Ryan Moats (1 Viewer)

[On The Rocks]

Am I crazy to think that Ryan Moats will finish as one of the top 40 RBs?

Me thinks he splits carries with Westbrook right down the middle. And my expectation of the Eagles running the ball and passing less than the last coupe of years, I put them at about 150 carries each. (which keeps Westbrook at close to the same number of carries as last year.)

With Moats getting 150 carries at lets say at 4.3 ypg = 645 rushing yards.

I have had Westbrook on my fantasy roster each of the last three seasons and the one thing I have noticed is he isn't much of a runner between the tackles inside the 5 yard line.

Is it too much of a stretch to expect Moats to get the goal line carries even though he is pretty much the same size as Westbrook?

Moats: 645 yards 6 TD's ????

 

[TCFF]

Westbrook is the man in Philly. Moats will certainly see some work to be sure, but the only way an even split occurs is if Westbrook gets injured midseason. Moats will also not get goalline work. If the Eagles use a short yardage back it is far more likely to be Brue Perry or Thomas Tapeh. Moats is a good handcuff for Westbrook however since he is the same type of player and would get Westbrook's role in the event of an injury.

 

[Marino13]

I could see Buckhalter IF he can stay healthy, get more of the goalline or in between the tackles work....

 

[diesel7982]

I could see Buckhalter IF he can stay healthy, get more of the goalline or in between the tackles work....

Buckhalter has little shot of making the team, let alone getting significant work.

 

[King of the Jungle]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

 

[diesel7982]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

List of 25 Carry Backs in the NFL:

 

[beto]

Moats looked good in goal line duty last preseason, but it was against 3rd string Ds.

I hope he continues to progress in his knowledge of the offense and Philly uses him to spell Westbrook.

 

[Tong Po]

Moats is basically the same type of back. The Eagles may sign another RB before opening day to work in as a power runner, or use Perry in that role as a previous poster pointed out. If things shape up that way... I would imagine Moats would then be relegated to a back-up role behind Westbrook.

 

[On The Rocks]

Westbrook is the man in Philly. Moats will certainly see some work to be sure, but the only way an even split occurs is if Westbrook gets injured midseason. Moats will also not get goalline work. If the Eagles use a short yardage back it is far more likely to be Brue Perry or Thomas Tapeh. Moats is a good handcuff for Westbrook however since he is the same type of player and would get Westbrook's role in the event of an injury.

this is pretty much what i expect and was on my mind when considering Moats as a #4 RB. i think it is forgone conclusion that Westbrook will miss at the very least 4 games.

 

[Snotbubbles]

i think it is forgone conclusion that Westbrook will miss at the very least 4 games.

How is it a forgone conclusion?

 

[King of the Jungle]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

List of 25 Carry Backs in the NFL:

I am sorry that you are missing the point. For your sake, change the 25 to 20. Westbrook Stats

2005

20+ carry games = 1

15+ carry games = 5

2004

20+ carry games = 1

15+ carry games = 4

2003

20+ carry games = 0

15+ carry games = 1

He is not a running back that handles a "large load". Comprende?

 

[Sleeper 43]

My opinion is a little tainted becasue I have been a huge fan of Moats since he played at LA Tech. I truly believe he is a mix between Westy and ....... Barry Sanders. I know this is a ballzy statement but the guy has quick twitch speed that I think only Caddy can currently hang with.

Although he was drafted in a bad situation I think slowly but surely Ried is finding out the same thing. The latest news of A. Moats looking comfortable this offseason and B. Talk about Westy playing a little wideout in situations lead me to believe Ried nows Moats potential but needs to find a way to keep Westy in the game.

If someone is not already the offical driver of the Moats bandwagon I have no problem stepping up.

My Ryan Moats Band Wagon

 

[NoFBinLA]

My Ryan Moats Band Wagon

Awesome.

On topic: I think we may see Moats a little more regularly this year especially if the run game is increased - spelling Westy would be an important part of it and I too am wondering if Westy will lineup outside on occasion as is being threatened in NO w/ Bush.

I think Moats could be a good pick in a Dynasty league as well.....

 

[On The Rocks]

i think it is forgone conclusion that Westbrook will miss at the very least 4 games.

How is it a forgone conclusion?

perhaps i should have said portions of at least 4 games. and i would base that on his injury history the two previous seasons.

 

[dcbreber]

i think it is forgone conclusion that Westbrook will miss at the very least 4 games.

How is it a forgone conclusion?

Sure its not 100%, but just like D Foster and Fred in JAX, its pretty much 99.9% that these guys will miss 2-8 games. On Moats, everyone here recognizes he's good but he just wont get the TDs he needs to be a real good pick. Will get his fair share of yards, but the lack of TDs and the eagles being a passing team dont help him. With the right situation, he could be top 30 but with so many questions, should be in the 40s.

 

[Cecil Lammey]

i think it is forgone conclusion that Westbrook will miss at the very least 4 games.

How is it a forgone conclusion?

perhaps i should have said portions of at least 4 games. and i would base that on his injury history the two previous seasons.

Go back to his days at Villanova and you'll find that Westy had a hard time staying healthy there too.Moats top 40 isn't that much of a stretch.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

Sshhh.

Ryan Moats

Excerpt from the Philly Daily News:

Nothing earth-shattering. But we've picked up a few hints in some areas, foreshadowing of things that could happen in training camp. Here are a few of those:

• The Eagles do indeed seem to have several interchangeable-looking possession receivers, generally good-sized wideouts without great speed, as everyone suspected. We'll know more when they play some preseason games. Right now, it looks as if Reggie Brown will be carrying a pretty big load. But one option to spice up the meatloaf could be to use Brian Westbrook as a receiver even more than in the past, out of the backfield and split wide, since Ryan Moats seems to have a much better grasp of the offense now. It's early for crystal ball-gazing, but Moats could wind up running the ball as much as or more than Westbrook, with Westbrook perhaps setting running-back reception records.

 

[diesel7982]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

List of 25 Carry Backs in the NFL:

I am sorry that you are missing the point. For your sake, change the 25 to 20. Westbrook Stats

2005

20+ carry games = 1

15+ carry games = 5

2004

20+ carry games = 1

15+ carry games = 4

2003

20+ carry games = 0

15+ carry games = 1

He is not a running back that handles a "large load". Comprende?

Im not getting the point, because you changed your qualifier by 20%? Westy has never been given the opportunity to carry the ball "20 times" a game. We don't know if he can do that. One can argue that he never has averaged 20 carries a game in his 4 years in the league, but the obvious counterpoint to that is he plays for one of the most pass-heavy teams in the league, which has almost always had another talented RB to play alongside him.

The "25" carry back theory is just silly though. Any RB can carry the ball 25 times in one game, but very few RBs (I can only think of 3..George, Wilder, Anderson) can average that over a season.

 

[Donnybrook]

Westbrook is the man in Philly. Moats will certainly see some work to be sure, but the only way an even split occurs is if Westbrook gets injured midseason. Moats will also not get goalline work. If the Eagles use a short yardage back it is far more likely to be Brue Perry or Thomas Tapeh. Moats is a good handcuff for Westbrook however since he is the same type of player and would get Westbrook's role in the event of an injury.

Thomas Tapeh OK - but when did Perry become a goalline back?Perry =Height: 5-9 Weight: 200

Moats = 5-8 210

Westbrook = 5-8 203

 

[gang-wars]

My opinion is a little tainted becasue I have been a huge fan of Moats since he played at LA Tech. I truly believe he is a mix between Westy and ....... Barry Sanders. I know this is a ballzy statement but the guy has quick twitch speed that I think only Caddy can currently hang with.

Although he was drafted in a bad situation I think slowly but surely Ried is finding out the same thing. The latest news of A. Moats looking comfortable this offseason and B. Talk about Westy playing a little wideout in situations lead me to believe Ried nows Moats potential but needs to find a way to keep Westy in the game.

If someone is not already the offical driver of the Moats bandwagon I have no problem stepping up.

My Ryan Moats Band Wagon

Barry Sanders? Man the FF gods are going to punish you for that.

 

[pheagles]

Westbrook is the man in Philly. Moats will certainly see some work to be sure, but the only way an even split occurs is if Westbrook gets injured midseason. Moats will also not get goalline work. If the Eagles use a short yardage back it is far more likely to be Brue Perry or Thomas Tapeh. Moats is a good handcuff for Westbrook however since he is the same type of player and would get Westbrook's role in the event of an injury.

Thomas Tapeh OK - but when did Perry become a goalline back?Perry =Height: 5-9 Weight: 200

Moats = 5-8 210

Westbrook = 5-8 203

Perry's running style is what has them thinking he can be a goaline/short yardage back, not his size - at least, that is among the many mini-camp murmurs we hear locally.

 

[Snotbubbles]

perhaps i should have said portions of at least 4 games. and i would base that on his injury history the two previous seasons.

A little better, but still not quite accurate. 2002: Games Played 15, Games Missed 1, Games missed due to injury 12003: Games played 15, Games missed 1, Games missed due to injury 12004: Games played 13, Games missed 3, Games missed due to injury 12005: Games Played 12, Games missed 4, Games missed due to injury 4You have to remember in 2004 the Eagles had everything locked up by week 13 so they sat mostly everyone. Westbrook missed two games but they were coaches decisions and not due to injury. So Westbrook has missed 7 games in 4 years due to injury or about 1.75 per year.

 

[King of the Jungle]

This conversation motivated to go get him. In Dynasty, just traded Jon Kitna for him.

 

[Sleeper 43]

My opinion is a little tainted becasue I have been a huge fan of Moats since he played at LA Tech. I truly believe he is a mix between Westy and ....... Barry Sanders. I know this is a ballzy statement but the guy has quick twitch speed that I think only Caddy can currently hang with.

Although he was drafted in a bad situation I think slowly but surely Ried is finding out the same thing. The latest news of A. Moats looking comfortable this offseason and B. Talk about Westy playing a little wideout in situations lead me to believe Ried nows Moats potential but needs to find a way to keep Westy in the game.

If someone is not already the offical driver of the Moats bandwagon I have no problem stepping up.

My Ryan Moats Band Wagon

Barry Sanders? Man the FF gods are going to punish you for that.

I know its saying alot and Barry and Payton are my all time favorites. All I'm saying is Moats has the "quick twich" ability that doesnt come along very often and I could see him being the top dog in the NFL down the road. I think eventually once his game is exposed he'll put on a few pounds like Portis did so he can last 16 games.

 

[Righetti]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

List of 25 Carry Backs in the NFL:

I am sorry that you are missing the point. For your sake, change the 25 to 20. Westbrook Stats

2005

20+ carry games = 1

15+ carry games = 5

2004

20+ carry games = 1

15+ carry games = 4

2003

20+ carry games = 0

15+ carry games = 1

He is not a running back that handles a "large load". Comprende?

Najeh Davenport on the other hand....

 

[King of the Jungle]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

Najeh Davenport on the other hand....

Point taken. I am not necessarily saying that Westy cannot handle the load due to his size. Warrick Dunn has proven to be incredibly durable. I am of the belief that some guys are able to take more punishment than others, Westy doesn't fall into this group. That ability may have to due with running style, body compisition, conditioning...many factors.

 

[Bushead]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

Najeh Davenport on the other hand....

Point taken. I am not necessarily saying that Westy cannot handle the load due to his size. Warrick Dunn has proven to be incredibly durable. I am of the belief that some guys are able to take more punishment than others, Westy doesn't fall into this group. That ability may have to due with running style, body compisition, conditioning...many factors.

I think Righetti meant "load" in a different sense than you think he did...

 

[pricklypete]

Najeh doesn't have to concern himself with handling the load, the laundry basket does.

 

[King of the Jungle]

I think Philly realizes that they will need to run the ball a little more this year. They also understand that Westy is not a 25 carry back. I think Moats will get 8-10 carries, 1-3 rec targets. And if Westy comes up gimp, he will step in and produce. #40 RB is not far-fetched by any means.

Najeh Davenport on the other hand....

Point taken. I am not necessarily saying that Westy cannot handle the load due to his size. Warrick Dunn has proven to be incredibly durable. I am of the belief that some guys are able to take more punishment than others, Westy doesn't fall into this group. That ability may have to due with running style, body compisition, conditioning...many factors.

I think Righetti meant "load" in a different sense than you think he did...

Sorry Rig! I just ruined good humor by being all serious!

*I thought that you were pointing out the fact that even bigger backs have injury issues. Load = Najeh = Closet = Stink Nugget. Got it!

 

[PhilyFn]

I think Andy will push to a 60/40 split this year for rushes bringing the team to a total of around 360 attempts. Based on this I estimate the carries to be as follows:

Westbrrok - 210 - 945 - 7

Moats - 100 - 450 - 5

Perry - 30 - 120 - 1

Tapeh - 10 - 38 - 1

With that it puts Moats on the outside of 40 looking in however, by throwing in his receiving yards which should total around 15 - 100 - 2 he should just squeak into the top 40.

Of course all this is based on injury free status for all and if Westbrook is hurt he take a huge jump.

 

[railman305]

i cant see moats getting more then about 5 carries a game, with a healthy westbrook, even when he was healthy he averaged not even 15 a game, the eagles wont run it a ton, granted more then last year, but i really find it hard for moats to get more then 5 carries a game X16 games= 80 carries this year and maybe 2-3 catches a game so about

80-428-3 --rush

40-400-2 --rec.

thats about what i see for him which isn't half bad,

i think it be a smart move for the birds to have a maybe 60-70% playswestbrook and 30-40% plays for moats, to keep them both fresh

 

[Donnybrook]

Westbrook is the man in Philly.  Moats will certainly see some work to be sure, but the only way an even split occurs is if Westbrook gets injured midseason.  Moats will also not get goalline work.  If the Eagles use a short yardage back it is far more likely to be Brue Perry or Thomas Tapeh.  Moats is a good handcuff for Westbrook however since he is the same type of player and would get Westbrook's role in the event of an injury.

Thomas Tapeh OK - but when did Perry become a goalline back?Perry =Height: 5-9 Weight: 200

Moats = 5-8 210

Westbrook = 5-8 203

Perry's running style is what has them thinking he can be a goaline/short yardage back, not his size - at least, that is among the many mini-camp murmurs we hear locally.

I got the impression from Bruce Perry's Prospect Profile that he was smaller than Westbrook. He was listed there at 5'7" 196# and is now listed as 5'10" 200# on the Eagles site. Obviously, his NFL prospect profile must have been wrong or he grew 3" while he was on IR.

 

[Bri]

Westbrook is the man in Philly.  Moats will certainly see some work to be sure, but the only way an even split occurs is if Westbrook gets injured midseason.  Moats will also not get goalline work.  If the Eagles use a short yardage back it is far more likely to be Brue Perry or Thomas Tapeh.  Moats is a good handcuff for Westbrook however since he is the same type of player and would get Westbrook's role in the event of an injury.

this is pretty much what i expect and was on my mind when considering Moats as a #4 RB. i think it is forgone conclusion that Westbrook will miss at the very least 4 games.

I thought the first post was yours

 

[hickbones]

I think Andy will push to a 60/40 split this year for rushes bringing the team to a total of around 360 attempts. Based on this I estimate the carries to be as follows:

Westbrrok - 210 - 945 - 7

Moats - 100 - 450 - 5

Perry - 30 - 120 - 1

Tapeh - 10 - 38 - 1

With that it puts Moats on the outside of 40 looking in however, by throwing in his receiving yards which should total around 15 - 100 - 2 he should just squeak into the top 40.

Of course all this is based on injury free status for all and if Westbrook is hurt he take a huge jump.

Your 60/40 split is at best asking for a miracle. Last year the Eagles threw 63% of the time. To go from 63% down to 40% would be hard enough. But then consider that the Steelers, the most prolific rushing team last year, only ran 59% of the time, and a 60/40 split for the Eagles this year appears nearly impossible.Last year in 12 games Westbrook rushed an average of 13 times a game and caught 5 balls per game (18 total touches) in a year that the coaches said they needed to get him the ball 20-25 times per game. Moats had 8.5 total touches in 7 games last year. Westbrook is by far the Eagles most potent offensive threat and he has a nice, new, big contract. They didn't sign him to wean themselves over to Moats.

Moats' best shot to be a top 40 back this year is for Westbrook to get hurt (very possible). Westbrook lining up at wideout looks even better in my ppr leagues.

Bottom line, Moats is probably the best handcuff in the league considering talent and injury tendencies, but he isn't going to cut into Westbrook's production.

 

[PhilyFn]

Your 60/40 split is at best asking for a miracle. Last year the Eagles threw 63% of the time.

I was meaning pass/run and the Eagles actually threw 67 percent of the time last year. The Eagles had to throw as much as they did last year to try and warm Donovan up. With the injury he had if you go back and watch early in the game his accuracy is worse then normal. As the game goes on he loosens up and is able to throw better. That being said normalcy should return and a concerted effort to run the ball. Westbrook will get the ball more, but so will Moats. The Eagles saw what he could do last year and will make every effort to get the ball in both of their hands. As Spads made mention of they will use some 2 back sets with both of them in their as well as splitting Westy out wide with Moats in the backfield.

 

[hickbones]

Your 60/40 split is at best asking for a miracle.  Last year the Eagles threw 63% of the time.

I was meaning pass/run and the Eagles actually threw 67 percent of the time last year. The Eagles had to throw as much as they did last year to try and warm Donovan up. With the injury he had if you go back and watch early in the game his accuracy is worse then normal. As the game goes on he loosens up and is able to throw better. That being said normalcy should return and a concerted effort to run the ball. Westbrook will get the ball more, but so will Moats. The Eagles saw what he could do last year and will make every effort to get the ball in both of their hands. As Spads made mention of they will use some 2 back sets with both of them in their as well as splitting Westy out wide with Moats in the backfield.

You meant 60% pass and 40% run? I misread that. I would hope Andy would get closer to 55% pass to keep D's more off-balance. But we'll see, as that would also be a drastic change from last year.As Spads made mention of they will use some 2 back sets with both of them in their as well as splitting Westy out wide with Moats in the backfield.

I would love to see this...would be exciting! But how many times a game do you think they would run a formation like that? I imagine 3 to 4 times per game, unless they really thought it would be an unstoppable bread and butter type of formation.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

Your 60/40 split is at best asking for a miracle. Last year the Eagles threw 63% of the time.

I was meaning pass/run and the Eagles actually threw 67 percent of the time last year. The Eagles had to throw as much as they did last year to try and warm Donovan up. With the injury he had if you go back and watch early in the game his accuracy is worse then normal. As the game goes on he loosens up and is able to throw better. That being said normalcy should return and a concerted effort to run the ball. Westbrook will get the ball more, but so will Moats. The Eagles saw what he could do last year and will make every effort to get the ball in both of their hands. As Spads made mention of they will use some 2 back sets with both of them in their as well as splitting Westy out wide with Moats in the backfield.

You meant 60% pass and 40% run? I misread that. I would hope Andy would get closer to 55% pass to keep D's more off-balance. But we'll see, as that would also be a drastic change from last year.As Spads made mention of they will use some 2 back sets with both of them in their as well as splitting Westy out wide with Moats in the backfield.

I would love to see this...would be exciting! But how many times a game do you think they would run a formation like that? I imagine 3 to 4 times per game, unless they really thought it would be an unstoppable bread and butter type of formation.

Westbrook is an excellent receiver, and despite the additions of rookies and Gaffney, the WR2 slot is wide open.Getting Westy in the slot either as a lined up receiver OR motioned out of a 2-back set would wreak havoc on defenses.

I hope they do just that.

Also they will use 2 TEs more this year with Schobel as the #2. That also helps the run game as he's a good run blocker as well (and LJ is improving).

Moats didn't play until November last year as he learned the complex offense. He's way ahead of that after a full season and offseason.

 

[renesauz]

I'm a big Philly homer, and have been following this situation closely over the past 6 months. The coaching staff is EXPECTING to give the ball to Moats more...in the area of 12-14 times a game. Every report on him coming out of minicamps has been extremely positive, and there's a ton of talk about using a lot of two back sets to get Moats and Westy both on the field.

Bottom line, top 40 is not just possible, but PROBABLE if the plans come to fruition. Top 30 is not impossible.

This guy is for real...a late round STEAL!

 

[hickbones]

Your 60/40 split is at best asking for a miracle.  Last year the Eagles threw 63% of the time.

I was meaning pass/run and the Eagles actually threw 67 percent of the time last year. The Eagles had to throw as much as they did last year to try and warm Donovan up. With the injury he had if you go back and watch early in the game his accuracy is worse then normal. As the game goes on he loosens up and is able to throw better. That being said normalcy should return and a concerted effort to run the ball. Westbrook will get the ball more, but so will Moats. The Eagles saw what he could do last year and will make every effort to get the ball in both of their hands. As Spads made mention of they will use some 2 back sets with both of them in their as well as splitting Westy out wide with Moats in the backfield.

You meant 60% pass and 40% run? I misread that. I would hope Andy would get closer to 55% pass to keep D's more off-balance. But we'll see, as that would also be a drastic change from last year.As Spads made mention of they will use some 2 back sets with both of them in their as well as splitting Westy out wide with Moats in the backfield.

I would love to see this...would be exciting! But how many times a game do you think they would run a formation like that? I imagine 3 to 4 times per game, unless they really thought it would be an unstoppable bread and butter type of formation.

Westbrook is an excellent receiver, and despite the additions of rookies and Gaffney, the WR2 slot is wide open.Getting Westy in the slot either as a lined up receiver OR motioned out of a 2-back set would wreak havoc on defenses.

I hope they do just that.

Also they will use 2 TEs more this year with Schobel as the #2. That also helps the run game as he's a good run blocker as well (and LJ is improving).

Moats didn't play until November last year as he learned the complex offense. He's way ahead of that after a full season and offseason.

Although lining him up as a receiver diminishes the mismatch potential. Better to see a linebacker assigned to him than a CB.

 

[lawyer]

Do you guys think he would be a good handcuff for Westy?

 

[Slinger]

This conversation motivated to go get him. In Dynasty, just traded Jon Kitna for him.

Excellent trade for you.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I'm a big Philly homer, and have been following this situation closely over the past 6 months. The coaching staff is EXPECTING to give the ball to Moats more...in the area of 12-14 times a game. Every report on him coming out of minicamps has been extremely positive, and there's a ton of talk about using a lot of two back sets to get Moats and Westy both on the field.Bottom line, top 40 is not just possible, but PROBABLE if the plans come to fruition. Top 30 is not impossible.This guy is for real...a late round STEAL!

12-14 times for Moats is very, very, very, very, very, very optimistic.The Eagles RBs under Andy Reid (1999-2005) have only averaged 27 TOUCHES (pass + rush) per game.Does anyone expect Moats to get 12-14 touches and Westbrook to only get 13-15 per game? Westbrook has averaged about 19 touches per game the last two years. That only leaves about 8 touches for the other RBs.EDIT: Eagles RBs numbers included touches by the FB as well as the tailback. Tailback only touches from 1999-2005 were 25/game, leaving a whole 6 touches per game for the other tailbacks.

 

[Ron_Mexico]

This conversation motivated to go get him. In Dynasty, just traded Jon Kitna for him.

Excellent trade for you.

I've been trying to get him in my dynasty league.I own Westbrook, and just received a proposal,

Williamson, Frye and my 2nd next yr

for

Moats and his 4th.

I don't think so.

 

[Traders2001]

Moats is useless .

 

[renesauz]

I'm a big Philly homer, and have been following this situation closely over the past 6 months. The coaching staff is EXPECTING to give the ball to Moats more...in the area of 12-14 times a game. Every report on him coming out of minicamps has been extremely positive, and there's a ton of talk about using a lot of two back sets to get Moats and Westy both on the field.

Bottom line, top 40 is not just possible, but PROBABLE if the plans come to fruition. Top 30 is not impossible.

This guy is for real...a late round STEAL!

12-14 times for Moats is very, very, very, very, very, very optimistic.The Eagles RBs under Andy Reid (1999-2005) have only averaged 27 TOUCHES (pass + rush) per game.

Does anyone expect Moats to get 12-14 touches and Westbrook to only get 13-15 per game? Westbrook has averaged about 19 touches per game the last two years. That only leaves about 8 touches for the other RBs.

EDIT: Eagles RBs numbers included touches by the FB as well as the tailback. Tailback only touches from 1999-2005 were 25/game, leaving a whole 6 touches per game for the other tailbacks.

Actually...yes, I do. Expect Westy to split out of the backfield and CATCH more balls. Westy will still average 19 touches a game, with another 12-14 touches for Moats. IN PPR leagues, Westy could be a top 5 back this year.

 

[Slinger]

This conversation motivated to go get him. In Dynasty, just traded Jon Kitna for him.

Excellent trade for you.

I've been trying to get him in my dynasty league.I own Westbrook, and just received a proposal,

Williamson, Frye and my 2nd next yr

for

Moats and his 4th.

I don't think so.

Yeah, looks like he's trying to take advantage of the fact that you also own Westbrook.

 

[Snotbubbles]

Actually...yes, I do. Expect Westy to split out of the backfield and CATCH more balls. Westy will still average 19 touches a game, with another 12-14 touches for Moats. IN PPR leagues, Westy could be a top 5 back this year.

I don't think you're following me here. The numbers I posted were TOUCHES (rushes AND receptions). Here is why Moats has no chance of TOUCHING (rushes and receptions) 12-14 a game.Here are the Eagles tailback (I excluded FB touches) per year under Andy Reid:1999: 24.6 (rushes AND receptions/game)2000: 23.72001: 24.12002: 29.32003: 26.42004: 25.02005: 24.3Now you think Moates will get the ball 12-14 per game and Westbrook will get the ball 19 times per game. That's a minimum of 31 touches per game. THE EAGLES UNDER ANDY REID HAVE NEVER COME CLOSE TO THAT TYPE OF PRODUCTION. Even in 2002 when they ranked 5th in rushing attempts and 18th in passing attempts they only had 29.3 touches per game. If Andy Reid does run the ball more you surely can't expect it to be more than in 2002. In 2004 Westbrook had 73 receptions, surely you don't think he's going to have 100+ out of the backfield. So at best you're looking at 29 touches for Moates/Westbrook (and that doesn't even consider the fact that some other RB could ever touch the ball), but more likely based on Andy Reids history you're probably looking at touches in the neighborhood of 24-26. If Westbroook is getting the 19 you think he will that leaves approximately 5-7 for Moates.I'd like to see your projectsions for Moates and Westbrook this year. I think, once you project them out, you may find that they falll short of what you are saying here.FBG PROJECTIONS:Westbrook 190 rushes-817 yards AND 73 receptions-679 yards (16 Touches/game)Moats 90 rushes-396 yards AND 7 receptions-46 yards (6 Touches/game)That's pretty close to probably what the final stats will be at the end of the year.

 

[renesauz]

I understand the hesitation, and that I am certain to remain in the minority opinion (that BOTH Westy and Moats will get significant touches).

My projections here are as much on gut as they are on hard data. If you don't beleive Moats to be a quality back, then skip these because you'll never give them credit. But remember this: Westy was NOT a highly regarded back coming out of college, and few could see what Reid saw in him. Reid talks about, and treats Moats the same way he did Westy. The skill-sets are similar. The options and possibilities present with BOTH players on the field at the same time have not been present in any of the past 5 seasons, so past numbers may be a little misleading.

I see Westy with 196 rushes for 810 yards and 6 TD's, 90 receptions for another 790 yards and 4 TD's.

Moats for 155 carries for 650 yards and 3 TD's, 42 receptions for 380 yards and a TD.

That's 17.8 touches per game for Westy , and 12.3 for Moats.

I have gone out on a limb in several threads this year predicting a huge year for the entire Eagles offense, and I'm sticking to it. I don't expect many will agree



Edited to add: I really don't see the other Philly RB's adding significant touches here (maybe 1.5 per game), so the total RB touches is not MUCH higher then the 2002 total....about 31-32 per game.

 

[Snotbubbles]

I understand the hesitation, and that I am certain to remain in the minority opinion (that BOTH Westy and Moats will get significant touches).My projections here are as much on gut as they are on hard data. If you don't beleive Moats to be a quality back, then skip these because you'll never give them credit. But remember this: Westy was NOT a highly regarded back coming out of college, and few could see what Reid saw in him. Reid talks about, and treats Moats the same way he did Westy. The skill-sets are similar. The options and possibilities present with BOTH players on the field at the same time have not been present in any of the past 5 seasons, so past numbers may be a little misleading.I see Westy with 196 rushes for 810 yards and 6 TD's, 90 receptions for another 790 yards and 4 TD's.Moats for 155 carries for 650 yards and 3 TD's, 42 receptions for 380 yards and a TD.That's 17.8 touches per game for Westy , and 12.3 for Moats. I have gone out on a limb in several threads this year predicting a huge year for the entire Eagles offense, and I'm sticking to it. I don't expect many will agree Edited to add: I really don't see the other Philly RB's adding significant touches here (maybe 1.5 per game), so the total RB touches is not MUCH higher then the 2002 total....about 31-32 per game.

Your projections assume:1. That the tailback producction for the Eagles in 2006 will be a minimum of 3 touches per game higher than the highest total they've ever had under Andy Reid and in the neighborhood of 6 touches per game from the other 6 years. There is always a possibility, but to expects 31 touches from 2 guys when historically the ENTIRE corp under Reid's best year was 29 and for all the other years it's been about 25 is a bit much to expect.2. You assume that the Eagles will use Moates extensively as a reciever out of the backfield when they are not throwing out of the backfield to Westbrook. 142 receptions from Moates and Westbrook not including any other backs is way too high. I doubt the Eagles have ever come close to that type of reception totals from their tailbacks ever.Moates will not get 42 receptions. The Eagles didn't use him in that role last year, and if they're throwing to another back besides Westbrook, it will probably someone other than Moates (maybe Mahe, or another back they pick up between now and opening day). I've watched ever Eagles game that Reid has coached and the one thing that never fails is that he will abandon the running game very quickly. Every year the Eagles talk about running the ball more, and every year they throw it way too much.

 

[renesauz]

I understand the hesitation, and that I am certain to remain in the minority opinion (that BOTH Westy and Moats will get significant touches).

My projections here are as much on gut as they are on hard data. If you don't beleive Moats to be a quality back, then skip these because you'll never give them credit. But remember this: Westy was NOT a highly regarded back coming out of college, and few could see what Reid saw in him. Reid talks about, and treats Moats the same way he did Westy. The skill-sets are similar. The options and possibilities present with BOTH players on the field at the same time have not been present in any of the past 5 seasons, so past numbers may be a little misleading.

I see Westy with 196 rushes for 810 yards and 6 TD's, 90 receptions for another 790 yards and 4 TD's.

Moats for 155 carries for 650 yards and 3 TD's, 42 receptions for 380 yards and a TD.

That's 17.8 touches per game for Westy , and 12.3 for Moats.

I have gone out on a limb in several threads this year predicting a huge year for the entire Eagles offense, and I'm sticking to it. I don't expect many will agree

Edited to add: I really don't see the other Philly RB's adding significant touches here (maybe 1.5 per game), so the total RB touches is not MUCH higher then the 2002 total....about 31-32 per game.

Your projections assume:1. That the tailback producction for the Eagles in 2006 will be a minimum of 3 touches per game higher than the highest total they've ever had under Andy Reid and in the neighborhood of 6 touches per game from the other 6 years. There is always a possibility, but to expects 31 touches from 2 guys when historically the ENTIRE corp under Reid's best year was 29 and for all the other years it's been about 25 is a bit much to expect.

2. You assume that the Eagles will use Moates extensively as a reciever out of the backfield when they are not throwing out of the backfield to Westbrook. 142 receptions from Moates and Westbrook not including any other backs is way too high. I doubt the Eagles have ever come close to that type of reception totals from their tailbacks ever.

Moates will not get 42 receptions. The Eagles didn't use him in that role last year, and if they're throwing to another back besides Westbrook, it will probably someone other than Moates (maybe Mahe, or another back they pick up between now and opening day).

I've watched ever Eagles game that Reid has coached and the one thing that never fails is that he will abandon the running game very quickly. Every year the Eagles talk about running the ball more, and every year they throw it way too much.

You may be right. I too have watched every game for the last 5 years, and most of them for 20 years. I wrote what I beleive we'll see, and don't expect many to agree. I do STRONGLY beleive that to expect historic averages this year from the Eagles running game is going far too conservative.