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Should you always counter a salary offer? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter KCitons
- Start date
Angry Beavers
Footballguy
Counter! Why not?
Osaurus
Footballguy
Depends on what you're looking for. I aimed low at last job and they offered me much more. This time around at new job, they offered me a little more than I expected plus I asked for a couple of other perks. Don't be greedy and be able to prove what you should earn IMO. Any place that offers in the middle of the range can usually offer more (private companies)
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Johnny Rock
Footballguy
Yes
SouthJersey
Footballguy
I always counter. How much I ask for depends on the offer.
But the way I see it, lots of places will make their initial offer a little less expecting to pay more. Plus after an interview process they're not gonna pull their offer just because you asked for more. It doesn't hurt to ask -- worst case they say no, and you accept the original offer.
But the way I see it, lots of places will make their initial offer a little less expecting to pay more. Plus after an interview process they're not gonna pull their offer just because you asked for more. It doesn't hurt to ask -- worst case they say no, and you accept the original offer.
Harris
Footballguy
So here's a different scenario different than the OPs (negotiation related though).
We've had a bunch of people quit in our 45-50 person department quit since beginning of 2015. My boss quit last Tuesday, and I am now without anyone who can cover for that boss and the only one who can perform certain functions. Was offered a significant stay bonus payable March 2016. Do you accept it or negotiate for salary? (The bonus has no effect on EOY bonus or EOY raise)
We've had a bunch of people quit in our 45-50 person department quit since beginning of 2015. My boss quit last Tuesday, and I am now without anyone who can cover for that boss and the only one who can perform certain functions. Was offered a significant stay bonus payable March 2016. Do you accept it or negotiate for salary? (The bonus has no effect on EOY bonus or EOY raise)
Jack White
Footballguy
They don't want you to leave now, so they'll pay you to stay . . . almost a year from now?
Tell them you'll take the bonus now and will sign an agreement that you'll repay it if you resign before March 2016.
KCitons
Footballguy
Are you wanting your old bosses position? Are you planning on leaving? Is the bonus enough, if they offered it to you right now, you would agree to stay for a year?
Andrew74
Footballguy
I would. They aren't at the top of the range, so go for it. Grab what you can now cause most places won't give you big raises. Don't leave the $ on the table.
As for the other guy - I'd negotiate. Basically your job is changing and you have leverage. You're obviously valuable to the firm, so ask for more.
As for the other guy - I'd negotiate. Basically your job is changing and you have leverage. You're obviously valuable to the firm, so ask for more.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
I was offered a job yesterday. It is a 25% bump in pay, but also a significant jump in responsibility.
They offered me $10k below the range of the job because I am slightly under qualified but they are willing to let me grow into the position. Their stance is that it is still a nice bump for me.
I have counter offered asking for the $10k. My stance is that we both believe I can do the job or they wouldnt offer it, plus regardless of qualification I am taking on the work and responsibility and should be paid accordingly.
Waiting for their answer...
They offered me $10k below the range of the job because I am slightly under qualified but they are willing to let me grow into the position. Their stance is that it is still a nice bump for me.
I have counter offered asking for the $10k. My stance is that we both believe I can do the job or they wouldnt offer it, plus regardless of qualification I am taking on the work and responsibility and should be paid accordingly.
Waiting for their answer...
Fennis
Footballguy
I'll be the number two guy here in Scranton in six weeks. How? Name repetition, personality mirroring and never breaking off a handshake. I'm always thinking one step ahead. Like a... carpenter... that makes stairs.
KCitons
Footballguy
I started interviewing for X position. During the 2nd interview, both the HR recruiter and the person who will be my boss, said they felt I had qualifications for recent opening at a Z position. Normally the path is X then Z. I agreed and they set up interviews with VP and COO. Both felt I had some qualifications for Z, but wasn't quite ready at this time.
This is one of the reasons I think I should be at the higher end of the range for X position. I may not be in the Y position as long as someone else, and the offer for Z position in the future will be too low as well.
This is one of the reasons I think I should be at the higher end of the range for X position. I may not be in the Y position as long as someone else, and the offer for Z position in the future will be too low as well.
Baloney Sandwich
Footballguy
The answer to the OP's question is no, you shouldn't always counter a salary offer. However, the vast majority of times it can be a good thing to do so and offers little downside. In almost all instances it doesn't hurt to counter-offer but I would make sure you provide a compelling reason for doing so.
In terms of the times it can be a bad idea, I've represented companies in providing salary offers several times where a candidate has provided a specific figure that it would take for them to accept the offer. The company gives the candidate their figure and then the candidate counters with no reasoning except they want more money. Most companies/hiring managers end up being pretty pissed off in this scenario, it often will not lead them to pull the offer (although I've seen it happen) but it rarely leads to them budging.
In terms of the times it can be a bad idea, I've represented companies in providing salary offers several times where a candidate has provided a specific figure that it would take for them to accept the offer. The company gives the candidate their figure and then the candidate counters with no reasoning except they want more money. Most companies/hiring managers end up being pretty pissed off in this scenario, it often will not lead them to pull the offer (although I've seen it happen) but it rarely leads to them budging.
SouthJersey
Footballguy
Nice. This is what I would've done in your situation. Worst case they say nope. But at least you tried.
Good luck!
FUBAR
Footballguy
That's my thoughts as well. I'm not in a position to negotiate anything with the boss really, but I think it makes sense to get incentive type clauses included if you can.
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
This is the problem with mentioning current salary. Good call countering. If they meet you half way will you take it?
I usually avoid mentioning current salary but if im absolutely pressed i will say a number that represents "total compensation" which allows me to inflate that number if necessary.
KCitons
Footballguy
I know this is a joke. But, I'm staying away from negotiating extra sick days or vacation time. Since this is an internal promotion both are already defined.
Apple Jack
Footballguy
"are sick days like "sick" <make air quotes> days or do I really have to be sick?"
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Do you have leverage?
Also, remember you're not only negotiating this salary, but all future raises will be anchored off of this starting salary.
I'm not saying not to negotiate....but it all depends on your best alternative and what sort of leverage you have.
Also, remember you're not only negotiating this salary, but all future raises will be anchored off of this starting salary.
I'm not saying not to negotiate....but it all depends on your best alternative and what sort of leverage you have.
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KCitons
Footballguy
Leverage wise, I could stay in my current position. But that probably won't happen if I don't take this promotion. I turned down an offer last fall, and I have a feeling if I turn down this one, it will be time to look outside the company.
For what it's worth, salary was the reason I turned down the offer in the fall. So, they know I'm not afraid to walk away if the I don't agree on the numbers.
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
So this job is at the same company? That changes things slightly because it is often more difficult to get a big jump in salary at the same company. Still, i will be interested to see where you end up. Good luck.
KCitons
Footballguy
Why is that? I went through it last fall also. My boss told me he could hire someone off the street and pay them salary I was asking, but due to an internal promotion HR wouldn't go above the mid point. I have two exceptional reviews on record, so they know what kind of employee they are getting.
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Insoxicated
PTO is more valuable than salary in some respects / for many people. If the salary is on the lower/mid end of what you're expecting then shoot for an extra week of PTO. If they won't budge on PTO then ask for more $.
Current employer has hard line on PTO, so I countered with ~15% higher salary. They agreed.
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
Sadly, its just the way it is. What type of percentage increase are we talking about? How long have you been there?
soothsayer
Footballguy
A "lot of places" may make their initial offer low, but I'm a recruiter and have worked for countless clients and not once have I seen an initial offer go out the door low in anticipation of a counter. Every single offer I've ever worked (thousands) has been for what the company believes is fair value for the hire - they want the person to accept! Some successful counters do still happen, of course, but not because the first offer went out the door under-market.
It's wrong to believe that "it can't hurt to ask". I have, in fact, seen offers pulled because a candidate countered the original offer. It doesn't happen often, but if the candidate presents a counter with no tact, or is outrageous in their demands, companies can and will rescind the opportunity.
Finally, a wise man once said, "don't walk in the door swinging." That advice should be heeded more often in job offer negotiations.
soothsayer
Footballguy
FWIW, many companies have a "no internal counters" policy. I'm typically surprised when I hear that employees are allowed to counter salary on internal offers/promotions. And frankly, if an employee is offered a promotion but the company isn't reasonable in the salary increase offered, it's probably time to find an opportunity with another company.
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Insoxicated
Yeah... if you're countering, you should be at least reasonably sure you're within a fair range for your services, and are respectfully conveying the logic behind your counter.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
I don't think that in the least there is anything wrong with asking "Would that the best you can do?" or something near that if you actually were happy with the amount offered. If you need to be a little more aggressive then it looks like a few people have covered that already in this thread. Heck, I asked that when I was asked to take a lateral transfer. It does not hurt.
In most of my positions the benefits were defined and not negoitable but salary is so I learned a long time ago to ask for more because sometimes you will get more.
In most of my positions the benefits were defined and not negoitable but salary is so I learned a long time ago to ask for more because sometimes you will get more.
E-Z Glider
Footballguy
If its a small company and you feel you're their #1 choice based on the interview, then counter. They offered in the middle, they're willing to go higher. They're actually afraid you will walk away without countering.
Instinctive
Footballguy
Salary can be expensive to employers because of all the other benefits that are based on it. If vacation isn't slmething you're willing to ask about because there's a set policy, there are tons of other options:
Signing bonus
Laptop Allowance
Moving allowance - obviously you don't have to move but a new hire might, so perhaps they're willing to convert some of that into a different kind of bonus for you.
Parking? Not sure what city you're in but that can be huge and much cheaper for a company to pay for than an employee.
Car Allowance?
Phone Allowance?
All of the "allowance" things are ways to just pocket extra money. I know of a few employers who had to stop giving executives Cadillac health insurance plans under Obamacsre, so they offered a bunch of those monthly allowances and execs could just keep the cash and not get a new car lease or what have you.
Also, if you're thinkig it's time for a new company, probably better to take this, work it a couple months, and then begin search with your new salary and title along with a compelling story (took promotion, like the job but decided company wasn't a cultural fit anymore so I'm looking elsewhere, etc).
Signing bonus
Laptop Allowance
Moving allowance - obviously you don't have to move but a new hire might, so perhaps they're willing to convert some of that into a different kind of bonus for you.
Parking? Not sure what city you're in but that can be huge and much cheaper for a company to pay for than an employee.
Car Allowance?
Phone Allowance?
All of the "allowance" things are ways to just pocket extra money. I know of a few employers who had to stop giving executives Cadillac health insurance plans under Obamacsre, so they offered a bunch of those monthly allowances and execs could just keep the cash and not get a new car lease or what have you.
Also, if you're thinkig it's time for a new company, probably better to take this, work it a couple months, and then begin search with your new salary and title along with a compelling story (took promotion, like the job but decided company wasn't a cultural fit anymore so I'm looking elsewhere, etc).
Johnny Rock
Footballguy
Boss actually said that? What a #####. So they'll pay someone more off the street who may or may not work out rather than pay the proven commodity in front of them (you)? Telling to say the least.
KCitons
Footballguy
PinkydaPimp is correct. I discussed my reasons why I felt the offer should be increased by 14%. But was willing to split the difference and take 7%.
She checked with the VP and called back in less than an hour. Said their offer already reflected the things I mentioned. She also mentioned my overall increase from current pay. It has less to do with my qualifications and more to do with a formula.
Ultimately I accepted. Vacation is non negotiable. I will do the same quality work ive always done. But my new title will allow me to apply with a lot of other companies after a couple years.
She checked with the VP and called back in less than an hour. Said their offer already reflected the things I mentioned. She also mentioned my overall increase from current pay. It has less to do with my qualifications and more to do with a formula.
Ultimately I accepted. Vacation is non negotiable. I will do the same quality work ive always done. But my new title will allow me to apply with a lot of other companies after a couple years.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
If moving to a new company, it may also be a good idea to find out their internet usage policy and whether FFA is blocked.
Update: I have a meeting with them on Fri to discuss.
Update: I have a meeting with them on Fri to discuss.
sublimeone
Footballguy
If it's a fair offer and you try to negotiate it can rub people the wrong way. If we're talking privately owned business this is much more of a concern. If you are negotiating with an HR person at a big company and it's not an entry level position I think a negotiation is fine.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
Congrats
Foosball God
Foos
If you're going to counter, don't just counter with a number. Give the reasons why you want the higher salary, or the more vacation, etc. You need the extra 5k because you're now driving further than you did before or have to pay tolls. You have a skill or knowledge that is unique that justifies more pay. Your current benefits supplied X but the new benefits only provide Y. You are coming in a couple of months prior to a yearly review so you don't want to wait wait 14 months for until the next one, etc.
PinkydaPimp
Footballguy
17seconds
root of all aliai
johnnycakes
Footballguy
Make sure you counteroffer Pawn Stars style.
