. ;)
Yudkin is definitely a Pats fan.
OK, that explains it! ;)
 

Bick

Footballguy
Reports have already said he has agreed to a deal with NE.
:( to the said reports, not to rumors/speculation.
We have been over this in at least 5 threads now. The Patriots CANNOT announce that they signed Moss until 2/29. Those are the league rules. So there cannot be an offical link until then, no matter what source out there may claim otherwise.
...exactly my point.
99.99999% chance he returns to NE. Anyone speculating any other destination should not do so until 3/1 . . . AFTER the Pats have officially NOT re-signed Moss.
Ok, can we now?
Bick said:
Hmmm. Maybe this isn't as far fetched as some would like to believe... :2cents: -- Patriots Blowing It with Randy Moss? --Fri Feb 29, 2008 --from FFMastermind.comESPN's John Clayton reports free-agent WR Randy Moss and the Patriots are not close to agreeing on a new contract. In addition, Moss is now listening to other offers, most notably the Cowboys. Apparently, the Patriots don't even have an offer on the table for Moss.
Quoted so it doesn't get hidden. Assuming that the percentage is at least down to 90% that he signs with the Pats now. Was the non-tag move a tactical error? Was there a deal in place, but Moss jilted? Or are the Pats willing to gamble?
The Pats are the best run organization - by that I mean showing the ability to maintain longer periods of being top tier. This wasn't a tactical error. They'll stay within budget to keep those long term prospects going. They got Moss on the cheap last season, and you can count on them NOT breaking the bank on a guy like Moss.
 

Chase Stuart

Footballguy
Thoughts on TO....

He scored 226 FPs last season, the most by any 34-year-old or older wide receiver in league history. Owens turns 35 this year, which presumably means he doesn't have much left in the tank...right?

His 1,355 receiving yards were the 2nd most ever by a 34 year old (or older) receiver; Marvin Harrison had 1,366 receiving yards in 2006, before breaking down last season. Owens' fifteen touchdowns were the most ever by someone of that age. Cris Carter (13 TDs), Marvin Harrison (12), Tim Brown (11), Irving Fryar (11), Joey Galloway (10) and Pete Retzlaff (10) all had double digit TDs at age 34, and they scored nine, one, nine, six, seven and six TDs at age thirty-five.

Owens had 109 VBD points last year, as the number two fantasy receiver. No wide receiver that age or older had ever had 100 points in value in a season; Harrison ('06), Carter ('99), Galloway ('05), Rice ('96) and Carter ('00) were the only ones with over 70 points of VBD. Owens is in a truly unique position.

On the other hand, it's worth noting that Owens has a December birthday. He's pretty young for a WR that's turning 35 this year :thumbup: .

 

cstu

Footballguy
Thoughts on TO....He scored 226 FPs last season, the most by any 34-year-old or older wide receiver in league history. Owens turns 35 this year, which presumably means he doesn't have much left in the tank...right?His 1,355 receiving yards were the 2nd most ever by a 34 year old (or older) receiver; Marvin Harrison had 1,366 receiving yards in 2006, before breaking down last season. Owens' fifteen touchdowns were the most ever by someone of that age. Cris Carter (13 TDs), Marvin Harrison (12), Tim Brown (11), Irving Fryar (11), Joey Galloway (10) and Pete Retzlaff (10) all had double digit TDs at age 34, and they scored nine, one, nine, six, seven and six TDs at age thirty-five.Owens had 109 VBD points last year, as the number two fantasy receiver. No wide receiver that age or older had ever had 100 points in value in a season; Harrison ('06), Carter ('99), Galloway ('05), Rice ('96) and Carter ('00) were the only ones with over 70 points of VBD. Owens is in a truly unique position. On the other hand, it's worth noting that Owens has a December birthday. He's pretty young for a WR that's turning 35 this year :lmao: .
I do actually think TO will be good again this year, although I thought the same of Harrison last year. However, the issue is that he wants a new contract and anything that he'd agree to is going to be way to much for him at this stage in his career. If they can extend him with another contract like his current one with the Cowboys (3 years/$25M with $5m guaranteed and $10M the first year) I think it's do-able.
 

Chadstroma

Footballguy
Moss has always wanted to play for the Cowboys and was pissed that they passed on him in the draft. I don't know why everyone thinks Moss going back to NE is a slam dunk since I think it will be a tough year mentally for the Pats after the SB collapse. I don't see Randy wanting to go through that.
Add in how he already feels he gave them a huge discount. Add in that he wants to get paid. Add in the amount of craziness that will go on with the Pat's scandals. Add in the aging Patriot D. Add in that he would like to get more credit that usually goes to Brady for the success of that offense. Add in that he feels dissed that the Pat's have not gone after him uber aggresively. I think each day that goes by means there is an even bigger chance that Moss does not go back to the Patriots. I am doubtful it would be Dallas although I do not think it is outside the realm of possibility.
 

Bick

Footballguy
Chadstroma said:
Moss has always wanted to play for the Cowboys and was pissed that they passed on him in the draft. I don't know why everyone thinks Moss going back to NE is a slam dunk since I think it will be a tough year mentally for the Pats after the SB collapse. I don't see Randy wanting to go through that.
Add in how he already feels he gave them a huge discount. Add in that he wants to get paid. Add in the amount of craziness that will go on with the Pat's scandals. Add in the aging Patriot D. Add in that he would like to get more credit that usually goes to Brady for the success of that offense. Add in that he feels dissed that the Pat's have not gone after him uber aggresively. I think each day that goes by means there is an even bigger chance that Moss does not go back to the Patriots. I am doubtful it would be Dallas although I do not think it is outside the realm of possibility.
Green Bay makes no sense - it's going to be Dallas. The biggest ego on the planet is in Big D, and he'll be all over Moss now. No wasy Wade Phillips will be able to keep those two guys on the straight and narrow...but I'll tune it to watch it along with the rest of the country.
 

Tyrion

Footballguy
Chadstroma said:
Moss has always wanted to play for the Cowboys and was pissed that they passed on him in the draft. I don't know why everyone thinks Moss going back to NE is a slam dunk since I think it will be a tough year mentally for the Pats after the SB collapse. I don't see Randy wanting to go through that.
Add in how he already feels he gave them a huge discount. Add in that he wants to get paid. Add in the amount of craziness that will go on with the Pat's scandals. Add in the aging Patriot D. Add in that he would like to get more credit that usually goes to Brady for the success of that offense. Add in that he feels dissed that the Pat's have not gone after him uber aggresively. I think each day that goes by means there is an even bigger chance that Moss does not go back to the Patriots. I am doubtful it would be Dallas although I do not think it is outside the realm of possibility.
Green Bay makes no sense - it's going to be Dallas. The biggest ego on the planet is in Big D, and he'll be all over Moss now. No wasy Wade Phillips will be able to keep those two guys on the straight and narrow...but I'll tune it to watch it along with the rest of the country.
Word on the street is that Owens is going to cut Moss in on his towl money.
 

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