** Son of Survivor II Master Thread ** (1 Viewer)

[Will Grant]

[JeffProbst]

In 2003, Footballguys.com rounded up 12 guys from these Message Board Forums and held the Survivor II Commentary Draft. The draft was intense. In fact, all of the participants rated it as one of the toughest drafts that they have ever participated in. In the end, victory was decided by only a couple of points spread out over the final 2 weeks of the season.

This year they've returned to face each other again. But this time the stakes are higher, and a Son of Survivor Trophy will be awarded to the winner.

Same Survivor Format.

Same Scoring Rules.

Same 12 Participants.

One (Son of) Survivor...

[/JeffProbst]

Ok.. cheesy intro aside, this is one of those content pieces that Footballguys hoped to release on the main site. However, the regular season starts tomorrow, and It's not going to make it.

So we'll present it here in the MB forums, where the whole draft started last year.

Let's start with the specifics:

20 rounds of drafting. Survivor Format (Highest Scoring Players automatically start)

No Waiver Wire, No Trading.

Lowest Score is voted off the Island

Highest Score wins Immunity and Cannot be Voted off the Following Week.

Note: Cannot win Immunity 2 weeks in a row

Draft Date: Friday Aug 13th, 2004.

Note: Rosters and Commentary Reflect Original Draft Date

1 QB 2 RB 3 WR 1 TE 1 PK 1 DT

6 pts for all TDS

1 pt per .04 yards passing

1 pt per .01 yards rushing/receiving

-2 pts per interception

1 pt per WR reception

2 pts per TE reception

1 pt per XP

3 Pts per FG < 40 yards

5 pts per FG >= 40 yards

2 pts per defensive turnover

2 pts per defensive safety

1 pt per defensive sack

6 pts for Defensive TD.

10 pts for 0 Points Allowed

5 pts for 1-6 Points Allowed

3 pts for 7-13 Points Allowed

0 pts for 14 or More Points Allowed

10 pts for less than 200 Yards Allowed.

5 pts for 200-249 Yards Allowed.

3 pts for 250-299 Yards Allowed.

0 pts for 300 or more Yards Allowed.

Here are the Team Rosters

As part of the content with this draft, each participant was asked some pre and post draft questions. Here (in one form or another) are those Questions and Answers:

Pre-Draft Questions and Commentary:

Pre-Draft Thread

Post-Draft Questions Commentary:

BassNBrew

Aaron28

PurpleHaze

smlevin

Gregr

RIL

CobaltCruisin'

Bueno

Gatorman

SandBagger

Note: Some Post Draft Commentary was not formatted for the main site. For BostonFred and LHUCKS, their commentary will be listed below.

 

[Will Grant]

Here is the Post-Draft ReCap from LHUCKS

AFTER THE DRAFT

1. Were you able to keep to your stated strategy? If you did deviate, at

what part of the draft did this happen and what caused it? Did this

deviation help or hurt your teams success?

No, my plan was to take Curtis Martin 2.12 as I did not expect him to go in the second round, since he was not there I started my draft going RB-RB-RB, to help mitigate the increased risk at RB with the upside/risk picks of Thomas Jones and Kevin Jones.

2. Are you happy with your team? Do you feel like it can compete?

Yes. At the risk of sounding overconfident, I feel I have the best team. I am deep at WR and QB, and I think my 3 RB rotation can compete with anybody’s.

3. List your three best value picks and state why.

Gannon @ 11.01 because I expect the Raiders offense to be consistent. As the #26 QB off the board I would take the under on his final QB ranking.

4. List your best high risk / high reward players that could make or break

this team. Why are you high on these players?

Thomas Jones – I believe he has the talent and opportunity to put up huge numbers.

Kevin Jones – Again, I believe he has the talent and opportunity to put up huge numbers.

Anquan Boldin – At 12.01 taking on a player that may not return for the ’04 season is a huge risk, but I like his chances to put up big numbers when/if he comes back because he is the best offensive weapon AZ has.

5. On a scale of 1-10 (10 being best), what would you rate your team.

10, I think I have the best team and don’t regret any of my picks.

6. Besides your team, name 3 others that you feel have a great shot to win.

1) GregR – One of only a few teams that has 3 solid RBs. Solid at all positions. QBs should be consistent and injury free. WRs are deep and have upside. Excellent team with minimal risk.

2) BassNBrew – Three starting RBs and good depth at WR. Downside at QB is only weakness.

3) PurpleHaze – Three starting RBs and good QB depth. WR depth is a concern.

7. Which 3 teams appear the weakest to you? Why?

1) Res Ipsa Loquitur – Risky RBs and only two starters. I don’t like WR depth either.

2) Cobalt Cruisin – Risky QB situation, shallow WR depth, Horrible Tes.

3) Bueno – Risky QB situation, WR depth is shaky

8. Do you feel post-draft that you reached on any players? If so which

ones?

Marty Booker, Kevin Jones, Steve McNair

9. Looking post-draft, what changes would you make to your selections.

I would have taken a more solid RB like Duce Staley over Kevin Jones or may have gone WR at 3.01 over Kevin Jones. Other than that I like my strategy.

10. Which weeks look to be your toughest to advance?

The week 9/10 period could be very tough for me…a lot of byes that late into the season can often lead to serious depth issues.

=====================================================================

1. Who do you think has the three best rosters (you can include your

team) and why.

1) GregR – One of only a few teams that has 3 solid RBs. Solid at all positions. QBs should be consistent and injury free. WRs are deep and have upside. Excellent team with minimal risk.

2) BassNBrew – Three starting RBs and good depth at WR. Downside at QB is only weakness.

3) LHUCKS – Great QB depth, Three starting RBs with great upside and secure hold on starting jobs. Good WR depth with solid upside.

2. Who do you think has the three worst rosters and why?

a. Res Ipsa Loquitur – Risky RBs and only two starters. I don’t like WR depth either.

b. Cobalt Cruisin – Risky QB situation, shallow WR depth, Horrible Tes.

c. Bueno – Risky QB situation, WR depth is shaky

3. What was your best value pick of the draft?

Boldin @12.12 should come up huge for me in the second half of the season.

4. What was you worst pick of the draft?

Kevin Jones at 2.01 – There were safer RBs and stellar WRs still on the board. Rookie RBs present too much risk that early, regardless of the potential.

 

[Will Grant]

Here is the Post-Draft ReCap from BostonFred

1. Who do you think has the three best rosters (you

can include your team) and why.

I feel my team is the best in the league. If you don't

feel that way at the end of a draft, you've had a bad

draft. I define a team as being good if they are

strong (and also unlikely to be hurt by a risky player

who busts) at every position, and at the top of at

least one position. I feel my WR position is the best

in the league bar none, and my QBs, RBs, TEs, K and D

are all good enough to score consistently for me.

That said, here are my top three other than myself:

Aaron has high quality QB, RBs and WRs, although he

skimped at TE, K and D. The one concern is that he

went light at RB (using just an 8th, 11th and 19th on

backup RBs) with Michael Bennett at RB2. If Bennett

busts, his team is dead.

Greg's has a top QB, RB, and TE. He's weak at WR1, but

made up for it by spending 7 picks, including 5 of his

top 11 picks, at the position. He has depth at RB

(although I don't personally like Garner or Martin at

those draft spots), two good kickers, and a pair of

below average defenses. I don't like him carrying only

two QBs, though, when Plummer and McNabb both seem

risky to me.

LHUCKS is decent at QB, and has average at best TEs and

Ks. His Ds will score well this year. The strength of

his team, though, is at RB and WR. He only carries

three running backs, but they're all very good. He's

got a huge injury risk - using the thumb rule that 1 in

5 RBs miss a significant amount of time, he's a 50/50

shot to lose at least one of his studs - but his third

back is as good as most people's second. His eight

receivers should also give him a ton of scoring.

2. Who do you think has the three worst rosters and why?

It's hard to answer that, because I think most everyone

went in there with a strategy and either executed it or

adapted as the draft went on. I don't usually rank

teams based on my own personal rankings, but in this

case I have to.

Gator's team had so much potential. I like Manning,

but Carr and Boller are weak backups. I like Domanick

Davis, but even if he meets my high expectations, I'm

not sure Griffin, Suggs and Emmitt Smith will start the

whole season. I love Moss and Bruce, but Rogers, Tim

Brown, Stokley and Hilliard are all crapshoots. I'd

like to see someone a little stronger there. The rest

of his positions are average at best.

I hate to put smlevin's team on here, because I'm a

believer in Tatum Bell, but this team is too thin at

key positions. Priest is great, but his RB2 of Bell,

Dayne, Stephen Jackson, Wheatley, and Zereoue seems

dodgy to me. Culpepper's great, but if Kurt Warner

isn't starting week 4, he has no QB2. 5 WRs is thin,

which would be fine if he were strong enough at other

positions to make up for it.

RIL's backs are a crapshoot. What do Kevan Barlow,

Chris Brown, Travis Minor and Kevin Faulk have in

common? Not one of them has ever started a year at RB

in the NFL. He spent three middle picks on QBs, and

ended up with Brooks, Brady and McCown - three of the

most overpriced QBs this year, IMO. Harrison is a

great WR1, but his next five receivers, led by

Harrison, Porter and Lelie, are very unproven. His TE

and K positions are nothing special. I love his three

Ds.

That said, any of those three could easily come back

and win it if the players I think are risks pan out. I

just think they have a greater amount of risk than I

would want on my team.

3. What was your best value pick of the draft?

The best value pick on my team was McGahee in the 10th.

I think he's going to get solid scoring all year. The

best value pick by anyone in this draft was by RIL,

with Chris Brown at 3.10, who was taken after his

normal ADP in an extremely RB heavy draft. It's not

that he went later than he should have, but that he

slid at all in a draft where 20 RBs went in the first

two rounds, and he was the 25th taken overall. I'd

have taken him at 3.9 if he didn't share a bye week

with Taylor. Gator's pick of Manning at 4.02 was also

excellent. I also considered him at 3.09 but passed

because the league scoring devalues passing QBs.

4. What was you worst pick of the draft?

My worst pick was Rod Smith at 5.9. Not because I

don't think Rod Smith was worth the pick - I think he's

going to have a very good year - but because not a

single WR went between 5.9 and 6.4, but four QBs went.

If I'd taken Brett Favre at 5.9, I could almost

certainly still have had Smith at 6.4.

The worst picks of the draft were Travis Minor at 4.03

and Emmitt Smith at 6.02. I think both will be

replaced throughout the season. I prefer guys whose

value increases, not decreases, throughout the season.

Team Specific Questions:

1. You committed to receivers early (taking 3 by round 5). Do you

feel that's the key to winning this?

No. I feel the key to winning this is getting quality

at every position, and being the best at at least one

position. Between my draft spot and the early round

run, I couldn't be the best at RB. I could have taken

Manning or Vick, but the league scoring devalues

passing QBs and I'm a little afraid of Vick. I could

have taken Gonzalez, Shockey or Heap, but with the same

1 pt per reception, I thought WRs were more valuable

than TEs.

Aside from the 1 pt per reception, the fact that we

start three receivers makes the position as a whole

more important. Moulds and Horn are both top 10

receivers on my list, and should be at least top 20 on

most anyone's list. Both are capable of 90+

receptions. Rod Smith's two biggest seasons were in

situations much like this - no McCaffrey or Sharpe,

unproven RB. He's struggled with ankle injuries the

last two years, but still put up very respectable

numbers.

2. You went after three quality backup RBs (McGahee, Pittman and

Perry). Tell us what you expect from these players.

McGahee will get a handful of carries every game, which

makes him a decent backup RB. I think he could take

the job outright, especially if

I'm not convinced that Pittman is the backup in Tampa.

He's not starting the first three games of the season,

but he's still practicing with the first team in camp.

I think he'll be the lead - or at least play a key role

- in a RBBC. It wouldn't surprise me one bit to see

him outproduce Garner this season.

As of right now, it looks like Perry will get some of

the third down duties, and may be asked to spell Rudi

Johnson periodically if he does well. I don't think

he'll produce often for my team unless Johnson gets

injured or is an absolute bust.

3. You have both Cincy QBs (Palmer and Kitna) and RBs (Johnson and

Perry). What do you see in their offense that makes owning so much of

thier team a great situation for this team?

I didn't deliberately pair them, but I didn't shy away

from the pairing, either. Cincinatti has a great young

offensive line and a head coach that has really turned

this team around. Chad Johnson is emerging as a very

talented receiver, and Warrick and Washington are both

quality receivers on the other side of the field. That

said, I only expect the Cincinatti offense to do be

average or a little better this year.

If he gets 80% of Kitna's numbers last year, Palmer

will have a better year than most of the QB2s out

there. The Palmer/Kitna handcuff gives me decent QB2

production and a sure starter.

Rudi Johnson has an excellent run blocking line, and a

nose for the end zone. With a young QB, he may be

called in to run for the score even more often than

last year. Chris Perry is one of a handful of RB

handcuffs I'd be willing to take because of his first

round status.

I'm not relying on Palmer/Kitna, or Johnson/Perry, as

my #1 at their position, but they both should provide

solid numbers with excellent injury protection.

 

[Will Grant]

Ok so There it is.Pre-Draft Questions and Commentary will be added once I get the info. I'll just edit the main post.As people are booted off, We'll post an exit interview here in the Shark Pool as well. I'm sure the other guys are dying to jump in here and start the mud flinging.. I'll just get out of the way and let the games begin.Enjoy!

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

f'in Michael Bennett! I may have pulled a sandbagger with that one.

 

[BassNBrew]

BassNBrew Player YTD Pts Bye Drafted Garcia, Jeff CLE QB - 8 6.07 Grossman, Rex CHI QB - 5 11.06 Manning, Eli NYG QB - 6 20.07 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Alexander, Shaun SEA RB - 4 1.06 Faulk, Marshall STL RB - 8 2.07 Green, William CLE RB - 8 9.06 Westbrook, Brian PHI RB - 5 3.06 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bennett, Drew TEN WR - 9 13.06 Branch, Deion NEP WR - 3 10.07 Burress, Plaxico PIT WR - 7 7.06 Chambers, Chris MIA WR - 10 5.06 Johnson, Kevin BAL WR - 6 14.07 Morgan, Quincy CLE WR - 8 12.07 Taylor, Travis BAL WR (P) - 6 15.06 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Gonzalez, Tony KCC TE - 5 4.07 Johnson, Teyo OAK TE - 10 18.07 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Feely, Jay ATL PK - 9 16.07 Gramatica, Martin TBB PK - 8 19.06 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Patriots, New England NEP Def - 3 8.07 Seahawks, Seattle SEA Def - 4 17.06 20 Total Players Interesting...I got one nod to finish in the top 3 and 2-3 votes to finish in the bottom 3. No mentioned of tactical errors, just on my selections.My RBs took the biggest knock. Well as of week 1 I'll have 4 of the 32 starting backs. I this league which gives no pts for RB recpt, I didn't see the value in overloading at RB. Between Faulk/Westbrook/Alexander I'll have good base production with excellent upside. I expect Green to get enough carries and TDs in Clevland to be sufficient bye week fillier and spot injury replacement.Yeah, my QBs aren't exciting. A small sacrifice to aquire Gonzo in the 4th who was an early 2nd round value per VBD. When Gonzo is putting up 20+ point weeks, the advantage I have on the field will more than cover any deficit at QB. I'm higher on Garcia the most so in my eyes I'm spotting very little at QB. I'm pretty confident that this year will demonstrate that TO didn't drive Garcia's numbers (which were close to top five when he played last year). Let's just say that I believe Northcutt/Davis/Morgan/Winslow/Suggs will give Garcia plenty of capable receiving options and he'll be needing them with the Clevland matadors on defense. Once Warner is killed behind that Giant line, Manning will make a nice insurance policy. The QB position won't win this league for anyone.I got killed at WR in this league last year and wasn't going to let it happen again. I've got 7 WRs capable of big games. Very few big names, but a lot of talent that was undervalued IMO.Defense is huge in this format. NE's talent has only gotten better since last year. I expect muliple weeks when the NE/Gonzo combo put me 30+ pts up on more then half the field. That equates to 40 yd rushing and a TD at RB + 100 yd receiving at WR + 100 yd passing and a TD at QB.

 

[BassNBrew]

f'in Michael Bennett! I may have pulled a sandbagger with that one.

Good thing you were one of the favorites. You may have room to spare a slow start.

 

[Gatorman]

My Team

Boller, Kyle BAL QB - 6 11.11 Carr, David HOU QB - 7 10.02 Manning, Peyton IND QB - 6 4.02

Other than the week 6 bye gaff, I like this group. Manning was a steal.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Davenport, Najeh GBP RB - 9 18.02 Davis, Domanick HOU RB - 7 2.02 Griffin, Quentin DEN RB - 10 3.11 Smith, Emmitt ARI RB - 6 6.02 Suggs, Lee CLE RB (D) - 8 5.11

Suggs freaky neck injury notwithstanding, I think I have 3 1/2 solid starters (sorry Emmitt) and Najeh.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Brown, Tim TBB WR - 8 19.11 Bruce, Isaac STL WR - 8 7.11 Hilliard, Ike NYG WR - 6 15.11 Moss, Randy MIN WR - 4 1.11 Rogers, Charles DET WR - 4 8.02 Stokley, Brandon IND WR - 6 17.11

Bye week alignment is very strange here, and maybe tim brown is a waste, but I love this group of WRs to score week in and out.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Kleinsasser, Jim MIN TE - 4 13.11 McMichael, Randy MIA TE - 10 9.11

Best TE tandem in the league--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mare, Olindo MIA PK - 10 20.02 Vinatieri, Adam NEP PK - 3 14.02

They're kickers--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dolphins, Miami MIA Def - 10 12.02 Packers, Green Bay GBP Def - 9 16.02

I still think it will be very hard to pass on the Miami Defense this year. If Bowens is out any length of time, the running game may suffer.I always look at survivor teams like a recepie. How do all the ingredients mix together. Other than switching Boller for Grossman, I can't see how this team doesn't make it to week 6. My RB guesses seem to all be on target.Lhucks, Why didn't you pick up an insurance RB like an allstott or Kevin faulk as a late round TD guy. It seems like a better pick than a calico or terrell (saying that a marginal RB #4 may be better for long term success than WR#8)

 

[LHUCKS]

Lhucks, Why didn't you pick up an insurance RB like an allstott or Kevin faulk as a late round TD guy.  It seems like a better pick than a calico or terrell (saying that a marginal RB #4 may be better for long term success than WR#8)

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)In general, I believe backup RBs have been overvalued in both Survivor I and Survivor II. In one of the post-draft commentaries(I think Gator's) he said he would have felt a lot more comfortable if I had a Kevin Faulk/Alstott type of RB at #4...my thoughts are that the odds of this type of RB actually contributing to my season at all are slim to none. Not only does that RB have to have an above average week, but he has to do it in a week where 2 of my other big 3 RBs falter...not to mention it has to be in a week where I actually need the points to survive. The odds are too slim for all of those to happen IMHO. If one of my RBs goes down don't forget I have Tomlinson who can single-handedly carry my RBs some weeks. Additionally if one of my RBs goes down I probably would not have a chance at winning anyhow...in essence I'm playing for all the marbles and gambling that I don't lose two of my three RBs. A more likely scenario IMHO is that Calico and Terrel(my last two WRs) have a handful of very solid weeks and actually make a solid contribution...especially near the end when I will need some very explosive WR scoring. I think Terrel and Calico are the types of guys that can put my WR scoring and my overall team scoring over the top when we get down to final teams. Because WR scoring has a greater standard deviation week to week, I believe my WR scoring has a great chance to blow everybody out of the water and I will gain some very valuable points at the position. Another point is that all of the WRs I drafted will always play, some of the RBs people drafted either got cut, got injured or simply wont get to play some weeks. All of my WRs have a chance week in and week out to make a big play(outside of Boldin of course)If we had the old rule where the top 5 get invited back I may have played it more conservatively and drafted Pinner or A-Train, but I think I drafted this year to win it, as opposed to placing top 5. I offended/embarrassed/humiliated myself when I allowed the likes of Haze and GregR to place ahead of me...I WILL NOT allow that to happen again

 

[Gatorman]

In general, I believe backup RBs have been overvalued in both Survivor I and Survivor II. In one of the post-draft commentaries(I think Gator's) he said he would have felt a lot more comfortable if I had a Kevin Faulk/Alstott type of RB at #4...my thoughts are that the odds of this type of RB actually contributing to my season at all are slim to none. Not only does that RB have to have an above average week, but he has to do it in a week where 2 of my other big 3 RBs falter...not to mention it has to be in a week where I actually need the points to survive. The odds are too slim for all of those to happen IMHO. If one of my RBs goes down don't forget I have Tomlinson who can single-handedly carry my RBs some weeks. Additionally if one of my RBs goes down I probably would not have a chance at winning anyhow...in essence I'm playing for all the marbles and gambling that I don't lose two of my three RBs.

If one of your backs goes down, what do you do when the others have a bye? That's my point here. A guy like allstott may not place in the weeks when all three of your backs are churning along, but what if one is out and the other is on a bye. Allstotts 40 yards and a TD may be what saves you there.I just feel that it is not a bad idea to go with a goaline specialty emrgency back with rosters this big. A guy like emmitt 2 years ago saved me with one of his 60 yard and a TD games. Just my humble opinion. I don't like to lose these things because of an injury.

 

[Gatorman]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

For the same reason. Your 3 RBs. They are strong but thin. It is why some like your team to go far (barring injury) while others call for a quick exit (predicting injuries and bye week issues with no wild card help)

 

[bostonfred2]

Now that some time has gone by and some news has come out, a couple teams have moved up and down.

Cobalt Cruisin lost Mike Anderson and Correll Buckhalter for the season, which is tough for a team that spent seven picks on RBs. He is now left with Jamal Lewis/Chester Taylor and Duce Staley, backed up by Antowain Smith and Justin Fargas. If Duce fails to produce, or if Musa is the guy in Baltimore, he's in trouble. There is some good news, though - I just saved a lot on car insurance by switching to GEICO. And also Fargas' value in Oakland seems higher than it did at the draft.

Aaron's got Deuce, Bennett, Foster, Anthony Thomas and Alstott. Now Bennett's out and Thomas is questionable for week 1. The first few weeks may be trouble for one of the consensus top teams, but you still have to like his chances with guys like Hasselbeck, Owens, Coles and Price.

RIL's got just four RBs - Kevan Barlow, Chris Brown, Travis Minor and Kevin Faulk. If Minor loses the starting spot, he's going to be thin at RB and banking on two good but risky guys to carry him through the season.

Bueno's team still looks good to me, but Vick's value has dipped with news he's struggling with the WCO. With only Harrington as a backup, Vick at 4.06 is truly boom or bust.

LHUCKS' starting WRs of Andre Johnson, Javon Walker and Marty Booker looked better when Booker is in Chicago. Amazingly, Booker got traded to one of the few teams that could really hurt his value. Now LHUCKS is going to be relying on depth at WR alone, which, with eight WRs on his roster would seem easy. Problem is, two are already out - Calico and Boldin.

Bass's team got a boost when Buckhalter went down, making Westbrook in the mid third look nice in this RB heavy draft. That alleviates one of the biggest concerns on his team - what happens if when Faulk goes down. Alexander, Faulk, Westbrook and William Green now looks very nice.

It's hard to say Gator's pick of Emmitt in the fifth round got worse, but when they added Hambrick, Emmitt's value went from not-in-the-fifth too really-not-in-the-fifth. D Davis, Griffin, Suggs, Emmitt and Davenport is pretty solid though.

Greg's team has been relativel unscathed, but Garner's stock has been dropping steadily all offseason, which makes the pick at 3.03 look like a bit of a reach. Still, in this RB crazy draft, you can't blame him.

Purplehaze got a short term boost with the Bennett injury, with both Onterrio Smith and Moe Williams on the roster. If Bennett continues to get dinged up, he may be tough to beat.

Sandbagger's picks of Kevin Dyson in the 12th round and Nedney in the 16th both got beat up, and with Shockey's foot still up in the air, 4.08 may have been a bit early for him.

Smlevin's RB2 situation is still up in the air, with Wheatley the only starting back in his RB2BC. Zereoue would look nicer if he spelled his name F-A-R-G-A-S.

And, of course, Bostonfred's team looks awesome. Seriously.

 

[LHUCKS]

LHUCKS' starting WRs of Andre Johnson, Javon Walker and Marty Booker looked better when Booker is in Chicago. Amazingly, Booker got traded to one of the few teams that could really hurt his value. Now LHUCKS is going to be relying on depth at WR alone, which, with eight WRs on his roster would seem easy. Problem is, two are already out - Calico and Boldin.

Agreed, but I think I have enough to get by until Calico/Boldin get back. I'm high on Terrel and I don't downgrade Booker as much as FBG.

 

[Will Grant]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

For the same reason. Your 3 RBs. They are strong but thin. It is why some like your team to go far (barring injury) while others call for a quick exit (predicting injuries and bye week issues with no wild card help)

A tough week from Tomlinson could kill you.I went down last year because Tomlinson posted something like 4 or 5 points that week.He took off after that, but a slow start from even ONE of your guys can put you in a big hole.Granted, I didn't do much better with Barlow and Brown being my only 2 real RBS for the year... Faulk should fill in some of the weak spots, but Minor was a total gamble and it looks like I lost that one. (see commentary for more on this).It should be interesting....

 

[Will Grant]

LHUCKS' starting WRs of Andre Johnson, Javon Walker and Marty Booker looked better when Booker is in Chicago.  Amazingly, Booker got traded to one of the few teams that could really hurt his value.  Now LHUCKS is going to be relying on depth at WR alone, which, with eight WRs on his roster would seem easy.  Problem is, two are already out - Calico and Boldin. 

Agreed, but I think I have enough to get by until Calico/Boldin get back. I'm high on Terrel and I don't downgrade Booker as much as FBG.

But trading Booker opened up Terrell.With Booker in Chicago, Terrell was competing for scraps with Gage and Wade... now he's a solid starter. If he lives up to HALF of the billing that he's getting here in Chicago, that pick will work out for you.Not sure if Aaron is getting the same take that I am... but MAN there are a lot of people who suddenly think this guy is one of the keys to the offense.

 

[bagger.]

I definitely screwed up with my drafting of 2 QBs in the same bye week...not so much that I took a 3rd QB as I would have anyway, but it made me take a 3rd one earlier than I would have liked.However, QB is not my issue. Only having one kicker and having a thin WR corps will boot me out of this earlier than I would have liked, unless McCardell can come back, and Dyson can hook on with some team.Week 8 is my big trouble spot only having 1 QB and no K. I think I can last until then though.

 

[LHUCKS]

A tough week from Tomlinson could kill you.

Agreed, but you could say that for every team can't you...if not at RB, then at QB or WR.Nobody is stacked at every position.

 

[Will Grant]

A tough week from Tomlinson could kill you.

Agreed, but you could say that for every team can't you...if not at RB, then at QB or WR.Nobody is stacked at every position.

Yeah I guess that's pretty accurate.I'm in the same boat with Barlow and Brown.. one bad week and I'm hurting.. I guess it's just the price of the #1 overall pick.. You get to choose a guy you think will be #1.. then you have to hope like heck that he performs to that #1 status every week.

 

[LHUCKS]

A tough week from Tomlinson could kill you.

Agreed, but you could say that for every team can't you...if not at RB, then at QB or WR.Nobody is stacked at every position.

Yeah I guess that's pretty accurate.I'm in the same boat with Barlow and Brown.. one bad week and I'm hurting.. I guess it's just the price of the #1 overall pick.. You get to choose a guy you think will be #1.. then you have to hope like heck that he performs to that #1 status every week.

I could have taken a less risky pick than Jones at 3.01. I was considering Staley. In hindsight it may have been the better pick.

 

[BassNBrew]

A tough week from Tomlinson could kill you.

Agreed, but you could say that for every team can't you...if not at RB, then at QB or WR.Nobody is stacked at every position.

Yeah I guess that's pretty accurate.I'm in the same boat with Barlow and Brown.. one bad week and I'm hurting.. I guess it's just the price of the #1 overall pick.. You get to choose a guy you think will be #1.. then you have to hope like heck that he performs to that #1 status every week.

I could have taken a less risky pick than Jones at 3.01. I was considering Staley. In hindsight it may have been the better pick.

Thanks for leaving Westbrook.

 

[LHUCKS]

But trading Booker opened up Terrell.With Booker in Chicago, Terrell was competing for scraps with Gage and Wade... now he's a solid starter. If he lives up to HALF of the billing that he's getting here in Chicago, that pick will work out for you.

Yes, but I even said in the chatroom that I drafted Terrel as a handcuff to Booker.At the time, Terrel had been getting rave reviews at training camp from coaches and observers and at the same time Booker had been missing time because of injury.It worked out pretty nicely for my squad, but it wasn't a shot in the dark by any means.Wouldn't it be ironic if Mr. Irrelevant actually ended up winning me the league

 

[LHUCKS]

Thanks for leaving Westbrook.

You can have him...I don't like his chances of being around in the second half of the season.You will not find Westbrook on any of the squads listed in my sig.

 

[BassNBrew]

I definitely screwed up with my drafting of 2 QBs in the same bye week...not so much that I took a 3rd QB as I would have anyway, but it made me take a 3rd one earlier than I would have liked.However, QB is not my issue. Only having one kicker and having a thin WR corps will boot me out of this earlier than I would have liked, unless McCardell can come back, and Dyson can hook on with some team.Week 8 is my big trouble spot only having 1 QB and no K. I think I can last until then though.

Just curious bagger...why on earth would you draft Dyson???Strike 1 - Coming off a year long injury.Strike 2 - Was on arguably the worst passing offense.Foul Tip - Injury prone.Strike 3 - WR's 1st year on a new team theory.This is one of the types of guys that I just cross off my cheatsheet before a draft.

 

[LHUCKS]

I definitely screwed up with my drafting of 2 QBs in the same bye week...not so much that I took a 3rd QB as I would have anyway, but it made me take a 3rd one earlier than I would have liked.However, QB is not my issue. Only having one kicker and having a thin WR corps will boot me out of this earlier than I would have liked, unless McCardell can come back, and Dyson can hook on with some team.Week 8 is my big trouble spot only having 1 QB and no K. I think I can last until then though.

Just curious bagger...why on earth would you draft Dyson???Strike 1 - Coming off a year long injury.Strike 2 - Was on arguably the worst passing offense.Foul Tip - Injury prone.Strike 3 - WR's 1st year on a new team theory.This is one of the types of guys that I just cross off my cheatsheet before a draft.

I liked Dyson until camp started and then word started leaking he wasn't running with the first team...I quickly jumped off that wagon.

 

[bagger.]

I definitely screwed up with my drafting of 2 QBs in the same bye week...not so much that I took a 3rd QB as I would have anyway, but it made me take a 3rd one earlier than I would have liked.However, QB is not my issue. Only having one kicker and having a thin WR corps will boot me out of this earlier than I would have liked, unless McCardell can come back, and Dyson can hook on with some team.Week 8 is my big trouble spot only having 1 QB and no K. I think I can last until then though.

Just curious bagger...why on earth would you draft Dyson???Strike 1 - Coming off a year long injury.Strike 2 - Was on arguably the worst passing offense.Foul Tip - Injury prone.Strike 3 - WR's 1st year on a new team theory.This is one of the types of guys that I just cross off my cheatsheet before a draft.

no WRs on SD and at the time i still thought he had the talent to be the #1 WR. getting a #1 WR in the 12th round was worth the gamble in my mind.he still may bump around and find a team, but since this draft i had significantly downgraded him.this was the last draft i was still big on dyson late.

 

[Marc Levin]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

 

[Marc Levin]

I'm high on Terrel and I don't downgrade Booker as much as FBG.

Funny enough, but I actually barely downgrade Booker - with coverages rolled onto Chambers, Booker will finally see single coverage again - like he did in the years he was nearing 100 catches.And if Booker starts seeing that underneath coverage, McMichael and Chambers will be running wide open - I actually like the Booker trade more than the Boston trade for Miami's purposes.

 

[LHUCKS]

Funny enough, but I actually barely downgrade Booker - with coverages rolled onto Chambers, Booker will finally see single coverage again - like he did in the years he was nearing 100 catches.And if Booker starts seeing that underneath coverage, McMichael and Chambers will be running wide open - I actually like the Booker trade more than the Boston trade for Miami's purposes.

I have booker at #39.Miami doesn't toss the rock enough to justify anything higher IMHO. Maybe Wanny will pull his head out of his #### and recognize the talent he has at WR/TE?Doesn't Dodds have Booker at 70+?

 

[LHUCKS]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

Well I certainly hope your implication isn't accurate.I would rather have people objectively grade the teams, than grade the teams based on how often I post on the boards(or whatever is deemed as "raising a stink")

 

[Marc Levin]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

Well I certainly hope your implication isn't accurate.I would rather have people objectively grade the teams, than grade the teams based on how often I post on the boards(or whatever is deemed as "raising a stink")

Imagine all the people, It isn't hard to do . . grading LHUCKS on content . . . Instead of his posts full of doo-doo.

 

[LHUCKS]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

Well I certainly hope your implication isn't accurate.I would rather have people objectively grade the teams, than grade the teams based on how often I post on the boards(or whatever is deemed as "raising a stink")

Imagine all the people, It isn't hard to do . . grading LHUCKS on content . . . Instead of his posts full of doo-doo.

:rotflmao: Unlike Marc Lennon, I'll let my teams' performances do the talking...again.

 

[bostonfred2]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

Well I certainly hope your implication isn't accurate.I would rather have people objectively grade the teams, than grade the teams based on how often I post on the boards(or whatever is deemed as "raising a stink")

Imagine all the people, It isn't hard to do . . grading LHUCKS on content . . . Instead of his posts full of doo-doo.

:rotflmao: Unlike Marc Lennon, I'll let my teams' performances do the talking...again.

YOU DIDN'T WIN. Seriously, you DO know that, right?

 

[LHUCKS]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

Well I certainly hope your implication isn't accurate.I would rather have people objectively grade the teams, than grade the teams based on how often I post on the boards(or whatever is deemed as "raising a stink")

Imagine all the people, It isn't hard to do . . grading LHUCKS on content . . . Instead of his posts full of doo-doo.

:rotflmao: Unlike Marc Lennon, I'll let my teams' performances do the talking...again.

YOU DIDN'T WIN. Seriously, you DO know that, right?

:honda: Fred...we should have a sig-bet on who lasts longer.Backing down? :chicken:

 

[BassNBrew]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

Well I certainly hope your implication isn't accurate.I would rather have people objectively grade the teams, than grade the teams based on how often I post on the boards(or whatever is deemed as "raising a stink")

Imagine all the people, It isn't hard to do . . grading LHUCKS on content . . . Instead of his posts full of doo-doo.

:rotflmao: Unlike Marc Lennon, I'll let my teams' performances do the talking...again.

YOU DIDN'T WIN. Seriously, you DO know that, right?

:honda: Fred...we should have a sig-bet on who lasts longer.Backing down? :chicken:

Funny, your wives both say I last longer then either of you.

 

[bostonfred2]

It is interesing to note that 4 of you listed my team as one of the 3 strongest, and 3 of you listed as one of the 3 weakest...making it the most mentioned team in the commentaries.(I think)

He who raises the biggest stink will have his smell talked about most.-a Buddhist Monk, upon exiting an outhouse following the Dalai Lama.

Well I certainly hope your implication isn't accurate.I would rather have people objectively grade the teams, than grade the teams based on how often I post on the boards(or whatever is deemed as "raising a stink")

Imagine all the people, It isn't hard to do . . grading LHUCKS on content . . . Instead of his posts full of doo-doo.

:rotflmao: Unlike Marc Lennon, I'll let my teams' performances do the talking...again.

YOU DIDN'T WIN. Seriously, you DO know that, right?

:honda: Fred...we should have a sig-bet on who lasts longer.Backing down? :chicken:

sig bets are for people who are afraid to bet money.

 

[Marc Levin]

:rotflmao: :rotflmao:Once again, if I survive week 5 (Priest's bye week) all three of your wives' will be calling ME Big Poppa.

 

[BassNBrew]

16 points for Branch...good way to start off the year. Heck with Harrison in the early 2nd when you can get the same production in the 10th round.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

:rotflmao: :rotflmao:Once again, if I survive week 5 (Priest's bye week) all three of your wives' will be calling ME Big Poppa.

I already predicted a week 4 exit for you, Marc. I'd be pretty concerned if I were you.BTW, I count 7 of my fellow owners who ranked me as a top-3 team, and none who ranked me in the bottom-3. Wow.I hope you guys are right. The injury to Bennett definitely weakens my squad for the time being, but I really think RBs are slightly overrated in this scoring system. I'm just hoping for strong years from my QBs and WRs and Deuce. That should be enough to stick around for awhile.

 

[BassNBrew]

21 for Branch.Unfortunately the defense has been sucking.

 

[BassNBrew]

Alright...28 pts posted for the good guys with 8 players to go and room to improve on the 2 posting numbers. A 12.5 average at the remaining spots advances me to week 2.

 

[Will Grant]

Comparing this year to last:17.4 from Harrison beats Tomlinson, Vick and Eddie George (my first 3 picks last year) in week 1. Tom Brady.Gator has to be feeling good with 3 guys in the top 10 from last night.Sure there's a lot of football to play yet.. but 17.7 from a 17th round draft pick is pretty good retun on investment.

 

[LHUCKS]

Although Clark only had one reception, I was pretty happy with what I saw from him last night...he could really round out my squad. I have him in Survivor II and Omega, so I'm expecting big things. My TE strategy in most of my leagues was based on getting Gates or Clark later.

 

[bueno]

Bueno's team still looks good to me, but Vick's value has dipped with news he's struggling with the WCO. With only Harrington as a backup, Vick at 4.06 is truly boom or bust.

Remember Drew Brees got me to week 6 last year. I'm a little weaker at WR, but if Vick struggles through the firsdy week or 2 until he clicks, I'll be fine.

 

[Will Grant]

Pre-Draft Thread is Posted

 

[Marc Levin]

:rotflmao:  :rotflmao:Once again, if I survive week 5 (Priest's bye week) all three of your wives' will be calling ME Big Poppa.

I already predicted a week 4 exit for you, Marc. I'd be pretty concerned if I were you.

Why week 4?I agree with week 5 b/c Preist is sitting, but any game in which Priest is playing, given my strength everywhere else, I have a good chance not to be the WORST team that week with more teams playing/one-week scores.Week 5 is the problem while Priest sits and I can only start guys like Jackson, Bell, Wheatley, and Dayne.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

:rotflmao:  :rotflmao:Once again, if I survive week 5 (Priest's bye week) all three of your wives' will be calling ME Big Poppa.

I already predicted a week 4 exit for you, Marc. I'd be pretty concerned if I were you.

Why week 4?I agree with week 5 b/c Preist is sitting, but any game in which Priest is playing, given my strength everywhere else, I have a good chance not to be the WORST team that week with more teams playing/one-week scores.Week 5 is the problem while Priest sits and I can only start guys like Jackson, Bell, Wheatley, and Dayne.

read my commentary. your week 4 demise is spelled out pretty clearly there.

 

[Marc Levin]

I can easily see this team being eliminated in week 4, but if he makes it by that week he should be able to last awhile. In week 4, he will have only Kurt Warner at QB, and Eli may have taken over the job by that point. Priest Holmes will be playing @ Baltimore so we can likely expect a low scoring week from him. The rookies Tatum Bell and Stephen Jackson may not be contributing much by then either. At WR, Darrell Jackson is on a bye, so he'll be relying heavily on Ward, Jimmy Smith, and 2 rookies. With 9 teams still alive, he may not need a huge total to survive, but I imagine he'll be praying to win immunity the week before. I didn't like his QB strategy with only Warner as his QB2 each week, and felt that Eli Manning and/or a Miami QB would have been a much better pick than Amos Zereoue in the 18th.

Whatever - I'm much more worried about week 5 w/o Priest at all than I am about week 4 with Ward at WR1, Smith at WR2 and Reggie Williams (as a starter for JAX) at WR3 when Priest is actually at least PLAYING and potentially getting in a TD or two. I am certainly much more worried about either Jackson or Bell actually playing for their respective teams when I am forced into using only Wheatley, Zereoue and Ron Dayne (gulp) at RB in week 5.The comment re: QB is true, however, a guess at whether Fiedler or Feely will be starting in week 4 (we had NO CLUE who would be starting when we drafted) was no better than guessing the Giants' QB. I was confident then (and I still am) that the Giants will have Warner starting in week 4 unless he actually gets injured - I don't think the Giants want to throw the major investment they made in Eli into a game behind that line unless they have to. Until the OL learns how to play at an NFL level, the team will let Warner take the hits - I DEFINTELY meant to add another QB behind C-Pepp who was a clear starter - Delhomme, Bledsoe, anyone, but things happened differently in the draft due to my need to add RBs - one of the picks I made for Bell or Jackson was meant for a second QB - I acknowledge that as my reaches. One of those picks should have been WR4or QB2.BTW - I know with my luck I would have picked wrong at QB if I took a Dolphin QB - if I took Fiedler, Feely will be playing in week 4, if I picked Feely, it'd be Fiedler in week 4 - I am more confident that if Warner is walking, he'll be starting for the Giants. there is also nothing to indicate "the" Dolhin QB (whoever it is) will be any better this year than "the" Giant QB (whoever that is).Finally, it is clear that if I pass Priest's bye week, I have a better survival chance than simply surviving C-Pepp's bye week by using Warner. Commenting that I look good if I get past week 4 ignores my real survival problem, which is week 5. Unless Bell or Jackson is either starting those weeks or makes a major contribution, I'm screwed.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Let's compare:

Week 4

No Culpepper/Frerotte - just Warner - potential 0 at QB if Warner gets injured or benched.

Priest Holmes @ Ravens - potentially his worst matchup of the entire season

No DJax - losing your #2 WR leaves you with probably only 3 starting WRs, 2 of whom play on the same team.

Week 5

No Priest Holmes - leaving you with 5 other RBs, including at least 1 starter in Wheatley who has a favorable matchup against the Colts

Culpepper plays against Houston

D.Jax plays against Arizona

J.Smith plays against San Diego

A.Crumpler plays at home against Detroit

I think you are overlooking some serious issues in week 4, and overestimating the loss of Holmes. QBs and WRs are more valuable in this scoring format than most standard leagues, and if Warner isn't starting @ Lambeau that week, I think you're in trouble. What do you really expect from Holmes against the Ravens anyway? Enough to offset the loss of Culpepper and DJax?

 

[Marc Levin]

I had a long, great, reply that went into the internet void being created by the board today - suffice to say we differ greatly on three major issues:1) IMO, Warner will be playing week 4 unless injured, and a zero from QB in week 4 is not as scary as Priest's 0 in week 5 given my RB2/3/4/5 situation. Yes, my QB2 sitch stinks, but your recommended solution of "the" Dolphin QB versus "the" Giants QB (or Manning instead of Warner) was a pretty piss-poor solution - the solution was to draft a QB2 or WR4 where I took Bell or Jackson since I could have had a Bledsoe, Delhomme, or Carr. The Warner selection was not a problem unless it BECOMES a problem - you are making as rash an assumptions that Warner is injured or benched by week 4 as I am that Warner will still be playing.2) Having Reggie W and Jimmy S going at the same time when I am missing DJax is a good thing, not a bad thing, for me b/c one or the other will surely put up WR2 numbers and th eother could easily have a 2/40 day, which is fine enough for WR3.3) Priest V. Ravens can EASILY still create 40 yards of total O and 2 TDs, which is perfectly fine by me - those are approx. the numbers that Faulk was able to muster against Bal. last year.In short, I worry much more about not having Priest in week 5 and having no RB2 on my team than I am in replacing DJax with JSmith, JSmith with Reggie W, and C-Pepp with Warner for one week.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

Yes, my QB2 sitch stinks, but your recommended solution of "the" Dolphin QB versus "the" Giants QB (or Manning instead of Warner) was a pretty piss-poor solution

I never really offered it as a solution. Just think the Zereoue pick was a wasted pick, and you could have probably helped your QB2 situation with that selection. I don't think a Miami QB was going to make or break your squad...just think relying on Kurt Warner is problematic. Also, when I typed that commentary...all reports were indicating that Manning was progressing rapidly. He struggled a bit later in the preseason, so Warner looks more likely to last past week 3 now provided they can keep him in one piece behind that sieve of an offensive line.2 TDs for Holmes against the Ravens isn't exactly a given either. They gave up an NFL-best 6 total rushing TDs all last year. Last year in Baltimore, Holmes put up 103 yards against them with 0 TDs for a whopping total of 10 points. I'd think the dropdown from Culpepper to Warner and from DJax to Reggie Williams would likely be greater than that.No worries.As I said earlier, I think RBs will likely prove to be overrated in this league, as they were last year. Losing a QB1 and WR1 and having a terrible matchup for your RB1 looks worse to me than simply losing a RB1, especially when you look at the other great matchups you'll have in week 5.