Couch Potato
Footballguy
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Sproles Franchised (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Couch Potato
- Start date
Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
Bad news for those wishing he would land somewhere else. I doubt you will see a trade. I guess Sproles owners now have to hope LT2 is cut.
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Blackjacks
Footballguy
Not good news for LT owners
Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
No, not good news for Sproles only owners. LT2 will still be the man as long as he's healthy. This changes nothing with regards to that. Sproles owners now have to hope LT2 gets cut or traded.
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FUBAR
Footballguy
RBBC with an aging LT.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
YES!!!!!
and I called it!
and I called it!
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Lucky Lefty
Footballguy
wow... bad move
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
not for the Football team it's not.great move
Well, you are going to pay Sproles over 6.621 million in 2009.
LT is due 8.791 million in 2009, and the Chargers are asking him to restructure. How much of a pay cut do you ask him to take?
Does LT make the same or just a tad bit more than Sproles in 2009?
I say no, LT will be moving on...the bonus on the new contract restructure will have to be nice.
LT is due 8.791 million in 2009, and the Chargers are asking him to restructure. How much of a pay cut do you ask him to take?
Does LT make the same or just a tad bit more than Sproles in 2009?
I say no, LT will be moving on...the bonus on the new contract restructure will have to be nice.
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
Convince me. Even with all that Sproles does, he is not worth what a top 5 back is worth. That seems like a lot of money to tie up on a backup RB who can also return.
tombonneau
Footballguy
I hope Sproles sends a cut to the Colts defense.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
really? just look at his 2nd half of the season and playoffs.dude was the chargers MVPLT is going to restructure. Committee is fine by me.That also means a LB/DL is going to be the #1 pick
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Rivers down?
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
I meant to type late season MVP
CalBear
Footballguy
11 carries for 15 yards against Pittsburgh, and a garbage time long TD. If that's your MVP, you might as well mail it in now.
Nick Vermeil
Footballguy
The top 5 money is assuming he doesn't get worked into a longer term deal, and even if he doesn't, it is just for 1 year. I like it more if they restructure LT and divy up the carries.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
LOL yeah you are right he sucks. cut him.guess you missed the Indy and Denver gamePitts D is great give them credit.
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Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
A guy has two good games over an entire regular season and two playoff games, and I am supposed to be exicted that he is getting paid as a top 5 back? I must be really missing something here. Discounting the Pittsburgh game doesn't seem any more reasonable than only looking at two games, one of them against an absolutely terrible defense.To address the MVP of the late-season comment, I'm not even completely buying that he was the MVP of those two games.
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bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Norv didnt use him until he had to. Now I think every see's what he means to the team. he's a COP back with home run hitting ability and a great special teamer. well worth 6 million to me.
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
Agree to disagree. Unless they use this franchise to get him to sign a long-term deal at a reasonable price for his services, I think it's a huge waste of money. I'm certainly willing to admit that A.J. probably knows a heck of a lot more about personnel decisions than I do though.
CalBear
Footballguy
Let's look at what Sproles really did in the stretch run. This is total cherry-picking in his favor, since other than game 2, he didn't do anything for the rest of the season.Week 14 vs. Oakland. San Diego blows out the hapless Raiders. Sproles has 9 carries for 30 yards. He scores on a pass to make it 17-0, and then scores a garbage-time TD to make it 34-7.
Week 15 vs. Kansas. No carries. 4 receptions for 11 yards.
Week 16 vs. Tampa Bay. 2 carries for 3 yards (no carries in the first three quarters), 3 receptions for 46 yards and a TD to make it 34-24.
Week 17 vs. Denver. An actual big game; 14 rushes for 115 yards, 2 TDs--but in the second half, after Tomlinson scored 2 TDs. Sproles' first carry came with San Diego already up 17-6; Tomlinson scored on that drive to make it 24-6. Sproles' first TD made it 31-13, Tomlinson scored two plays later after an INT to make it 38-13, and then Sproles got more garbage time stats.
So let's be clear on this; Sproles was not the Chargers' MVP in any of the late-season games. All his scores came with the Chargers already ahead; nearly all his stats came in garbage time.
He was the MVP of the wild card game; he did score two TDs, both of which gave San Diego the lead.
So what do we have here? We have a change of pace back who did well in one playoff game with the starter injured, and other than that, mostly mopped up stats in garbage time. When pressed against a good defense, he had a terrible game.
Extremely risky to put a big investment into that. I don't think he's a smaller Marshall Faulk--he's more like a speedier Kevin Faulk.
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Da Guru
Fair & Balanced
People read too much into being an everydown player.
Sproles is a game breaker who may be worth a win or two to the Chargers by keeping him.
If Sproles puts him team in position to score a couple of times from a return, or breaks a screen pass for a TD that is well worth it.
Doing this proves the Chargers are not sold on LT.
Sproles is a game breaker who may be worth a win or two to the Chargers by keeping him.
If Sproles puts him team in position to score a couple of times from a return, or breaks a screen pass for a TD that is well worth it.
Doing this proves the Chargers are not sold on LT.
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bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
IMO he wasnt given a chance to do much based on his limited touches during the early season.Poor coaching on Norv's part (big shock)CalBear said:
You think AJ is franchising him for giggles??? Sproles is very valuable
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bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
he wasnt given a chance very early in the season. teams late season MVP!
and vjax had 0 catches vs. Indy, remember
Phil you have an arguement for
CalBear
Footballguy
Saying this over and over won't make it true. He had good performances in two games, one of which was basically over before he did anything. He had bad performances in two other games, and his bad performance contributed to the bad loss to the Steelers.
comfortably numb
Footballguy
Just want to add that I think tomfoolery is a VERY under rated term
He'll get the money for 1 year until they cut him in 2010.The 2009 money has to be good, because everyone is on a 1 year deal. They restructure to get the contract... salary cap friendly.LT has a solid agent, so he is getting at least the chance to make his 8.791 million(incentives, etc) in 2009, or he could go somewhere else and get an Edge type deal.
trader jake
Footballguy
Let Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles? 
sos32
Footballguy
They have a saying...Fool me one, fool me twice, they fooled won't get fooled again!Let Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
When Brees walked, the Chargers had Rivers.When Turner walked, the Chargers had Sproles.If Sproles walked, the Chargers would have a big hole to fill.Let Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
PatsWillWin
Footballguy
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Sproles is no Turner, I still think that is crazy logic. If for some reason L.T got seriously injured, sproles could not be a workhorse for 10+ games. They should have franchised Turner IMO, said it before he left, said it ever since. I think they should have paid Turner that off-season and let L.T steadily decline until he had no more gas, if they had Turner right now they probably could have afforded to cut or move Tomlinson and had no quams doing it either. I mean they obviously knew what they had in Turner when they were demanding a 1st and 3rd round draft pick for him and not budging on the price either.When Brees walked, the Chargers had Rivers.When Turner walked, the Chargers had Sproles.If Sproles walked, the Chargers would have a big hole to fill.Let Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
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trader jake
Footballguy
Our definitions of "big hole" must be different.When Brees walked, the Chargers had Rivers.When Turner walked, the Chargers had Sproles.If Sproles walked, the Chargers would have a big hole to fill.Let Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
Scooby1974
Footballguy
As a Sproles owner in a league with return yardage this move is fine by me, he was the #14th ranked RB in our league (nice #2). He certainly has game breaking ability and with increased carries come increased chances to bust more long ones. Gauging Sproles worth of the franchise tag based on a poor performance against one of (arguably) the best Defensive units of all time seems just a bit unfair. Certainly Sproles isn't going to be a 3rd down pound it between the tackles 20-25 times a game back, that isn't his game. I could see SD getting him the ball more in open space, running him outside the tackles and forcing DB's to make more open field tackles, tossing him more screen passes, etc. They will get him the ball more and take advantage of his quicks which will in turn open things up for the passing game and will also serve to extend LT by finding him more rest and getting more focus off him. Play both Sproles and LT in the backfield at the same time and D's will have nightmares trying to stop SD. Sproles helps to brings great balance to the SD attack.
Those bringing up the Turner move. When Turner was "let go" LT was at the top of his game was he not? How could SD afford to pay both LT and Turner long term big money? They had LT signed for 3 more years and would have to pay both men significant money. Why would SD make plans to trade/let go of the best RB in the league for an unproven Turner? Hindsight is always pretty close to 20/20.
Those bringing up the Turner move. When Turner was "let go" LT was at the top of his game was he not? How could SD afford to pay both LT and Turner long term big money? They had LT signed for 3 more years and would have to pay both men significant money. Why would SD make plans to trade/let go of the best RB in the league for an unproven Turner? Hindsight is always pretty close to 20/20.
Tackling Dummies
Footballguy
The point is that SD screwed the pooch on Turner. First, they had the opportunity to trade him after the 06 season. Secondly, they did not tag him (like they just did for a COP back) and get something in return for him. Thirdly, please review Turner's regular season touches vs Sproles and remember they were both in the same situation. It's really a no brainer which back to keep and/or get value in return if that's the end result. Fourthly, Turner's 5' 10" 244# frame is obviously built as a back that can carry the load, not a 5'6" 185#. Fifth, there's a reason that Sproles was behind Turner in 07. Lastly, they're paying top position dollars for a guy that is a back-up and might get 100-something touches, clearly, not the most effective use of revenue.
I'm a Sproles owner and think this is good news. His opportunities should increase. The other reason is that I don't think it kills his trade value, like signing with another team might have done.As far as Turner goes, I think most people thought it was foolish to let him go. I know I did.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
they francshied both of them for one season as well. They received 3rd round comp picks for both (well not yet for Turner, but they will)I expect sproles to sign a long term deal or hit FA next yearLet Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
nice of you to totally discount his special team contributions.In that Pitt game they were down 21 -10 and sproels took the kickoff to the pitt 25, rivers threw a pick on the next play, that was SD's only offensive play of the quarter. Score some points there and that game might be different. a poor rushing performance vs the best D in the league on the road is no crimeI guess garbage time dont count for you but he did score a td late. Dude makes plays and is valuable.
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This is indeed going to be bad news for Sproles owners. I'm not one who buys into the LDT is done idea, it could be true, but it's being assumed waaaaay too early. He had a poor season, it happens. That doesn't necessarily mean that's he's old and done at all.. If a young player had a year like that, most would assume he'll be back next year. But when an older player does, people assume he's done automatically, which can be a silly assumption to make. LDT isn't all that old, and I saw enough flashes of him throughout the season to believe that he'll be the go-to guy again in 2009, with Sproles being maybe one of those 350, 400 rushing yard change-up guys.
mozzy84
Footballguy
Do you really consider getting some comp pick a real form of compensation? Thats sugar coating it to the finest. Turner is a running back, they probably wouldn't have gotten much more, brees is a totally different animal.I would agree they will sign sproles long term before the season starts, if they don't this is a dumb move imo.they francshied both of them for one season as well. They received 3rd round comp picks for both (well not yet for Turner, but they will)I expect sproles to sign a long term deal or hit FA next yearLet Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
Jason Wood
Zoo York
When considering tags, it's really not realistic to compare what they're getting for one year and say, "Player X isn't worth Top 5 money" because you're comparing apples and oranges. If every player at every position had to get a new deal each year, then yes, you could easily argue that Sproles or anyone else with a tag in 2009 doesn't deserve to be a top 5 played player. But the vast majority of players are already under contract, and negotiated their terms at a different time with a different salary cap against a different baseline.
The 2009 salary cap is going to be $123mm, implying an average of $2.3mm allocated per active player on the 53-man roster. The NFL has always been a stars and planets league, with low-priced rookies and vets getting the vet minimums offsetting a group of core players getting escalating salaries. To that end, Sproles is guaranteed $6.621mm this season.
$6.621mm = 5.38% of the team's salary cap this year
Last year, Sproles accounted for:
*** 73.5% of the Chargers punt and kick return yardage
*** 11.7% of the Chargers yards from scrimmage
*** 13.7% of the Chargers TDs
And we can safely assume he'll play a substantially larger role in the offense this year.
How is he not worth the money?
The 2009 salary cap is going to be $123mm, implying an average of $2.3mm allocated per active player on the 53-man roster. The NFL has always been a stars and planets league, with low-priced rookies and vets getting the vet minimums offsetting a group of core players getting escalating salaries. To that end, Sproles is guaranteed $6.621mm this season.
$6.621mm = 5.38% of the team's salary cap this year
Last year, Sproles accounted for:
*** 73.5% of the Chargers punt and kick return yardage
*** 11.7% of the Chargers yards from scrimmage
*** 13.7% of the Chargers TDs
And we can safely assume he'll play a substantially larger role in the offense this year.
How is he not worth the money?
FUBAR
Footballguy
why wouldn't you? They get the pick because they lost a player, it's not exactly a trade but it's surely compensation.Do you really consider getting some comp pick a real form of compensation? Thats sugar coating it to the finest. Turner is a running back, they probably wouldn't have gotten much more, brees is a totally different animal.I would agree they will sign sproles long term before the season starts, if they don't this is a dumb move imo.they francshied both of them for one season as well. They received 3rd round comp picks for both (well not yet for Turner, but they will)Let Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
I expect sproles to sign a long term deal or hit FA next year
mmmWaffles
Footballguy
Michael Turner
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
3rd round picks are worth somethingI agree on Brees.But remember when they let brees hit FA, he had a severe shoulder injury and man teams passed on signing him - Miami comes to mind.Do you really consider getting some comp pick a real form of compensation? Thats sugar coating it to the finest. Turner is a running back, they probably wouldn't have gotten much more, brees is a totally different animal.I would agree they will sign sproles long term before the season starts, if they don't this is a dumb move imo.they francshied both of them for one season as well. They received 3rd round comp picks for both (well not yet for Turner, but they will)I expect sproles to sign a long term deal or hit FA next yearLet Drew Brees and Michael Turner leave with no compensation but franchise Sproles?
Tigerbot Hesh
Footballguy
LT might be inclined to find a place where he can still be 'the man' rather than agree to a 50-50 split. One of the things he showed me this past season was that he thought himself at 50 percent was better than anything else the Chargers could field in his place. I could see his ego getting in the way of a timeshare.
Dave Stauff
Footballguy
Here's the part I don't get. You pay him for 1 year at 6+ million (avg of 5 highest RBs in the whole damn league) for services as a part-time RB plus special teamer? And then you think when you sit down across the table from him to negotiate a long-term deal that he's not thinking "Man, I'm a pretty valuable commodity and ought to be paid like an everydown, starting RB over several years with a very large signing bonus." How do they think they're going to find middle ground with this guy? I'm thinking one and done in SD (assuming LT restructures) or they're going to have to franchise him again next year.
Gr00vus
Footballguy
It's a good move for this year. Going into training camp without a viable running back on the roster is not a recipe for success. The team has said it will release LaDainian if he does not restructure. They're talking about offering him 3 or 4 million a year plus incentives - there's a very real chance he does not accept. At that point, you have to have a back up plan. They could roll the dice and see what they come up with in the draft, they could sign someone off the scrap heap, or they could make sure Sproles sticks around this year. What are the chances they get someone as good as Tomlinson or Sproles if they let them both walk? Think about it - how is option three not the best option? If this team gets healthy (finally) they should be a contender. That doesn't happen if you have a void at running back. Sproles is a guy who knows the system and has had success in it. I'm sure they're not going to have him sit around and get 6 touches a game if he's still on the squad, he'll earn his money. This gives them essentially two drafts to find a replacement at starting tailback. It's easily worth it.
On a side note, the Michael Turner revisionist history is hilarious. I knew he'd be a good running back when given a starting gig, but I suggest those of you who are saying it's obvious the Chargers should have kept him go back and read the various and sundry Michael Turner threads leading up to this season. It paints a very different picture of what people actually thought at the time.
On a side note, the Michael Turner revisionist history is hilarious. I knew he'd be a good running back when given a starting gig, but I suggest those of you who are saying it's obvious the Chargers should have kept him go back and read the various and sundry Michael Turner threads leading up to this season. It paints a very different picture of what people actually thought at the time.
PatsWillWin
Footballguy
February.
