Today's Scottish vote to leave the UK (1 Viewer)

[TheIronSheik]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

 

[Gawain]

Kinda makes that Civil War we had seem a little pointless.

 

[Tom Servo]

They haven't actually voted to leave yet. You might want to change the title GB.

 

[Doug B]

I read the title as such "Scottish citizens voted YES to leaving the UK". Like it officially went through. I knew the vote was coming, but I didn't know when.

Not smart enough about UK internal politics to have a meaningful opinion, but I am insterested in the outcome of the vote all the same.

 

[McGarnicle]

Let's just say, no sheep will be safe.

 

[TheIronSheik]

They haven't actually voted to leave yet. You might want to change the title GB.

It's just a subject about the Scottish vote to leave the UK. The Scots vote tomorrow. It's the Scottish vote to leave the UK.

 

[Doug B]

What does the polling look like? Is an independent Scotland now an eventuality? Or is it too close to call even now?

 

[timschochet]

I dinna ken.

 

[Doug B]

It's just a subject about the Scottish vote to leave the UK. The Scots vote tomorrow. It's the Scottish vote to leave the UK.

Even being aware of the Scots/Scottish distinction, I still misread tre OP title. No real harm, though ... might get some more eyeballs on the thread.

 

[timschochet]

Farewell ye dungeons dark and strong,
Farewell, farewell tae thee,
MacPhersons time will no be lang,
On yonder gallow's tree

It was by a woman's treachorous hands,
That I was condemned to dee,
She stood uben a windae ledge,
and a blanket threw o'er me

(chorus)
Sae rantingly, sae wantonly,
Ans sae dauntingly gaed he,
He played a tune and he danced around
Below the gallow's tree
(chorus)

Oh what is death, but parting breath
On mony a bloody plain
I've daur'd his face, and in his place
I scorn him yet again

(chorus)

I have lived a life, o' straught and strife
I die by treachery
It burns my heart, that I must depart
An no avenged be

(chorus)

So tak these bands fae aff my hands
Gae to me my sword
There's nae a man in a' Scotland
But I'll brave him at a word

(chorus)

Now farewell light thou sunshine bright
And all beneath the sky
May coward shame distain his name
The wretch that dare not die

 

[TheIronSheik]

What does the polling look like? Is an independent Scotland now an eventuality? Or is it too close to call even now?

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

 

[Doug B]

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

<slow whistle>

I wonder what even led up to having such a vote. Didn't think the Scots were still bristling in the 21st century, but what do I know?

 

[Josie Maran]

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

<slow whistle>

I wonder what even led up to having such a vote. Didn't think the Scots were still bristling in the 21st century, but what do I know?

Braveheart revival at the Edinburgh Odeon.

 

[timschochet]

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

<slow whistle>

I wonder what even led up to having such a vote. Didn't think the Scots were still bristling in the 21st century, but what do I know?

Braveheart revival at the Edinburgh Odeon.

I used to love Braveheart. But now I can't stand looking at that guy's face.

 

[CBusAlex]

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

<slow whistle>

I wonder what even led up to having such a vote. Didn't think the Scots were still bristling in the 21st century, but what do I know?

From what I understand, the Scots are a good deal more liberal than the English. They'd like to have a larger welfare state more like the Scandinavian countries, but they can't get that as part of the UK.

 

[Tom Servo]

What does the polling look like? Is an independent Scotland now an eventuality? Or is it too close to call even now?

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

Should I expect to find the dead voting in Inverness or excess ballots found in Kilmarnock?

 

[Spanky267]

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

<slow whistle>

I wonder what even led up to having such a vote. Didn't think the Scots were still bristling in the 21st century, but what do I know?

From what I understand, the Scots are a good deal more liberal than the English. They'd like to have a larger welfare state more like the Scandinavian countries, but they can't get that as part of the UK.

Will they have the economic wherewithall as an independent nation to provide it? I think its a horrible thing for the Scots and for the UK. They are stronger together than seperate.

 

[whoknew]

What does the polling look like? Is an independent Scotland now an eventuality? Or is it too close to call even now?

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

Should I expect to find the dead voting in Inverness or excess ballots found in Kilmarnock?

On Bovada, its +400 for a yes vote and -600 for a no vote.

Seems like its maybe not as close as the polls indicate.

 

[timschochet]

Does the Lochness Monster get a vote?

 

[Eephus]

Even if Yes wins, there will be a lot of discussion about who gets the North Sea oil reserves

 

[TheIronSheik]

So what time do the polls open and close ET? When should we expect to know one way or the other?

 

[snogger]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..

One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

 

[TheIronSheik]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..

One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

I heard about this, too. Apparently if they win independence, they want them gone immediately.

So if they win, do they have to vote for a PM or President? Or does the highest ranking Scotsman just assume that role? Seems like it would be a lot of work to just start a new country from scratch. Or course if they do it well, maybe they could send the User Manual to Iraq, Egypt and Syria.

 

[Ned]

One of the downfalls to avoiding all news... I had no idea this was going on. Crazy.

 

[zamboni]

May have to break out my Bay City Rollers albums if they vote yes.

 

[TheIronSheik]

One of the downfalls to avoiding all news... I had no idea this was going on. Crazy.

Right. I feel the same way. Saw it on CNN.com the other day and thought WTF?!? I didn't even know this was something in the works. And then upon reading deeper, it turns out there are a lot of places in the world (and not crappy parts of the world, like Africa or the Middle East) that want the same thing. Places in Spain, Belgium and Canada to name just a few that I read.

 

[glock]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..

One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

Except that until the early 1700's Scotland was an independent country...

 

[TheIronSheik]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..

One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

Except that until the early 1700's Scotland was an independent country...

He said the best way he could come up with. He didn't say it was perfect. But I get what you're saying.

 

[Spanky267]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..

One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

I read that too. Scottish independence would require the repositioning of significant portions of the armed forces of the UK. Her Majesties Naval Base Clyde is the Royal Navy's HQ in Scotland and also the home of the RN's Ballisitc Missile Submarines. Scottish independence will most likely require that the UK's Armed forces in Scotland relocate to England or Wales.

 

[CBusAlex]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

Except that until the early 1700's Scotland was an independent country...

Okay, so just Texas then.

 

[Eephus]

The ballot wording is deceptively simple for such a complicated matter.

"Should Scotland be an independent country?"

There are tons of unanswered questions that will have to be answered. From what I've read, there is a lot of nationalist resentment that Scotland has been left out compared to the relative prosperity of the south. But I don't know how an independent Scotland will be economically viable unless they're somehow able to get the lion's share of oil rights.

 

[Guest]

Can we give them Florida?

 

[Spanky267]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..

One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

I heard about this, too. Apparently if they win independence, they want them gone immediately.

So if they win, do they have to vote for a PM or President? Or does the highest ranking Scotsman just assume that role? Seems like it would be a lot of work to just start a new country from scratch. Or course if they do it well, maybe they could send the User Manual to Iraq, Egypt and Syria.

I would imagine that Scotland has its own Parliament and Executive Branch. I just dont understand why the Scots would abandon 307 years of Union with England, Wales & Northern Ireland for Independence. They will lose the economies of scale they share as part of the large union. They will become inconsequential on the world stage and they will have to grow institutions that they currently share with the other members of their union i.e. foreign service & defense.

 

[CBusAlex]

I heard about this, too. Apparently if they win independence, they want them gone immediately.

So if they win, do they have to vote for a PM or President? Or does the highest ranking Scotsman just assume that role? Seems like it would be a lot of work to just start a new country from scratch. Or course if they do it well, maybe they could send the User Manual to Iraq, Egypt and Syria.

If the vote passes, they have I think a year or so to negotiate the terms of secession with the UK and get their own government set up.

Another big issue is what currency an independent Scotland would use. The pro-independence crowd seems convinced they'll still be able to use the pound. The UK says absolutely not.

 

[TheIronSheik]

The ballot wording is deceptively simple for such a complicated matter.

"Should Scotland be an independent country?"

There are tons of unanswered questions that will have to be answered. From what I've read, there is a lot of nationalist resentment that Scotland has been left out compared to the relative prosperity of the south. But I don't know how an independent Scotland will be economically viable unless they're somehow able to get the lion's share of oil rights.

I'm not 100% certain, but I thought most of that would be theirs. I thought that was one of the reasons they were so upset. Because they felt like it was their oil and it was not being used to help them as much as they thought.

I could be 100% incorrect on this though.

 

[TheIronSheik]

I heard about this, too. Apparently if they win independence, they want them gone immediately.

So if they win, do they have to vote for a PM or President? Or does the highest ranking Scotsman just assume that role? Seems like it would be a lot of work to just start a new country from scratch. Or course if they do it well, maybe they could send the User Manual to Iraq, Egypt and Syria.

If the vote passes, they have I think a year or so to negotiate the terms of secession with the UK and get their own government set up.

Another big issue is what currency an independent Scotland would use. The pro-independence crowd seems convinced they'll still be able to use the pound. The UK says absolutely not.

The craziest thing I saw (and I feel stupid for not realizing it until the news report) is that the Union Jack is a combination of the 4 territories and with Scotland leaving, would mean that the flag would most likely need to be changed.

The death of the Union Jack is crazier, to me, than Scotland wanting it's freedom.

 

[Spanky267]

The ballot wording is deceptively simple for such a complicated matter.

"Should Scotland be an independent country?"

There are tons of unanswered questions that will have to be answered. From what I've read, there is a lot of nationalist resentment that Scotland has been left out compared to the relative prosperity of the south. But I don't know how an independent Scotland will be economically viable unless they're somehow able to get the lion's share of oil rights.

I dont see why they'd want the oil rights. The push from members of the Scottish National Party, which controls the current Scottish government, is to focus solely on renewable energy. Scotland has two nuclear power plants that will soon reach the ends of their usable lives. SNP does not wish to replace them, instead they want to rely solely on renewable energy. I would imagine geothermal or wind energy. But I'm not well versed on that. It would seem to me that pursuing the north sea oil rights would fly in the face of the SNP's push to go green.

 

[Eephus]

The ballot wording is deceptively simple for such a complicated matter.

"Should Scotland be an independent country?"

There are tons of unanswered questions that will have to be answered. From what I've read, there is a lot of nationalist resentment that Scotland has been left out compared to the relative prosperity of the south. But I don't know how an independent Scotland will be economically viable unless they're somehow able to get the lion's share of oil rights.

I dont see why they'd want the oil rights. The push from members of the Scottish National Party, which controls the current Scottish government, is to focus solely on renewable energy. Scotland has two nuclear power plants that will soon reach the ends of their usable lives. SNP does not wish to replace them, instead they want to rely solely on renewable energy. I would imagine geothermal or wind energy. But I'm not well versed on that. It would seem to me that pursuing the north sea oil rights would fly in the face of the SNP's push to go green.

They'll need the oil revenue in order to make the capital investments needed to expand renewables

 

[Eephus]

Link

I have to admit, other than hearing them talk about the vote tomorrow, I'm kind of clueless as to what happens if the vote goes through. I keep hearing news outlets talk about how it would be a bad thing for the entire world, but I'm not sure I get it.

What's the FFA's thoughts on this vote? I see that Quebec said they are watching it very closely and if it goes through, they might try again to leave Canada.

Figured there would have already been a topic on this, but don't see it. If there is, please accept my humble apologies and hard delete this.

TIA

TIS

Was reading a little about this yesterday..One of the parts was that most of UK's Nuclear weapons are stored in Scotland and those that are pushing for the independence are very Anti-Nuke and so no one right now knows what happens to the stockpile of weapons if they vote for independence.

I was trying to explain to my wife & daughter last night what this was and the best I could come up with was "It would be like any of the States in America voting to be independent"..

I heard about this, too. Apparently if they win independence, they want them gone immediately. So if they win, do they have to vote for a PM or President? Or does the highest ranking Scotsman just assume that role?

I nominate Sean Connery

 

[CBusAlex]

I dont see why they'd want the oil rights. The push from members of the Scottish National Party, which controls the current Scottish government, is to focus solely on renewable energy. Scotland has two nuclear power plants that will soon reach the ends of their usable lives. SNP does not wish to replace them, instead they want to rely solely on renewable energy. I would imagine geothermal or wind energy. But I'm not well versed on that. It would seem to me that pursuing the north sea oil rights would fly in the face of the SNP's push to go green.

People still drive cars, Spanky.

And even if they didn't use any oil themselves, they'd still want the money from selling it.

 

[Mr. Ected]

May have to break out my Bay City Rollers albums if they vote yes.

Or play this guy.

 

[dickey moe]

It would probably have a significant effect on the politics of British Parliament. Scottish representatives are overrepresented in the more left leaning parties.

 

[Don Quixote]

Last I saw, it was 51% to leave, 49% to stay. But because of the margin of error, they said it's pretty much a toss up.

<slow whistle>

I wonder what even led up to having such a vote. Didn't think the Scots were still bristling in the 21st century, but what do I know?

From what I understand, the Scots are a good deal more liberal than the English. They'd like to have a larger welfare state more like the Scandinavian countries, but they can't get that as part of the UK.

Yeah, a good chunk of Labour Party support is in Scotland. Also, support for the EU. The Economist expressed concern this week that a Scotland vote for independence would result in the UK leaving the EU.

 

[matttyl]

So if they win, do they have to vote for a PM or President? Or does the highest ranking Scotsman just assume that role? Seems like it would be a lot of work to just start a new country from scratch. Or course if they do it well, maybe they could send the User Manual to Iraq, Egypt and Syria.

They don't control their health care. They don't own their banks. They don't have their own currency. They don't own their oil. And they think that they can get all that dealt with by 2016? Yeah, right.....

 

[Eephus]

It would probably have a significant effect on the politics of British Parliament. Scottish representatives are overrepresented in the more left leaning parties.

Yes in the short term but the longer-term question is whether Scottish independence would re-energize the left, particularly in Northern England.

 

[Eephus]

I dinna ken.

Queue up the Great Scots Draft

 

[dickey moe]

It would probably have a significant effect on the politics of British Parliament. Scottish representatives are overrepresented in the more left leaning parties.

Yes in the short term but the longer-term question is whether Scottish independence would re-energize the left, particularly in Northern England.

In what way (can you hypothesize?)

 

[dickey moe]

Interesting that neither Paul Krugman nor Niall Ferguson think this would be a good thing.

 

[Spanky267]

I dont see why they'd want the oil rights. The push from members of the Scottish National Party, which controls the current Scottish government, is to focus solely on renewable energy. Scotland has two nuclear power plants that will soon reach the ends of their usable lives. SNP does not wish to replace them, instead they want to rely solely on renewable energy. I would imagine geothermal or wind energy. But I'm not well versed on that. It would seem to me that pursuing the north sea oil rights would fly in the face of the SNP's push to go green.

People still drive cars, Spanky.

And even if they didn't use any oil themselves, they'd still want the money from selling it.

Well thats some pretty crass calculus. But I understand it. I know there has been some talk about how the Scots feel slighted. But in doing some reading the Scots get more per capita from the UK central government than the English or the Welsh under something called the Barnett Formula.

 

[timschochet]

If this passes, Wales is next!