Shanahanless effect on the Denver Running Game (1 Viewer)

[JohnnyU]

I think it's safe to say that Denver's starting running back isn't on their roster right now. One has to ask, what effect does not having Shanahan have on the Denver running game? I know that Denver has been a successful running team for over a decade, and that famous zone blocking scheme mastered by the Denver coaches is the reason, but I'm sure fantasy owners are rejoicing nevertheless, at least until he lands somewhere to screw with us some more. I doubt that Denver drafts a RB high because of their need for defense, but you never know. Do they have multiple 2nd or 3rd rounders? Obviously the crap they have on their roster isn't going to cut it long term.

 

[BeTheMatch]

Not to hijack here, but I wonder what the impact will be on Cutler.

 

[JohnnyU]

Not to hijack here, but I wonder what the impact will be on Cutler.

...but you did, and the first post at that. Not a good start, lol.

 

[renesauz]

I think it's safe to say that Denver's starting running back isn't on their roster right now. One has to ask, what effect does not having Shanahan have on the Denver running game? I know that Denver has been a successful running team for over a decade, and that famous zone blocking scheme mastered by the Denver coaches is the reason, but I'm sure fantasy owners are rejoicing nevertheless, at least until he lands somewhere to screw with us some more. I doubt that Denver drafts a RB high because of their need for defense, but you never know. Do they have multiple 2nd or 3rd rounders? Obviously the crap they have on their roster isn't going to cut it long term.

I have a minor problem with your last statement, as I'm not so sure that that is obvious.The defensive holes should eat up their early picks anyway, so at best they bring in a castoff FA (a cheap runner) or a late pick to compete. Even that seems unlikely.

I'll agree that the answer isn't Tater.

 

[BeTheMatch]

Not to hijack here, but I wonder what the impact will be on Cutler.

...but you did, and the first post at that. Not a good start, lol.

Maybe we could discuss the impact on the offense as a whole?

 

[Avery]

Not to hijack here, but I wonder what the impact will be on Cutler.

...but you did, and the first post at that. Not a good start, lol.

Maybe we could discuss the impact on the offense as a whole?

Scheffler?

 

[Michael Fox Fan]

Not to hijack here, but I wonder what the impact will be on Cutler.

...but you did, and the first post at that. Not a good start, lol.

Maybe we could discuss the impact on the offense as a whole?

Great idea. Maybe you could start a thread on that topic.Does anybody else think Shanny's departure kills the value of Ryan Torain? Not many people seemed to think Torain had talent going into the draft, so the only thing he had in his favor was "the Shanny Effect". With Shanny gone, I'm not convinced that Torain has anything going for him.

Then again, Hall/Young/Bell/Pittman aren't exactly guys to build a running game around either.

 

[lyon812]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

 

[Sebowski]

What does this mean for Chad Jackson?

 

[JohnnyU]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

You might be right, but when I see who they had, it doesn't exactly look exciting. Tatum Bell - uh......noPeyton Hillis - decent fill-in, but I'm sorry, John Riggins he isn't.Ryan Torain - I'm not sure, but I don't think he's the answer either. Bad injury to boot.Selvin Young - I am convinced he has mediocre talent.Anthony Alridge - COP back IMOP.J. Pope - Recycled Cory Boyd - hell, I don't knowSee why I feel the 2009 Denver starter isn't on their roster?

 

[renesauz]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

You might be right, but when I see who they had, it doesn't exactly look exciting. Tatum Bell - uh......noPeyton Hillis - decent fill-in, but I'm sorry, John Riggins he isn't.Ryan Torain - I'm not sure, but I don't think he's the answer either. Bad injury to boot.Selvin Young - I am convinced he has mediocre talent.Anthony Alridge - COP back IMOP.J. Pope - Recycled Cory Boyd - hell, I don't knowSee why I feel the 2009 Denver starter isn't on their roster?

No...I don't. They have too many other glaring needs to invest heavily at RB right now.Torrain hasn't even had a real shot yet, and Young has shown enough to be considered at least a temporary solution or a potential COP/committee RB. Hillis showed heart and could certainly fill any short-yardage needs. Is there a star RB, a fantasy #1 on their roster?....nope. Is there enough talent to sit tight until they address more pressing needs?.....yep.

 

[JohnnyU]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

You might be right, but when I see who they had, it doesn't exactly look exciting. Tatum Bell - uh......noPeyton Hillis - decent fill-in, but I'm sorry, John Riggins he isn't.Ryan Torain - I'm not sure, but I don't think he's the answer either. Bad injury to boot.Selvin Young - I am convinced he has mediocre talent.Anthony Alridge - COP back IMOP.J. Pope - Recycled Cory Boyd - hell, I don't knowSee why I feel the 2009 Denver starter isn't on their roster?

No...I don't. They have too many other glaring needs to invest heavily at RB right now.Torrain hasn't even had a real shot yet, and Young has shown enough to be considered at least a temporary solution or a potential COP/committee RB. Hillis showed heart and could certainly fill any short-yardage needs. Is there a star RB, a fantasy #1 on their roster?....nope. Is there enough talent to sit tight until they address more pressing needs?.....yep.

I agree they have other needs, but it shouldn't be that difficult to get a back in the draft if they have multiple 2nd or 3rd rounders. I don't even know if they do, but they would have to consider it. Also, maybe they go after LJ. He's better than anyone they have, and he wants out of KC.

 

[lyon812]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

You might be right, but when I see who they had, it doesn't exactly look exciting. Tatum Bell - uh......noPeyton Hillis - decent fill-in, but I'm sorry, John Riggins he isn't.Ryan Torain - I'm not sure, but I don't think he's the answer either. Bad injury to boot.Selvin Young - I am convinced he has mediocre talent.Anthony Alridge - COP back IMOP.J. Pope - Recycled Cory Boyd - hell, I don't knowSee why I feel the 2009 Denver starter isn't on their roster?

I understand why you feel that way, certainly. I just think that it's more likely that they take time to evaluate what they have as opposed to making another investment. I think that Hillis and Young have at least shown they can play at an NFL level, even if they're not studs. In the era of the 3-headed-monster, it's entirely possible that they'll spend next year hoping that health means productivity, and that they can play those two along with whomever emerges in training camp. If not, there's 2010. For 2009, though, their draft priorities should be solely on the defensive side.

 

[JohnnyU]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

You might be right, but when I see who they had, it doesn't exactly look exciting. Tatum Bell - uh......no

Peyton Hillis - decent fill-in, but I'm sorry, John Riggins he isn't.

Ryan Torain - I'm not sure, but I don't think he's the answer either. Bad injury to boot.

Selvin Young - I am convinced he has mediocre talent.

Anthony Alridge - COP back IMO

P.J. Pope - Recycled

Cory Boyd - hell, I don't know

See why I feel the 2009 Denver starter isn't on their roster?

I understand why you feel that way, certainly. I just think that it's more likely that they take time to evaluate what they have as opposed to making another investment. I think that Hillis and Young have at least shown they can play at an NFL level, even if they're not studs. In the era of the 3-headed-monster, it's entirely possible that they'll spend next year hoping that health means productivity, and that they can play those two along with whomever emerges in training camp. If not, there's 2010. For 2009, though, their draft priorities should be solely on the defensive side.

I think the draft has to dictate this. Depending on the defensive talent and what's available when they pick, should determine who they pick. Not desperately going after defense if they don't feel the player is deserving of the pick.

 

[renesauz]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

You might be right, but when I see who they had, it doesn't exactly look exciting. Tatum Bell - uh......noPeyton Hillis - decent fill-in, but I'm sorry, John Riggins he isn't.Ryan Torain - I'm not sure, but I don't think he's the answer either. Bad injury to boot.Selvin Young - I am convinced he has mediocre talent.Anthony Alridge - COP back IMOP.J. Pope - Recycled Cory Boyd - hell, I don't knowSee why I feel the 2009 Denver starter isn't on their roster?

No...I don't. They have too many other glaring needs to invest heavily at RB right now.Torrain hasn't even had a real shot yet, and Young has shown enough to be considered at least a temporary solution or a potential COP/committee RB. Hillis showed heart and could certainly fill any short-yardage needs. Is there a star RB, a fantasy #1 on their roster?....nope. Is there enough talent to sit tight until they address more pressing needs?.....yep.

I agree they have other needs, but it shouldn't be that difficult to get a back in the draft if they have multiple 2nd or 3rd rounders. I don't even know if they do, but they would have to consider it. Also, maybe they go after LJ. He's better than anyone they have, and he wants out of KC.

2nd or 3rd round draft picks are hardly sure-fire starters. a third round pick would be more likely to be behind Young when the season actually starts, not starting.Sure...they might make a play for an LJ type FA Rb. What other RB's are coming on the market that are an obvious upgrade over what they already have?I'm not even trying to say you're completely wrong....I just don't think it's anything close to a given that their 09 back is not already on the roster.

 

[JohnnyU]

Considering the injuries they had, I think it's disingenuous to suggest the starter isn't on the roster. Since the RBs have had varying degrees of success, chances are they're going to truly evaluate the talent they have before rushing out to buy a new one.

You might be right, but when I see who they had, it doesn't exactly look exciting. Tatum Bell - uh......noPeyton Hillis - decent fill-in, but I'm sorry, John Riggins he isn't.Ryan Torain - I'm not sure, but I don't think he's the answer either. Bad injury to boot.Selvin Young - I am convinced he has mediocre talent.Anthony Alridge - COP back IMOP.J. Pope - Recycled Cory Boyd - hell, I don't knowSee why I feel the 2009 Denver starter isn't on their roster?

No...I don't. They have too many other glaring needs to invest heavily at RB right now.Torrain hasn't even had a real shot yet, and Young has shown enough to be considered at least a temporary solution or a potential COP/committee RB. Hillis showed heart and could certainly fill any short-yardage needs. Is there a star RB, a fantasy #1 on their roster?....nope. Is there enough talent to sit tight until they address more pressing needs?.....yep.

I agree they have other needs, but it shouldn't be that difficult to get a back in the draft if they have multiple 2nd or 3rd rounders. I don't even know if they do, but they would have to consider it. Also, maybe they go after LJ. He's better than anyone they have, and he wants out of KC.

2nd or 3rd round draft picks are hardly sure-fire starters. a third round pick would be more likely to be behind Young when the season actually starts, not starting.Sure...they might make a play for an LJ type FA Rb. What other RB's are coming on the market that are an obvious upgrade over what they already have?I'm not even trying to say you're completely wrong....I just don't think it's anything close to a given that their 09 back is not already on the roster.

He very well may be on their roster, but it sure is ugly.

 

[renesauz]

He very well may be on their roster, but it sure is ugly.

It's ugly from a fantasy perspective for sure...but I'm not sure that it's terrible from an NFL roster perspective.

 

[Buffaloes]

I think the Broncos have 10 picks right now. So they have plenty of room to move around for the player(s) they target. I don't think their starting RB is on the roster right now either.

 

[Couch Potato]

I think we have to wait and first see who fills the GM and HC jobs before we can speculate too much on the RBs to emerge from the list of injured / castoff / practice squad / fullback / cell phone salesman names. If they promote from within and the new HC is familiar with the rostered players, he may have a strong personal favorite. If they choose their new HC from without, the players will go through an evaluation process and new talent may come in and move to the top. The GM will almost certainly be a new hire, and there is a pretty good chance he'll also want to put his stamp on the team and RB position.

With Shanny, I would say the only guys in the 2008 group that would have had real upside were Torain and Hillis. With him gone, their odds of being featured decline so their value takes a hit. They still have a shot to prove themselves I'd say, but it's a harder battle now.

 

[coolnerd]

Until the Broncos have a coach (and OC in place)in place, think we won't really be able to give quality speculation. There is not great talent in that backfield, but if Leron Mac. can become a viable fantasy option under a new coach and system, then guys like Hillis and Torian might have a chance. I knew the question was coming, but probably too early to answer.

 

[Koya]

:nipsey:

 

[BoltBacker]

He very well may be on their roster, but it sure is ugly.

It's ugly from a fantasy perspective for sure...but I'm not sure that it's terrible from an NFL roster perspective.

I have to agree with JohnnyU in this instance and it seemed that way even before the season began to me which is why I was pretty high on Cutler going into the season. Out of all those guys I thought Tatum Bell looked the best this year in limited action(really they all had limited action). The same Tatum Bell that couldn't make the roster on the 0-16 Detroit Lions. That's ugly from a whole lot of different perspectives.

 

[JohnnyU]

He very well may be on their roster, but it sure is ugly.

It's ugly from a fantasy perspective for sure...but I'm not sure that it's terrible from an NFL roster perspective.

No, IMO those choices are ugly.

 

[jonboltz]

Interested to see what Cecil thinks of this now... he had strong feelings about Hillis/Alridge combo next year.

 

[JohnnyU]

Interested to see what Cecil thinks of this now... he had strong feelings about Hillis/Alridge combo next year.

I'm having a hard time wrapping my mind around the idea of Hillis as the feature back long term, but Alridge might turn out to be a decent COP back.

 

[GregR_2]

I think we have to wait and first see who fills the GM and HC jobs before we can speculate too much on the RBs to emerge from the list of injured / castoff / practice squad / fullback / cell phone salesman names. If they promote from within and the new HC is familiar with the rostered players, he may have a strong personal favorite. If they choose their new HC from without, the players will go through an evaluation process and new talent may come in and move to the top. The GM will almost certainly be a new hire, and there is a pretty good chance he'll also want to put his stamp on the team and RB position. With Shanny, I would say the only guys in the 2008 group that would have had real upside were Torain and Hillis. With him gone, their odds of being featured decline so their value takes a hit. They still have a shot to prove themselves I'd say, but it's a harder battle now.

This is pretty much where my thoughts run too. Until we know who the new coach is and what his running philosophy is, it really is hard to say anything definitive. Denver could end up with a coach who wants to do a power running game and will completely remake the offensive line and will have different needs at RB than they had under Shanahan. Even if the new coach does want to stick with the old system, is it going to be someone who knows that system well enough to excel in it? Alex Gibbs is coaching the Texans O-line now, not the Broncos. If the new coach doesn't have the experience of working alongside Gibbs in his scheme that Shanahan had, will continuing it be successful?I just don't think there's much value to be had in speculating when so many of the factors that will drive the future of their running game are unknown at this point.

 

[JohnnyU]

I think we have to wait and first see who fills the GM and HC jobs before we can speculate too much on the RBs to emerge from the list of injured / castoff / practice squad / fullback / cell phone salesman names. If they promote from within and the new HC is familiar with the rostered players, he may have a strong personal favorite. If they choose their new HC from without, the players will go through an evaluation process and new talent may come in and move to the top. The GM will almost certainly be a new hire, and there is a pretty good chance he'll also want to put his stamp on the team and RB position. With Shanny, I would say the only guys in the 2008 group that would have had real upside were Torain and Hillis. With him gone, their odds of being featured decline so their value takes a hit. They still have a shot to prove themselves I'd say, but it's a harder battle now.

This is pretty much where my thoughts run too. Until we know who the new coach is and what his running philosophy is, it really is hard to say anything definitive. Denver could end up with a coach who wants to do a power running game and will completely remake the offensive line and will have different needs at RB than they had under Shanahan. Even if the new coach does want to stick with the old system, is it going to be someone who knows that system well enough to excel in it? Alex Gibbs is coaching the Texans O-line now, not the Broncos. If the new coach doesn't have the experience of working alongside Gibbs in his scheme that Shanahan had, will continuing it be successful?I just don't think there's much value to be had in speculating when so many of the factors that will drive the future of their running game are unknown at this point.

Watch the next coach of Denver drive fantasy owners just as crazy as Skeletor. Could it get worse? Probably not.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Wasn't it unlikely that Torian would ever be an effective RB again after his combination of injuries with or w/o Shanny?

 

[seabronc]

An important thing to keep your eye on--- Does Bobby Turner get retained by the next Denver HC as RB coach? In Broncos circles, he has been given almost as much credit as Shanahan for the string of nobody backs churning out 1,000 yard seasons. He is a top notch position coach. I think him retaining a job would be a sign that Denver does not stray to far from it's scheme, predicated on one cut and go running. If Turner remains, they could definitely still bring in a new runner, but I think the results and style will look similar to what we've seen under shanahan.

 

[Don Quixote]

Not to hijack here, but I wonder what the impact will be on Cutler.

...but you did, and the first post at that. Not a good start, lol.

Maybe we could discuss the impact on the offense as a whole?

Great idea. Maybe you could start a thread on that topic.Does anybody else think Shanny's departure kills the value of Ryan Torain? Not many people seemed to think Torain had talent going into the draft, so the only thing he had in his favor was "the Shanny Effect". With Shanny gone, I'm not convinced that Torain has anything going for him.

Then again, Hall/Young/Bell/Pittman aren't exactly guys to build a running game around either.

I thought Torain's value came from his fit with the scheme -- in terms of him being a downhill runner that was perfect for the zone blocking scheme. With that scheme gone, I think his value is down the tubes, unless he somehow lands in Seattle or Houston or wherever Shanny gets hired.

 

[Zaxxon]

I think that the burning question for most people is what does this mean for Darrell Jackson.

 

[UnknownCoach]

An important thing to keep your eye on--- Does Bobby Turner get retained by the next Denver HC as RB coach? In Broncos circles, he has been given almost as much credit as Shanahan for the string of nobody backs churning out 1,000 yard seasons. He is a top notch position coach. I think him retaining a job would be a sign that Denver does not stray to far from it's scheme, predicated on one cut and go running. If Turner remains, they could definitely still bring in a new runner, but I think the results and style will look similar to what we've seen under shanahan.

They were so good at makeing Joe running back look good that it went to Shanny's head. I doubt the new coach is going to be so confident relying on Joe at RB. They will finally add a real name.

 

[JohnnyU]

An important thing to keep your eye on--- Does Bobby Turner get retained by the next Denver HC as RB coach? In Broncos circles, he has been given almost as much credit as Shanahan for the string of nobody backs churning out 1,000 yard seasons. He is a top notch position coach. I think him retaining a job would be a sign that Denver does not stray to far from it's scheme, predicated on one cut and go running. If Turner remains, they could definitely still bring in a new runner, but I think the results and style will look similar to what we've seen under shanahan.

They were so good at makeing Joe running back look good that it went to Shanny's head. I doubt the new coach is going to be so confident relying on Joe at RB. They will finally add a real name.

I don't know about you guys, but I look forward to the possibility of knowing who the Denver RB will be week to week, let alone year to year.