Terrell Owens (1 Viewer)

[hollaatyaboy]

TO has been playing for 2 WCO teams where he was able to succeed. He had 2 mobile QBs and both teams passed a lot.

Now hes going to a team with a defense first philosophy and has 2 RBs that will be handling the load. Here are the leading recievers on Parcell's team from his entire coaching career;

1983 Earnest Gray 78 1139 14.6 5

1984 Bobby Johnson 48 795 16.6 7

1985 Lionel Manuel 49 859 17.5 5

1986 Bobby Johnson 31 534 17.2 5

1987 Lionel Manuel 30 545 18.2 6

1988 Lionel Manuel 65 1029 15.8 4

1989 Odessa Turner 38 467 12.3 4

1990 Stephen Baker 26 541 20.8 4

1993 Vincent Brisby 45 626 13.9 2

1994 Michael Timpson 74 941 12.7 3

1995 Vincent Brisby 66 974 14.8 3

1996 Terry Glenn 90 1132 12.6 6

1997 Keyshawn Johnson 70 963 13.8 5

1998 Keyshawn Johnson 83 1131 13.6 10

1999 Keyshawn Johnson 89 1170 13.1 8

2003 Terry Glenn 52 754 14.5 5

2004 Keyshawn Johnson 70 981 14.0 6

2005 Terry Glenn 62 1136 18.3 7

:X

Now TO is 33 years old and past his prime. How is he going to do anything like he did in Philly with such less opportunity and likely diminished skills? Hes a consensus top 5? I just don't see the opp.

 

[Banger]

when has Parcells ever had a WR with TO's talent?

 

[BlueOnion]

when has Parcells ever had a WR with TO's talent?

Probably the closest comparison would be Keyshawn in his early days of New York. Say what you want about Parcells coaching philosphy and Keyshawn's ability, Keyshawn's numbers were pretty good.I think Parcells is a dynamic enough coach at this point in his established career that he will get the most out of his players.

FYI - Mooch is widely considered a run-first coach.

 

[jurb26]

I'm not seeing the love for TO this year either. This will be a completly different kind of offense for him. One that runs first and runs often. His QB is a statue now and the Dal D should be rather good. Plus, I'm very worried about Bledsoe (despite his great year last year). The guy is simply getting old and it still holds true that if he is blitzed and pressured in the pocket he will be severly ineffective. To say that TO is not in his prime is simply false though.

 

[GregR_2]

Now hes going to a team with a defense first philosophy and has 2 RBs that will be handling the load.

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.I'm saying this to make 2 points... first that Dallas isn't necessarily a team that is reluctant to pass... they are right at the NFL average. Second is that even if a team doesn't pass a lot compared to other NFL teams, if a particular player gets targetted enough he can still outperform receivers on more pass-happy teams.Whether you think TO will draw a high enough percentage of the targets with Witten and Glenn as the main guys to compete with him is of course your own call. But it definitely isn't beyond reason to believe TO can perform at high FF levels in this situation.

 

[jurb26]

Now hes going to a team with a defense first philosophy and has 2 RBs that will be handling the load.

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

I'm saying this to make 2 points... first that Dallas isn't necessarily a team that is reluctant to pass... they are right at the NFL average. Second is that even if a team doesn't pass a lot compared to other NFL teams, if a particular player gets targetted enough he can still outperform receivers on more pass-happy teams.

Whether you think TO will draw a high enough percentage of the targets with Witten and Glenn as the main guys to compete with him is of course your own call. But it definitely isn't beyond reason to believe TO can perform at high FF levels in this situation.

Middle of the pack is a far drop from 3rd (620) and 9th (550) in pass attempts, where Philly has been the last 2 years with TO. To compare anyone's situation to that of Car is very naive to. If you can supplant Jake Tunnel Vision Delhomme to the new team, then I think you have a point.

 

[GregR_2]

Now hes going to a team with a defense first philosophy and has 2 RBs that will be handling the load.

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

I'm saying this to make 2 points... first that Dallas isn't necessarily a team that is reluctant to pass... they are right at the NFL average. Second is that even if a team doesn't pass a lot compared to other NFL teams, if a particular player gets targetted enough he can still outperform receivers on more pass-happy teams.

Whether you think TO will draw a high enough percentage of the targets with Witten and Glenn as the main guys to compete with him is of course your own call. But it definitely isn't beyond reason to believe TO can perform at high FF levels in this situation.

Middle of the pack is a far drop from 3rd (620) and 9th (550) in pass attempts, where Philly has been the last 2 years with TO. To compare anyone's situation to that of Car is very naive to. If you can supplant Jake Tunnel Vision Delhomme to the new team, then I think you have a point.

Come on man, don't you think you know me well enough the naieve crack is a little low?I think I made it pretty clear in my last paragraph that I wasn't saying, "Because it happened in Carolina it will happen in Dallas." I said it is up to the individual to decide what the distribution of targets will be.

Last year Glenn had 109 targets for 60 catches and Keyshawn 115 for 66. Witten had 81. That's about 3/5 of the total passes thrown.

So if you slot TO in there for Keyshawn and give him about 115 to start with before difference in ability, do you mean to tell me you can't see him getting the ball thrown his way once or twice more every game than it got thrown to Keyshawn? One more pass per game than Keyshawn and TO would have been targetted in the same range as Marvin Harrison and Steve Smith. Twice more per game and he's going to start cracking the top 5 WRs in targets.

I don't see how you can call it naieve to say that it is reasonable that a middle-of-the-road team in pass attempts can produce a top WR.

 

[tecmo bo]

did'nt hearst and barlow almost run for a grand a piece in one of owens first years?

 

[jurb26]

I don't see how you can call it naieve to say that it is reasonable that a middle-of-the-road team in pass attempts can produce a top WR.

This is not what I said in the least and you know it.What I said was that a comparison to Car and what seems to be the anomily for lopsided WR production is niave. Nobody locks onto 1 WR more than Delhomme. Basically my point was that it is not a good comparison. Car is a far bit different (or at least has been the past 2 years) than other teams in that regard.

Some stats to go with it:

Wide Receivers+----------------------+----+-----------------------+----------------------+| Name                 |  G |  RSH  YARD   AVG  TD  |  REC  YARD   AVG  TD |+----------------------+----+-----------------------+----------------------+| Drew Carter          |  3 |    0     0   0.0   0  |    5   103  20.6   1 || Keary Colbert        | 16 |    1     6   6.0   0  |   25   282  11.3   2 || Rod Gardner          | 10 |    0     0   0.0   0  |    9    84   9.3   1 || Karl Hankton         | 16 |    0     0   0.0   0  |    0     0   0.0   0 || Ricky Proehl         | 16 |    1    -8  -8.0   0  |   25   441  17.6   4 || Steve Smith          | 16 |    4    25   6.2   1  |  103  1563  15.2  12 |+----------------------+----+-----------------------+----------------------+

Tight Ends+----------------------+----+----------------------+| Name                 |  G |  REC  YARD   AVG  TD |+----------------------+----+----------------------+| Michael Gaines       | 11 |   12   155  12.9   2 || Kris Mangum          | 14 |   23   202   8.8   2 || Mike Seidman         | 12 |    0     0   0.0   0 |+----------------------+----+----------------------+

 

[GregR_2]

did'nt hearst and barlow almost run for a grand a piece in one of owens first years?

2001 would probably be the most appropriate year to compare to what is being said is the Cowboys situation. SF was 2nd in the league in rush attempts and yards, and was 22nd in pass attempts and 18th in passing yards.Owens had 93 recs for 1412 yards and 16 TDs that year. However, the 49ers had little else in receivers that year. EJ had 40 catches which isn't bad for a TE... Stokes was the 2nd best WR with 54 catches. I'd say there's more competition for TO on Dallas than there was on that 49er team.

And for what it's worth, that 49er team threw as an almost identical # of passes as did Dallas last year.

 

[GregR_2]

I don't see how you can call it naieve to say that it is reasonable that a middle-of-the-road team in pass attempts can produce a top WR.

This is not what I said in the least and you know it.What I said was that a comparison to Car and what seems to be the anomily for lopsided WR production is niave. Nobody locks onto 1 WR more than Delhomme. Basically my point was that it is not a good comparison. Car is a far bit different (or at least has been the past 2 years) than other teams in that regard.

You're still missing my point. I used it to show that it is number of opportunities for the WR that matter. I didn't use it to say that Bledsoe has to lock in on TO like Delhomme does on his WRs to make TO a viable top FF receiver. That would have been silly because Dallas passes quite a bit more than Carolina. TO can get his share without having to have a Delhome-lock-on mode installed in Bledsoe.So please stop treating it as if I'm arguing such a lock-on is necessary. As I said in my reply that you completely avoided, 1 more pass to TO per game than Keyshawn got last year and he's already getting as many passes as Steve Smith. Do you not think TO's talent level is worth 1 more target a game than Keyshawn's?

 

[joffer]

Now TO is 33 years old and past his prime. 

disagree

How is he going to do anything like he did in Philly with such less opportunity and likely diminished skills? 

he doesn't need to. TO's per game numbers in Philly were awesome. 5.9 catches, 93 yards, .95 TDsover a 16 game season, that's 94.4/1488/15.2. he doesn't need to produce at that rate to be top 5. i've got him at 83/1270/12, which i think is very achievable. That's 199 points. WR5's five year average is 191. his greatest value lies in his red zone ability and TDs. i think the the San Francisco comparison with Mooch, Hearst, Barlow, etc. is somewhat valid.

 

[jurb26]

So please stop treating it as if I'm arguing such a lock-on is necessary. As I said in my reply that you completely avoided, 1 more pass to TO per game than Keyshawn got last year and he's already getting as many passes as Steve Smith. Do you not think TO's talent level is worth 1 more target a game than Keyshawn's?

What I am confused about is if you are adding this extra pass to the Dal total or taking it away from an exhisting player, Witten/Glenn. I see your point and agree that targets is what makes the difference. I at 1st thought you were trying to say that TO would force a Car-like distribution and I disagree with that. In short, I don't see the passing pie getting bigger in Dal. I think the running game and D will be better this year and Bledose is at the end of the rope (with little behind him). Sure I think TO is worth more targets in Dal as he is a better WR than Key was. That does not mean I expect they will happen.BTW, didn't Glenn lead the Cowboys in targets last year with 118? Why are you using Key's target numbers?

 

[glock]

I don't see how you can call it naieve to say that it is reasonable that a middle-of-the-road team in pass attempts can produce a top WR.

This is not what I said in the least and you know it.What I said was that a comparison to Car and what seems to be the anomily for lopsided WR production is niave. Nobody locks onto 1 WR more than Delhomme. Basically my point was that it is not a good comparison. Car is a far bit different (or at least has been the past 2 years) than other teams in that regard.

You're still missing my point. I used it to show that it is number of opportunities for the WR that matter. I didn't use it to say that Bledsoe has to lock in on TO like Delhomme does on his WRs to make TO a viable top FF receiver. That would have been silly because Dallas passes quite a bit more than Carolina. TO can get his share without having to have a Delhome-lock-on mode installed in Bledsoe.So please stop treating it as if I'm arguing such a lock-on is necessary. As I said in my reply that you completely avoided, 1 more pass to TO per game than Keyshawn got last year and he's already getting as many passes as Steve Smith. Do you not think TO's talent level is worth 1 more target a game than Keyshawn's?

 

[Chaka]

The notion that Bill Parcells is a run first coach is what is naive, it is simply untrue. Parcells will adapt his offense to his talent not the other way around, and if that means T.O. will get 1-2 more target/game than Key then Parcells will do it.

T.O. will get his.

 

[jurb26]

The notion that Bill Parcells is a run first coach is what is naive, it is simply untrue. Parcells will adapt his offense to his talent not the other way around, and if that means T.O. will get 1-2 more target/game than Key then Parcells will do it.

T.O. will get his.

I do not see Dal strength being in the passing game this year. As I said, I see the running game and D improving.

 

[Chaka]

The notion that Bill Parcells is a run first coach is what is naive, it is simply untrue. Parcells will adapt his offense to his talent not the other way around, and if that means T.O. will get 1-2 more target/game than Key then Parcells will do it.

T.O. will get his.

I do not see Dal strength being in the passing game this year. As I said, I see the running game and D improving.

I see a balanced offense (52:48 pass:run) featuring a RBBC and a QB that is as close a lock to start 16 games this side of Peyton Manning.In this environment T.O. can, and will, excel.

Dominant WRs dominate in any situation, just look at Steve Smith last season (or T.O. in any season).

 

[glock]

The notion that Bill Parcells is a run first coach is what is naive, it is simply untrue. Parcells will adapt his offense to his talent not the other way around, and if that means T.O. will get 1-2 more target/game than Key then Parcells will do it.

T.O. will get his.

I do not see Dal strength being in the passing game this year. As I said, I see the running game and D improving.

...thereby strengthening an already above average passing attack.

 

[jurb26]

The notion that Bill Parcells is a run first coach is what is naive, it is simply untrue. Parcells will adapt his offense to his talent not the other way around, and if that means T.O. will get 1-2 more target/game than Key then Parcells will do it.

T.O. will get his.

I do not see Dal strength being in the passing game this year. As I said, I see the running game and D improving.

I see a balanced offense (52:48 pass:run) featuring a RBBC and a QB that is as close a lock to start 16 games this side of Peyton Manning.In this environment T.O. can, and will, excel.

Dominant WRs dominate in any situation, just look at Steve Smith last season (or T.O. in any season).

You have far more confidence in Bledsoe this year than I do. Fair enough.

 

[jurb26]

The notion that Bill Parcells is a run first coach is what is naive, it is simply untrue. Parcells will adapt his offense to his talent not the other way around, and if that means T.O. will get 1-2 more target/game than Key then Parcells will do it.

T.O. will get his.

I do not see Dal strength being in the passing game this year. As I said, I see the running game and D improving.

...thereby strengthening an already above average passing attack.

No doubt, it would become more efficient. At least Dal should hope so. They gave up 50 sacks last year, 4th highest in the NFL despite passing only 500 times, 18th in the NFL. Not a good ratio to have.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Plus, I'm very worried about Bledsoe (despite his great year last year).

You'd be well advised to worry about Bledsoe -- because he was far from great last year. When he was on the field (which was all the time), he wasn't that good. He ranked just 17th in FP/Game, when you adjust for partial games. When you factor in SOS, (Bledsoe played an easy schedule), he ranked just 20th. A QB ranking 20th is far from a great year; it's below average.

Bledsoe didn't miss any time last year, and played an easy schedule --- that's why his raw numbers looked good. But it's clear to me that he wasn't very good when he was on the field, but rather he was very good at staying on the field.

 

[glock]

The notion that Bill Parcells is a run first coach is what is naive, it is simply untrue. Parcells will adapt his offense to his talent not the other way around, and if that means T.O. will get 1-2 more target/game than Key then Parcells will do it.

T.O. will get his.

I do not see Dal strength being in the passing game this year. As I said, I see the running game and D improving.

...thereby strengthening an already above average passing attack.

No doubt, it would become more efficient. At least Dal should hope so. They gave up 50 sacks last year, 4th highest in the NFL despite passing only 500 times, 18th in the NFL. Not a good ratio to have.

How have efforts to shore up that OL gone so far? Anyone?

 

[GregR_2]

...

What I am confused about is if you are adding this extra pass to the Dal total or taking it away from an exhisting player, Witten/Glenn.

I think it could come from both, as I doubt Dallas will have the exact same distribution. But I suppose I had more in mind shifting a target from one player to another. I wouldn't be surprised to see Witten lose a few to the rook and what Glenn/Price/Randall Williams got lose some to TO and Crayton both.Haven't started my team projections yet (though it is getting time to get on it), so I haven't fully broken down targets or receptions yet for the Cowpokes. I may not end up having TO as a top WR, but I can see an argument being made for it either way, and disagreed with casting the Cowboy's offense as a limited passing game, which was more of the reason of why I bothered to post.

I see your point and agree that targets is what makes the difference. I at 1st thought you were trying to say that TO would force a Car-like distribution and I disagree with that.

I'd disagree with that too, so we're on the same page.

In short, I don't see the passing pie getting bigger in Dal. I think the running game and D will be better this year and Bledose is at the end of the rope (with little behind him). Sure I think TO is worth more targets in Dal as he is a better WR than Key was. That does not mean I expect they will happen.

BTW, didn't Glenn lead the Cowboys in targets last year with 118? Why are you using Key's target numbers?

The numbers I gave were what FBG's has in their 2005 targets here. Assuming they are correct, but not sure of it. I don't have any links to other sites with target info to compare.Edit to add: Ah, I wonder if it includes week 17. The address says 17, but the page mentions week 16.

 

[gocats]

did'nt hearst and barlow almost run for a grand a piece in one of owens first years?

2001 would probably be the most appropriate year to compare to what is being said is the Cowboys situation. SF was 2nd in the league in rush attempts and yards, and was 22nd in pass attempts and 18th in passing yards.Owens had 93 recs for 1412 yards and 16 TDs that year. However, the 49ers had little else in receivers that year. EJ had 40 catches which isn't bad for a TE... Stokes was the 2nd best WR with 54 catches. I'd say there's more competition for TO on Dallas than there was on that 49er team.

And for what it's worth, that 49er team threw as an almost identical # of passes as did Dallas last year.

 

[hollaatyaboy]

How much does Owens Value diminish if Bledsoe goes down ??

 

[glock]

How much does Owens Value diminish if Bledsoe goes down ??

Tony Romo, Drew Henson, or Jeff Mroz...

 

[Banger]

Key had 71 catches last year and he's gone. All TO needs is 10-15 catches more than Key and he'll get 1200+ 10 tds.

 

[MLBrandow]

I don't mean to interject without contributing anything of value to the subject matter... but naive has been misspelled about a dozen times in this thread and in like four different ways.

 

[diesel7982]

TO has been playing for 2 WCO teams where he was able to succeed. He had 2 mobile QBs and both teams passed a lot.

Now hes going to a team with a defense first philosophy and has 2 RBs that will be handling the load. Here are the leading recievers on Parcell's team from his entire coaching career;

1983 Earnest Gray 78 1139 14.6 5

1984 Bobby Johnson 48 795 16.6 7

1985 Lionel Manuel 49 859 17.5 5

1986 Bobby Johnson 31 534 17.2 5

1987 Lionel Manuel 30 545 18.2 6

1988 Lionel Manuel 65 1029 15.8 4

1989 Odessa Turner 38 467 12.3 4

1990 Stephen Baker 26 541 20.8 4

1993 Vincent Brisby 45 626 13.9 2

1994 Michael Timpson 74 941 12.7 3

1995 Vincent Brisby 66 974 14.8 3

1996 Terry Glenn 90 1132 12.6 6

1997 Keyshawn Johnson 70 963 13.8 5

1998 Keyshawn Johnson 83 1131 13.6 10

1999 Keyshawn Johnson 89 1170 13.1 8

2003 Terry Glenn 52 754 14.5 5

2004 Keyshawn Johnson 70 981 14.0 6

2005 Terry Glenn 62 1136 18.3 7

:X

Now TO is 33 years old and past his prime. How is he going to do anything like he did in Philly with such less opportunity and likely diminished skills? Hes a consensus top 5? I just don't see the opp.

Did this just happen? Or has he been declining the last couple years?

 

[Marc Levin]

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.

Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

That's all that needs to be said.TO has 80/1200/14 potential on the current incarnation of the 'boys - if that happens, Glenn and Witten are worthless.

Heck, Glenn was the #12 WR last year with the exact same sitch that TO steps into. I'll take TO to move up a few slots (at least this year) over what Glenn produced.

 

[Marc Levin]

Incidentally, Key had in the 125 target range in 2005 - Glenn in the 120 - TO will see PLENTY of passes his way to make a top-5 WR finish.

And with the Dallas struggles running the ball in the red zone in 2005, expect TO to be a TD machine once again.

 

[joffer]

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.

Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

That's all that needs to be said.TO has 80/1200/14 potential on the current incarnation of the 'boys - if that happens, Glenn and Witten are worthless.

Heck, Glenn was the #12 WR last year with the exact same sitch that TO steps into. I'll take TO to move up a few slots (at least this year) over what Glenn produced.

i'm not sure that i agree that Witten is worthless. he could still have a nice year if he is not called on to block a lot and is going pretty late right now (7th/8th round).

 

[Marc Levin]

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.

Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

That's all that needs to be said.TO has 80/1200/14 potential on the current incarnation of the 'boys - if that happens, Glenn and Witten are worthless.

Heck, Glenn was the #12 WR last year with the exact same sitch that TO steps into. I'll take TO to move up a few slots (at least this year) over what Glenn produced.

i'm not sure that i agree that Witten is worthless. he could still have a nice year if he is not called on to block a lot and is going pretty late right now (7th/8th round).

Worthless may be harsh, but not worth a top-6/top-8 TE ranking - more worthy of a backup TE or TE11/12 ranking.The two-TE sets being talked about in Dallas are scary too - I have a big "avoid" tag on Witten this year.

 

[GregR_2]

I think some more targets will go to TO.

However, do you think he's going to command double teams that will free up Witten one on one instead of maybe having faced a LB with safety help more often?

 

[Marc Levin]

no - i don't. i think ds will committ the same number of defenders as they committed with Glenn/Key last year.

 

[Brunswick]

How have efforts to shore up that OL gone so far? Anyone?

Let's see Larry Allen left and they signed Jason Fabini and Kyle Kosier, you're guess is as good as anyones

 

[Jason Wood]

Building off what some others have said...Parcells has already said he plans on running more 2-TE sets as the base offense this year (hence the drafting of Fasano); and they already weren't fond of 3- and 4-WR formations. That means plenty of targets for TO and Glenn; not so much for the other WRs.

One clarification to the first post...when you said TO had TWO mobile WCO QBs...he's actually had three: Steve Young, Jeff Garcia and Donovan McNabb.

The great thing about TO is he's such a phenomenal scorer (4th all time) despite averaging 81 receptions per 16 games.

In Owens five 1,000-yard seasons...his teams have passed:

1998 -- 556 times
2000 -- 583 times
2001 -- 506 times
2003 -- 510 times
2004 -- 547 timesThe Cowboys threw 501 times a year ago...

In Parcells last 10 years as a head coach, his teams attempts =

1993 -- 566 attempts
1994 -- 699 attempts
1995 -- 686 attempts
1996 -- 628 attempts
1997 -- 564 attempts
1998 -- 532 attempts
1999 -- 476 attempts
2003 -- 510 attempts
2004 -- 518 attempts
2005 -- 501 attemptsWhere's the problem here? TO will see plenty of targets, no question about that.

 

[Marc Levin]

^------

Him Smart

S-M-R-T!!

 

[Lightning Fast Whip]

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.

Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

That's all that needs to be said.TO has 80/1200/14 potential on the current incarnation of the 'boys - if that happens, Glenn and Witten are worthless.

Heck, Glenn was the #12 WR last year with the exact same sitch that TO steps into. I'll take TO to move up a few slots (at least this year) over what Glenn produced.

Glenn is only worthless if he gets injured. No reason Glenn can't put up 1000 with about 5 or 6 Tds facing single coverage if healthy. See Peerless Price (anyone think Price is better than Glenn?) as Bledsoes #2. Also the list of top WRs for Parcells teams is at best misleading when Coates was pretty much the #1 Receiver putting up 96 catches one year and Bavaro going over 1000 yards back when only 1 or 2 TE a year put up WR stats. Parcells adapts to what he has. If his team is talented running he'll run..if the best receiver is a TE he'll throw to him. If T.O. is the best he'll get the ball. My guess if chemistry between Bledsoe-Glenn isn't going to completely disappear..and T.O. might feel a bit like Witten did last year and complain because he doesn't think Bledsoe looks at him as often as he'd like...which for T.O. is almost everypass.

 

[Marc Levin]

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.

Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

That's all that needs to be said.TO has 80/1200/14 potential on the current incarnation of the 'boys - if that happens, Glenn and Witten are worthless.

Heck, Glenn was the #12 WR last year with the exact same sitch that TO steps into. I'll take TO to move up a few slots (at least this year) over what Glenn produced.

Glenn is only worthless if he gets injured. No reason Glenn can't put up 1000 with about 5 or 6 Tds facing single coverage if healthy.

Except that no receiver besides Jerry Rice has ever put up close to 1G across from TO. 5 or 6 TDs? OK. 1G rec. yards? Nope.

 

[Lightning Fast Whip]

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.

Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

That's all that needs to be said.TO has 80/1200/14 potential on the current incarnation of the 'boys - if that happens, Glenn and Witten are worthless.

Heck, Glenn was the #12 WR last year with the exact same sitch that TO steps into. I'll take TO to move up a few slots (at least this year) over what Glenn produced.

Glenn is only worthless if he gets injured. No reason Glenn can't put up 1000 with about 5 or 6 Tds facing single coverage if healthy.

Except that no receiver besides Jerry Rice has ever put up close to 1G across from TO. 5 or 6 TDs? OK. 1G rec. yards? Nope.

An older rehabbed Jerry Rice did it. Did we expect Stokes,Cedric or Pinkston,Greg Lewis/Rookie Reggie Brown to do it. I'm ranking Glenn far ahead of what any WR opposite T.O. has been besides Jerry Rice. And because Glenn is quicker and faster than post injury Rice I'm not sure is isn't close to equal to that older/rehabbed Rice. Pinkston put up nearly 700 and Pinkston is no where near Glenn. And as a passer Bledsoe is better for WRs than McNabb.

 

[Lightning Fast Whip]

and Pinkston would have been over 800 easy without alligator arms on some bombs..Glenn will make those catches that Pinkston bailed on.

edit to add- Pinkstons best year ever is only 120 more yards than the year he played with owens. AND THAT WAS sitting out some game(s) because Andy got scared of injuries after they clinched.

120 off Glenns best year or even last year is about 1000 yards

 

[Chaka]

Dallas had 500 pass attempts last year, which put them middle of the pack at #18 in that stat.

Carolina on the other hand, was 28th in pass attempts with 449, yet produced the #1 WR in most scoring systems.

That's all that needs to be said.TO has 80/1200/14 potential on the current incarnation of the 'boys - if that happens, Glenn and Witten are worthless.

Heck, Glenn was the #12 WR last year with the exact same sitch that TO steps into. I'll take TO to move up a few slots (at least this year) over what Glenn produced.

Glenn is only worthless if he gets injured. No reason Glenn can't put up 1000 with about 5 or 6 Tds facing single coverage if healthy.

Except that no receiver besides Jerry Rice has ever put up close to 1G across from TO. 5 or 6 TDs? OK. 1G rec. yards? Nope.

An older rehabbed Jerry Rice did it. Did we expect Stokes,Cedric or Pinkston,Greg Lewis/Rookie Reggie Brown to do it. I'm ranking Glenn far ahead of what any WR opposite T.O. has been besides Jerry Rice. And because Glenn is quicker and faster than post injury Rice I'm not sure is isn't close to equal to that older/rehabbed Rice. Pinkston put up nearly 700 and Pinkston is no where near Glenn. And as a passer Bledsoe is better for WRs than McNabb.

Since 1998 (he was injured in '97) an older, rehabbed Jerry Rice still outperformed Terry Glenn in every facet of the game.Glenn since 1998 (97 games) 6213 yards & 30 TDs (64 ypg & 0.31 TD/game)

Rice since 1998 (97 games) 6440 yards & 42 TDs (66.4 ypg & 0.43 TD/game)

It should also be noted that Glenn only played in 80 games during Rice's last 7 seasons, compared to Rice's 97 (I included Glenn's 2005 stats so they would both have an = # of games played).

I am not optomistic that Glenn will produce better #'s than the average WR who has started opposite T.O.

 

[Chaka]

and Pinkston would have been over 800 easy without alligator arms on some bombs..Glenn will make those catches that Pinkston bailed on.

edit to add- Pinkstons best year ever is only 120 more yards than the year he played with owens. AND THAT WAS sitting out some game(s) because Andy got scared of injuries after they clinched.

120 off Glenns best year or even last year is about 1000 yards

Last year was his best year, 11 yards less than his career high (1,147 in 1999) and a career high 7 TDs.Glenn has only cracked 1,000 yards three times in his career ('96, '99 & '05).

 

[Marc Levin]

Yeah - I am NOT seeing Glenn crest 1G this year - in fact, I don't see him cresting 800 yards. But, he will have 6-8 TDs.

 

[Lightning Fast Whip]

and Pinkston would have been over 800 easy without alligator arms on some bombs..Glenn will make those catches that Pinkston bailed on.

edit to add- Pinkstons best year ever is only 120 more yards than the year he played with owens. AND THAT WAS sitting out some game(s) because Andy got scared of injuries after they clinched.

120 off Glenns best year or even last year is about 1000 yards

Last year was his best year, 11 yards less than his career high (1,147 in 1999) and a career high 7 TDs.Glenn has only cracked 1,000 yards three times in his career ('96, '99 & '05).

Rookie Year would be his best year as a WR imo. And for fantasy in point per catch league for sure. He isn't going to catch 90 again but yardage wise being 2 yards per game less than post surgery Jerry Rice is pretty darn close. How far away from Glenn are the average WR who played opposite Owens besides Rice? way more than 2 yards per game that I am sure of. Closest comparison is Older Jerry playing opp Owens...or from Bledsoes perspective how Price Did as a #2 when Bledsoe had a good #1 in Moulds.Price opposite Moulds with Bledsoe = 94 catches 1252 yards 9 TDs

Rice average in 3 years after surgery opposite Owens approx 75 Catches 930 yards 7 TDs

Glenn better than Price and close to post surgery Rice imo. Thinking he is irrelevant if healthy is just silly. Predicting him for less than 50 yards per game is saying he is no better than a Pinkston type. I aint buying that.

 

[Bankerguy]

Building off what some others have said...Parcells has already said he plans on running more 2-TE sets as the base offense this year (hence the drafting of Fasano); and they already weren't fond of 3- and 4-WR formations. That means plenty of targets for TO and Glenn; not so much for the other WRs.

One clarification to the first post...when you said TO had TWO mobile WCO QBs...he's actually had three: Steve Young, Jeff Garcia and Donovan McNabb.

The great thing about TO is he's such a phenomenal scorer (4th all time) despite averaging 81 receptions per 16 games.

In Owens five 1,000-yard seasons...his teams have passed:

1998 -- 556 times
2000 -- 583 times
2001 -- 506 times
2003 -- 510 times
2004 -- 547 timesThe Cowboys threw 501 times a year ago...

In Parcells last 10 years as a head coach, his teams attempts =

1993 -- 566 attempts
1994 -- 699 attempts
1995 -- 686 attempts
1996 -- 628 attempts
1997 -- 564 attempts
1998 -- 532 attempts
1999 -- 476 attempts
2003 -- 510 attempts
2004 -- 518 attempts
2005 -- 501 attemptsWhere's the problem here? TO will see plenty of targets, no question about that.

I'm with Woods.

 

[Lightning Fast Whip]

Actually I just checked- Pinkston didn't even get to play after Dallas game where TO got hurt.

So Pinkston in 13 games with Owens averaged over 50 yards per game.