The Raiders are nuts if they take Russell #1 (1 Viewer)

[JohnnyU]

No way the QBs in this draft rank as well as last year's, and if Russell goes #1 overall, that means the Raiders will have to pay this guy more than Young and Leniart, and do you think he's better than both of those guys? I don't believe the Raiders should be tying up all that money in a QB that I don't believe is worthy of a #1 overall pick, just because they need a QB. When you have the #1 overall pick and need help in several areas, you have to take the BPA or trade down, not draft for need. The value their getting in Russell doesn't match the draft position when considering cost of that player vs team needs.

 

[EBF]

I completely agree. Johnson should be the pick.

 

[massraider]

Yeah, I disagree.

 

[gzilla]

No way the QBs in this draft rank as well as last year's, and if Russell goes #1 overall, that means the Raiders will have to pay this guy more than Young and Leniart, and do you think he's better than both of those guys? I don't believe the Raiders should be tying up all that money in a QB that I don't believe is worthy of a #1 overall pick, just because they need a QB. When you have the #1 overall pick and need help in several areas, you have to take the BPA or trade down, not draft for need. The value their getting in Russell doesn't match the draft position when considering cost of that player vs team needs.

I think Russell is better than both guys last year. QB is always a bit of a leap of faith but there hasn't been a passer like Russell to enter the draft in a long time. He's that good.Now, personally, I think CJ is really hard to pass on. But, I think QB is a bigger need that WR. Anything other than those 2 would be a major mistake IMO.

 

[Chaos Commish]

Yeah, I disagree.

I'm with stupid.

 

[JohnnyU]

No way the QBs in this draft rank as well as last year's, and if Russell goes #1 overall, that means the Raiders will have to pay this guy more than Young and Leniart, and do you think he's better than both of those guys? I don't believe the Raiders should be tying up all that money in a QB that I don't believe is worthy of a #1 overall pick, just because they need a QB. When you have the #1 overall pick and need help in several areas, you have to take the BPA or trade down, not draft for need. The value their getting in Russell doesn't match the draft position when considering cost of that player vs team needs.

I think Russell is better than both guys last year. QB is always a bit of a leap of faith but there hasn't been a passer like Russell to enter the draft in a long time. He's that good.Now, personally, I think CJ is really hard to pass on. But, I think QB is a bigger need that WR. Anything other than those 2 would be a major mistake IMO.

Sorry, but Russell is a long way off from helping the Raiders. They should use that pick more wisely. There have been plenty of one year wonders that shot to the top of the draft board that didn't pan out, and even if he does turn out OK, his cost will make it even more difficult for the Raiders help themselves in other areas long term. What they really need to do is trade the pick.. Jeff George could throw it 80 yds as well.

 

[bostonfred]

When I look back at the quarterbacks who have been taken this early, I always seem to prefer the ones that everyone said were more NFL ready, like Manning and Palmer. When I think of the ones who had the physical gifts and lots of upside, guys like Ryan Leaf, Akili Smith, and Jeff George come to mind. I don't know if it's correct, or if it's fair to judge Russell by my half-assed memory, but I wouldn't take Russell with the #1 pick or even a top 5 pick.

 

[Capella]

Going to be a complete bust. Only player in that 'top-7' group of guys I would be angry about if the Bucs ended up with him.

Thankfully, we all have the Raiders to fall back on.

 

[Ilov80s]

- played against top notch SEC competition

- experience 2 full seasons as starter

- winning record (10-1, 11-2)

- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP

- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.

- 6-6 258

- A+ arm strength

coming off this season:

232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb rating

Now where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?

how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

 

[JohnnyU]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

 

[massraider]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

 

[JohnnyU]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

 

[massraider]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

Hey, maybe not.Care to answer the question?What if they are sitting there next year, and staring at Calais Campbell and Jake Long, and they are both rated higher than any QB (Very much a possibility)? DE and OT, both needs................QB is not the BPA. What then? Is it OK to reach then?

 

[JohnnyU]

Even if Russell eventually turns out pretty good, by the time that happens (and I think it will take Russell awhile to be good), he would have already left for free agency before the Raiders have accumulated enough talent to be competitive.

 

[JohnnyU]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

Hey, maybe not.Care to answer the question?What if they are sitting there next year, and staring at Calais Campbell and Jake Long, and they are both rated higher than any QB (Very much a possibility)? DE and OT, both needs................QB is not the BPA. What then? Is it OK to reach then?

Personally, I don't think you ever reach on any position with the #1 overall pick, and you sure don't draft for need with the #1 overall pick unless that player matches the draft position. I just don't think Russell matches the draft position. If you aren't talking about the #1 overall pick next year, sure it's ok to reach a little bit later in the draft.

 

[massraider]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

Hey, maybe not.Care to answer the question?What if they are sitting there next year, and staring at Calais Campbell and Jake Long, and they are both rated higher than any QB (Very much a possibility)? DE and OT, both needs................QB is not the BPA. What then? Is it OK to reach then?

Personally, I don't think you ever reach on any position with the #1 overall pick.

So the answer is: No, you don't take a QB next year in the first round either.What if the Raiders aren't drafting #1? What if they are #3, and it is the same situation?

 

[JohnnyU]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

Hey, maybe not.Care to answer the question?What if they are sitting there next year, and staring at Calais Campbell and Jake Long, and they are both rated higher than any QB (Very much a possibility)? DE and OT, both needs................QB is not the BPA. What then? Is it OK to reach then?

Personally, I don't think you ever reach on any position with the #1 overall pick.

So the answer is: No, you don't take a QB next year in the first round either.What if the Raiders aren't drafting #1? What if they are #3, and it is the same situation?

If the value of the QB matches the #3 value and no worse than say #7 thru #10, then yes, draft the QB if you are desperate. But no way do you spend a #3 overall pick on a QB that is late first rd talent.

 

[massraider]

- played against top notch SEC competition- experience 2 full seasons as starter- winning record (10-1, 11-2)- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.- 6-6 258- A+ arm strengthcoming off this season:232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb ratingNow where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

Hey, maybe not.Care to answer the question?What if they are sitting there next year, and staring at Calais Campbell and Jake Long, and they are both rated higher than any QB (Very much a possibility)? DE and OT, both needs................QB is not the BPA. What then? Is it OK to reach then?

Personally, I don't think you ever reach on any position with the #1 overall pick, and you sure don't draft for need with the #1 overall pick unless that player matches the draft position. I just don't think Russell matches the draft position.

Oh, no, I got that. I understand. You don't think Russell matches the draft position. Gotcha.My question is, if we are going BPA, what if a QB doesn't match the draft position next year? Or the year after?Do we keep accumulating 2nd and 3rd round QBs till one of them shoots out of the gate a Hall of Famer? (Cue the Tom Brady/Joe Montana reference)

 

[massraider]

- played against top notch SEC competition

- experience 2 full seasons as starter

- winning record (10-1, 11-2)

- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP

- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.

- 6-6 258

- A+ arm strength

coming off this season:

232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb rating

Now where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?

how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

Hey, maybe not.Care to answer the question?

What if they are sitting there next year, and staring at Calais Campbell and Jake Long, and they are both rated higher than any QB (Very much a possibility)? DE and OT, both needs................QB is not the BPA. What then? Is it OK to reach then?

Personally, I don't think you ever reach on any position with the #1 overall pick.

So the answer is: No, you don't take a QB next year in the first round either.

What if the Raiders aren't drafting #1? What if they are #3, and it is the same situation?

If the value of the QB matches the #3 value and no worse than say #7, then yes, draft the QB. But no way do you spend a #3 overall pick on a QB that is late first rd talent.

Is that the value you place on Russell?

 

[JohnnyU]

- played against top notch SEC competition

- experience 2 full seasons as starter

- winning record (10-1, 11-2)

- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP

- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.

- 6-6 258

- A+ arm strength

coming off this season:

232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb rating

Now where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?

how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He just hasn't done enough, and I feel is still very raw IMO. That's too much of a risk when considering the cost of that player vs overall team needs. If they don't hit a home run with Russell, it could set them back a decade. They could always draft a QB next year or even later in this draft, and use the extra picks to fill several needs at a lower cost.

Yeah, but they're still gonna have more than one need next year. And what happens next year if, when they pick, a QB isn't the BPA?

Maybe they won't have as many needs if they get several picks for this one and use them wisely

Hey, maybe not.Care to answer the question?

What if they are sitting there next year, and staring at Calais Campbell and Jake Long, and they are both rated higher than any QB (Very much a possibility)? DE and OT, both needs................QB is not the BPA. What then? Is it OK to reach then?

Personally, I don't think you ever reach on any position with the #1 overall pick.

So the answer is: No, you don't take a QB next year in the first round either.

What if the Raiders aren't drafting #1? What if they are #3, and it is the same situation?

If the value of the QB matches the #3 value and no worse than say #7, then yes, draft the QB. But no way do you spend a #3 overall pick on a QB that is late first rd talent.

Is that the value you place on Russell?

No (talking if the same situation came up next year), but there's a big difference in the money they would have to pay Russell at #1 overall vs say #6 or #7, etc. I don't think he's worth more money than either Young or Leinart.

 

[radballs]

Al Davis will take the BPA regardless in CJ. Case closed.

 

[massraider]

We aren't talking about money at all here. We were talking about value of player.

Personally, I am not sure the money should enter into it. Because you could make a good case that paying a rookie WR that kind of money is all kinds of stupid.

If a player busts at #1 it hurts, same with #4.

Not worth more than Young and Leinart? What the......I don't think Gaines Adams should get more than Leinart, but he will.

Are you really going to base draft decisions based on what players got paid last year, and your perceived value in relation this year? Let's hope not, because otherwise, CJ would go #1, then everyone for the next 5 picks might try and pass.

 

[massraider]

This must be a fishing trip. I'm a sucker.

 

[softball]

Al Davis will take the BPA regardless in CJ. Case closed.

I agree, and bring in McCown. The Raiders rarely draft a QB #1 (Wilson,Marenavich sp?)They go get someone elses QB.I have been saying for a while what they should do is take CJ and then grab Trent Edwards in Round #2 if they want a good young QB to groom.BTW: Still no word that they have changed their minds on Andrew Walter being a decent prospect.JMO

 

[JohnnyU]

We aren't talking about money at all here. We were talking about value of player.

Well, before I go to bed, I will say that I WAS talking about money (cost of #1 overall) vs player value. I don't think Russell's value and risk is worth the money it's going to cost the Raiders vs the overall team needs. I believe the Raiders would come out further ahead in the long run to accumulate some picks this year to fill other team needs and draft a QB next year, or trade for one this year or next.

 

[Giggity]

- played against top notch SEC competition

- experience 2 full seasons as starter

- winning record (10-1, 11-2)

- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP

- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.

- 6-6 258

- A+ arm strength

coming off this season:

232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb rating

Now where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?

how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He looked VERY average against the top SEC teams this year.Swap his ND game with his game against Florida, and he wouldn't be a 1st round pick. Just to refresh.

24 for 41 228 yards 3 ints 1 td

Heck, I'll toss is his game against Auburn.

20 for 25 269 yards 0 tds.

So Florida and Auburn kicked his ###, and he's ready to be the #1 overall pick and play in the NFL? He had a great supporting cast, would chuck it into double coverage far too often, and generally relied on his atheism to carry him. Here's a clue, that doesn't work in the NFL. He could be 7'2 290, that doesn't mean squat. He's not careful with the ball, he makes bad decisions, and against the good defenses he got his ### kicked.

Not to mention he showed up at the combine fat. Lost 9lbs between the combine and his pro day? Really? Have you seen Quinn? That guy is cut.

Brady Quinn

So a QB who spends that much time in film study, is that cut? That's called work ethic. Throw it 80 yards? Really? 7 step drop? That's going to be his big play? Scramble around and throw it 80 yards? That's really going to fly in the NFL? Come on.

Accuracy. Reading defenses. Taking care of the ball.

That's the new breed of NFL QB. The Favre type QB is dying. You just can't have 15-20-25 INTs. Rivers had 22 tds 9 ints. That's what you need from your NFL QB. Name a stud QB that relies on his physical tools. Manning, Brady, McNabb, Bulger, Hass, Rivers, Palmer, those guys barely move around (Mcnabb will never run like he used to, and he'd kill you from the pocket, not running around). You don't need a freak of nature at QB. You need a workaholic who takes care of the ball who is a student of the game.

Listen Russell has some great tools, but I'm not giving him 60Mil. Sorry, not going to do it. And no, I wouldn't give it to Quinn either.

 

[JaxBill]

- played against top notch SEC competition

- experience 2 full seasons as starter

- winning record (10-1, 11-2)

- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP

- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.

- 6-6 258

- A+ arm strength

coming off this season:

232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb rating

Now where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?

how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

I just want to chime in the fact that the NCAA QB rating is different than the NFL's. Russell's QB rating (season) would be 114.28 under NFL computations. (Still very good)http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/calc-p...mp;t=28&i=8

Let me ask you this: Would you be worried about his performance in these 3 road games (toughest games of the year)?

Opponent Score   QBRat Comp Att Pct Yds Y/A TD Int @Auburn L 3-7   81.7 20 35 57.1 269 7.7 0 0   @Florida L 10-23   51.7 24 41 58.5 228 5.6 1 3 @Tennessee W 28-24   79.3 24 36 66.7 247 6.9 3 3

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/players/102446

 

[Chaos Commish]

Pretty much the same topic. I think Boltbacker nails this one in that thread.

JU - this comes down to how Russell grades. Kiffin has gushed about him as a QB, a leader, and a person. Al has compared him to Elway.

 

[Chaos Commish]

Manning was awful against Jax and Baltimore.

 

[Ilov80s]

- played against top notch SEC competition

- experience 2 full seasons as starter

- winning record (10-1, 11-2)

- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP

- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.

- 6-6 258

- A+ arm strength

coming off this season:

232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb rating

Now where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?

how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

I just want to chime in the fact that the NCAA QB rating is different than the NFL's. Russell's QB rating (season) would be 114.28 under NFL computations. (Still very good)http://football.stassen.com/cgi-bin/calc-p...mp;t=28&i=8

Let me ask you this: Would you be worried about his performance in these 3 road games (toughest games of the year)?

Opponent Score   QBRat Comp Att Pct Yds Y/A TD Int @Auburn L 3-7   81.7 20 35 57.1 269 7.7 0 0   @Florida L 10-23   51.7 24 41 58.5 228 5.6 1 3 @Tennessee W 28-24   79.3 24 36 66.7 247 6.9 3 3

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/players/102446

Its no different then looking at how Quinn played against UM and LSU. BTW, I wouldn't call 20-25 for 269 yards and 0 ints a bad game.

 

[Riffraff]

Russell is a project QB. I'd draft Calvin if I were Raider King for a day.

Sweet upside, no doubt. But poor foot mechanics at this point in his game.

Can't live off his arm strength in the NFL.

He was surrounded by NFL level prospects at LSU. That helped.

Calvin's more NFL ready and has more trade-ability.

 

[cstu]

I completely agree. Johnson should be the pick.

Agreed, and then try to trade down.

 

[Jedimaster21]

There will be variance in talent level with each position over a several year period. Just because Russel may not be as good a prospect as Young, Cutler, and Leinart, doesn't mean he won't be a franchise QB. There are many opportunities to get quality players at other positions later in the draft and in FA. It is MUCH harder to get a franchise QB, because they never get traded once they are considered such. If you look at all the starting QBs in the league, there are a lot of very early picks behind center. You just don't see many late first rounders or later round picks emerging at QB compared to other positions. I just don't think the Raiders can pass up the opportunity to get a franchise QB with the first pick. Whether it is Quinn or Russell, they should decide who they like better and pick them.

 

[Stealthycat]

FWIW I watched Russell play Arkansas this past year. His game stats

J. Russell 22-14-0 210 2 47 longest pass 2 sacks

Not bad but I don't remember a vertical pass of more than 10 yards. What he did was hit short slant routes and his recievers did all the yardage gains.

What does that mean ? Only that his high completion rate and yardages and all came from dinky stuff a high school QB could have made. He didn't impress me as a WOW QB ......

 

[Verbal Kint]

- played against top notch SEC competition

- experience 2 full seasons as starter

- winning record (10-1, 11-2)

- awards: 1st team SEC, Sugar Bowl MVP

- great guy: housed 20 New Orleans refugees in his apartment.

- 6-6 258

- A+ arm strength

coming off this season:

232-342 / 68% / 3129 yards / 28 tds / 8 ints / 167.04 qb rating

Now where is the reasoning that Russell isn't worthy of the 1st pick?

how can you fault anybody for drafting JaMarucs?

He looked VERY average against the top SEC teams this year.Swap his ND game with his game against Florida, and he wouldn't be a 1st round pick. Just to refresh.

24 for 41 228 yards 3 ints 1 td

Heck, I'll toss is his game against Auburn.

20 for 25 269 yards 0 tds.

So Florida and Auburn kicked his ###, and he's ready to be the #1 overall pick and play in the NFL? He had a great supporting cast, would chuck it into double coverage far too often, and generally relied on his atheism to carry him. Here's a clue, that doesn't work in the NFL. He could be 7'2 290, that doesn't mean squat. He's not careful with the ball, he makes bad decisions, and against the good defenses he got his ### kicked.

Not to mention he showed up at the combine fat. Lost 9lbs between the combine and his pro day? Really? Have you seen Quinn? That guy is cut.

Brady Quinn

So a QB who spends that much time in film study, is that cut? That's called work ethic. Throw it 80 yards? Really? 7 step drop? That's going to be his big play? Scramble around and throw it 80 yards? That's really going to fly in the NFL? Come on.

Accuracy. Reading defenses. Taking care of the ball.

That's the new breed of NFL QB. The Favre type QB is dying. You just can't have 15-20-25 INTs. Rivers had 22 tds 9 ints. That's what you need from your NFL QB. Name a stud QB that relies on his physical tools. Manning, Brady, McNabb, Bulger, Hass, Rivers, Palmer, those guys barely move around (Mcnabb will never run like he used to, and he'd kill you from the pocket, not running around). You don't need a freak of nature at QB. You need a workaholic who takes care of the ball who is a student of the game.

Listen Russell has some great tools, but I'm not giving him 60Mil. Sorry, not going to do it. And no, I wouldn't give it to Quinn either.

 

[Verbal Kint]

I'll add that QBs who rely on their athleticism can make an impact earlier in their career, but tend to level off if they can't master the intricacies of the offense. (case study - Vick, Mike)

 

[Traders2001]

You dont draft a WR with the #1 pick in the draft , either you trade down or you take the only player worthy of the #1 pick ( ADP ).

 

[Chunky Soup]

I'll add that QBs who rely on their athleticism can make an impact earlier in their career, but tend to level off if they can't master the intricacies of the offense. (case study - Vick, Mike)

Russell isn't a running QB.

 

[Chunky Soup]

Scouts have been saying Russell is the best QB they've seen in the pro-day. Tom Martinez, a highly respected QB coach is obsessed with Russell. Teams that have brought him in for an interview say he's intelligent, down-to-earth and has a great head on his shoulders. He has one of the strongest arms in all of the NFL right now. For Oakland, Russell is an even bigger plus as they don't need a better line with him. He's big enough to be able to handle a worse line.

Seems like a great fit in OAK to me.

 

[Ilov80s]

I'll add that QBs who rely on their athleticism can make an impact earlier in their career, but tend to level off if they can't master the intricacies of the offense. (case study - Vick, Mike)

The more fitting comparison is CPep.

 

[Enderdog]

Until the Raiders do something with the OL (like trade down and hope for a shot at Thomas), either Quinn or Russell will be laying down as much as Walter last year.

 

[JAA]

For the most part, I agree with JU. However, if Oak cant get proper value for the pick, they would be stupid not to take Russell. just because they take Russell, doesnt mean that Russell is the best player ever. It simply means he was the best player to take at this draft position conidering the teams needs.

 

[Verbal Kint]

I'll add that QBs who rely on their athleticism can make an impact earlier in their career, but tend to level off if they can't master the intricacies of the offense. (case study - Vick, Mike)

Russell isn't a running QB.

I didn't say he was a running QB. I said he relies on his athleticism.

 

[fsufan]

I'll add that QBs who rely on their athleticism can make an impact earlier in their career, but tend to level off if they can't master the intricacies of the offense. (case study - Vick, Mike)

Russell isn't a running QB.

I didn't say he was a running QB. I said he relies on his athleticism.

listing to Mike and Mike and Todd M says he was told Russell will go #1

 

[massraider]

FWIW I watched Russell play Arkansas this past year. His game statsJ. Russell 22-14-0 210 2 47 longest pass 2 sacksNot bad but I don't remember a vertical pass of more than 10 yards. What he did was hit short slant routes and his recievers did all the yardage gains. What does that mean ? Only that his high completion rate and yardages and all came from dinky stuff a high school QB could have made. He didn't impress me as a WOW QB ......

Catch any of his other games? Like Alabama? Or Notre Dame? Yeah, the kid puts it downfield. That may be the most bizarre argument ever. That was not a Texas Tech offense he ran. The kid put it downfield regularly.By the way, if you're trying to scare me off Russell by explaining how he hit short timing routes, and his receivers did after-the-catch damage, I can safely say it won't work.

 

[massraider]

I'll add that QBs who rely on their athleticism can make an impact earlier in their career, but tend to level off if they can't master the intricacies of the offense. (case study - Vick, Mike)

The more fitting comparison is CPep.

He doesn't even run that much. How about Roethlisberger?Russell, by the way, comes from a better program than either of those QBs.

 

[ATC1]

Yes, I'm an LSU fan and no, I'm not completely sold on Russel. He is a make or break QB and I would actually like to see him sit for a year or two before he gets a start, but that won't happen.

Right now OAK is deterimining if they will take CJ. If they want a QB then they will trade down with TB who is desperate to get up to the #1.

I think the TB staff got their hands on as many available QBs as they could to put the pressure on OAK to take a QB. If a trade goes down I would like to see one of the TB QBs involved. Then OAK can choose Russell, Quinn, or Thomas at the #4 spot. They can groom Russell a bit. If they get Thomas they have a decent starting QB from TB, and wait for the franchise next year. Or they have Quinn and have a nice backup. They also get the extra picks from TB to build a solid O-line for the future.

 

[massraider]

Yes, I'm an LSU fan and no, I'm not completely sold on Russel. He is a make or break QB and I would actually like to see him sit for a year or two before he gets a start, but that won't happen.Right now OAK is deterimining if they will take CJ. If they want a QB then they will trade down with TB who is desperate to get up to the #1. I thin the TB staff got their hands on as many available QBs as they could to put the pressure on OAK to take a QB. If a trade goes down I would like to see one of the TB QBs involved. Then OAK can choose Russell, Quinn, or Thomas at the #4 spot. They can groom Russell a bit. If they get Thomas they have a decent starting QB from TB, and wait for the franchise next year. Or they have Quinn and have a nice backup. They also get the extra picks from TB to build a solid O-line for the future.

I don't think Oakland is determining anything. I think unless an 11th hour trade offer blows them away, they are talking contract with Russell.Very little mystery here, IMO. McShay, Schefter, MacDonald, Nancy Gay, everyone is saying it's Russell. They've brought in no QB, Moss is still on the team, very little points to anything but Russell.Not saying it's a lock. But it's close

 

[-OZ-]

No way the QBs in this draft rank as well as last year's, and if Russell goes #1 overall, that means the Raiders will have to pay this guy more than Young and Leniart, and do you think he's better than both of those guys? I don't believe the Raiders should be tying up all that money in a QB that I don't believe is worthy of a #1 overall pick, just because they need a QB. When you have the #1 overall pick and need help in several areas, you have to take the BPA or trade down, not draft for need. The value their getting in Russell doesn't match the draft position when considering cost of that player vs team needs.

I think Russell is better than both guys last year. QB is always a bit of a leap of faith but there hasn't been a passer like Russell to enter the draft in a long time. He's that good.Now, personally, I think CJ is really hard to pass on. But, I think QB is a bigger need that WR. Anything other than those 2 would be a major mistake IMO.

How long exactly are you suggesting? While I personally consider all 3 last year to be better, I can see an argument that Russell is better than 06 or 05. Maybe all the way back to 03, although I disagree. I've watched quite a few LSU games this year and while I like Russell, if we ranked the last 5 drafts (07-03), he'd be around 6th on my list. I might prefer Quinn.

 

[Whiplash Inc.]

I like the option of trading down and taking Quinn a few spots lower. Russell is just a bit too raw to be the #1 guy. They shouldn't just stick at 1 and pick anyQB, just because they have such a big hole to fill there.

If they don't trade down, just invest all that money in the can't miss prospect (imagine the merchandise sales of Calvin Johnson Raiders shirts, etc) and get Trent Edwards with the first pick of the second round.

Ugh...I just keep going back and forth... I don't know what the right thing to do is.. LOL