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Trivia Question: How many times in the Shannahan era (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter LHUCKS
- Start date
Weiner Dog
Footballguy
5?
Davis 3x. Portis 2x.
Davis 3x. Portis 2x.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
The thread title on my machine says "QB" . . .
Since Shannahan became head coach of the Broncos, I have counted four instances of his QB finishing in the top 6 of fantasy football. John Elway did it in '95, '96, and '97. Jake Plummer did it in '04.
David Yudkin
Footballguy
Accoring to PFR, Elway did it three times but no one else since. Plummer was close once (7th).
Why top 6? That's kind of an arbitrary number, isn't it? Why not top 5, top 10, or most importantly, top 12 (since most "SERIOUS" fantasy leagues are AT LEAST 12 team leagues)?
Anyway, top 6, 4 times: 95, 96, 97-John Elway AND 04-Jake Plummer
Top 12, however, you add 98 (Elway), 05 (Plummer), and 07 (Cutler). You also have Brian Griese ranked 15 in 2000, however, he only played 10 games that year. If you take his ppg for those 10 games, over the entire season, he would have been the #4 QB.
So if the question is asking how often the Shanahan "system" produces a quality #1 FF QB, you should say 8 out of 13 years. That's not a bad ratio, IMO.
Anyway, top 6, 4 times: 95, 96, 97-John Elway AND 04-Jake Plummer
Top 12, however, you add 98 (Elway), 05 (Plummer), and 07 (Cutler). You also have Brian Griese ranked 15 in 2000, however, he only played 10 games that year. If you take his ppg for those 10 games, over the entire season, he would have been the #4 QB.
So if the question is asking how often the Shanahan "system" produces a quality #1 FF QB, you should say 8 out of 13 years. That's not a bad ratio, IMO.
LHUCKS
Footballguy
No, it isn't arbitrary.If you are top 6, you are an above average starting QB in a 12 team league...hence the number six.
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David Yudkin
Footballguy
Q: In the past 10 years, how many Denver QBs have had a positive VBD score?A: Jake Plummer twice . . . with scores of 51 and 5 points. And Jay Cutler with a score of 2 points.
Chase Stuart
Footballguy
Unless you think playing in Denver makes a QB more likely to get injured, I don't think this is the question you want to ask.
Here's how the Denver Team QB has ranked in FP every year since Shanahan arrived:
It certainly hasn't been pretty lately, but that's five top-six finishes in thirteen years. And obviously the average performance is a few ticks above the league average, as well. So Shanahan's fantasy QBs have fared better than most fantasy QBs since he's arrived.
Here's how the Denver Team QB has ranked in FP every year since Shanahan arrived:
Code:
2007 142006 252005 152004 82003 182002 152001 142000 51999 201998 51997 41996 51995 6Avg 12
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Chase Stuart
Footballguy
Here's Belichick's:
Obviously if you looked at this before 2005 (outside the top 10 for all five seasons), or even before last year (only one ranking better than 10 in six of seven years), you would have been steered far in the wrong direction.
Code:
2007 12006 102005 12004 122003 122002 122001 232000 20LHUCKS
Footballguy
Okay, this year they lose Walker, their #1 RB, Marshall for 3 weeks. The Pats added Welker, and arguably the best WR in the history of the game in Moss.Let's not compare apples to oranges here.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Oh, so you meant "the last seven years of the Shanahan era" then. Got it.
Chase Stuart
Footballguy
I'm simply stating that looking just at historical trends can sometimes bite you pretty hard. I think how Cutler ranked last year in adjusted fantasy points per adjusted games is a whole lot more important than how the Denver QBs ranked in any season, or all seasons, from 1995-2006.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
But that rational argument doesn't mesh with HUCKS' agenda.
a_troll00
Footballguy
Great logic here LHUCKS! You have to downgrade Cutler because Brian Griese and Jake The Mistake haven't put up stellar fantasy numbers?
We're talking about Griese who couldn't even beat out Jay Fiedler in Miami. Then Jake Plummer, the guy with the strong arm but poor accuracy and decision making. Nonetheless, Plummer did manage 4000 yds and 27 tds in 2004.
The problem with the Broncos offense has been the QUARTERBACKS since Elway retired, not Mike Shanahan's system. Nice try attempting to use Griese and Plummer to project Cutler.
We're talking about Griese who couldn't even beat out Jay Fiedler in Miami. Then Jake Plummer, the guy with the strong arm but poor accuracy and decision making. Nonetheless, Plummer did manage 4000 yds and 27 tds in 2004.
The problem with the Broncos offense has been the QUARTERBACKS since Elway retired, not Mike Shanahan's system. Nice try attempting to use Griese and Plummer to project Cutler.
a_troll00
Footballguy
You're talking about the guy who says Cutler will be average at best, but Leinart will be a GREAT NFL QB.But that rational argument doesn't mesh with HUCKS' agenda.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
Take a stab why that is...He's only now abandoning the Akili Smith bandwagon.You're talking about the guy who says Cutler will be average at best, but Leinart will be a GREAT NFL QB.But that rational argument doesn't mesh with HUCKS' agenda.
LHUCKS
Footballguy
I'd agree with that, but I also think you need to take into account the downgrades at WR and RB.
LHUCKS
Footballguy
Plummer was a pretty good QB IMHO.
Oh, got it. That makes sense, I guess. So that means that 5 out of 13 years, Shanahan has had an "above average starting QB." 95, 96, 97-John Elway, 04-Jake Plummer, AND 2000 (Griese and Gus Frerotte combined for 368 points, which was higher than the 4th ranked QB) 5/13 is 39%Let's look at some other QBs, shall we? Brett Favre: 7/16 years as top 6 or better=44% Not to much better, huh? (Doesn't count year 1 in ATL)Matt Hasselbeck: 3/7 years=43% (Doesn't count back-up years in GB)Donovan McNabb: 3/8 years=38%Drew Brees: 2/6 years=33%
Hmmm...I think we can agree that he is an "above average starting QB?" (Doesn't count 1st year)Tom Brady: 2/7 years=29% Wow, I could have sworn he was above average.
Federal
Footballguy
You combined Greise & Frerotte. Did you do the same combos for all teams? If not, then you might not be able to count that one and the number moves closer to 30%, not that big of a deal, just sayin'Oh, got it. That makes sense, I guess. So that means that 5 out of 13 years, Shanahan has had an "above average starting QB." 95, 96, 97-John Elway, 04-Jake Plummer, AND 2000 (Griese and Gus Frerotte combined for 368 points, which was higher than the 4th ranked QB) 5/13 is 39%Let's look at some other QBs, shall we?
Brett Favre: 7/16 years as top 6 or better=44% Not to much better, huh? (Doesn't count year 1 in ATL)
Matt Hasselbeck: 3/7 years=43% (Doesn't count back-up years in GB)
Donovan McNabb: 3/8 years=38%
Drew Brees: 2/6 years=33%
Tom Brady: 2/7 years=29% Wow, I could have sworn he was above average.
thatguy
Footballguy
Better change that to just IMO. Your opinion is never humble.
RenegadeGM
Footballguy
The real question here is how many years did Jay Cutler play in the Pac 10?
Top 12 does not equal quality FF QB. Top six does.
