Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Texans 2014 off & pre season thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter coolnerd
- Start date
Loan Sharks
Not a Wolf
Lol, crazy. They said on NFL radio that the Texans are hitting the panic button at running back.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
so, you think they're getting a free pass in the next day's film session, or you'd just prefer to hear them thrown under the bus in a press conference?dhockster said:
you really think a guy loses players by taking the heat in a press conference rather than pointing the finger at everyone else?
maybe they should've hired schiano for you guys
GregR
Footballguy
The times I have heard this subject brought up to former Texans players, most of them seemed to kind of chuckle at the notion Kubiak was soft on players just because of how he handles the media. Left me with the impression that he's not shy at all about tearing into them in private.
dhockster
Footballguy
I get what you guys are saying. It is just tiring hearing the same coachspeak when the players have laid an egg. Some coaches have the ability to be honest about player performances to the media without "losing them" or "throwing them under the bus". After Kubiak, I was hoping we would get one of those. Apparently (based on a very small sample size, I admit) we did not.
Oh well, maybe the players will play better, which will mean O'Brien won't have to sugarcoat his comments as much.
No, I don't want Schiano. There's being honest and there's being idiotic. We don't want idiotic.
Oh well, maybe the players will play better, which will mean O'Brien won't have to sugarcoat his comments as much.
No, I don't want Schiano. There's being honest and there's being idiotic. We don't want idiotic.
GregR
Footballguy
Kind of tired so just a few comments. Obviously a much better performance. I haven't had a chance to watch the broadcast but Fitzpatrick seemed more accurate, though the receivers didn't seem to be getting very open against Atlanta's first string without AJ out there. Also didn't think he had a lot of clean pockets, but want to watch the replays to get a better feel for how the line did.
The way I look at preseason games, I think a QB should look good against vanilla defenses that made no attempt to scheme to stop you or that are worrying about disguising coverage and such to the level they would in a game. So when someone looks as bad as Fitzpatrick did the first game, I think that warrants more pessimism than tonight's game warrants optimism. An NFL QB should look like that tonight. So not a bad sign how he played tonight, but it also doesn't erase last week for me. I keep hearing the radio talking about Fitzpatrick's best season in Buffalo, but I think last year in Tennessee is more reasonable to expect out of him.
But, all in all, good to see how well the team did with most every top player on the team sitting out tonight. Grimes showed some good elusiveness on a pair of runs, though what I saw live neither RB particularly bowled me over with their performance. Maybe I'll feel different after watching the broadcast.
The way I look at preseason games, I think a QB should look good against vanilla defenses that made no attempt to scheme to stop you or that are worrying about disguising coverage and such to the level they would in a game. So when someone looks as bad as Fitzpatrick did the first game, I think that warrants more pessimism than tonight's game warrants optimism. An NFL QB should look like that tonight. So not a bad sign how he played tonight, but it also doesn't erase last week for me. I keep hearing the radio talking about Fitzpatrick's best season in Buffalo, but I think last year in Tennessee is more reasonable to expect out of him.
But, all in all, good to see how well the team did with most every top player on the team sitting out tonight. Grimes showed some good elusiveness on a pair of runs, though what I saw live neither RB particularly bowled me over with their performance. Maybe I'll feel different after watching the broadcast.
Last edited by a moderator:
Duane Brown might be the most important player on offense. Let's hope we never have to see Newton at Left Tackls during the regular season. Having him start on the right side is bad enough.
Seems like CB Brandon Harris is on the bubble. If we carry 5 corners, I see Joseph, Jackson, Bouye, Hal being ahead of him for sure.
Grimes and Blue might prove to be a good 1-2 punch for WHEN, not if, Foster goes down.
Liked what I see from Clowney so far. I hope it continues.
Fitzpatrick will definitely earn the praise and hatred of the fanbase as he takes em through extreme highs and pitiful lows. Keenum probably got back his 2nd string job over Savage.
Refreshing to see some good plays on special teams for once.
Seems like CB Brandon Harris is on the bubble. If we carry 5 corners, I see Joseph, Jackson, Bouye, Hal being ahead of him for sure.
Grimes and Blue might prove to be a good 1-2 punch for WHEN, not if, Foster goes down.
Liked what I see from Clowney so far. I hope it continues.
Fitzpatrick will definitely earn the praise and hatred of the fanbase as he takes em through extreme highs and pitiful lows. Keenum probably got back his 2nd string job over Savage.
Refreshing to see some good plays on special teams for once.
Houston turmOiler
Footballguy
Excellent post. Gotta give Grimes credit where it's due even though Ive stated I like Blue better. Guy is playing his heart out. Ronnie Brown got hit in the backfield quite a bit.
The whole team played with great passion and it was a lot more fun to watch obviously. Seemed Clowney may have helped set the tone with back to back plays.
Ive seen more than enough of Derek Newton and Brandon Harris. Time to try someone else.
Felt bad for TJ Yates but loved the energy of that group of defenders. Yates looked miserable.
Fitzpatrick looked much better. His ability to move made a big difference.
Overall a nice performance and a step in the right direction.
Major
Footballguy
I don't like Keenum's prospects of making the team. It just seems that O'Brien isn't keen on Case. Similar to a girl saying "He's a really nice guy". Odd that when hes out there they run a completely different offense. I think Case is competing with FA QBs and those soon to be placed on waivers.
I agree with most things you are saying. He saw game action AFTER savage. He had moments where he did seem like he wanted to run first. If a Matt McGloin saw waivers, I would bet the farm that Keenum is sent packing in a heartbeat to make room. However, you mention the different offense. I don't view that as a pure negative. I view it as a positive in Bill O'Brien's coaching philosophy. How many people whined and complained about Kubiak trying to "square-peg" Keenum into his "round-hole" offense? For Keenum to have any chance to succeed, he needs to run something similar to his U of H spread offense. I liked the wide looks and screens that he threw to Martin last night. O'Brien didn't try to make Keenum play like Fitzpatrick, unlike Kubiak who tried to make him play like Matt Schaub. I hope the guy succeeds, despite some of his VY-like fan boys trashing any other QB for the Texans that takes air and space away from Case. I think Savage is way too raw and green, that Keenum will retain the #2 job, unless a hidden veteran talent that BOB likes becomes unexpectedly available.
Last edited by a moderator:
Major
Footballguy
I hope you're right bc I'd like to see Case as the 2. However, listening to O'Brien in interviews I get the feeling hes keeping Case on to appease McNair and the Houston Cougar fanboys.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
is there really an alternative to newton, or will they just have to plant cj over there until next year's draft?
Are you referring to CJ Fiedorowitz? Yeah...there's not much behind Newton, unless Tyson Clabo and Will Yeatmon find the magical fountain of youth AND skills. Sadly, Newton is decent at run blocking, and I think BOB wants to pound the rock as much as possible. A good chunk of our picks this year seemed to indicate improving the run game. So it makes sense to glue CJ next to Newton as much as possible. He's already the biggest and best blocker of the 3 tight ends. Graham is mediocre at blocking, and Griffin is allegedly not picking up the playbook as well as others. I like CJ a lot, but his transformation into the uber poor-man's Gronk might have to wait a few seasons.
Faust posted this in the Tom Savage Thread. I really do see him sticking as #3, with Keenum remaining #2 unless a Matt McGloin or Chase Daniel gets released unexpectedly.
Tom Savage - QB - Texans
Despite playing second behind Ryan Fitzpatrick in Friday's preseason game, coach Bill O'Brien confirmed rookie Tom Savage remains third string on the Texans' quarterback depth chart.
O'Brien said Savage had no idea he'd be thrown in with the second team, and he "wanted to see how Savage handled it." It's a classic Belichickian move, one that Bill used to pull with Matt Cassel and Brian Hoyer in New England. Through two preseason appearances, fourth-round rookie Savage has completed 6-of-8 passes for 22 yards with two sacks absorbed, and no TDs or INTs.
Source: Brian Smith on Twitter
Aug 17 - 3:57 PM
Tom Savage - QB - Texans
Despite playing second behind Ryan Fitzpatrick in Friday's preseason game, coach Bill O'Brien confirmed rookie Tom Savage remains third string on the Texans' quarterback depth chart.
O'Brien said Savage had no idea he'd be thrown in with the second team, and he "wanted to see how Savage handled it." It's a classic Belichickian move, one that Bill used to pull with Matt Cassel and Brian Hoyer in New England. Through two preseason appearances, fourth-round rookie Savage has completed 6-of-8 passes for 22 yards with two sacks absorbed, and no TDs or INTs.
Source: Brian Smith on Twitter
Aug 17 - 3:57 PM
dhockster
Footballguy
If the Texans are the organization that "does things the right way" I really think they need to get JJ Watt signed to a new deal. He is one of, if not THE premier defensive players right now and he has outplayed his contract tremendously over the first three years of the contract. Consider that with his signing bonus and salary he has been paid just over $9 million in his first 3 years ($3 million per year on average). He will be paid $1.9 million this year, and will be paid $6.9 million next year since the Texans exercised the 5th year option. He could be franchised in his sixth year for probably around $10 million (if they do it based on 3-4 defense DE's) or $13 million (if it is based on all defensive ends). So on the high end the Texans could have Watt for 3 more years for $22 million without signing him to a long term deal ($7.3 million per year). If he has a career ending injury, he doesn't have the benefit of having received a big signing bonus up front. Besides the fact that he is extremely talented, he is also a workout warrior and is the right guy to have as the face of your team.
The Texans have hamstrung themselves with their cap management, first continually deferring money on Andre's salary, causing him to have a cap figure of $15 million this year, and second signing Cushing and Foster to big contracts at positions that are getting less and less of the big money contracts. I understand their cap issues, but not tying up Watt long term is just a black eye for an organization that considers itself the gold standard in how to run an organization.
I say figure out a way to get his contract done before this season to fit under this years cap. Treat a top player in the league like a top player in the league.
One last point: In the next CBA, the players need to change the rules regarding the fifth year option. I say if a team exercises the fifth year option then they lose the right to franchise that player in year 6 or they have to pay the player some amount to retain the right to franchise him in year 6.
The Texans have hamstrung themselves with their cap management, first continually deferring money on Andre's salary, causing him to have a cap figure of $15 million this year, and second signing Cushing and Foster to big contracts at positions that are getting less and less of the big money contracts. I understand their cap issues, but not tying up Watt long term is just a black eye for an organization that considers itself the gold standard in how to run an organization.
I say figure out a way to get his contract done before this season to fit under this years cap. Treat a top player in the league like a top player in the league.
One last point: In the next CBA, the players need to change the rules regarding the fifth year option. I say if a team exercises the fifth year option then they lose the right to franchise that player in year 6 or they have to pay the player some amount to retain the right to franchise him in year 6.
While I agree that taking care of their own would be good for their image as an organization, there appears to be a disconnect. There are basically two ways these contract negotiations work:
1) Play out the contract, get paid top dollar as a free agent
2) Tear up rookie contract early, take discounted contract
But it appears Watt wants to have his cake and eat it, too. He wants to immediately become the highest paid defensive player after 3 years on a 5 year deal.
The contracts signed by Patrick Peterson and Tyron Smith actually hurt Watt's case and squarely fit in category #2 above despite seeming like large contracts. These guys would certainly get paid more (and/or have more guaranteed money) if they waited a year or two. It would be fundamentally unwise to make Watt the highest paid defensive player two years before his rookie contract is up. It might seem like the right thing to do, but it would cripple the team.
dhockster
Footballguy
Generally, I agree with what you are saying. And I think the biggest problem is what the players got in the CBA. Cutting the rookie pay grade was necessary because undeserving rookies who became busts were getting monies that should have gone to more deserving veterans. The 5th year team option is ridiculus for the players because the only way the team takes the option is if the player is far outplaying his contract. With the Franchise Tag, if you draft a stud first rounder who outplays his contract you can get that player for 6 years (like Watts case) without having to sign them to a huge second contract. That seems like too much of a players career, especially for players who are showing they deserve the money. I am sure there are lesser defensive ends who were drafted with Watt who will make more money than Watt over the first 6 years because they were able to sign a second contract before he did.
Now if the Texans don't redo his contract this off-season, they may plan to do it next off season when they have more cap room. That would be fine, but it still leaves one of their top players exposed to having a career ending injury this year and not having a lot to show (comparatively) for his first 3 seasons. I just like the guy, and would like to see him taken care of.
dhockster
Footballguy
Oh and Watt didn't choose to sign a 5 year deal. The CBA mandates a 4 year deal for 1st rounders with a 5th year team option. And I don't think he necessarily wants to become the top paid player. He wants to be paid like one of the top players which he has shown he is. He is a victim of the poor CBA the players negotiated.
So what's your point? Those are the parameters for EVERYONE. Whether they are good or not is irrelevant. Saying "it's not fair" is not a good negotiation tactic. Those parameters are what they all have to work with. And negotiations work one of the two ways that I outlined. He's either going to have to take a nice, long deal like Tyron Smith or he's going to have to wait until his contract is up to get a sick deal. Teams can't afford to tear up rookie contracts and make guys the highest paid at their position. That's the whole allure of draft picks - they give you the opportunity to acquire good talent on the cheap. If you suddenly start paying them before their contracts expire, who is going to be on your team? There are 53 players and only $133 million in cap space. I think Joseph, Andre, and Schaub's contracts alone take up more than $33 million of this year's number, so you have to average less than $2 million per player for the rest of them. Levi Brown, Foster, and Cushing aren't cheap.
dhockster
Footballguy
You are right that the system is what the system is and right now that is what Watt has to work with. To be clear, I do not think he is saying it's not fair, I think he is only pointing out to the Media that he thinks he has earned better pay based on his play. His popularity is really the only negiotiating chip he has so he is trying to use this to move negotiations. He can't do anything about the current CBA but he can still do everything he can to try to get the Texans to redo his deal. You would do the same thing if you were at the top of your profession and other less qualified people were making more than you because of a contract that was in place before you entered the profession.
I very rarely take the players side in contract situations but this is one instance where I think a player deserves a new deal. Doesn't mean the Texans have to give him one, but I hope it happens.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
my thoughts are that people love to complain.
when the texans repeatedly appease johnson with all these new deals you complain.
when they sign these other guys to new deals you complain.
now, you're complaining that they haven't done the exact same thing with watt.
I think the ghost of al davis should come visit you this xmas so you can learn the error of your ways.
when the texans repeatedly appease johnson with all these new deals you complain.
when they sign these other guys to new deals you complain.
now, you're complaining that they haven't done the exact same thing with watt.
I think the ghost of al davis should come visit you this xmas so you can learn the error of your ways.
dhockster
Footballguy
I am a fan. I want the team to sign the right deal everytime. I want the team to sign my favorite player to a huge contract until he stinks and then I want them to cut him. I reserve the right to second guess everything. Geez... don't you know how to be a fan?
dhockster
Footballguy
Interesting article on what a Watt contract might look like:
http://overthecap.com/projecting-contract-jj-watt/
http://overthecap.com/projecting-contract-jj-watt/
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
I thought being a fan meant rooting for your team -- not nitpicking the #### out of them
dhockster
Footballguy
My main point was I thought the Texans should reward their best player for playing great. My secondary point was that the Texans may have difficulty doing this because they have made some questionable cap decisions in the past.
Regardless of these two points, I will root for the Texans. Lighten up, Francis.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
GregR
Footballguy
dhockster
Footballguy
O'Brien was very happy with how he looked in the practices he participated in with the Broncos. He said he did not feel the need to start all his starters since they got in work against another team during the week.
I think at this point Arian is good to go. I think he may have had a slight hamstring issue, but I think it is just as likely that he was using some of that as an excuse to avoid preseason work and be ready for the regular
season. I have no problem with this since he was used so much by Kubiak.
DawnBTVS
Footballguy
One other thing to point out is that by sitting Foster for the preseason, it's allowed other players such as Grimes and Blue to make more of an impact and impression on O'Brien and the coaching staff. Knowing O'Brien from his days with the Patriots and Penn State, he would rather have a stable of running backs to utilize and this allows him to see the strengths of each individual for matchup duty down the road.
Last edited by a moderator:
dhockster
Footballguy
If Keenum plays poorly, I don't think he will be one of the three. I think the Texans would likely sign a veteran QB cut from another team.
dhockster
Footballguy
Keenum has given the Texans no reason to keep him. If a decent back-up QB is cut, I think they will cut Keenum.
Think about it, Keenum is an undrafted free agent, he is 0-8 as a starter, he wasn't signed by this coaching staff, and he has shown nothing this pre-season. Other than he went
to U of H and has some local fan support, there is absolutely no reason to keep him.
GregR
Footballguy
Unfortunately the local fan support creates enough distraction for the team it is even extra reason to cut him. That's one thing I think the supporters of Tebow never understood, just how much their behavior hurt the very player they were supporting. Granted this is orders of magnitude less than Tebow. But when no other city in the NFL would have this level desire to see him as the QB, it's a pretty good sign the support is based in other than what he's showing on the NFL field so far.
Though with all the talk about O'brien wanting people who know the system and all, that might give Keenum an edge if other options are equal. Just that he's had a few months in the system now, while anyone else is coming in a blank slate. Should McGloin or Mallett become available though I would think he might jump at getting them at the expense of Case.
Though with all the talk about O'brien wanting people who know the system and all, that might give Keenum an edge if other options are equal. Just that he's had a few months in the system now, while anyone else is coming in a blank slate. Should McGloin or Mallett become available though I would think he might jump at getting them at the expense of Case.
dhockster
Footballguy
That's even more of an indictment against Keenum. he supposedly "knows" the system, and he is still this bad. I don't think any decent FA QB they sign could do worse than Case even with the fact that they don't know the system yet.
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
What do you guys think the chances are that Fitzpatrick gets replaced at any point this season?
dhockster
Footballguy
If it were based purely on his pre-season performances I would say it was extremely likely. But since Keenum and Savage have been so bad, it is not likely early in the season. If the Texans are out of it by week 11 or 12, I could definitely
see Savage getting some late season starts to get some experience and for the Texans to see whether they need to go back into the draft for a future QB.
If the Texans cut Keenum, definitely keep an eye on whatever veteran they bring in to be back-up to assess whether they have any starting potential.
GregR
Footballguy
I think you summed the situation up well. I don't expect Fitzpatrick to play well enough that replacing him isn't looked at during the season. I'm just not sure there's much reason to think it's going to improve anything at this point. A poorly playing Fitzpatrick is probably still the best option unless you're looking at getting experience for a Savage, or Keenum, to see more of what you might or might not have in them.
coolnerd
Footballguy
Cuts as far as I can tell
Boswell, Chris K 6-2 185 R Rice
Denham, Anthony TE 6-4 235 R Utah
Labhart, Travis WR 5-9 182 23 0 Texas A&M
Opurum, Toben RB 6-1 250 23 2 Kansas
Potter, Zach TE 6-7 269 28 4 Nebraska
Starling, Jawanza SAF 6-1 206 23 2 USC
Quentin Groves OLB 6-3 265 30 6 Auburn
Mike Farrell T 6-6 303 1 Penn State
Young, Chris ILB 6-0 252 R Arizona State
Harris, Brandon CB 5-10 189 24 4 Miami (Fla.)
McAllister, Chris OLB 6-2 255 R Baylor
Mathews, Ricardo DT 6-3 300 27 5 Cincinnati
Browner, Keith DE 6-4 288 26 2 California
Warmsley, Julius DE 6-2 296 R Tulane
Williams, Marcus CB 5-11 196 R North Dakota State
Kupper, Alex G 6-3 299 24 2 Louisville
Irwin, Bronson G 6-4 316 22 0 Oklahoma
Ferentz, James C 6-2 285 R Iowa
Groves, Quentin OLB 6-3 265 30 6 Auburn
Bullough, Max ILB 6-3 249 22 0 Michigan State
Hazel, Paul
Feiler, Matt T 6-6 330 R Bloomsburg
Bester, Lacoltan WR 6-3 208 R Oklahoma
Nwachukwu, Uzoma WR 5-11 198 23 2 Texas A&M
Boswell, Chris K 6-2 185 R Rice
Denham, Anthony TE 6-4 235 R Utah
Labhart, Travis WR 5-9 182 23 0 Texas A&M
Opurum, Toben RB 6-1 250 23 2 Kansas
Potter, Zach TE 6-7 269 28 4 Nebraska
Starling, Jawanza SAF 6-1 206 23 2 USC
Quentin Groves OLB 6-3 265 30 6 Auburn
Mike Farrell T 6-6 303 1 Penn State
Young, Chris ILB 6-0 252 R Arizona State
Harris, Brandon CB 5-10 189 24 4 Miami (Fla.)
McAllister, Chris OLB 6-2 255 R Baylor
Mathews, Ricardo DT 6-3 300 27 5 Cincinnati
Browner, Keith DE 6-4 288 26 2 California
Warmsley, Julius DE 6-2 296 R Tulane
Williams, Marcus CB 5-11 196 R North Dakota State
Kupper, Alex G 6-3 299 24 2 Louisville
Irwin, Bronson G 6-4 316 22 0 Oklahoma
Ferentz, James C 6-2 285 R Iowa
Groves, Quentin OLB 6-3 265 30 6 Auburn
Bullough, Max ILB 6-3 249 22 0 Michigan State
Hazel, Paul
Feiler, Matt T 6-6 330 R Bloomsburg
Bester, Lacoltan WR 6-3 208 R Oklahoma
Nwachukwu, Uzoma WR 5-11 198 23 2 Texas A&M
Similar threads
