Trent Green's value (1 Viewer)

[easy like sunday morning]

Everywhere I read people are down on Trent Green this year. He has been a top 10 guy for years. Is his run in the top 10 done for sure? The talk is that LJ will be so productive that they will throw a lot less. Green was putting up top 10 numbers when Priest had huge rushing numbers. I realize Preist is a better receiver than LJ. Thoughs?

 

[BigRed]

He's been for the most part very consistent, but Edwards is supposed to be a real run-oriented guy and has an offense that practically screams "run" to boot. Plus Green is getting up there in age and has very limited receiving options. I'd say top 10 is reasobable but so what, I don't want the 10th best QB starting for me....well unless I went for strength in other areas and felt I could "get away" with it. Wouldn't bother me to have him starting if cheap enough I guess.

 

[easy like sunday morning]

He's been for the most part very consistent, but Edwards is supposed to be a real run-oriented guy and has an offense that practically screams "run" to boot. Plus Green is getting up there in age and has very limited receiving options. I'd say top 10 is reasobable but so what, I don't want the 10th best QB starting for me....well unless I went for strength in other areas and felt I could "get away" with it. Wouldn't bother me to have him starting if cheap enough I guess.

He is my back up as I have Hasselback. McNair and Brunell are out there and a lot of the rankings I see have both ahead of Green. I am still thinking I will stick with Green though.

 

[The Jerk]

Everywhere I read people are down on Trent Green this year. He has been a top 10 guy for years. Is his run in the top 10 done for sure? The talk is that LJ will be so productive that they will throw a lot less. Green was putting up top 10 numbers when Priest had huge rushing numbers. I realize Preist is a better receiver than LJ. Thoughs?

He definitely slipped a little last year. He was top 10 in total points but roughly 14th in ppg (FBG's stats). His durability is one of the best parts of his game. He's a solid guy to have, but only at the right price. (But the right price part is true of everyone, right?)

 

[nygiants56]

He's been for the most part very consistent, but Edwards is supposed to be a real run-oriented guy and has an offense that practically screams "run" to boot.  Plus Green is getting up there in age and has very limited receiving options.  I'd say top 10 is reasobable but so what, I don't want the 10th best QB starting for me....well unless I went for strength in other areas and felt I could "get away" with it. Wouldn't bother me to have him starting if cheap enough I guess.

BIG TIME SLEEPER FOR 2006.look, Herm wants to throw the deep ball, but coaching in NY< he knew he couldn't throw more than 5 yards downfield with noodle-armed bust, Chad Pennington..Green is 1,000 times better than Penny..17 td with 4k yards is still nothing to sneeze at! he's a certified top 8-9 QB ( I'm personally certifying him..lol)

you have nothing to worry about with him,it'll be a banner year for Green !

avg'd 4k yards 3 years in a row, with what, 26-28 tds each year?

please.he'll get that in his sleep , with teams focusing on LJ, Kennison and Parker will be blazing trails down the sidelines.

 

[Mystery Achiever]

He is my back up as I have Hasselback. McNair and Brunell are out there and a lot of the rankings I see have both ahead of Green. I am still thinking I will stick with Green though.

Wow - No contest between Green and McNair/Brunell imo. He still put up 4000 yards last year. I think the whole Herm likes to run thing is pushing him down too far.

 

[BigRed]

He is my back up as I have Hasselback. McNair and Brunell are out there and a lot of the rankings I see have both ahead of Green. I am still thinking I will stick with Green though.

Wow - No contest between Green and McNair/Brunell imo. He still put up 4000 yards last year. I think the whole Herm likes to run thing is pushing him down too far.

right

 

[MLBrandow]

BIG TIME SLEEPER FOR 2006.

look, Herm wants to throw the deep ball, but coaching in NY< he knew he couldn't throw more than 5 yards downfield with noodle-armed bust, Chad Pennington..Green is 1,000 times better than Penny..17 td with 4k yards is still nothing to sneeze at! he's a certified top 8-9 QB ( I'm personally certifying him..lol)

you have nothing to worry about with him,it'll be a banner year for Green !

avg'd 4k yards 3 years in a row, with what, 26-28 tds each year?

please.he'll get that in his sleep , with teams focusing on LJ, Kennison and Parker will be blazing trails down the sidelines.

I realize Herm loves to pair the deep ball with his running game, but who's going to stretch the field?Kennison?

Samie Parker?

Dante Hall?

 

[Evilgrin 72]

I don't see how his downside is any lower than last year's performance. He has nowhere to go but up in the TD department going from an offensive system that ran 1st, 2nd and 3rd in the red zone. I see him as a serviceable starter if you decide to wait on a QB - I'd rather spend a 7th/8th round pick on him than a 5th on Culpepper (all based on current AntSports ADP) once the few top guns are off the board.

 

[slayer666]

Trent Green just turned 36 and is getting to that age when skills can start eroding quickly. His touchdown pass numbers were down 38% in 2005 from 2004. With that said, the KC brain trust must be comfortable with him, as they have no one worth mentioning behind him on the depth chart. I wouldn't want to rely on Green as anything more than a QB2 in 2006.

 

[BigRed]

I'd rather spend a 7th/8th round pick on him than a 5th on Culpepper (all based on current AntSports ADP)

lol @ Culpepper in the 5th. wtf

 

[Evilgrin 72]

I'd rather spend a 7th/8th round pick on him than a 5th on Culpepper (all based on current AntSports ADP)

lol @ Culpepper in the 5th. wtf

Current ADP in P1 leagues on AntSports, Flex, No TE Required is 5.08

 

[Assani Fisher]

BIG TIME SLEEPER FOR 2006.

look, Herm wants to throw the deep ball, but coaching in NY< he knew he couldn't throw more than 5 yards downfield with noodle-armed bust, Chad Pennington..Green is 1,000 times better than Penny..17 td with 4k yards is still nothing to sneeze at! he's a certified top 8-9 QB ( I'm personally certifying him..lol)

you have nothing to worry about with him,it'll be a banner year for Green !

avg'd 4k yards 3 years in a row, with what, 26-28 tds each year?

please.he'll get that in his sleep , with teams focusing on LJ, Kennison and Parker will be blazing trails down the sidelines.

I realize Herm loves to pair the deep ball with his running game, but who's going to stretch the field?Kennison?

Samie Parker?

Dante Hall?

Isn't the deep ball considered the strength of those WRs?

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

You all saying that Green will suffer. Last season he was a top 10 QB and he is the only QB with three straight 4K yard season. I know leagues differ but he was a top 10 guy last season in my league (#8), even with the drop in TDs. And only three QBs that scored more PPG than Green had fewer INTS.

When you factor in bonuses for 300 yd games (he had four....as many as P. Manning) and the bonuses you get there, there is no reason Green shouldnt be a top 10 QB.

Another nugget: Herman Edwards has said he wants to rush the ball 500 times.....if you just combine Holmes-LJ-Dee Brown-T-Rish from 2005, you get 468 carries.....and if you throw Green in you have over 500...so I dont get where the uproar is coming from abut KC running the ball more will hurt Green...the proportion wont change much to me....but the distribution will

I would love to see the histroical data dominator and see how many guys who are 36 have still put up 3500 Yds and 20 TDs. I bet its more than one would think. And when you factor in that Green doesnt have the normal wear on a QB his age becuase of the rough beginning of his career, the numbers could be inflated even more.

 

[joffer]

You all saying that Green will suffer. Last season he was a top 10 QB and he is the only QB with three straight 4K yard season. I know leagues differ but he was a top 10 guy last season in my league (#8), even with the drop in TDs. And only three QBs that scored more PPG than Green had fewer INTS.

When you factor in bonuses for 300 yd games (he had four....as many as P. Manning) and the bonuses you get there, there is no reason Green shouldnt be a top 10 QB.

Another nugget: Herman Edwards has said he wants to rush the ball 500 times.....if you just combine Holmes-LJ-Dee Brown-T-Rish from 2005, you get 468 carries.....and if you throw Green in you have over 500...so I dont get where the uproar is coming from abut KC running the ball more will hurt Green...the proportion wont change much to me....but the distribution will

I would love to see the histroical data dominator and see how many guys who are 36 have still put up 3500 Yds and 20 TDs. I bet its more than one would think. And when you factor in that Green doesnt have the normal wear on a QB his age becuase of the rough beginning of his career, the numbers could be inflated even more.

1 Rich Gannon qb 2002 37 16 16 418 618 4689 7.59 26 10 362.05 2 Warren Moon qb 1995 39 12 16 377 606 4228 6.98 33 14 337.60 3 Steve Young qb 1998 37 14 15 322 517 4170 8.07 36 12 421.90 4 Brett Favre qb 2005 36 15 16 372 607 3881 6.39 20 29 251.25 5 Rich Gannon qb 2001 36 15 16 361 549 3828 6.97 27 9 325.50 6 Vinny Testaverde qb 2000 37 14 16 328 590 3732 6.33 21 25 248.80 7 Warren Moon qb 1997 41 14 15 313 528 3678 6.97 25 16 277.90 8 John Elway qb 1997 37 15 16 280 502 3635 7.24 27 11 306.55 9 Roger Staubach qb 1979 37 11 16 267 461 3586 7.78 27 11 293.50

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

You all saying that Green will suffer. Last season he was a top 10 QB and he is the only QB with three straight 4K yard season. I know leagues differ but he was a top 10 guy last season in my league (#8), even with the drop in TDs. And only three QBs that scored more PPG than Green had fewer INTS.

When you factor in bonuses for 300 yd games (he had four....as many as P. Manning) and the bonuses you get there, there is no reason Green shouldnt be a top 10 QB.

Another nugget: Herman Edwards has said he wants to rush the ball 500 times.....if you just combine Holmes-LJ-Dee Brown-T-Rish from 2005, you get 468 carries.....and if you throw Green in you have over 500...so I dont get where the uproar is coming from abut KC running the ball more will hurt Green...the proportion wont change much to me....but the distribution will

I would love to see the histroical data dominator and see how many guys who are 36 have still put up 3500 Yds and 20 TDs. I bet its more than one would think. And when you factor in that Green doesnt have the normal wear on a QB his age becuase of the rough beginning of his career, the numbers could be inflated even more.

1 Rich Gannon qb 2002 37 16 16 418 618 4689 7.59 26 10 362.05 2 Warren Moon qb 1995 39 12 16 377 606 4228 6.98 33 14 337.60 3 Steve Young qb 1998 37 14 15 322 517 4170 8.07 36 12 421.90 4 Brett Favre qb 2005 36 15 16 372 607 3881 6.39 20 29 251.25 5 Rich Gannon qb 2001 36 15 16 361 549 3828 6.97 27 9 325.50 6 Vinny Testaverde qb 2000 37 14 16 328 590 3732 6.33 21 25 248.80 7 Warren Moon qb 1997 41 14 15 313 528 3678 6.97 25 16 277.90 8 John Elway qb 1997 37 15 16 280 502 3635 7.24 27 11 306.55 9 Roger Staubach qb 1979 37 11 16 267 461 3586 7.78 27 11 293.50

Moon and Gannon on there twice....so anyone saying Green will decline doesnt have all the facts. Is it possible? Probable? I dont know but you cant just throw out those guys listed.

 

[The Jacket]

BIG TIME SLEEPER FOR 2006.

look, Herm wants to throw the deep ball, but coaching in NY< he knew he couldn't throw more than 5 yards downfield with noodle-armed bust, Chad Pennington..Green is 1,000 times better than Penny..17 td with 4k yards is still nothing to sneeze at! he's a certified top 8-9 QB ( I'm personally certifying him..lol)

you have nothing to worry about with him,it'll be a banner year for Green !

avg'd 4k yards 3 years in a row, with what, 26-28 tds each year?

please.he'll get that in his sleep , with teams focusing on LJ, Kennison and Parker will be blazing trails down the sidelines.

I realize Herm loves to pair the deep ball with his running game, but who's going to stretch the field?Kennison?

Samie Parker?

Dante Hall?

Isn't the deep ball considered the strength of those WRs?

With Parker and Kennison, absolutely. And you could argue that Hall's strength is going deep or working the underneath stuff. Kennison's definitely an underrated deep receiver, too. Last 4 seasons: 906, 853, 1086 and 1102 yards. The worst yards per catch average in any of those seasons was a very solid 15.2. He's also complimented that with 16.2, 17.1 and a very impressive 17.5 in 2004 when he had 1086 yards and 8 touchdowns.

I know it was 2004, but almost 1100 yards and 8 touchdowns, in itself without consideration for the yards per catch average, is very solid fantasy production.

 

[raidergil]

You all saying that Green will suffer.  Last season he was a top 10 QB and he is the only QB with three straight 4K yard season.  I know leagues differ but he was a top 10 guy last season in my league (#8), even with the drop in TDs.  And only three QBs that scored more PPG than Green had fewer INTS.

When you factor in bonuses for 300 yd games (he had four....as many as P. Manning) and the bonuses you get there, there is no reason Green shouldnt be a top 10 QB.

Another nugget:  Herman Edwards has said he wants to rush the ball 500 times.....if you just combine Holmes-LJ-Dee Brown-T-Rish from 2005, you get 468 carries.....and if you throw Green in you have over 500...so I dont get where the uproar is coming from abut KC running the ball more will hurt Green...the proportion wont change much to me....but the distribution will

I would love to see the histroical data dominator and see how many guys who are 36 have still put up 3500 Yds and 20 TDs.  I bet its more than one would think.  And when you factor in that Green doesnt have the normal wear on a QB his age becuase of the rough beginning of his career, the numbers could be inflated even more.

1 Rich Gannon qb 2002 37 16 16 418 618 4689 7.59 26 10 362.05 2 Warren Moon qb 1995 39 12 16 377 606 4228 6.98 33 14 337.60 3 Steve Young qb 1998 37 14 15 322 517 4170 8.07 36 12 421.90 4 Brett Favre qb 2005 36 15 16 372 607 3881 6.39 20 29 251.25 5 Rich Gannon qb 2001 36 15 16 361 549 3828 6.97 27 9 325.50 6 Vinny Testaverde qb 2000 37 14 16 328 590 3732 6.33 21 25 248.80 7 Warren Moon qb 1997 41 14 15 313 528 3678 6.97 25 16 277.90 8 John Elway qb 1997 37 15 16 280 502 3635 7.24 27 11 306.55 9 Roger Staubach qb 1979 37 11 16 267 461 3586 7.78 27 11 293.50

Moon and Gannon on there twice....so anyone saying Green will decline doesnt have all the facts. Is it possible? Probable? I dont know but you cant just throw out those guys listed.

Then again 6 of those 9 spots are taken by HOFers and Gannon's teams used the pass to control the clock (and had 2 HOF WRs). I would not at all be surprised to see Green end up around the 8th spot again. BUT, he lost his HC & OC and has a 33 yr old WR as his top WR. With LJ taking over last yr Green threw for 10 less TDs than '04. An anamoly? Possibly. But something that does need to be noted. I wouldn't predict a collapse, but I do see him dropping just out of the top 10 this yr.

 

[renesauz]

You all saying that Green will suffer.  Last season he was a top 10 QB and he is the only QB with three straight 4K yard season.  I know leagues differ but he was a top 10 guy last season in my league (#8), even with the drop in TDs.  And only three QBs that scored more PPG than Green had fewer INTS.

When you factor in bonuses for 300 yd games (he had four....as many as P. Manning) and the bonuses you get there, there is no reason Green shouldnt be a top 10 QB.

Another nugget:  Herman Edwards has said he wants to rush the ball 500 times.....if you just combine Holmes-LJ-Dee Brown-T-Rish from 2005, you get 468 carries.....and if you throw Green in you have over 500...so I dont get where the uproar is coming from abut KC running the ball more will hurt Green...the proportion wont change much to me....but the distribution will

I would love to see the histroical data dominator and see how many guys who are 36 have still put up 3500 Yds and 20 TDs.  I bet its more than one would think.  And when you factor in that Green doesnt have the normal wear on a QB his age becuase of the rough beginning of his career, the numbers could be inflated even more.

1 Rich Gannon qb 2002 37 16 16 418 618 4689 7.59 26 10 362.05 2 Warren Moon qb 1995 39 12 16 377 606 4228 6.98 33 14 337.60 3 Steve Young qb 1998 37 14 15 322 517 4170 8.07 36 12 421.90 4 Brett Favre qb 2005 36 15 16 372 607 3881 6.39 20 29 251.25 5 Rich Gannon qb 2001 36 15 16 361 549 3828 6.97 27 9 325.50 6 Vinny Testaverde qb 2000 37 14 16 328 590 3732 6.33 21 25 248.80 7 Warren Moon qb 1997 41 14 15 313 528 3678 6.97 25 16 277.90 8 John Elway qb 1997 37 15 16 280 502 3635 7.24 27 11 306.55 9 Roger Staubach qb 1979 37 11 16 267 461 3586 7.78 27 11 293.50

Moon and Gannon on there twice....so anyone saying Green will decline doesnt have all the facts. Is it possible? Probable? I dont know but you cant just throw out those guys listed.

Then again 6 of those 9 spots are taken by HOFers and Gannon's teams used the pass to control the clock (and had 2 HOF WRs). I would not at all be surprised to see Green end up around the 8th spot again. BUT, he lost his HC & OC and has a 33 yr old WR as his top WR. With LJ taking over last yr Green threw for 10 less TDs than '04. An anamoly? Possibly. But something that does need to be noted. I wouldn't predict a collapse, but I do see him dropping just out of the top 10 this yr.

Agreed...a great QB2 with the potential to be a solid QB1. Likely a little bit under-rated this year, the concerns are not unjustified. Use it to your advantage and take him late!

 

[jbird]

From KFFL

Chiefs | Days of big-play offense appear to be gone

Sun, 23 Jul 2006 12:16:15 -0700

Adam Teicher, of the Kansas City Star, reports the Kansas City Chiefs days of having a big-play offense appear to be gone now that head coach Herman Edwards has control of the team. QB Trent Green said, "I've had many meetings with coach Edwards and talked with him about what his game plan is and what his style is in terms of game management. We talked about the way we were a big-play offense and the way we really threw the ball around and those kinds of things. If we're winning, that's great. I don't have a problem with that."

It seems to me that Green is surrendering the big play, implying he won’t have the same kind of passing stats that he and we have been accustomed to by saying “If we're winning, that's great. I don't have a problem with that.”

 

[-OZ-]

Supposedly, they'll run more, but quite frankly, if Priest doesn't return, I don't see how. LJ gets hurt, what do you think will happen to that offense?

A better defense though, and Herm's philosophy will cut into Green's stats, just not as much as his ADP would imply.

 

[x260bm]

Green’s TD numbers were down last year because Kansas City had a lot of pass protection issues. They lost their starting RT in training camp. Their top backup lineman was suspended for the first four games. Willie Roaf missed several games and played the worst season of his professional career. Holmes is a much better blocker than LJ so when he went down they took another hit. On top of that they decided to take the FB out of their offense last year. When the Chiefs have to use Gonzo to block (see his numbers last year) they don’t have the receivers to score in the redzone. Going into this year, they don’t even have a FB on their roster and they still do not have a possession receiver. So if you think they can find a RT, the aging players on the line can stay healthy, and LJ gets better at blocking move Trent Green up the list. If you don’t think that will happen move Green down.

Herm is not going to change the offense until he starts bringing in his type of players which he has not done yet.

 

[cr8f]

He's been for the most part very consistent, but Edwards is supposed to be a real run-oriented guy and has an offense that practically screams "run" to boot. Plus Green is getting up there in age and has very limited receiving options. I'd say top 10 is reasobable but so what, I don't want the 10th best QB starting for me....well unless I went for strength in other areas and felt I could "get away" with it. Wouldn't bother me to have him starting if cheap enough I guess.

He's been available late rounds in 2 keeper leagues. A good backup QB.

 

[DaTruth]

Mark my words, Trent Green will surprise a lot of people this year. Granted, that Herm will pull back the reigns, but even Pennington in 2002 was a very good fantasy QB. Green i think will continue to do well with teams looking to stop the run first.

DaTruth

 

[jurb26]

I have not been high on Green at all this year. Heck, I've been down on basically all Chiefs. I got Green in the 14th round of a 10 team draft tonight though. Just could not pass up that value. He is QB3 on the team. Yes, people are very DOWN on him for whatever reason.

 

[broncofan13000]

Mark my words, Trent Green will surprise a lot of people this year. Granted, that Herm will pull back the reigns, but even Pennington in 2002 was a very good fantasy QB. Green i think will continue to do well with teams looking to stop the run first. DaTruth

I'm with you...T.Green kept dropping in one of my drafts, and am loving the value he presents this year.

 

[shadow2k]

FWIW, Herm has nothing to do with the play calling. Solari will be doing it, sending in two plays to Green at a time, and letting Green pick. It used to be Saunders sending in one play, and that was basically it. And it took way too long to do it, so you never saw any audibles. This year, the emphasis is on getting to the line quicker with two numbers from Solari that he has on a wristband, so Green can get the plays quicker. Then he can get to the line, and have time to audible if he wants. This simply did not happen with Saunders, except when it wasn't supposed to be happening.

For those of you who aren't aware, Green has done this in the past on a limited basis with KC, and had very good success at it. Mostly because Saunders couldn't seem to get his plays called in time when the clock mattered. I know everyone likes to think he's an offensive genius, but he was a very slow "genius". So a lot of those successful two-min drills KC would run, it wasn't Saunders calling the plays. It was Green.

Than being said...I still see Green's numbers being a lot like last year. Solid backup, but not the greatest starting option. But if you can play the matchups, he's definitely worth owning. Just don't expect him to add on 10TD's to last years totals, it's not going to happen. They'll lean on LJ a lot this year, just like last year. They want to control the clock like they have in the past, not just air it out.

 

[DaTruth]

I agree and i think they will lean on LJ a lot, but as we saw the Giants and Rams do, they will put 8 men in teh box to stop the run first. That will leave Green with options to throw the ball. From what i saw against the Rams, he looked pretty sharp. He moved well in the pocket and showed his ability to miss would be tacklers and then throw a strike to his receivers. Granted this was the Rams, but physically you can tell he still has it. Green is going be a very undervalued player this year.

DaTruth

 

[broncofan13000]

FWIW, Herm has nothing to do with the play calling. Solari will be doing it, sending in two plays to Green at a time, and letting Green pick. It used to be Saunders sending in one play, and that was basically it. And it took way too long to do it, so you never saw any audibles. This year, the emphasis is on getting to the line quicker with two numbers from Solari that he has on a wristband, so Green can get the plays quicker. Then he can get to the line, and have time to audible if he wants. This simply did not happen with Saunders, except when it wasn't supposed to be happening.For those of you who aren't aware, Green has done this in the past on a limited basis with KC, and had very good success at it. Mostly because Saunders couldn't seem to get his plays called in time when the clock mattered. I know everyone likes to think he's an offensive genius, but he was a very slow "genius". So a lot of those successful two-min drills KC would run, it wasn't Saunders calling the plays. It was Green.Than being said...I still see Green's numbers being a lot like last year. Solid backup, but not the greatest starting option. But if you can play the matchups, he's definitely worth owning. Just don't expect him to add on 10TD's to last years totals, it's not going to happen. They'll lean on LJ a lot this year, just like last year. They want to control the clock like they have in the past, not just air it out.

thanks for the insight

 

[zamboni]

I would agree that the Herm run-oriented concern is overblown. Even with Curtis Martin, Herm has always said this his offense is a "QB-driven offense". I'm not totally sure what that means, but it does indicate that the QB's role is not merely to hand the ball off.

Whatever the case, I think Green's numbers will hinge more on the defense. If the defense is strong, and keeps the offense off the field, Green's numbers may suffer. If the defense is porous, then Green may get back to his old numbers.

 

[The Duff Man]

Green = Gold value this year.

TDs were down last year. I read somewhere that Gonzo had X number of catches inside the 10 last year, none for TDs. Look for that to change this year.

Also, I think they will pass more in the red zone and in particular near the goal line, given the loss of Roaf and Richardson.

 

[DaTruth]

I'm not sure how many TD's Green will get, but i definately see him between 3800-4000 yards passing. The running game will not be as dominate as it has been in the past and even with Herm's conservative plan, they will be forced to throw.

DaTruth