So hungover this morning I accidently wore two different shoes (2 Viewers)

[KCitons]

Where did I say that? We can't control his driving behaviour. That's on him. Saving Rok, he has to do himself. If Rok can turn himself around, save him as you say, then that would trickle down to potentially saving others. Nothing we can do other than what's in this thread.

Exactly. You admitted that you didn't read all of his posts. But, you do seem to read and respond to the posts that are calling out Rok. It just seems one sided to me. As I said, I've tried to give him thoughtful advice, but he chooses to disregard anything that anyone says or suggests. I could ignore his posts and title changes. But, I also could ignore every post and thread in this forum. I choose to interject when I have something funny, helpful or have a strong opinion about the topic. In this case, Rok doesn't have special privileges to post without repercussion. 

You only need to look at a majority of the self help posts in the FFA. They start with the question at hand and invite all answers, including shtick. This includes Rok responding in a different post about investing money for kids retirement. I respect that Rok apologized the next day. He was obviously drunk when he made the posts. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice....

 

[RokNRole]

I'm just not capable of taking much of the advice. I try

 

[T J]

I didn't mean to single you out, I apologize. There are many people who seem to hang around this thread solely to call Rok out on damn near every post he makes. 

And they should. Try reading his posts. 

 

[jamny]

I'm just not capable of taking much of the advice. I try

When is your first AA meeting?

 

[CurlyNight]

I ask again, why do you bother reading his posts calling him out? He has you hooked line and sinker? I'm not in this thread every day. I know it's the same stuff over and over, and if you guys are fed up with 9 years of this, I have no clue why you even open his thread, or read his posts elsewhere. If someone can explain to me how calling someone out you really don't know, including myself, is helpful I'd sure like to know. If it's schtick, you are feeding it. If it's not or not completely, you aren't helping someone by 'calling them out' who truly needs help.

 

[RokNRole]

When is your first AA meeting?

Don't know I'm not ready to go, if I ever will be

 

[KCitons]

I ask again, why do you bother reading his posts calling him out? He has you hooked line and sinker? I'm not in this thread every day. I know it's the same stuff over and over, and if you guys are fed up with 9 years of this, I have no clue why you even open his thread, or read his posts elsewhere. If someone can explain to me how calling someone out you really don't know, including myself, is helpful I'd sure like to know. If it's schtick, you are feeding it. If it's not or not completely, you aren't helping someone by 'calling them out' who truly needs help.

I already explained this to you. It's an open forum. But, to make a comparison, there is now a new sub forum for politics. Why? Because people were tired of page 1 of the FFA being cluttered with political threads. Now, Rok could leave the title of his thread the same and just post in the thread when he has something to say. But, instead he changes the title to invite people to enter. 

Again, you spend a lot of time on the macro instead of the micro. Why are you so concerned with what we are doing?

 

[Evilgrin 72]

And they should. Try reading his posts. 

I read them. I don't really understand what you get out of piling on or calling B.S. on everything he says. My hope was that by confining everything to one thread that those who wanted to listen and assist could do so and the rest could avoid it. I clearly underestimated either the number of people he's ticked off in the past or the number of people here that just want to troll someone. Or both.

To be clear, I'm not referring to people like jammy or DW, who will interject humor or criticism but actually would like to see Rok get the help he needs. The posters who contribute absolutely nothing but sniper fire puzzle me.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

Don't know I'm not ready to go, if I ever will be

You don't need to be ready to go. You just have to acknowledge that you have a problem. It seems you've done that already, so the time is already nigh. I'm sure most people aren't "ready to go." All you have to do initially is show up, sit there, and listen. 

 

[CurlyNight]

I already explained this to you. It's an open forum. But, to make a comparison, there is now a new sub forum for politics. Why? Because people were tired of page 1 of the FFA being cluttered with political threads. Now, Rok could leave the title of his thread the same and just post in the thread when he has something to say. But, instead he changes the title to invite people to enter. 

Again, you spend a lot of time on the macro instead of the micro. Why are you so concerned with what we are doing?

The 20 political threads are no comparison to his 1 thread, which can easily be put on ignore if it's that intrusive. So you're saying he does have people hook line and sinker by changing the title of his thread, which basically doesn't mean much other than he's posting his thought in the title as well. And I could ask you, why are you so concerned about what he is doing? The ignore function works well on this site..

 

[CurlyNight]

I read them. I don't really understand what you get out of piling on or calling B.S. on everything he says. My hope was that by confining everything to one thread that those who wanted to listen and assist could do so and the rest could avoid it. I clearly underestimated either the number of people he's ticked off in the past or the number of people here that just want to troll someone. Or both.

To be clear, I'm not referring to people like jammy or DW, who will interject humor or criticism but actually would like to see Rok get the help he needs. The posters who contribute absolutely nothing but sniper fire puzzle me.

You put my thoughts into words much better than me. I don't get why people who have had it with him feed in his thread with just calling him out. It's some sort of making themselves look better and gain some likes/responses by being the tougher guy here? I don't get it either.

 

[Conanthecontrarian]

If everyone stops posting then maybe he'd be pushed to seek help, or maybe not. While my case is different, my sole thread on a basically dead message board while has many views it's basically me writing about how I feel. what's going on, etc in my world. Just writing stuff helps me even though once in a blue moon the usual couple people who I'm good friends with will respond. I don't require attention and know all to well how people can turn mean which is why I never continued posting in my cancer thread on this board. I'd have to defend myself from folks who think they know how it is for everyone with cancer because they go through it all just fine. At least on that other board, I'm in peace and I try to educate for whoever wants to know in addition to just rattling on about my stuff.

The ax murderer comparison is not a comparison. It's pretty obvious who's side people would be on unless they are sick like that themselves. This is Rok's thread. If he posts something offensive to someone, that person can just take themselves out of this thread.He's not hurting anyone. You have a choice, leave the thread. Reasoning obviously isn't working and won't until he reaches his point. Hell I've been called many things on this board back when and I just took a break if I was hurt or ignored those threads. My uncle is a drunk. When he gets drunk, he becomes nasty. I've been called whore, slut, he just uses the worst offensive stuff. My mom would get hurt but he's drunk. When he's sober he doesn't remember and becomes remorseful. But we know this. He's not harming us, really himself because it takes awhile before we'll chill around him again. So really, he's punishing himself and not us. We just need to know what's in store when he gets like that and either walk away or deal. You can't reason with someone who is not only a nasty drunk but has other issues the times he's sober as well.

If he's scamming the system by not reporting wages, that's on him. He either will or won't get caught. It's not something in our control so why keep thinking about it, and with a person who we only "know" from online. We need to not get that involved with the details for who knows schtick or not, but his being unwell is no schtick. I don't check this thread every day. Most days getting through my own #### is enough. I don't read his entire posts, sometimes not at all. Just seeing what others are posting, their reaction which is in their control.

sorry but that is called being an enabler. somebody needs to call him on that behavior, not excuse it because he is a drunk.

 

[CurlyNight]

sorry but that is called being an enabler. somebody needs to call him on that behavior, not excuse it because he is a drunk.

I don't think anyone here is saying there's nothing wrong with that behaviour. However how does calling him on it (how many times now??) actually help if it's not followed up with what could go wrong? And this is someone we know well, a fam member. We gave up and will occasionally say something but after I don't know how many years of this stuff, we are too tired to talk to a wall. But we care about him even when he calls us nasty #### because that is our fam. We adjust to how much we will see him. We can't force him into AA or anything. He's been pulled over for DUI before and still here he is. He is clinically depressed and basically is trying to kill himself the slower way by never seeing a doc and drinking like a fish from am to early am. Throwing him out of his condo which my grandparents left for all the kids equally is not the answer. This will lead to even more of a downward spiral and other bad behaviours. Unfortunately the way this usually ends up in the end is something really bad has to happen before they get the wake up call. Meanwhile we also need to take care of ourselves.

 

[KCitons]

The 20 political threads are no comparison to his 1 thread, which can easily be put on ignore if it's that intrusive. So you're saying he does have people hook line and sinker by changing the title of his thread, which basically doesn't mean much other than he's posting his thought in the title as well. And I could ask you, why are you so concerned about what he is doing? The ignore function works well on this site..

I explained this to you already. I have the same right to post as Rok, or you. Why do you insist on censoring me?

But, if you need more:

1 - I posted a thread a few years back on drunk drivers. I don't agree with those that do it and I think they should throw the book at people that do it. Rok is one of those people. He shows no remorse for his actions and as I mentioned, he either drove drunk or lied about driving drunk just to rub it in peoples noses. 

2 - I posted that I lost 2 people to suicide and almost my sister. Rok admitted to using the term so that people would take him seriously. He said that he wasn't thinking about hurting himself, but felt he had to project the possibility to get the attention he wanted. 

 

[RokNRole]

I explained this to you already. I have the same right to post as Rok, or you. Why do you insist on censoring me?

But, if you need more:

1 - I posted a thread a few years back on drunk drivers. I don't agree with those that do it and I think they should throw the book at people that do it. Rok is one of those people. He shows no remorse for his actions and as I mentioned, he either drove drunk or lied about driving drunk just to rub it in peoples noses. 

2 - I posted that I lost 2 people to suicide and almost my sister. Rok admitted to using the term so that people would take him seriously. He said that he wasn't thinking about hurting himself, but felt he had to project the possibility to get the attention he wanted. 

1. I said I was remorseful about that.

2. What? I said nothing of the kind. You really need to back that up with evidence otherwise I'll just assume you are screwing with me on purpose because this is a ridiculous statement.

 

[RokNRole]

I explained this to you already. I have the same right to post as Rok, or you. Why do you insist on censoring me?

Because you are either a damn liar or you aren't actually paying attention to anything which is why you have your facts wrong. Either was it would be as pointless to speak to you as Conan.

 

[T J]

I read them. I don't really understand what you get out of piling on or calling B.S. on everything he says. My hope was that by confining everything to one thread that those who wanted to listen and assist could do so and the rest could avoid it. I clearly underestimated either the number of people he's ticked off in the past or the number of people here that just want to troll someone. Or both.

To be clear, I'm not referring to people like jammy or DW, who will interject humor or criticism but actually would like to see Rok get the help he needs. The posters who contribute absolutely nothing but sniper fire puzzle me.

I read them too and have a different take. A totally different take. That said, I don't pile on. I have made a couple critical observations but I certainly don't pile on. You don't get why people pile on? I don't get why you go out of your way to have his back. I think his posts and the tone and tact he takes with others 100% warrants and any all piling on he gets - and then some. I choose not to ignore the thread and I frankly can't believe he hasn't been banned yet for some of the nasty things he's said to people. I hope it's coming soon. 

 

[KCitons]

1. I said I was remorseful about that.

2. What? I said nothing of the kind. You really need to back that up with evidence otherwise I'll just assume you are screwing with me on purpose because this is a ridiculous statement.

1 Remorseful doesn't mean you stop the behavior. 

2 I asked you the question a few weeks back. You admitted that you weren't saying that you were thinking about hurting yourself. But it was the only way you could convey your feelings so people would understand. I'm not searching through your thread to find the quotes. You may have been drunk at the time. 

 

[RokNRole]

EXACTLY! I was the same way!

I would have worries/concerns about the next day....they would torture me! I BELIEVED that alcohol would suppress me and let me relax...sleep.

That  was a false belief....even though I often passed out to sleep many a night.

EXACTLY AGAIN!

After too much time, it just added to my "alertness". It no longer helped me sleep...rather, it kept me awake...was a circle. And, I was not aware of it. Now, I am not super-smart, nor super-stupid. Yet, I missed it. IMO, I missed it because I had accustomed myself to it. This happens to  everyone in some way...imo.

Yep...I get it.

People like us...who are so far removed from the norm...things like this have effects/affects. Yet, it  is up to us to adjust.

We have no choice.

Life and the world ain't gonna change their course to accommodate loons like us.

BTW: "loons" is a term of affection in my little multiverse.

I don't take offense to being called a loon.

 

[KCitons]

Because you are either a damn liar or you aren't actually paying attention to anything which is why you have your facts wrong. Either was it would be as pointless to speak to you as Conan.

Again, you choose to attack instead of discuss. Can you at least acknowledge that I've given you advice?

 

[CurlyNight]

I explained this to you already. I have the same right to post as Rok, or you. Why do you insist on censoring me?

But, if you need more:

1 - I posted a thread a few years back on drunk drivers. I don't agree with those that do it and I think they should throw the book at people that do it. Rok is one of those people. He shows no remorse for his actions and as I mentioned, he either drove drunk or lied about driving drunk just to rub it in peoples noses. 

2 - I posted that I lost 2 people to suicide and almost my sister. Rok admitted to using the term so that people would take him seriously. He said that he wasn't thinking about hurting himself, but felt he had to project the possibility to get the attention he wanted. 

I'm not trying to censor anyone. Trying to get people to think a little out of the box. No one knows for sure about Rok. Psych issues are tougher than physical ones to figure out even by the top professionals. Just because he wrote that doesn't mean it's truth. That's why I try not to get caught up in details in posts from someone who is either disturbed or drunk or both because what they are saying can be true or false. I went though one case of this with my bro. His bff had issues for the longest time. In and out of psych wards, on meds, drinking, you name it. Bro lost touch with him for 6 weeks because he got so busy with his own stuff. Suddenly he gets a call from him and he's on cloud 9. Everything is great now. He's done counseling, is back on meds, stopped drinking. He called him to thank bro for all his help and to tell him he loves him. Great news! Only a month later when the mail was piling up and he never leaves his house did they find his dead body. Suicide the night he called my bro. So who knows about anyone. Maybe they have some good days but their bad days are awful.

Getting attention helps you not feel so alone. Obviously playing a suicide card is never ok but that also says the person is quite disturbed to even do that, and needs help.

And sorry to hear about your experiences. It's rough trying to help people who are either unintentionally or intentionally causing harm to themselves- and hope not to others.

 

[Man of Constant Sorrow]

I don't take offense to being called a loon.

I'll post some more later when the action slows down.

Peace out,

Loon

 

[RokNRole]

1 Remorseful doesn't mean you stop the behavior. 

2 I asked you the question a few weeks back. You admitted that you weren't saying that you were thinking about hurting yourself. But it was the only way you could convey your feelings so people would understand. I'm not searching through your thread to find the quotes. You may have been drunk at the time. 

Doesn't sound like something I would say even drunk. If possible post what I said.

 

[RokNRole]

Again, you choose to attack instead of discuss. Can you at least acknowledge that I've given you advice?

Yeah but you are also attributing things to me that aren't true.

 

[Conanthecontrarian]

Because you are either a damn liar or you aren't actually paying attention to anything which is why you have your facts wrong. Either was it would be as pointless to speak to you as Conan.

why do you continue to reply to my posts if it is pointless?

 

[RokNRole]

1 Remorseful doesn't mean you stop the behavior. 

I did stop but that is irrelevant. You said I wasn't remorseful.

 

[KCitons]

I did stop but that is irrelevant. You said I wasn't remorseful.

then it's safe to say you haven't driven drunk in 3 weeks?

 

[RokNRole]

why do you continue to reply to my posts if it is pointless?

Honestly, with the exception of this reply, it's usually because I'm drunk and I don't realize it's you.

BTW your avatar is ugly

 

[RokNRole]

then it's safe to say you haven't driven drunk in 3 weeks?

Idk. Has it been 3 weeks?

 

[KCitons]

Idk. Has it been 3 weeks?

Do you know?

 

[RokNRole]

Do you know?

I don't exactly remember how long ago it was that I admitted to driving drunk. Seems like less time than 3 weeks it I could very well be wrong.

Whenever it was, unless I was completely blacked out, took the car for a spin, bought and drank beer, immediately discarded just those cans so I didn't notice extras in the morning, hit nothing and parked in the exact same spot then I'm pretty sure I haven't driven drunk since that day.

 

[RokNRole]

I'll post some more later when the action slows down.

Peace out,

Loon

What action? Are you posting from an orgy?

 

[Man of Constant Sorrow]

What action? Are you posting from an orgy?

Always...

 

[KCitons]

I mentioned it once in passing because I was feeling that way when I was unemployed. I'm pretty happy now. I don't know why you focus on this and if you don't believe anything I say you don't have to participate in this thread.

You also don't have a monopoly on being effected by suicide so you don't dictate what people can and cannot talk about. The issue isn't me and what may or may not be shtick. I have restricted myself to one thread. The issue here is self righteousness on the part of several posters.

This is exactly the same as someone supposedly hating a TV show but watching it anyway. If some people just enjoy reading this thread just to get upset with me then I'm not getting what I want, they are getting what they want and should probably be thanking me.

 

[KCitons]

I don't exactly remember how long ago it was that I admitted to driving drunk. Seems like less time than 3 weeks it I could very well be wrong.

Whenever it was, unless I was completely blacked out, took the car for a spin, bought and drank beer, immediately discarded just those cans so I didn't notice extras in the morning, hit nothing and parked in the exact same spot then I'm pretty sure I haven't driven drunk since that day.

How about driving high?

 

[Conanthecontrarian]

Honestly, with the exception of this reply, it's usually because I'm drunk and I don't realize it's you.

BTW your avatar is ugly

really? my avatar is a great young American! where is your avatar? 

 

[RokNRole]

How about driving high?

Lol

 

[RokNRole]

really? my avatar is a great young American! where is your avatar? 

If that avatar is your photo you look like a #####

 

[RokNRole]

I mentioned the suicidal thoughts in the past tense. I was really feeling that way and I have been again lately. I didn't say I made it for dramatic effect. There was a period in between then and now when I was happy about meeting the single mom but we all know how that ended

 

[KCitons]

Lol

so that is a yes.

 

[RokNRole]

so that is a yes.

Evidently it's whatever you want it to be.

 

[KCitons]

Evidently it's whatever you want it to be.

no. it's what you tell me. how should I take the lol?

 

[El Floppo]

You don't need to be ready to go. You just have to acknowledge that you have a problem. It seems you've done that already, so the time is already nigh. I'm sure most people aren't "ready to go." All you have to do initially is show up, sit there, and listen. 

And unlike your coworkers, these people might have conversations you'll understand and be able to contribute to.

 

[El Floppo]

I stopped following rok and this thread. Got tired of taking the time to contribute and feel essentially  ignored.

But like ditka, I genuinely don't understand the people coming in here to only laugh at or #### on rok. Petty, small, mean behavior that I hope is beneath those doing it. There's nothing stopping all of you from just not opening this thread. But instead, you take the time and energy to be petty, small and mean. 

 

[KCitons]

For those of you that are telling others to stop posting, I hope you police the hundreds of other threads in this forum and do the same for all posters.

I will oblige by putting Rok on ignore (first time I've used it in 7 years on this forum) and will no longer post here. 

 

[T J]

I stopped following rok and this thread. Got tired of taking the time to contribute and feel essentially  ignored.

But like ditka, I genuinely don't understand the people coming in here to only laugh at or #### on rok. Petty, small, mean behavior that I hope is beneath those doing it. There's nothing stopping all of you from just not opening this thread. But instead, you take the time and energy to be petty, small and mean. 

BS.

 

[El Floppo]

BS.

Which part

 

[CurlyNight]

BS.

Another one that should put this thread/Rok on ignore. Apparently after 9 years there's still something to prove.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

I read them too and have a different take. A totally different take. That said, I don't pile on. I have made a couple critical observations but I certainly don't pile on. You don't get why people pile on? I don't get why you go out of your way to have his back. I think his posts and the tone and tact he takes with others 100% warrants and any all piling on he gets - and then some. I choose not to ignore the thread and I frankly can't believe he hasn't been banned yet for some of the nasty things he's said to people. I hope it's coming soon. 

There was a kid in my neighborhood growing up that had Tourette Syndrome. He was very socially awkward and had no idea how to communicate with people. He irritated the crap out of just about everyone. He obviously was suffering from multiple disorders and would garner attention any way he could, even though 99% of it was negative.

He aggravated people to the point that other kids in the neighborhood would throw rocks at him as he walked home from school. He got beaten up a few times. I never could figure out why no one seemed to empathize or cut him a break, but I figured maybe I could help. I started walking home from school with him every day. I knew I couldn't shield him from the world but at least the rocks stopped flying. He used to annoy me too, make no mistake, but at least he wasn't being hit by rocks any more.

I don't know what ever happened to that kid, he moved a year later and I never saw or heard from him again, and to be honest I wasn't entirely sad about that, he was really grating. But I hope he's alive and happy now. I don't know if he even remembers me, but it's not really important. It may not have been a boon to my popularity to align myself with this kid, but if one less ####ing rock bounced off of his skull as a result, it was worth it to me, even if his behavior is what prompted it. Even though I was widely derided and often verbally abused for taking up for this kid, if I could go back in time, I'd do it again in a minute.

You asked why I go out of my way to have his back, I guess this is why. For better or worse, it's who I've always been.  I'm comfortable with that. I guess I still just don't understand why some people can't just put the rock down and go inside.

 

[T J]

There was a kid in my neighborhood growing up that had Tourette Syndrome. He was very socially awkward and had no idea how to communicate with people. He irritated the crap out of just about everyone. He obviously was suffering from multiple disorders and would garner attention any way he could, even though 99% of it was negative.

He aggravated people to the point that other kids in the neighborhood would throw rocks at him as he walked home from school. He got beaten up a few times. I never could figure out why no one seemed to empathize or cut him a break, but I figured maybe I could help. I started walking home from school with him every day. I knew I couldn't shield him from the world but at least the rocks stopped flying. He used to annoy me too, make no mistake, but at least he wasn't being hit by rocks any more.

I don't know what ever happened to that kid, he moved a year later and I never saw or heard from him again, and to be honest I wasn't entirely sad about that, he was really grating. But I hope he's alive and happy now. I don't know if he even remembers me, but it's not really important. It may not have been a boon to my popularity to align myself with this kid, but if one less ####ing rock bounced off of his skull as a result, it was worth it to me, even if his behavior is what prompted it. Even though I was widely derided and often verbally abused for taking up for this kid, if I could go back in time, I'd do it again in a minute.

You asked why I go out of my way to have his back, I guess this is why. For better or worse, it's who I've always been.  I'm comfortable with that. I guess I still just don't understand why some people can't just put the rock down and go inside.

Because of the way he treats people. He is due any and all criticism he gets.