Gottabesweet
Footballguy
Who'd you rather have led your team. If you had to pick one, Coaching aside what quarterback would you want.
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Trent Edwards vs. JP Losman (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Gottabesweet
- Start date
Inspiration
Footballguy
It depends on what kind of offense the team is running.
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Gottabesweet
Footballguy
You can run any offense you want. Your the coach.. Based on skills brains etc and what you've seen out of them who do you want.
JP - More 300 yard passing games, 19td season, fumbles, low completion percentage,
Trent - 12 Wins to JP's 11 in 9 less starts, higher completion percentage, quarterback rating, "checks down"
JP - More 300 yard passing games, 19td season, fumbles, low completion percentage,
Trent - 12 Wins to JP's 11 in 9 less starts, higher completion percentage, quarterback rating, "checks down"
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
JP - 32 fubmles, 17 lost
Trent - 9 fumbles, 5 lost
Trent - 9 fumbles, 5 lost
Gottabesweet
Footballguy
Right, when 31 other teams don't want him it says something.
Chase Stuart
Footballguy
Here are their year-by-year statistics:
QB year att pyd ptd/int sk/skyd rsh-yd-td fum/fr CY/P lgavg VALUE REPLTE 2008 374 2699 11/10 23/143 36-117-3 9/1 5.27 5.31 - 20 511TE 2007 269 1630 7/ 8 12/105 14- 49-0 4/1 4.27 5.07 -230 128JP 2008 104 584 2/ 5 15/119 12- 70-2 8/3 1.20 5.31 -479 -318JP 2007 175 1204 4/ 6 14/103 20-110-0 5/1 4.08 5.07 -160 80JP 2006 429 3051 19/14 47/332 38-140-1 13/4 4.56 4.91 -171 416JP 2005 228 1340 8/ 8 26/197 31-154-0 7/3 3.16 4.80 -393 - 87JP 2004 5 32 0/ 1 1/ 0 2- 15-0 1/0 -8.00 5.18 - 72 - 64Both QBs have been below average for each season of their careers, although they've usually been better than replacement (defined as 75% as good as league average). It also is worth mentioning that the bulk of Edwards' career came last season, when he had one of the easiest schedules in the league (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=3190). If you factor in weather and schedule adjustments, Edwards' average converted yards/play drops from 5.27 to 4.74, and he drops to being 232 yards below average. So, uh, so far, both have been pretty bad. Losman's '06 was better than either of Edwards' two seasons (because his SOS was 0.30 CY/P harder than average in '06), but he hasn't exactly given us reason to think he can play at that level consistently.
QB year att pyd ptd/int sk/skyd rsh-yd-td fum/fr CY/P lgavg VALUE REPLTE 2008 374 2699 11/10 23/143 36-117-3 9/1 5.27 5.31 - 20 511TE 2007 269 1630 7/ 8 12/105 14- 49-0 4/1 4.27 5.07 -230 128JP 2008 104 584 2/ 5 15/119 12- 70-2 8/3 1.20 5.31 -479 -318JP 2007 175 1204 4/ 6 14/103 20-110-0 5/1 4.08 5.07 -160 80JP 2006 429 3051 19/14 47/332 38-140-1 13/4 4.56 4.91 -171 416JP 2005 228 1340 8/ 8 26/197 31-154-0 7/3 3.16 4.80 -393 - 87JP 2004 5 32 0/ 1 1/ 0 2- 15-0 1/0 -8.00 5.18 - 72 - 64Both QBs have been below average for each season of their careers, although they've usually been better than replacement (defined as 75% as good as league average). It also is worth mentioning that the bulk of Edwards' career came last season, when he had one of the easiest schedules in the league (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=3190). If you factor in weather and schedule adjustments, Edwards' average converted yards/play drops from 5.27 to 4.74, and he drops to being 232 yards below average. So, uh, so far, both have been pretty bad. Losman's '06 was better than either of Edwards' two seasons (because his SOS was 0.30 CY/P harder than average in '06), but he hasn't exactly given us reason to think he can play at that level consistently.
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Gottabesweet
Footballguy
Trent averages 180 per game to JP's 150 passing. Both under 200.
JP sacked 103 to 35 vs. Trent (obviously 9 more starts)
Both TD-INT ratio even (JP 33-34) Trent 18-18
JP sacked 103 to 35 vs. Trent (obviously 9 more starts)
Both TD-INT ratio even (JP 33-34) Trent 18-18
Bills_Fan11
Footballguy
I'm not sure if Edwards can engineer a winning football team or not. I know Losman can't even though he's better for Lee Evans fantasy owners...
So I'll go with Edwards and cross my fingers; but like others I don't have much reason to believe either is any good at this point.
So I'll go with Edwards and cross my fingers; but like others I don't have much reason to believe either is any good at this point.
Tommy Collins
Footballguy
Do I have to pick someone?
Johnson is the only one with a ring.
Tommy Collins
Footballguy
I'll take Flutie
GoBills02
Footballguy
Cheater, he wasn't a choice!
OC Zed
Footballguy
I love all the quick judgments against Edwards who has started about a season and a half's worth of games. I won't profess to say he's destined for the hall of fame, but it's certainly not unreasonable to say that he's still maturing as a quarterback.
With respect to the comparison between Edwards and Losman, Edwards wins in every significant category except for arm strength and mobility. Sure, those attributes are nice, but not nearly as important as basic accuracy, being able to effectively read defenses, having a quick release and generally avoiding the bad decision. And I say all of this as someone who wanted to see Losman succeed until he played himself out of the job in 2007 and 2008.
Edwards' Achilles' heel has been throwing against flooded zone defenses (see the Cleveland and Miami games last year). But you also need to study how poorly the coaching staff strategized against those defenses. The logical response would have been to run, run and run some more against the soft defensive sets. Instead, Turk Schonert stubbornly insisted on passing. And not only passing, but passing 90% of the time while in the shotgun and running 90% of the time while under center (check last year's Bills threads where I linked the buffalorumbings' statistical analysis). NO quarterback in this league could succeed when you are tipping your plays like that.
Thus far in the preseason, the Bills' offense has been putrid and Edwards has looked mediocre at best. But it should be noted that he has played all but two series with TO and the offensive line play has been spotty and will continue to be for at least the first of the half of the year. On the upside, Edwards does seem comfortable running the hurry-up offense and the playcalling has been more varied. I recognize a ton of work must be done before the season opener in 15 days, but I am optimistic to think that the offense will continue to get better by Week 1 and throughout the year.
With respect to the comparison between Edwards and Losman, Edwards wins in every significant category except for arm strength and mobility. Sure, those attributes are nice, but not nearly as important as basic accuracy, being able to effectively read defenses, having a quick release and generally avoiding the bad decision. And I say all of this as someone who wanted to see Losman succeed until he played himself out of the job in 2007 and 2008.
Edwards' Achilles' heel has been throwing against flooded zone defenses (see the Cleveland and Miami games last year). But you also need to study how poorly the coaching staff strategized against those defenses. The logical response would have been to run, run and run some more against the soft defensive sets. Instead, Turk Schonert stubbornly insisted on passing. And not only passing, but passing 90% of the time while in the shotgun and running 90% of the time while under center (check last year's Bills threads where I linked the buffalorumbings' statistical analysis). NO quarterback in this league could succeed when you are tipping your plays like that.
Thus far in the preseason, the Bills' offense has been putrid and Edwards has looked mediocre at best. But it should be noted that he has played all but two series with TO and the offensive line play has been spotty and will continue to be for at least the first of the half of the year. On the upside, Edwards does seem comfortable running the hurry-up offense and the playcalling has been more varied. I recognize a ton of work must be done before the season opener in 15 days, but I am optimistic to think that the offense will continue to get better by Week 1 and throughout the year.
Mr Capicollo
Footballguy
The guy who shoots T-shirts into the stands out of the t-shirt cannon is the shark pick here.
stevegamer
Footballguy
I'd second that selection.
Bills_Fan11
Footballguy
He's losing people because with the exception of December 07 --> September 08 he has regressed every month of those 1.5 years. Whatever his stats looked like, he looked like a sharp QB in his first start against the Jets. Jaworski said the same thing during the Cowboys game. He appears to be more indecisive and less confident with more experience. That's not a good sign. We've been blaming our lousy QB play on coaching for a decade and that theory has pretty much always been proven wrong when both the QB and coach have seeked work elsewhere.
