"Top 10 Coaches Who Never Won a Championship" (1 Viewer)

[Raider Nation]

NFLN continues their excellent "Top 10" series on Friday night at 8:00 EST with this interesting topic.

Gotta think Marv Levy has to be very high on the list, if not # 1. Four consecutive Super Bowl appearances speaks for itself, plus he had a .561 winning percentage and he was a respected leader of men. Any coach who quotes Shakespeare on the sidelines pretty much deserves the top spot.

Who else will be on the list? You can put the following six coaches in there for certain:

George Allen, Jeff Fisher, Don Coryell, Marty Schottenheimer, Dan Reeves & Chuck Knox.

Dennis Green should probably also be there. That's 8 coaches so far. We need two more.

How about Rich Kotite and David Shula?

 

[Skanker]

Awesome, will definitely have to watch this.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Given his one Super Bowl appearance and five NFC title appearances, I don't see how Andy Reid doesn't make this list.

 

[Raider Nation]

Upcoming "Top 10" programs on the NFLN in the following weeks:

July 10: Gunslingers -- Sammy Baugh, Joe Namath, Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, Brett Favre and others are debated as NFL's Top 10 profiles quarterbacks the shotgun and play-action pass were made for.

July 17: Meltdowns -- They are the moments players and fans live to forget -- from Tony Romo's fumbled snap in the playoffs to Pete Carroll's five-game slide with the New York Jets, NFL's Top 10 takes a look at the most memorable meltdowns in NFL history.

July 24: Greatest Hands -- From Lynn Swann and Fred Biletnikoff to Marvin Harrison and Larry Fitzgerald, these receivers have made the tough catches look easy. NFL's Top 10 counts down the top 10 greatest hands.

July 31: Most Snakebitten Franchises -- NFL's Top 10 looks at the teams that could never seem to get fate on their side. The Detroit Lions, New York Jets, Kansas City Chiefs and Minnesota Vikings all make the list.

August 7: Traditions -- From cheerleaders to tailgates, NFL's Top 10 counts down the traditions that make the game the most popular sport in America.

 

[Raider Nation]

Given his one Super Bowl appearance and five NFC title appearances, I don't see how Andy Reid doesn't make this list.

There ya go. Knew I forgot someone obvious. We just need one more name to most likely nail the exact list.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Bud Grant?

Also, I don't see Dennis Green as being a sure thing on this list.

 

[Matt Waldman]

Potential candidates for that last remaining spot:

Sam Rutigliano

John Fox

Buddy Ryan

Norv Turner

Bum Phillips

Sam Wyche

But to me the most obvious is Bud Grant of the Vikings...

 

[renesauz]

Bud Grant?Also, I don't see Dennis Green as being a sure thing on this list.

 

[Instinctive]

Potential candidates for that last remaining spot:Sam RutiglianoJohn FoxBuddy RyanNorv TurnerBum PhillipsSam WycheBut to me the most obvious is Bud Grant of the Vikings...

Did Norv Turner never win one as Dallas OC?

 

[Heatman]

Bud Grant?Also, I don't see Dennis Green as being a sure thing on this list.

Agreed as a Vikings fan.

 

[zed2283]

Potential candidates for that last remaining spot:Sam RutiglianoJohn FoxBuddy RyanNorv TurnerBum PhillipsSam WycheBut to me the most obvious is Bud Grant of the Vikings...

You've got to be kidding... I think I missed the punch line.Definitely Bud Grant.

 

[Chase Stuart]

In this article I ranked the coaching records of every coach ever. Here are the top coaches to never win a championship:

coach all only+ #seas persea winsBud Grant 80.2 82.5 18.0 4.5 160.5Dan Reeves 71.2 74.9 22.8 3.1 191Marty Schottenheimer 65.0 65.1 20.5 3.2 200.5George Allen 63.4 63.4 12.0 5.3 118.5Marv Levy 57.9 65.0 16.4 3.5 143Chuck Knox 55.7 58.0 22.0 2.5 186.5Sid Gillman 45.7 52.7 17.0 2.7 125.5Jeff Fisher 40.1 48.1 14.4 2.8 128Andy Reid 39.1 44.8 10.0 3.9 97.5Don Coryell 33.7 40.7 13.3 2.5 111.5Jim Mora 29.7 38.7 14.5 2.1 125Lou Saban 26.7 40.3 14.4 1.9 98.5Dennis Green 26.1 35.9 12.9 2.0 113Mike Martz 25.9 28.2 5.3 4.9 53Roy Andrews 24.8 33.5 7.0 3.5 53Red Miller 23.1 23.1 4.0 5.8 40Tommy Hughitt 21.8 21.8 5.0 4.4 37.5I included Gillman and Saban, who won AFL titles, because it's possible that the NFLN will discount those. Personally, I would exclude those two coaches from the list.Grant should be #1. As you mentioned, Levy, Allen, Fisher, Coryell, Schottenheimer, Reeves, Reid and Knox are very likely to be on the list, and with good reason. The 10th coach is a more interesting debate. As you mentioned, Green is a solid pick. So is Jim Mora. But I certainly wouldn't be surprised to see the NFLN take Gillman, who was an incredible innovator, coached well for 18 seasons, is a "name" guy, and technically did not win an NFL title.

 

[tppt]

Marv Levy is in the HOF, no doubt he makes this list

 

[Chase Stuart]

Marv Levy is in the HOF, no doubt he makes this list

As are Allen and Grant. Combined with Reeves, Schottenheimer and Knox, that's definitely your top six.

 

[Jason Wood]

I'm deeply saddened that my team's current coach is a lock for this list

 

[Raider Nation]

I am DEEPLY ashamed that I completely whiffed on Bud Grant in my original post.

As I've said many times, the Vikings are my "NFC team"... I've always admired their organization.

I have no excuse for this egregious oversight. Commence the tar and feathering.

 

[Lehigh98]

Next how about the "Bottom 10 Coaches Who Won a Championship"?

 

[TheDirtyWord]

Next how about the "Bottom 10 Coaches Who Won a Championship"?

Barry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry Switzer...maybe this should just be a SportsCentury piece/retrospective...?

 

[Chase Stuart]

Next how about the "Bottom 10 Coaches Who Won a Championship"?

Barry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry SwitzerBarry Switzer...maybe this should just be a SportsCentury piece/retrospective...?

Don McCafferty, too.

 

[Sweet Love]

I'm deeply saddened that my team's current coach is a lock for this list

And your starting QB would probably be on the Top Ten QBs to never win too. You Iggles fans always make me laugh...al you ahve to do is look 80 miles North East to find the Jets. Who do we rally around? Glenn Foley and Herm Edwards!?!?!?

 

[Chase Stuart]

I'm deeply saddened that my team's current coach is a lock for this list

And your starting QB would probably be on the Top Ten QBs to never win too.

That's an interesting question. I'd say these guys would be in the mixan MarinoFran TarkentonDan FoutsKen AndersonSonny Jurgensen (won 1960 title as backup to NVB)Daryle LamonicaWarren MoonBoomer EsiasonRoman GabrielTrent GreenY.A. TittleJim HartSteve McNairJeff GarciaDaunte CulpepperJohn BrodieRich GannonBert JonesRandall CunninghamEarl MorrallDrew BreesBilly KilmerJim KellyUnlike at HC, a lot of really good QBs did not win championships. I don't think I'd put McNabb on my top ten list.

 

[dgreen]

I'm deeply saddened that my team's current coach is a lock for this list

And your starting QB would probably be on the Top Ten QBs to never win too.

That's an interesting question. I'd say these guys would be in the mix:Sammy Baugh

He won twice.

 

[Chase Stuart]

I'm deeply saddened that my team's current coach is a lock for this list

And your starting QB would probably be on the Top Ten QBs to never win too.

That's an interesting question. I'd say these guys would be in the mix:Sammy Baugh

He won twice.

Oops. Thanks.

 

[loose circuits]

I'm deeply saddened that my team's current coach is a lock for this list

And your starting QB would probably be on the Top Ten QBs to never win too.

That's an interesting question. I'd say these guys would be in the mixan Marino

Fran Tarkenton

Dan Fouts

Ken Anderson

Sonny Jurgensen (won 1960 title as backup to NVB)

Daryle Lamonica

Warren Moon

Boomer Esiason

Roman Gabriel

Trent Green

Y.A. Tittle

Jim Hart

Steve McNair

Jeff Garcia

Daunte Culpepper

John Brodie

Rich Gannon

Bert Jones

Randall Cunningham

Earl Morrall

Drew Brees

Billy Kilmer

Jim Kelly

Unlike at HC, a lot of really good QBs did not win championships. I don't think I'd put McNabb on my top ten list.

would be interesting if you put career records up there and then made that statement

 

[Chase Stuart]

would be interesting if you put career records up there and then made that statement

I don't see any reason to judge QB's by win-loss records, since that's a way to judge teams. If you insist on looking at win-loss records, you might as well look at them using adjusted records, presented by Doug Drinen. The adjusted win-loss records take into account strength of schedule, era, and the number of points your defense allows and special teams scores.Of the QBs I listed above, here are their adjusted wins above average per game scores:

Daryle Lamonica 1.35Y.A. Tittle 0.72Dan Marino 0.66Randall Cunningham 0.62Jim Kelly 0.62Dan Fouts 0.57Trent Green 0.48Drew Brees 0.44Fran Tarkenton 0.40Rich Gannon 0.40Steve McNair 0.36Daunte Culpepper 0.32Bert Jones 0.32John Brodie 0.30Donovan McNabb 0.28Jim Hart 0.20Boomer Esiason 0.17Warren Moon 0.16Roman Gabriel 0.13Jeff Garcia 0.10Earl Morrall 0.07Billy Kilmer 0.07Sonny Jurgensen 0.01Ken Anderson -0.02Here are their wins above average (i.e., not per game):

Dan Marino		  0.66	25.4Daryle Lamonica	 1.35	19.2Jim Kelly		   0.62	17.8Randall Cunningham  0.62	15.5Dan Fouts		   0.57	14.9Fran Tarkenton	  0.40	14.8Y.A. Tittle		 0.72	14.6Rich Gannon		 0.40	 9.4Steve McNair		0.36	 9.2Trent Green		 0.48	 8.8Drew Brees		  0.44	 8.1John Brodie		 0.30	 7.6Donovan McNabb	  0.28	 6.2Jim Hart			0.20	 6.0Warren Moon		 0.16	 5.5Daunte Culpepper	0.32	 5.3Boomer Esiason	  0.17	 5.1Bert Jones		  0.32	 5.0Roman Gabriel	   0.13	 2.8Jeff Garcia		 0.10	 1.7Billy Kilmer		0.07	 1.3Earl Morrall		0.07	 0.9Sonny Jurgensen	 0.01	 0.3Ken Anderson	   -0.02	-0.6

Of course, even Doug would say this is a silly way to rank QBs, just less silly than using regular win-loss records.I would use the formula in this post, which puts the QBs in the order in mostly the same order that I originally listed them in. I think all of those guys have a good argument over McNabb, and enough of them have obvious arguments (Marino, Tarkenton, Fouts) that I feel comfortable keeping DMAC out of my top ten.

 

[Saints-Man]

Great post Chase.

 

[gonzobill5]

I think all of those guys have a good argument over McNabb, and enough of them have obvious arguments (Marino, Tarkenton, Fouts) that I feel comfortable keeping DMAC out of my top ten.

Who are the ten that would comprise your list? Was it the top ten in your original post? I'm curious if Kelly made the cut.

 

[Chase Stuart]

I think all of those guys have a good argument over McNabb, and enough of them have obvious arguments (Marino, Tarkenton, Fouts) that I feel comfortable keeping DMAC out of my top ten.

Who are the ten that would comprise your list? Was it the top ten in your original post? I'm curious if Kelly made the cut.

I think Kelly and McNabb are pretty comparable, right down to the lack of rings (4 SB losses for Kelly, 4 NFCG losses for McNabb and then the SB loss). I'm not sure who would make my top ten -- it's tough, obviously, separating out all those guys that are pretty even in my opinion. But with 20 other guys to consider for seven spots (after Marino/Tarkenton/Fouts), I feel pretty confident in saying McNabb wouldn't make my top ten. Kelly probably wouldn't, either, but then I always thought he was just a bit overrated. He was awesome in '90 and '91, but really only HOF caliber those two seasons. I don't have a problem with Kelly in the HOF, but I certainly think that saying a QB is "better than Kelly" should not guarantee enshrinement into the Hall.To answer your other question, generally, the guys at the top of the list would rank ahead of the guys at the bottom of the list, but that's not always the case.

 

[renesauz]

I'm deeply saddened that my team's current coach is a lock for this list

And your starting QB would probably be on the Top Ten QBs to never win too.

That's an interesting question. I'd say these guys would be in the mixan MarinoFran TarkentonDan FoutsKen AndersonSonny Jurgensen (won 1960 title as backup to NVB)Daryle LamonicaWarren MoonBoomer EsiasonRoman GabrielTrent GreenY.A. TittleJim HartSteve McNairJeff GarciaDaunte CulpepperJohn BrodieRich GannonBert JonesRandall CunninghamEarl MorrallDrew BreesBilly KilmerJim KellyUnlike at HC, a lot of really good QBs did not win championships. I don't think I'd put McNabb on my top ten list.

I can't see ten on that list I'd put ahead of him.

 

[Chase Stuart]

I can't see ten on that list I'd put ahead of him.

This has turned into a McNabb thread, so I apologize for that. Another note on McNabb -- in the ten seasons he's been in the league, he's not once been name a 1st or 2nd team all pro by any of the major awards. Pro Football Weekly names its top QB for each conference, while the Associated Press, Sporting News and Pro Football Writers named 1st and 2nd team all-pros. Since McNabb's been in the league, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Rich Gannon, Kurt Warner, Brett Favre, Drew Brees, Daunte Culpepper, Matt Hasselbeck and Steve McNair have received at least one of those awards.I'm not a huge fan of using these awards for QBs since there are a bunch of other things to look at, but I do find it interesting. McNabb has had one terrific season ('04), one really good season ('06) and then a bunch of good seasons. He's had a great career, and he's certainly been harmed by having lackluster receivers. But a bunch of QBs have had more success than McNabb, they just didn't necessarily play in such a QB friendly era.

 

[Yellow Line is Unoffcial]

Jim Mora turned around a morbid Saints team and did a nice job in Indy

Ground Chuck took three different teams to the playoffs

Grant took the Vikings to the Super Bowl 4 times

Marty has been good everywhere he has been

Dan Reeves took two different teams to the big game

 

[gonzobill5]

I think all of those guys have a good argument over McNabb, and enough of them have obvious arguments (Marino, Tarkenton, Fouts) that I feel comfortable keeping DMAC out of my top ten.

Who are the ten that would comprise your list? Was it the top ten in your original post? I'm curious if Kelly made the cut.

I think Kelly and McNabb are pretty comparable, right down to the lack of rings (4 SB losses for Kelly, 4 NFCG losses for McNabb and then the SB loss).

Indeed, the two QBs are eerily similar. Whether they are deserving of making such a list or not, I'd be surprised if they didn't based solely on how close they came. Without giving too much thought, I think this would be my listan MarinoFran TarkentonDan FoutsWarren MoonKen AndersonSonny JurgensenRandall CunninghamBoomer EsiasonDrew BreesMcSomebody Though this probably makes my age pretty transparent.

 

[Raider Nation]

This has turned into a McNabb thread, so I apologize for that.

No worries. It's the offseason. Have fun!

 

[Jason Wood]

Chase is on the pulpit right now. I love McNabb and feel that too many of my fellow Eagles fans give him short shrift, but he's not a Hall of Famer and it would take a SB ring [or two] to even argue that he's got a shot someday.

 

[Bills_Fan11]

Chase is on the pulpit right now. I love McNabb and feel that too many of my fellow Eagles fans give him short shrift, but he's not a Hall of Famer and it would take a SB ring [or two] to even argue that he's got a shot someday.

He is on the outside looking in now, but c'mon - 1 ring and he's a lock.

 

[Jason Wood]

Chase is on the pulpit right now. I love McNabb and feel that too many of my fellow Eagles fans give him short shrift, but he's not a Hall of Famer and it would take a SB ring [or two] to even argue that he's got a shot someday.

He is on the outside looking in now, but c'mon - 1 ring and he's a lock.

Well, in keeping with the Jim Kelly comparison and realizing that for the Eagles to win the Super Bowl McNabb would likely have a monster year, you're probably right. But let's get the ring first and then I'll be happy to have this debate.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Chase is on the pulpit right now. I love McNabb and feel that too many of my fellow Eagles fans give him short shrift, but he's not a Hall of Famer and it would take a SB ring [or two] to even argue that he's got a shot someday.

He is on the outside looking in now, but c'mon - 1 ring and he's a lock.

It would depend on what sort of ring it was. If it was a Joe Montana 1989 season, then yeah, he'd be a lock. If it was a Trent Dilfer 2000 season, he'd still be on the outside looking in.McNabb will only have to deal with Manning and Brady (assuming Warner retires soon) and maybe Brees -- that should help him. But there are a bunch of QBs better than McNabb that have been passed over several times, so he's not going to be a lock unless he has some crazy good seasons in the future.

 

[obxlegends]

Chase is on the pulpit right now. I love McNabb and feel that too many of my fellow Eagles fans give him short shrift, but he's not a Hall of Famer and it would take a SB ring [or two] to even argue that he's got a shot someday.

He is on the outside looking in now, but c'mon - 1 ring and he's a lock.

It would depend on what sort of ring it was. If it was a Joe Montana 1989 season, then yeah, he'd be a lock. If it was a Trent Dilfer 2000 season, he'd still be on the outside looking in.McNabb will only have to deal with Manning and Brady (assuming Warner retires soon) and maybe Brees -- that should help him. But there are a bunch of QBs better than McNabb that have been passed over several times, so he's not going to be a lock unless he has some crazy good seasons in the future.

To me McNabb and Fouts are similar in the way I view their careers... up to this point. Both played on winning teams. Both had statistical arguments on their side, but neither passes the first ballot sniff test. McNabb will get in the hall. Unless things change, he'll have to wait some time though.

 

[Mr. Fusion]

Marv Levy is in the HOF, no doubt he makes this list

 

[Chase Stuart]

Chase is on the pulpit right now. I love McNabb and feel that too many of my fellow Eagles fans give him short shrift, but he's not a Hall of Famer and it would take a SB ring [or two] to even argue that he's got a shot someday.

He is on the outside looking in now, but c'mon - 1 ring and he's a lock.

It would depend on what sort of ring it was. If it was a Joe Montana 1989 season, then yeah, he'd be a lock. If it was a Trent Dilfer 2000 season, he'd still be on the outside looking in.McNabb will only have to deal with Manning and Brady (assuming Warner retires soon) and maybe Brees -- that should help him. But there are a bunch of QBs better than McNabb that have been passed over several times, so he's not going to be a lock unless he has some crazy good seasons in the future.

To me McNabb and Fouts are similar in the way I view their careers... up to this point. Both played on winning teams. Both had statistical arguments on their side, but neither passes the first ballot sniff test. McNabb will get in the hall. Unless things change, he'll have to wait some time though.

You could argue that it's much easier to throw the ball in San Diego than in Philly, or that Fouts had much better targets than McNabb, or that McNabb added a bunch on the ground. But you can't say that both have statistical arguments on their side when Fouts' numbers blow away McNabb's numbers.Three times, Fouts led the league in adjusted net yards per pass attempt. Three more times he finished 2nd, in addition to a third, sixth and ninth place finish. Seven seasons in the top three in ANY/A is incredible.McNabb ranked 3rd in the league in '04 and 2nd in '06 in adjusted net yards per pass attempt.... and those were his only two top ten finishes.

 

[obxlegends]

To me McNabb and Fouts are similar in the way I view their careers... up to this point. Both played on winning teams. Both had statistical arguments on their side, but neither passes the first ballot sniff test.

McNabb will get in the hall. Unless things change, he'll have to wait some time though.

You could argue that it's much easier to throw the ball in San Diego than in Philly, or that Fouts had much better targets than McNabb, or that McNabb added a bunch on the ground. But you can't say that both have statistical arguments on their side when Fouts' numbers blow away McNabb's numbers.Three times, Fouts led the league in adjusted net yards per pass attempt. Three more times he finished 2nd, in addition to a third, sixth and ninth place finish. Seven seasons in the top three in ANY/A is incredible.

McNabb ranked 3rd in the league in '04 and 2nd in '06 in adjusted net yards per pass attempt.... and those were his only two top ten finishes.

Not only can I say that there's a statistical argument for both. I did say it. You also really make a case for McNabb. While McNabb never had a Joyner, Winslow or Jefferson (outside T.O. briefly) he still has managed to be on the cusp of 30,000 passing yards. Amazing when you consider what McNabb's had to work with over the years. McNabb's career TD% is also the same as Fouts to date. McNabb also obliterates Fouts when it comes to TD to interception ratio. To the point where it's almost laughable.

However my point wasn't comparing McNabb to Fouts per se. My point was saying that they both have arguments to be in the Hall of Fame, but neither one (to this point for McNabb) an overwhelming one to me.

 

[Chase Stuart]

To me McNabb and Fouts are similar in the way I view their careers... up to this point. Both played on winning teams. Both had statistical arguments on their side, but neither passes the first ballot sniff test.

McNabb will get in the hall. Unless things change, he'll have to wait some time though.

You could argue that it's much easier to throw the ball in San Diego than in Philly, or that Fouts had much better targets than McNabb, or that McNabb added a bunch on the ground. But you can't say that both have statistical arguments on their side when Fouts' numbers blow away McNabb's numbers.Three times, Fouts led the league in adjusted net yards per pass attempt. Three more times he finished 2nd, in addition to a third, sixth and ninth place finish. Seven seasons in the top three in ANY/A is incredible.

McNabb ranked 3rd in the league in '04 and 2nd in '06 in adjusted net yards per pass attempt.... and those were his only two top ten finishes.

Not only can I say that there's a statistical argument for both. I did say it. You also really make a case for McNabb. While McNabb never had a Joyner, Winslow or Jefferson (outside T.O. briefly) he still has managed to be on the cusp of 30,000 passing yards. Amazing when you consider what McNabb's had to work with over the years. McNabb's career TD% is also the same as Fouts to date. McNabb also obliterates Fouts when it comes to TD to interception ratio. To the point where it's almost laughable.

However my point wasn't comparing McNabb to Fouts per se. My point was saying that they both have arguments to be in the Hall of Fame, but neither one (to this point for McNabb) an overwhelming one to me.

McNabb's numbers adjusted for era don't blow away Fouts' numbers nor are they amazing

 

[obxlegends]

To me McNabb and Fouts are similar in the way I view their careers... up to this point. Both played on winning teams. Both had statistical arguments on their side, but neither passes the first ballot sniff test.

McNabb will get in the hall. Unless things change, he'll have to wait some time though.

You could argue that it's much easier to throw the ball in San Diego than in Philly, or that Fouts had much better targets than McNabb, or that McNabb added a bunch on the ground. But you can't say that both have statistical arguments on their side when Fouts' numbers blow away McNabb's numbers.Three times, Fouts led the league in adjusted net yards per pass attempt. Three more times he finished 2nd, in addition to a third, sixth and ninth place finish. Seven seasons in the top three in ANY/A is incredible.

McNabb ranked 3rd in the league in '04 and 2nd in '06 in adjusted net yards per pass attempt.... and those were his only two top ten finishes.

Not only can I say that there's a statistical argument for both. I did say it. You also really make a case for McNabb. While McNabb never had a Joyner, Winslow or Jefferson (outside T.O. briefly) he still has managed to be on the cusp of 30,000 passing yards. Amazing when you consider what McNabb's had to work with over the years. McNabb's career TD% is also the same as Fouts to date. McNabb also obliterates Fouts when it comes to TD to interception ratio. To the point where it's almost laughable.

However my point wasn't comparing McNabb to Fouts per se. My point was saying that they both have arguments to be in the Hall of Fame, but neither one (to this point for McNabb) an overwhelming one to me.

McNabb's numbers adjusted for era don't blow away Fouts' numbers nor are they amazing

Unless of course you want to ignore winning %.

 

[Despyzer]

Unless of course you want to ignore winning %.

Fouts was saddled with some ridiculously bad defenses that had something to do with his winning %.Out of 28 teams, they went a stretch where they finished 26th, 24th, 28th, 24th, 25th, and 24th. That's an awful lot to ask one person to compensate for.McNabb's defenses have been top ten and better almost every year he has played.

 

[massraider]

#10:

Jim Mora

#9:

Jeff Fisher

#8:

Don Coryell

#7:

Andy Reid (Oof, over Coryell? I dunno....)

#6:

Chuck Knox

#5:

Dan Reeves (He's not in the HOF? That's terrible.)

#4:

Marty Schottenheimer

#3:



George Allen

#2:

Marv Levy

#1:

Bud Grant

 

[whitewizard]

i like the top ten series NFLnetwork does, it is great. sometimes it seems like they retread some areas like with the coming one about snakebitten franchises, a little too much like worst teams ever. there will be difference i am sure but still to close to the same tropic for me.

they talk about best LB corps, best defense, best secondary duo. to me it seems like they intentionally avoid general broad list in favor of specific things. like best speed back, best power back. i like both episodes but why not just do best RB. if they want to wait fine but for me time is clicking.

the specific things are fun because they can go obscure and make their point and bring up other points to herald the unsung/controversial. it is fun but it gets clouded and they sometimes lose their focus when trying to go out of their way to make a point on the more made up/point of view slots for their lists. simply because there is just not enough evidence to support or shut down what they say.

a good the best (insert position here) would be nice, yes they have the best TE episode but i want the big dogs, best QB, best WR. go old school do whatever you want make johnny U the best, otto graham. i just want to see some of the ones we have been waiting for instead of the best gunslinger which will be a love affair for brett or some other random guy off the shelf. it will be fun but there will be some lost direction in the episode because the definition of a gun slinger is so open to interpretation. be a man NFL network and go after the big dogs.

 

[Chase Stuart]

#10:

Jim Mora

#9:

Jeff Fisher

#8:

Don Coryell

#7:

Andy Reid (Oof, over Coryell? I dunno....)

#6:

Chuck Knox

#5:

Dan Reeves (He's not in the HOF? That's terrible.)

#4:

Marty Schottenheimer

#3:



George Allen

#2:

Marv Levy

#1:

Bud Grant

In this article I ranked the coaching records of every coach ever. Here are the top coaches to never win a championship:

coach all only+ #seas persea winsBud Grant 80.2 82.5 18.0 4.5 160.5Dan Reeves 71.2 74.9 22.8 3.1 191Marty Schottenheimer 65.0 65.1 20.5 3.2 200.5George Allen 63.4 63.4 12.0 5.3 118.5Marv Levy 57.9 65.0 16.4 3.5 143Chuck Knox 55.7 58.0 22.0 2.5 186.5Sid Gillman 45.7 52.7 17.0 2.7 125.5Jeff Fisher 40.1 48.1 14.4 2.8 128Andy Reid 39.1 44.8 10.0 3.9 97.5Don Coryell 33.7 40.7 13.3 2.5 111.5Jim Mora 29.7 38.7 14.5 2.1 125Lou Saban 26.7 40.3 14.4 1.9 98.5Dennis Green 26.1 35.9 12.9 2.0 113Mike Martz 25.9 28.2 5.3 4.9 53Roy Andrews 24.8 33.5 7.0 3.5 53Red Miller 23.1 23.1 4.0 5.8 40Tommy Hughitt 21.8 21.8 5.0 4.4 37.5I included Gillman and Saban, who won AFL titles, because it's possible that the NFLN will discount those. Personally, I would exclude those two coaches from the list.Grant should be #1. As you mentioned, Levy, Allen, Fisher, Coryell, Schottenheimer, Reeves, Reid and Knox are very likely to be on the list, and with good reason. The 10th coach is a more interesting debate. As you mentioned, Green is a solid pick. So is Jim Mora. But I certainly wouldn't be surprised to see the NFLN take Gillman, who was an incredible innovator, coached well for 18 seasons, is a "name" guy, and technically did not win an NFL title.

No big surprises here -- all 10 were expected, and Grant should be #1. Reid over Coryell, as a coach, is what the numbers say.

 

[JKL]

#10:

Jim Mora

#9:

Jeff Fisher

#8:

Don Coryell

#7:

Andy Reid (Oof, over Coryell? I dunno....)

#6:

Chuck Knox

#5:

Dan Reeves (He's not in the HOF? That's terrible.)

#4:

Marty Schottenheimer

#3:



George Allen

#2:

Marv Levy

#1:

Bud Grant

In this article I ranked the coaching records of every coach ever. Here are the top coaches to never win a championship:

coach all only+ #seas persea winsBud Grant 80.2 82.5 18.0 4.5 160.5Dan Reeves 71.2 74.9 22.8 3.1 191Marty Schottenheimer 65.0 65.1 20.5 3.2 200.5George Allen 63.4 63.4 12.0 5.3 118.5Marv Levy 57.9 65.0 16.4 3.5 143Chuck Knox 55.7 58.0 22.0 2.5 186.5Sid Gillman 45.7 52.7 17.0 2.7 125.5Jeff Fisher 40.1 48.1 14.4 2.8 128Andy Reid 39.1 44.8 10.0 3.9 97.5Don Coryell 33.7 40.7 13.3 2.5 111.5Jim Mora 29.7 38.7 14.5 2.1 125Lou Saban 26.7 40.3 14.4 1.9 98.5Dennis Green 26.1 35.9 12.9 2.0 113Mike Martz 25.9 28.2 5.3 4.9 53Roy Andrews 24.8 33.5 7.0 3.5 53Red Miller 23.1 23.1 4.0 5.8 40Tommy Hughitt 21.8 21.8 5.0 4.4 37.5I included Gillman and Saban, who won AFL titles, because it's possible that the NFLN will discount those. Personally, I would exclude those two coaches from the list.Grant should be #1. As you mentioned, Levy, Allen, Fisher, Coryell, Schottenheimer, Reeves, Reid and Knox are very likely to be on the list, and with good reason. The 10th coach is a more interesting debate. As you mentioned, Green is a solid pick. So is Jim Mora. But I certainly wouldn't be surprised to see the NFLN take Gillman, who was an incredible innovator, coached well for 18 seasons, is a "name" guy, and technically did not win an NFL title.

No big surprises here -- all 10 were expected, and Grant should be #1. Reid over Coryell, as a coach, is what the numbers say.

Bud Grant did actually win a championship-- the 1969 NFL Championship. The Vikings went 12-2 and won the NFL Championship game against the Cleveland Browns.Now, I know that they went on to the Super Bowl and lost to the Chiefs, but that was a championship-winning team, just like the Packers were the 1962 NFL Champions and the Browns were the 1964 Champs. The next year, the Super Bowl winner was the NFL Champion, but in 1969, Minnesota was NFL Champion and Kansas City was the AFL Champion.

If the category is greatest coachest to never win a Super Bowl, Bud Grant is #1. If it is greatest coach to never win a championship, then Bud Grant should not be on the list. Since none of the coaches on the list pre-date the Super Bowl era, they could have easily named it as such and been accurate.

 

[Despyzer]

Bud Grant did actually win a championship-- the 1969 NFL Championship. The Vikings went 12-2 and won the NFL Championship game against the Cleveland Browns.Now, I know that they went on to the Super Bowl and lost to the Chiefs, but that was a championship-winning team, just like the Packers were the 1962 NFL Champions and the Browns were the 1964 Champs. The next year, the Super Bowl winner was the NFL Champion, but in 1969, Minnesota was NFL Champion and Kansas City was the AFL Champion.

Most of the guys on that list had won some sort of "championship," be it AFL, NFL, AFC, or NFC. If you don't win that final playoff game, you aren't the actual champion.