dundeeslugger
Footballguy
They have 2 above average options in Sproles and Hester and LT is starting to get the injury bug.
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San Diego should cut LT2 (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter dundeeslugger
- Start date
Banger
Footballguy
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
LOL
Hester cant get out of LT's way half the time
Hester cant get out of LT's way half the time
Jason Wood
Zoo York
There's not a Chargers fan I respect more than our own Maurile Tremblay. And as many of you know MT hosts our weekly Fantasy Roundtable discussion. Last week, for those of you who don't read the feature, one of the topics was about who we saw as top 10 options for 2009. LT came up, and was somewhat divisive. This is what MT had to say:
When I first heard MT suggest that Sproles was the better back, I was floored. But MT is neither emotional nor prone to hyperbole. Makes you wonder if you're in a dynasty league and could get rid of LT for big value right now.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
he dont play Denver every week but he seemed to have some old burst and cuts last night. until he got tweaked again. If I was Norv I'd put Brandon Manumaleuna in front of LT and bench Jacob hester unless its an obvious passing down. Norv doesnt like the FB but to me LT is best with a FB infront of him.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Turner was a FA but thanks for playing
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
sproles is a FA and isnt getting franchise so he can go whereever he wants.
Ozymandias
Footballguy
Yes, he has been hit by the injury bug. Yes, he is on the downside of a stellar career. But in 2009, he could be a very nice surprise for someone who drafts him in the 6-12 range. But they'd better get the best blocking back available to open holes for him.
Sproles might be more explosive, but there's no way he would hold up to the punishment a full time RB role would create.. Sproles is the type of back that you bring in for 5-10 plays after a def is softened up and gets the big gains... He can't soften up the defense himself though...
What's LT's remaining contract look like? I couldn't find the numbers on google.
LT may be in the downslope of his career but he is still a solid option, particularily paired up with Sproles. Resign Sproles, draft another RB late (SD seems to have a knack for drafting solid RB's late) and use that 1st rounder on some defense. While you're at, go out and sign the best blocking FB you can find. The loss of Lorenzo Neal has hurt LT more than age.
LT may be in the downslope of his career but he is still a solid option, particularily paired up with Sproles. Resign Sproles, draft another RB late (SD seems to have a knack for drafting solid RB's late) and use that 1st rounder on some defense. While you're at, go out and sign the best blocking FB you can find. The loss of Lorenzo Neal has hurt LT more than age.
dundeeslugger
Footballguy
No way in hell they are going to be able to keep LT and resign Sproles. Sproles as a FA is going to be going after almost starting RB numbers.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
WOW. I respect MT as well, and I'm floored by this. Sproles has looked more explosive and certainly taken advantage of his opportunities, but those opportunities have mostly been late in games and in favorable situations. Meanwhile, LT's been banged up and carrying the load when the defense is still fresh and having more of his touches in traditional, 1st down, between-the-tackles scenarios.MT may be right; he knows the Chargers as well as anyone and his football acumen is top notch. But I think Tomlinson is still the better back when both are healthy.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
While Sproles has remained relatively healthy this year, it should be noted that he struggled with injuries and ball security his first couple years in San Diego. He hasn't fumbled recently, but I still cringe when I see his 170 pound body going full speed into crowds on kickoffs and find myself praying he holds onto the ball.
Maybe it's just me. But I'm not sold on his ability to be an effective every down back. I don't think he'll hold up.
Maybe it's just me. But I'm not sold on his ability to be an effective every down back. I don't think he'll hold up.
Who out there is going to risk giving him starting caliber money? Sproles does not have anywhere near the body of work or the hype that Turner did.
BoltBacker
Footballguy
Well said.That's exactly what I was going to post. People that think.....Sproles '09 = Turner '08... will be rudely awakened IF Sproles is ever made a featured back, and this coming from a fan of his from the time he was drafted. Sproles has been the more productive back this season than LT in his limited opportunities but I just can't imagine Sproles carrying a full work load by himself for more than one season.... if even for a full season. Maybe if he could find himself playing for a dome team in a high powered run-and-shoot offense.
JoeyJoeJoeJrShabadoo
Footballguy
You can blame injuries, offensive line, playcalling, whatever. All I know is he cracked 100 yards rushing twice all season, and averaged 3.8 yards/carry. I watched 5 or 6 Chargers games this season and Tomlinson has clearly lost a step. Unless he comes out once SD's season ends and says he has been in a lot of pain all season long and it was affecting his ability to run effectively (ie his "explosiveness"), then I won't touch this guy inside of the 1st 4 rounds next year. Lowest YPC in the top 15 rushing yards other than Jamal Lewis. I'll let someone else take him early because of his name. He is done as a dominating RB.
As far as Sproles, I think SD should at least give him a shot at starting. Of course, I thought the same thing about Jerious Norwood after last season.
As far as Sproles, I think SD should at least give him a shot at starting. Of course, I thought the same thing about Jerious Norwood after last season.
Banger
Footballguy
would you take Forte in the 1st? He averaged 3.9 ypc and he ran for more than 100 yards 3 times.
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BoltBacker
Footballguy
That's exactly the comparison I was going to make as well.
bonesman
Footballguy
I'm firmly entrenched in the "There's no way Sproles can handle a full load" camp. He's got lightning in a bottle... but that bottle is made of brittle glass that breaks when handled more than occasionally.
Steelers4Life
Footballguy
I don't understand this comparison. Why? Because they're both big play threats?Sproles is 5 foot 6, 180.
Norwood is 5 foot 11, 204
Sproles is much more compact and isn't exposed to nearly as many big hits because of it. He seems to have a knock for AVOIDING the big hit by angling his body or going down at the right time. No one questions how explosive he is or how quickly he hits the holes, either. He's a tough inside runner (he withstood the Big 12 in college, too) and aside from both of them being big play threats, I don't see much of a similarity between them.
Do I think Sproles is built to be a 300+ carry RB in the NFL? Nope. But I think that any team that gives him a role where he touches the ball 15 to 20 times total per game will be rewarded in a big way.
Edit to add that Sproles is a full 4 inches shorter than Steve Slaton but only ten pounds lighter. I think writing him off is a big mistake. He's also 3 inches shorter but the same weight as Warrick Dunn, but more explosive than I ever remember Dunn being.
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bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
sproles will never be a fulltime RB1, he a COP back that is an excellent special team returner.
wouldnt surprise me to see sproles back because no one pays him to be what he wants full time starting RB.
wouldnt surprise me to see sproles back because no one pays him to be what he wants full time starting RB.
And the Cowboys should cut Marion Barber ... He was worse than LT and they have 2 RBs that completely outperformed him when given the opportunity.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Turf toe and the injuries/struggles of the OL aren't fictional excuses, they're facts. You can ignore the facts, and instead chalk up LT's poor season to "losing a step", but you do so at your own risk. LT is still a top 5 NFL RB playing on the highest scoring team in the AFC. Just as his 30+ TD season was a bit of a fluke a couple years ago, his 12 TD season this year is a fluke. He'll be back between 15-20 TDs again next year.
BoltBacker
Footballguy
Completely disagree.The OL issues is moot, LT has rarely had a good OL to run behind. This year certainly hasn't been one of his worst to be sure.I'm not sold on the injury issue. Sure his play is likely diminished due to injury but after this many carries I'm not sure you can count on him bouncing back or able to fend off the nagging injuries that have been more common than most people think over the past several years.One of my favorite all-time players to watch and always will be but this is Rivers team now. The emergence of Rivers and some of the receivers makes 20 TD's by any RB in this offense a pipe dream imo.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
I could be wrong. But if my life depended on it, and I was asked to guess TD totals for Rivers and LT in 2009, off the top of my head I'd guess:Rivers 26LT 17
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BoltBacker
Footballguy
My guess would be closer to Rivers 36LT 12but I'll admit I can picture Gates making closer to a true bounce back than LT. I'm also completely sold on Vincent Jackson right now after being someone that was very hesitant to just assume he was going to develop into a #1 WR early in his career. Floyd is still young(especially for a possession WR) and Davis can't produce any less than he has up to this point. But I think I'm one of the few that doesn't write off a WR after his first two seasons in the league. Even Naane has showed flashes in the past.I could be wrong. But if my life depended on it, and I was asked to guess TD totals for Rivers and LT in 2009, off the top of my head I'd guess:Rivers 26LT 17
Tau837
Footballguy
Several comments here.
1. No, SD should not cut LT. Even if he continues getting worse going forward, he has earned the right to finish his career as a Charger.
2. LT's contract info (from Rotoworld): On 8/14/2004 signed an eight-year, $60 million contract. The deal includes $21 million in guarantees. 2008: $5.75 million, 2009: $6.725 million, 2010: $8 million, 2011: $9.275 million, 2012: Free Agent.
Once the cap situation beyond 2009 is sorted out, if those numbers seem too high based on the size of the cap and/or his performance, I could see them restructuring.
3. LT was clearly affected by the toe this year. On SNF earlier this season, Madden did a very nice job of showing the effect on his cutting ability, by comparing video from this season to previous seasons, and showing that he just could not plant and cut effectively off the foot with the injured toe. To my knowledge, there is no reason to believe the toe injury (or any other injury he has dealt with) will affect him in future seasons.
4. LT turns 30 next June. Barry Sanders, Emmitt Smith, Walter Payton, Tiki Barber, Priest Holmes, and Curtis Martin all had great seasons at age 30 and/or older. Tomlinson is certainly worthy of being grouped with those guys in terms of his ability, and given his work ethic and desire, I see no reason why he can't rebound with 1-2 more very strong seasons.
5. That said, I think it makes sense to have a strong backup, and start sharing touches more between Tomlinson and that backup, in order to extend Tomlinson's career a bit and save him from having to carry the entire workload. IMO Sproles is ideal for this, because he truly represents a change of pace for the defense, and he is very talented in his own right and thus deserves touches.
6. I do think Sproles could probably handle a greater workload than many believe. As some evidence of that, he dominated the Big 12 for three years in college. That said, he is an excellent kick and punt returner, and I don't think he could continue those duties if serving as a feature back. I think a team is likely better off using him as a strong second RB and its primary returner than using another returner and featuring Sproles. Just as San Diego has used him this year.
7. I hope San Diego resigns Sproles. I don't think it will require feature back money, because I don't think any team is really going to sign him to be a feature back, due to the concerns about his ability to carry the load. I see no reason why San Diego can't outbid other teams when his price should be in line with his expected role as second back and primary returner.
1. No, SD should not cut LT. Even if he continues getting worse going forward, he has earned the right to finish his career as a Charger.
2. LT's contract info (from Rotoworld): On 8/14/2004 signed an eight-year, $60 million contract. The deal includes $21 million in guarantees. 2008: $5.75 million, 2009: $6.725 million, 2010: $8 million, 2011: $9.275 million, 2012: Free Agent.
Once the cap situation beyond 2009 is sorted out, if those numbers seem too high based on the size of the cap and/or his performance, I could see them restructuring.
3. LT was clearly affected by the toe this year. On SNF earlier this season, Madden did a very nice job of showing the effect on his cutting ability, by comparing video from this season to previous seasons, and showing that he just could not plant and cut effectively off the foot with the injured toe. To my knowledge, there is no reason to believe the toe injury (or any other injury he has dealt with) will affect him in future seasons.
4. LT turns 30 next June. Barry Sanders, Emmitt Smith, Walter Payton, Tiki Barber, Priest Holmes, and Curtis Martin all had great seasons at age 30 and/or older. Tomlinson is certainly worthy of being grouped with those guys in terms of his ability, and given his work ethic and desire, I see no reason why he can't rebound with 1-2 more very strong seasons.
5. That said, I think it makes sense to have a strong backup, and start sharing touches more between Tomlinson and that backup, in order to extend Tomlinson's career a bit and save him from having to carry the entire workload. IMO Sproles is ideal for this, because he truly represents a change of pace for the defense, and he is very talented in his own right and thus deserves touches.
6. I do think Sproles could probably handle a greater workload than many believe. As some evidence of that, he dominated the Big 12 for three years in college. That said, he is an excellent kick and punt returner, and I don't think he could continue those duties if serving as a feature back. I think a team is likely better off using him as a strong second RB and its primary returner than using another returner and featuring Sproles. Just as San Diego has used him this year.
7. I hope San Diego resigns Sproles. I don't think it will require feature back money, because I don't think any team is really going to sign him to be a feature back, due to the concerns about his ability to carry the load. I see no reason why San Diego can't outbid other teams when his price should be in line with his expected role as second back and primary returner.
Cenobite
Footballguy
Sounds a lot like R. Bush. As to the topic - LT2 is beloved, and rightfully so, in San Diego. He is the franchise. It would be like the Bears cutting Payton. It will never happen. Reduced role as he gets older? Probably. Cut? Never
Tau837
Footballguy
kevjones22
Footballguy
Hey the fans here in Seattle turned on SA pretty fast once he stopped producing (trying).
JoeyJoeJoeJrShabadoo
Footballguy
Would I? I'd certainly take him before LT. Forte's best years are still in front of him. LT was looking at 8 rushing TD's this year before his 3 TDs in what equates to the "garbage time" of the FF season.He had a good run at the top, but it's a slippery slope when FF Superstar RB's start to decline due to injury/wear & tear (Holmes, Alexander, Faulk, Terrell Davis, etc). The signs are all there, the same excuses you always hear. So go ahead and take LT. He should be a lock for 900 yards and a half dozen TD's next year.
massraider
Footballguy
They didn't like him even when he was producing.
LT obviously won't be cut, since trading him would make more sense than cutting him.
He could be traded, but I think there's a fairly small chance (less than 10%) of that happening.
I don't think the Chargers will extend (i.e., restructure) his contract. After 2011 they'll let him be a free agent. He'll probably retire at that point anyway.
He could be traded, but I think there's a fairly small chance (less than 10%) of that happening.
I don't think the Chargers will extend (i.e., restructure) his contract. After 2011 they'll let him be a free agent. He'll probably retire at that point anyway.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
While the loss of O'Neal certainly hurt the Bolts this year (I've been a critic of the decision not to resign him), I think Hester has greatly improved over the 2nd half of the season and I think he'll be much better going into '09.
LT isn't going anywhere including my team. People will keep chasing the old LT's numbers which he simply will never get again and the odds are as good that he will fall off that RB cliff either due to injury, under-performing, splitting more carries etc. So I will not draft him, guaranteed, because someone else will be willing to pay more and IMO probably get less.
Cenobite
Footballguy
It seems I may be dead wrong on this one. A lot of prognosticators believe that LT2 will be cut. I sincerely thought that LT2 had an enourmous amount of respect and fan appeal that S.D. would never cut him. From what I've read and heard, he is an incredible human being. I guess winning is everything. BTW- no way the Bears would have ever cut Payton.
CalBear
Footballguy
I guess Sproles' 15-yard rushing performance in a critical playoff game really cemented him as a clear every-down back.
SuperJohn96
RPS World Champion
IMHO, it's better to get rid of a player a year early rather than a year late.
You can get SOMETHING for him if it's a year early. If it's a year late, you'll get nothing from him (a) on the field or (b) from another team.
It's a business.
You can always sign him to a one day contract when he's ready to retire after 3-4 years of mediocrity some other place.
You can get SOMETHING for him if it's a year early. If it's a year late, you'll get nothing from him (a) on the field or (b) from another team.
It's a business.
You can always sign him to a one day contract when he's ready to retire after 3-4 years of mediocrity some other place.
G-Money
Footballguy
Chargers | Tomlinson on way out?
Tue, 13 Jan 2009 11:13:16 -0800
Nick Canepa, of the San Diego Union-Tribune, reports the San Diego Chargers may soon prepare for life without RB LaDainian Tomlinson. Tomlinson has three years remaining on his contract. His salary cap number in 2009 will be $8.8 million, and considering Tomlinson is now 30 and has suffered from an assortment of injuries the last two seasons may make him expendable. Parting ways with Tomlinson would help the team save money that it could use to improve other positions. General manager A.J. Smith also hinted that Tomlinson could perhaps be replaced if he were let go. "You're assuming," Smith says, "that, if we have to move on, we're not capable of getting another running back."
Tue, 13 Jan 2009 11:13:16 -0800
Nick Canepa, of the San Diego Union-Tribune, reports the San Diego Chargers may soon prepare for life without RB LaDainian Tomlinson. Tomlinson has three years remaining on his contract. His salary cap number in 2009 will be $8.8 million, and considering Tomlinson is now 30 and has suffered from an assortment of injuries the last two seasons may make him expendable. Parting ways with Tomlinson would help the team save money that it could use to improve other positions. General manager A.J. Smith also hinted that Tomlinson could perhaps be replaced if he were let go. "You're assuming," Smith says, "that, if we have to move on, we're not capable of getting another running back."
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
not as a traditional blocking fullback. He's too little. He's a pass catching back, thats it
PatsWillWin
Footballguy
Wow.
LT will find a home. SD would be foolish to let him go, but there was clearly a disconnect between LT and Rivers. I believe it goes to Rivers playing with an ACL, losing a little respect for LT sitting last year.
Either way...LT will be great in the following cities.
Tampa
Seattle
Arizona
Indy
Denver
Cleveland
NE
Dallas
SD
LT will land on his feet, and he will be ready to go.
He is very durable, but has reached the point he needs an O-line in front of him. He played most of the season with a toe, which would have kept most RB's on the shelf.
Guy is getting beat up, and it's silly.
Either way...LT will be great in the following cities.
Tampa
Seattle
Arizona
Indy
Denver
Cleveland
NE
Dallas
SD
LT will land on his feet, and he will be ready to go.
He is very durable, but has reached the point he needs an O-line in front of him. He played most of the season with a toe, which would have kept most RB's on the shelf.
Guy is getting beat up, and it's silly.
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JAA
Footballguy
Hester? Is that a joke?
Synthesizer
Footballguy
Are you using hindsight to say that the Chargers should have gotten rid of LT before this season? If so, I totally disagree.SuperJohn96 said:
I don't think anyone believes he'll be cut. A number of people believe he could be traded.Cenobite said:
