What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

US Men's National Team (12 Viewers)

gianmarco said:
So let's fill in the rest...
Click to expand...
It's hard after you get past the obvious ones.  Too old, too young, haven't seen them enough, not really very different from each other, recency bias, in form/out of form, etc.

Yedlin, Bradley, Jozy, Arriola, Boyd all probably there today -- but ask me in two months and I might give you a different answer.

What do you do with Fabian Johnson, Nagbe and Bobby Wood?

Is Zardes just a placeholder?  What about Lletget when he's healthy?

How much more would you need to see from Pomykol, Duane Holmes?  Weah?  Sargent?

Which of the CBs emerge?  CCV, Miazga, Long, Zimmerman?

Is Horvath top-15 if he's our #2 keeper?

How do you mix in my "somedays" -- Dest, Richards, Reyna?

After the top-4 I don't think I could argue with anyone's order from 5-26.  And I'm sure I've forgotten someone.

I'd fight you on Ream, Roldan, Cannon and Morris though (and I like them just fine in our pool -- they're useful).

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
It's hard after you get past the obvious ones.  Too old, too young, haven't seen them enough, not really very different from each other, recency bias, in form/out of form, etc.

Yedlin, Bradley, Jozy, Arriola, Boyd all probably there today -- but ask me in two months and I might give you a different answer.

What do you do with Fabian Johnson, Nagbe and Bobby Wood?

Is Zardes just a placeholder?  What about Lletget when he's healthy?

How much more would you need to see from Pomykol, Duane Holmes?  Weah?  Sargent?

Which of the CBs emerge?  CCV, Miazga, Long, Zimmerman?

Is Horvath top-15 if he's our #2 keeper?

How do you mix in my "somedays" -- Dest, Richards, Reyna?

After the top-4 I don't think I could argue with anyone's order from 5-26.  And I'm sure I've forgotten someone.

I'd fight you on Ream, Roldan, Cannon and Morris though (and I like them just fine in our pool -- they're useful).
Click to expand...
I understand. That's kind of the purpose of the question. Put pen to paper and list our top 15, whatever that means to you. Emphasis on talent (current or potential).

 
Fine.  First tier is in order, but the rest are not:

Elite/near elite:

  • Pulisic
  • Adams
  • McKennie
  • Brooks
Players I think have a great chance to get into elite/near elite tier:

  • Steffan
  • Pomykol
  • Richards
  • Dest
  • Reyna
Solid players right now, plus players with good chance of being solid players or better soon:

  • Miazga
  • Yedlin
  • Arriola
  • Boyd
  • Altidore
  • Bradley
  • Weah
  • Sargent
  • Horvath
  • Holmes
Other:

  • Zardes
  • Lletget
  • Acosta
  • Zimmerman
  • Long
  • CCV

 
Last edited by a moderator:
btw... is Acosta completely out of the picture forever?  I realize the competition at his position has gotten ridiculous, but isn't he still pretty young?  Good players don't just stop being good.  I don't remember the last time I heard anything about him (club included).

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
btw... is Acosta completely out of the picture forever?  I realize the competition at his position has gotten ridiculous, but isn't he still pretty young?  Good players don't just stop being good.  I don't remember the last time I heard anything about him (club included).
Click to expand...
Berhalter has not called him even to a C team level camp, so as long as Berhalter is around, I think his window is shut for now.

He is 23.  He needed to get to Europe 2 years ago IMO but nothing ever materialized and now he toils at one of the worst clubs in the league in Colorado.  Dallas had so much young talent that they traded him away for a player who rarely sees the field for them.

 
it is worth mentioning again that there are likely to be 2-5 players on the WC team (should they qualify) that none of us have ever mentioned or even heard of.

Three years ago not a single person was talking about Aaron Long as he was still playing in the USL, none of us had ever heard of Boyd and Pomykal was still just a baby in FC Dallas's system.

I expect a few more surprises, whether it be an unheralded youth player who catches on or one of the 75 seeds we have in Germany who emerge, or a dual citizen no one knows about, or a reclamation project etc etc.

I expect a decent amount of change the next 2.5 years even if the coach remains the same.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
El Floppo said:
Have we already forgotten about Boyd and Lletget?
Click to expand...
I like Lletget but I think we also have to come to terms that he has an incredibly hard time staying healthy.

He is almost 27 years old and has played only 106 professional games (across all competitions) in his career.  The is a ridiculously low number at his age.

I really liked what I have seen of Boyd.  I am hoping that his one bad (and it was really bad) game did not remove him from the picture so quickly.  Morris made exactly two good plays last night but was otherwise invisible.  We have to get more out of a winger in this system else Pulisic is not going to live to see 23 years old once the central american teams figure out that they can kick him into oblivion and not worry about any one else.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Another seed planted.  These ones take longer to grow though

=================================

Goalkeeper Nico Hansen has signed a first professional contract with Everton, penning a two-year deal until June 2021.
 
The 17-year-old USA youth international has been rewarded for his impressive progress since moving to Everton from his home country in 2017.
 
The talented stopper set out his resolve to continue working hard and developing his game.
 
“Signing this deal is a proud moment for me and my family,” he told evertonfc.com. “It’s everything I’ve been working towards these past two years.
 
“Since I first arrived here, it’s been fantastic. It’s been like a family. It’s a great environment to be in and everyone is so supportive.
 
“Now I just want to repay the support the Club has shown in me by becoming the best goalkeeper I can be.”

 
Manuel Veth‏ @ManuelVeth

Djordje Mihailovic from the Chicago Fire is being heavily linked with a move to Germany. According to German sources Hertha are the favorites but Bayer Leverkusen are also interested (Sport 90)

 
  • Thinking
Reactions: Ned
Griffin Yow, who flashed some good things for the U17's back in qualifying, gets his first MLS start tonight for DC.  He is still just 16.

 
I did not see the game but people on twitter are buzzing about Pomykal's game tonight.  Sounds like he was a beast on both sides of the ball again.

 
NewlyRetired said:
Manuel Veth‏ @ManuelVeth

Djordje Mihailovic from the Chicago Fire is being heavily linked with a move to Germany. According to German sources Hertha are the favorites but Bayer Leverkusen are also interested (Sport 90)
Click to expand...
Oof. Why?

 
gianmarco said:
Oof. Why?
Click to expand...
He's only 20.  Way too soon to write him off, and moving to a big league will help him find his true level. 

Love what's happening right now with US players.  Pretty soon it will be impossible to keep up with all of the teens signing overseas.  This is not a drill -- it's what we've been waiting for for 25 years!

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Column F has the FFA Tiers.  I pre-filled a few on a whim; feel free to edit if you want.

I've been on the fence where to draw the line on including youth players in this exercise.  I think including U20 and older makes the most sense, especially given how many kids showed up during the U20 WC.  

I think we can also trim some of the fat on the older guys.  Someone like Bedonka doesn't really need to be there any more...

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BRCRlGNeeXlNdKqHkQbdFZj_VuKJOrv3glOitfCyQOs/edit?usp=sharing

 
NewlyRetired said:
I think it is very healthy for our players to be wanted by better leagues.

Other teams don't make their decisions on one or two international games.  They make their decisions based on the bulk of the work at club level where Milhailovic has shown well.
Click to expand...
Definitely agree on the bolded.  And I'm glad he's even getting a chance.

But the few times I've seen, every time I've come away incredibly underwhelmed.  In particular, his ability to deliver crosses or balls from set pieces is way below what I'd expect from someone at this level.  Maybe I'm missing something or these teams see something I don't and hopefully that's the case.

 
Ned said:
Column F has the FFA Tiers.  I pre-filled a few on a whim; feel free to edit if you want.

I've been on the fence where to draw the line on including youth players in this exercise.  I think including U20 and older makes the most sense, especially given how many kids showed up during the U20 WC.  

I think we can also trim some of the fat on the older guys.  Someone like Bedonka doesn't really need to be there any more...

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BRCRlGNeeXlNdKqHkQbdFZj_VuKJOrv3glOitfCyQOs/edit?usp=sharing
Click to expand...
:lmao: @ 99

 
gianmarco said:
Definitely agree on the bolded.  And I'm glad he's even getting a chance.

But the few times I've seen, every time I've come away incredibly underwhelmed.  In particular, his ability to deliver crosses or balls from set pieces is way below what I'd expect from someone at this level.  Maybe I'm missing something or these teams see something I don't and hopefully that's the case.
Click to expand...
I agree he has not looked very good with the US team but he has looked good in Chicago, which is where the German scouts likely have watched him play much more often.

It is also worth mentioning that German teams are not as interested, per say, in international play, since there is no requirement in Germany (like there is in England) where a player has to be a important part of his national team to be able to obtain a work permit.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
NewlyRetired said:
gianmarco said:
Definitely agree on the bolded.  And I'm glad he's even getting a chance.

But the few times I've seen, every time I've come away incredibly underwhelmed.  In particular, his ability to deliver crosses or balls from set pieces is way below what I'd expect from someone at this level.  Maybe I'm missing something or these teams see something I don't and hopefully that's the case.
Click to expand...
I agree he has not looked very good with the US team but he has looked good in Chicago, which is where the German scouts likely have watched him play much more often.

It is also worth mentioning that German teams are not as interested, per say, in international play, since their is no requirement in Germany (like there is in England) where a player has to be a important part of his national team to be able to obtain a work permit.
Click to expand...
He also had a good showing when he got his first chance with the Sr. team, so I wouldn't be so quick to write him off (even though he looked pretty bad last couple of times).

 
I wonder if the German teams are figuring out that the depth of talent in the US is comparable to South America, where Spanish and Portuguese teams often get their young talent.  Maybe they figure it's easier to get young American players to move to Germany than South American players, or that they want to grow the fan base in the US?  Maybe it's all of these things: talent, competition for talent, ease of transfer, and marketing to a larger fan base.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
The Z Machine said:
I wonder if the German teams are figuring out that the depth of talent in the US is comparable to South America, where Spanish and Portuguese teams often get their young talent.  Maybe they figure it's easier to get young American players to move to Germany than South American players, or that they want to grow the fan base in the US?  Maybe it's all of these things: talent, competition for talent, ease of transfer, and marketing to a larger fan base.
Click to expand...
Absolutely.  And now that the German league has shown a willingness to give them a fair chance and develop them it becomes a virtuous cycle.  Other Americans want to go, more success, more Americans want to go, etc.

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
Which of the eight players in the upper-right area are American?  Pomykol and... anyone? 

And who the hell is Liam Fraser?  That's a ridiculous spot on the chart -- if there's any volume behind that it seems like that would be MVP-level stuff.
Click to expand...
Pomykal, Mihailovic, and Amaya.

Fraser is one of the good young Canadian players from TFC's academy.  Take his stats with a grain of salt since he is not a regular starter yet (only 8 games played this year).

Player on the bottom right is American as well.  That is a nice spot to be as a holding midfielder and young age, which he is.  His passing progression will likely increase as he gets more experience.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
NewlyRetired said:
Pomykal, Mihailovic, and Amaya.

Fraser is one of the good young Canadian players from TFC's academy.  Take his stats with a grain of salt since he is not a regular starter yet (only 8 games played this year)0
Click to expand...
What's Amaya's story?  Has he been capped at any of the U- levels?

 
NewlyRetired said:
Every day I wake up wondering if this is the start of a regular chain, or if it is just a coincidence to have a handful of good players at the same age.

I won't know for another 4 or 5 years I guess.
Click to expand...
Probably a bit of both -- we'll produce more quality players now that there's a natural path for good teens to take and the transfer pipeline overseas is expanding, but having four that good all at once might still be uncommon.

 
The Z Machine said:
I wonder if the German teams are figuring out that the depth of talent in the US is comparable to South America, where Spanish and Portuguese teams often get their young talent.  Maybe they figure it's easier to get young American players to move to Germany than South American players, or that they want to grow the fan base in the US?  Maybe it's all of these things: talent, competition for talent, ease of transfer, and marketing to a larger fan base.
Click to expand...
I am sure there is a bit of a copycat mentality too.  Other German teams saw Pulisic, Weston and Adams become instant regular starters on very good Bundesliga teams.  Those performances certainly help in the evaluation and willingness to try other US talent.

 
My favorite part of the passing chart is Pomykal being higher than both Barco and Rossi.  Those two are the most coveted young MLS players.  Barco could be sold for over $20m in the coming year.

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
Pulisic, Adams and McKennie are 20.  Pomykol is 19.  Somebody pinch me.
Click to expand...
My headbanging moment of the day is acknowledging that Taitigue was the player considered the best of this group too.  The few times he has been healthy, he has been blowing people away who watch him play.

Seems like he will just be one of those guys whose body won't cooperate.

 
I worry Richards will follow this type of path if he does not get away from Bayern via at least a loan

=============

Future USMNT‏ @FutureUsmnt

Right back Matthew Olasunde (21) has signed a 2 year deal with English League 1 club Rotherham United. He moves after spending the last 3 years at Manchester United. Great opportunity for him to get minutes in a first team environment

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
Probably a bit of both -- we'll produce more quality players now that there's a natural path for good teens to take and the transfer pipeline overseas is expanding, but having four that good all at once might still be uncommon.
Click to expand...
I'm hoping that our academies will produce enough quality pros that MLSs quality will rise enough to keep them here, when discussing a way of progressing their "development".

But as it is, it's really clear the academies are producing better young pros. And hopefully CP isnt just a generational freak.

 
El Floppo said:
 And hopefully CP isnt just a generational freak.
Click to expand...
he is scary good at times.  I don't think we can expect his level more than once a generation at best.   He is so far ahead of where Donovan and Dempsey were at the same age, that it is amazing.

His US stat break down of games that matter vs friendlies that they highlighted in the last game was really eye opening.

 
I like that we still have varied development paths in the near future.

1) MLS academy -> MLS -> Europe (the Miazga model)

2) MLS academy -> USL -> MLS -> Europe (the Adams model)*

3) MLS Academy -> Europe youth team -> European main club (the Weston model)

4) Roll the dice and go to Europe really young -> Euro youth team -> Euro Main team (The Pulisic model)

5) MLS Academy -> MLS -> Beating Mexico off with a mallet to stay away from our young players (the Alveraz annoyance)

Then we can add in the overseas dual citizens who have their own development model as well to give us even more diversity.

* by far and away my favorite model, followed by #1.   Any model that returns a transfer fee is fantastic to keep the machine oiled.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
NewlyRetired said:
I like that we still have varied development paths in the near future.

1) MLS academy -> MLS -> Europe (the Miazga model)

2) MLS academy -> USL -> MLS -> Europe (the Adams model)*

3) MLS Academy -> Europe youth team -> European main club (the Weston model)

4) Roll the dice and go to Europe really young -> Euro youth team, Euro Main team (The Pulisic model)

5) MLS Academy -> MLS -> Beating Mexico off with a mallet to stay away from our young players (the Alveraz annoyance)

Then we can add in the overseas dual citizens who have their own development model as well to give us even more diversity.

* by far and away my favorite model, followed by #1.   Any model that returns a transfer fee is fantastic to keep the machine oiled.
Click to expand...
The bold is what's being pushed here locally as the youth pathway to the pros.

I think this is going to continue to intensify as the MLS academies mature.  I know from a Union Academy perspective, they're siphoning more and more talent out of the local clubs on a seemingly daily basis.  The long-term goal here is to produce a national level DA, but that's becoming challenging with the number of kids going from our elite club to Union.  It's an interesting dynamic from a club perspective, but from a US perspective it's exciting and holds a ton of promise.

 
Pomykal needs to get integrated into the team stat.   I’ve seen enough.  I want him and Weah on the roster and getting playing time ASAP.

 
TripItUp said:
Pomykal needs to get integrated into the team stat.   I’ve seen enough.  I want him and Weah on the roster and getting playing time ASAP.
Click to expand...
The only thing that may delay this is whether the group of US coaches want those two on the Olympic qualifying team.

I can see arguments both ways.  I think Olympic qualifying and the Nations League games this fall will overlap so there will have to be a choice if that is correct.

 
Ned said:
I think this is going to continue to intensify as the MLS academies mature.  I know from a Union Academy perspective, they're siphoning more and more talent out of the local clubs on a seemingly daily basis.  
Click to expand...
From a detached perspective, I think this is excellent.

We want and need a high turn over in the academies IMO.

For a zillion different reasons, one 14 year old can look better than another 14 year old and then have it completely flip by the time they are 16.  We need all the academies to be scouting to constantly remove players that may not have a pro tract and replace them with ones that do, even if the replacements were not considered good enough a couple of years ago.

 
NewlyRetired said:
I like that we still have varied development paths in the near future.

1) MLS academy -> MLS -> Europe (the Miazga model)

2) MLS academy -> USL -> MLS -> Europe (the Adams model)*

3) MLS Academy -> Europe youth team -> European main club (the Weston model)

4) Roll the dice and go to Europe really young -> Euro youth team -> Euro Main team (The Pulisic model)

5) MLS Academy -> MLS -> Beating Mexico off with a mallet to stay away from our young players (the Alveraz annoyance)
Click to expand...
6) MLS academy -> UK non-league pub teams -> Championship -> Captain your club in the Premier League -> finally get noticed by US Soccer (the DeMerit model)

 
Let's avoid this:

MLS -> Portugal -> Greece -> Turkey -> MLS -> Brazil -> Serbia -> Finland -> USL (Freddy Adu model)

 
NewlyRetired said:
From a detached perspective, I think this is excellent.

We want and need a high turn over in the academies IMO.

For a zillion different reasons, one 14 year old can look better than another 14 year old and then have it completely flip by the time they are 16.  We need all the academies to be scouting to constantly remove players that may not have a pro tract and replace them with ones that do, even if the replacements were not considered good enough a couple of years ago.
Click to expand...
At least at the 13-15 age, they're taking a different approach where they're still developing the kids at that age and don't have such a cut throat approach (it's really hard to get in, but once you're in you're in for the most part).  They have one big fluid pool where kids are up/down the depth chart playing in multiple levels of leagues generating a lot of playing time.  Once they hit 16 is when that cut pressure really ramps up, IRRC.

Before the 13-15 level, they have a pre-academy going all the way down to the U10 level where they're developing the foundation before they move on to the Academy at U13.  I've seen the U11's and they're seriously deep with talented little fellas; they've done well in some international tournaments.

There's a new academy league developing that our U12 boys will be participating in this fall with Union, DC, NYRB and some other clubs.  It's going to be very interesting.

I am all-in on this; can't get enough of it.  I think we'll really start to see the influx of academy products in the next 5 years once this current crop of boys (2006-2009) flow through the academies.

 
I know somebody has already said this, but Zardes makes me want to take back anything I’ve ever said about Jozy that was negative.

 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

snogger
I'm starting a new job and looking for insight on leading a team
Replies
37
Views
942
Phil Elliott
Phil Elliott
titusbramble
  • Poll Poll
2026 FIFA World Cup megathread
3 4 5
Replies
220
Views
3K
QuizGuy66
QuizGuy66
the moops
Taste test ideas
Replies
38
Views
487
bcat01
B

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 9 (members: 1, guests: 8)
Back
Top