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Santana Moss (1 Viewer)

Do you think they remain the same, go slightly up with Lloyd and Randle EL giving him more single coverage or slighty go down because more balls going to the new guys.

 

coco the monkey

Footballguy
Down some but not a lot. Last year wasn't a fluke, he had 1100 yards and 10 Tds in 2003. I'd put him somewhere in the 1200 yard 8-10 TD range.

 

Baracuda

Footballguy
Do you think they remain the same, go slightly up with Lloyd and Randle EL giving him more single coverage or slighty go down because more balls going to the new guys.
I think go down because of reversion to the mean after a career year and the new guys.
 

gman8343

What would Lemmy do?
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.

 

TheFanatic

Footballguy
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.
The number of balls may decrease but the amount of single coverage will increase which will likely increase his YAC a great deal and offset the lower receptions with more yards.....
 

Buckna

RMT Beta Tester
I'm bearish on Moss for much the same reason I was after the 2003 season, much of his stats in 2005 came from big plays. (Remember the Monday night football game against Dallas where 2 of his catches where for long bombs for TD's in the final 3 or 4 minutes of the game?) He was 2nd only to Terry Glenn in YD/Rec for receivers that caught more than 50 balls indicating a lot of long passes.

While he'll still do well, I think you'll see a drop in his yardage numbers down to the 1100-1200 range.

 

Z-Dog

Footballguy
Given the inconsistency he's demonstrated throughout his career, I'd say that he shuold rank no higher than WR6 on a cheat hseet. To me, the potetial effects of other receivers are negligible next to the potential effects of an injury to him or to his QB. And with Brunell's age, I don't think Moss will rank higher than WR10 for me.

 

redman

Footballguy
Around 70-75 receptions, 1250-1350 yards, 8-10 TD's.

Gibbs loves having multiple targets at WR and using them all. Only twice, before last year, had Gibbs had a WR exceed 1300 yards (Monk and Clark); he's only had a WR catch double-digit TD's in a season (as head coach) twice (Clark 10, and Sanders 12).

I think this team will be better than last year's team, and will be playing an easier schedule, albeit in a tougher division. They should have more leads, which means more running of the football late in games. That will further restrict Moss from repeating last year's numbers.

 

nygiants56

Footballguy
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.
he'll have more chances for longer tds , since he'll face more 1-on-1 coverage.he should be open even MORE, and is STILL the #1 wr on the team.

I'd say the biggest worry for Moss owners is going to come from Cooley, because Al Saunders loves to utilize the TE (Gonzalez)..you'll see alot of action going his way..I wouldn't doubt that Cooley winds up with 80 or 90 catches in 2006..so what that'll do to Moss' numbers remains to be seen..perhaps the yardage and reception totals drop a bit, but he should see a big rise in TD's b/c he'll only be in single coverages...

 
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dgreen

Footballguy
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.
he'll have more chances for longer tds , since he'll face more 1-on-1 coverage.he should be open even MORE, and is STILL the #1 wr on the team.

I'd say the biggest worry for Moss owners is going to come from Cooley, because Al Saunders loves to utilize the TE (Gonzalez)..you'll see alot of action going his way..I wouldn't doubt that Cooley winds up with 80 or 90 catches in 2006..so what that'll do to Moss' numbers remains to be seen..perhaps the yardage and reception totals drop a bit, but he should see a big rise in TD's b/c he'll only be in single coverages...
Cooley had 71/774/7 last year. I'm really not sure how much higher that can go, even with a guy (Saunders) who likes to use the TE/H-back in the passing game.I think Moss sees a slight drop in his numbers. And that's not a horrible thing. Moss was WR3 last year. He can easily remaing top 10 in 2006.

 

redman

Footballguy
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.
he'll have more chances for longer tds , since he'll face more 1-on-1 coverage.he should be open even MORE, and is STILL the #1 wr on the team.

I'd say the biggest worry for Moss owners is going to come from Cooley, because Al Saunders loves to utilize the TE (Gonzalez)..you'll see alot of action going his way..I wouldn't doubt that Cooley winds up with 80 or 90 catches in 2006..so what that'll do to Moss' numbers remains to be seen..perhaps the yardage and reception totals drop a bit, but he should see a big rise in TD's b/c he'll only be in single coverages...
Well, they threw 15 TD's to their TE's/H-backs last year, so I have a hard time imagining that any more will go their way, especially with better WR's now playing for them. Moss' 9 TD's last year is a pretty moderate number for a guy who was essentially the only WR option for his team last year and who managed to lead the league in receiving yards but for Steve Smith. He averaged 17.7 ypc, but I could see that increasing as much as a full yard with the addition of Lloyd and Randle El to take pressure off of him. This receiving corps - whatever you think of its quality = speed.

 

Sigmund Bloom

Footballguy
Staff member
I think we saw Moss's career year last year. It's no knock on him going into the future, its just a realistic assessment that just about everything broke in a such a way for him to have a huge statistical year, and that's unlikely to happen again. I would say the same about Steve Smith.

 
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Dope

Footballguy
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.
he'll have more chances for longer tds , since he'll face more 1-on-1 coverage.he should be open even MORE, and is STILL the #1 wr on the team.

I'd say the biggest worry for Moss owners is going to come from Cooley, because Al Saunders loves to utilize the TE (Gonzalez)..you'll see alot of action going his way..I wouldn't doubt that Cooley winds up with 80 or 90 catches in 2006..so what that'll do to Moss' numbers remains to be seen..perhaps the yardage and reception totals drop a bit, but he should see a big rise in TD's b/c he'll only be in single coverages...
Isn't this more of a cause/effect thing?I have a supremely talented 250 lb guy playing TE and a bunch of meh guys on the outside...So I throw to my super talented guy.

Unless Saunders has been doing this his whole career (not sure) this is almost like saying Pat Riley likes feeding the ball into his center (Kareem, Ewing, Shaq) and would continue doing so if he had Eddy Grant at the 5.

 

redman

Footballguy
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.
he'll have more chances for longer tds , since he'll face more 1-on-1 coverage.he should be open even MORE, and is STILL the #1 wr on the team.

I'd say the biggest worry for Moss owners is going to come from Cooley, because Al Saunders loves to utilize the TE (Gonzalez)..you'll see alot of action going his way..I wouldn't doubt that Cooley winds up with 80 or 90 catches in 2006..so what that'll do to Moss' numbers remains to be seen..perhaps the yardage and reception totals drop a bit, but he should see a big rise in TD's b/c he'll only be in single coverages...
Isn't this more of a cause/effect thing?I have a supremely talented 250 lb guy playing TE and a bunch of meh guys on the outside...So I throw to my super talented guy.

Unless Saunders has been doing this his whole career (not sure) this is almost like saying Pat Riley likes feeding the ball into his center (Kareem, Ewing, Shaq) and would continue doing so if he had Eddy Grant at the 5.
Exactly. I meant to add: Saunders also was in St. Louis in '99 with the Greatest Show on Turf, and I don't recall too many impressive TE statistics off of that team. Saunders will distribute the ball to those capable of handling it. Cooley's better than what was in St. Louis, so he'll get the ball more, but he's neither as good as Gonzalez as a receiver, nor were the KC WR's as good as this receiving corps in Washington, so a lot more passes will go to the WR's in Washington IMHO. Moss is the clear #1 option there, but I think we'll see numbers out of Lloyd and especially Randle El that we've never seen from them before.

 

wannabee

Footballguy
I think his numbers should take a hit, though he'll still be solid. Last year there was NO ONE playing WR other than Moss, so the ball was forced his way. Now, it should be spread out a bit more, which may open things up for Moss in coverage, but the number of balls thrown his way will decrease IMO.
he'll have more chances for longer tds , since he'll face more 1-on-1 coverage.he should be open even MORE, and is STILL the #1 wr on the team.

I'd say the biggest worry for Moss owners is going to come from Cooley, because Al Saunders loves to utilize the TE (Gonzalez)..you'll see alot of action going his way..I wouldn't doubt that Cooley winds up with 80 or 90 catches in 2006..so what that'll do to Moss' numbers remains to be seen..perhaps the yardage and reception totals drop a bit, but he should see a big rise in TD's b/c he'll only be in single coverages...
Isn't this more of a cause/effect thing?I have a supremely talented 250 lb guy playing TE and a bunch of meh guys on the outside...So I throw to my super talented guy.

Unless Saunders has been doing this his whole career (not sure) this is almost like saying Pat Riley likes feeding the ball into his center (Kareem, Ewing, Shaq) and would continue doing so if he had Eddy Grant at the 5.
Exactly. I meant to add: Saunders also was in St. Louis in '99 with the Greatest Show on Turf, and I don't recall too many impressive TE statistics off of that team. Saunders will distribute the ball to those capable of handling it. Cooley's better than what was in St. Louis, so he'll get the ball more, but he's neither as good as Gonzalez as a receiver, nor were the KC WR's as good as this receiving corps in Washington, so a lot more passes will go to the WR's in Washington IMHO. Moss is the clear #1 option there, but I think we'll see numbers out of Lloyd and especially Randle El that we've never seen from them before.
I would think this helps Brunell as well
 

TheFanatic

Footballguy
Unless Saunders has been doing this his whole career (not sure) this is almost like saying Pat Riley likes feeding the ball into his center (Kareem, Ewing, Shaq) and would continue doing so if he had Eddy Grant at the 5.
Al Saunders only called the plays for KC. Before that he was either WR or QB coach for St. Louis (I don't recall witch). In St. Louis they did not utilize the TE much at all while Saunders was here. All the short, underneath stuff went to Faulk. Sure, he utilized the TE in KC because Gonzo is a future HOFer. I love Riley feeding his center comment.....Fantastic analogy....

 

Carter_Can_Fly

Footballguy
Was S. Moss underrated this year????

I was actually mad when he fell to me as the next best WR on the board and I snagged him up and was not happy about it.

However, after watching tonight and seeing how the Redskins are going out of their way to make sure he touches the ball a ton and let him utilize his play making ability I am really excited. He also just about hung on to the ball in the end zone. With Randel El and Lloyd taking some attention away from him, this guy could be money again all year.

He and S. Smith are very similiar players and everyone was very high on Smith after having a career year last year and not as high on Moss after a career year.

I think S. Moss produces great value this year as he would have fallen after much of the WR 1's and could very well produce at that elite level like last year again finshing ahead of many of those guys.

 

Carter_Can_Fly

Footballguy
Was S. Moss underrated this year????I was actually mad when he fell to me as the next best WR on the board and I snagged him up and was not happy about it.However, after watching tonight and seeing how the Redskins are going out of their way to make sure he touches the ball a ton and let him utilize his play making ability I am really excited. He also just about hung on to the ball in the end zone. With Randel El and Lloyd taking some attention away from him, this guy could be money again all year.He and S. Smith are very similiar players and everyone was very high on Smith after having a career year last year and not as high on Moss after a career year.I think S. Moss produces great value this year as he would have fallen after much of the WR 1's and could very well produce at that elite level like last year again finshing ahead of many of those guys.
So I guess I ask again. Did we undervalue S. Moss this year??
 

redman

Footballguy
Was S. Moss underrated this year????I was actually mad when he fell to me as the next best WR on the board and I snagged him up and was not happy about it.However, after watching tonight and seeing how the Redskins are going out of their way to make sure he touches the ball a ton and let him utilize his play making ability I am really excited. He also just about hung on to the ball in the end zone. With Randel El and Lloyd taking some attention away from him, this guy could be money again all year.He and S. Smith are very similiar players and everyone was very high on Smith after having a career year last year and not as high on Moss after a career year.I think S. Moss produces great value this year as he would have fallen after much of the WR 1's and could very well produce at that elite level like last year again finshing ahead of many of those guys.
So I guess I ask again. Did we undervalue S. Moss this year??
Well, if you take the ever-popular amortization approach, then you've got 68/1304/12. That's not all that different than the more moderate #'s that most of us were predicting, although the TD's are a tad higher than what I'd estimated before the year, but not unrealistic. :shrug:
 

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