Rusty Barr
Footballguy
league full
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Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
Chris,You are also way off base with regards to our league, and I don't appreciate you referring that I ripped anyone off in trades. You're also wrong about my league not having a way to do something about it, we have a veto process (see below). I've lost a lot on deals as well as gained on them. You think my team is too strong, yet I have one shared title in the 4 year history of the league, and two first round exits the last two years. What looks great today sometimes doesn't look so great next year or the year after that. Baseball slumps, football doesn't. I think our format is better than anything you could come up with to be honest. Everyone seems to really like our format except you. The problem with you is that you don't know how to recognize young talent, so you have to limit the amount that others can obtain until you come up to speed on their value, so you couldn't hack it in our league. You had a roster full of geezers that made it to the World Series your last year, then you bailed on your team. Because of your inability, or lack of initiative to know the minors, our league wasn't for you and I can respect that. Because of the roster size of our league, I think it is perfect for allowing player development, but not hoarding.Rusty Barr said:
Here is our rules. Let your readers decide for themselves. You probably got most of your rules from my rules.
RULES start here if you wish to ignore the rest
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League Constitution
Recent bug found in CBS system - It looks like CBS may restore the rosters to what they were before giving us the message on the home screen, "The 2008 season has ended Please be aware that any changes you make to your league setup will affect your 2008 results. We STRONGLY recommend that you do not make any changes (such as adding/deleting teams, changing schedule or scoring options, etc.) until we launch the 2009 product.". So, it looks like I shouldn't drop any players added to rosters during the playoffs until at least after 10/2, and also to make sure we don't do manual waivers until after 10/2. What was happening was that dropped players after the playoffs were being added back to the rosters by CBS, then when I ran manual waivers those players were back on rosters when they shouldn't have been.
It will be a 34 Player Franchise League (Keep all) $100 league + hosting site fee (split 12 ways).
We will use CBS SPORTSLINE as the hosting site. This site was chosen because they do a better job with providing minor league players in their player database and they allow entry of unlisted players.
League Format, Starting Lineup Requirements, and Scoring Categories
It will be 5x5 (R, RBI, HR, AVG, S (W, ERA, WHIP, SO, SV) standard Head to Head Scoring, 2 Divisions, 13 positional players 1 of each (catcher, first, second, third, shortstop, corner infielder, middle infielder. 4 outfielders and 2 utility spots) and 9 pitchers. You cannot start a minor leaguer in your active lineup unless he is scheduled to start by CBS (see next 7 days schedule for pitchers), or by CNNSI.COM Probables for pitchers. The only time you can start a position player who is in the minors is if CBS says a player will be called up in the next scoring period in the Player News. Any other player in your active lineup must be on a major league roster. That would seriously challange the integrity of the league, where a team could put 9 minor league pitchers in his starting lineup and 10 on the bench. That was NEVER the intention of this league.
If a player is sent down after the Monday lineup deadline, and he's in your starting lineup, he isn't illegal until the following week.
Each week you must start 3 SP who are scheduled to start (not just designated as a SP). If for some reason that player doesn't start, he must have been scheduled to start by CBS (see next 7 days schedule), or by CNNSI.COM Probables.
You may start a player who is on the DL. The reason for this is so teams don't have to sacrifice their future by dropping players they would rather keep in order to pickup someone for their starting lineup.
Added rule 9/21/2008: Any illegal lineup will result in the following penalty:
1st offense - Lose add/drop privileges for a week.
2nd offense - Lose an off-season roster slot for 1 off-season.
3rd offense - Lose an in-season roster slot for 1 season.
4th offense - Removal from the Dirty Dozeen league.
After 5 years you get a clean slate.
We will scramble the divisions every 2 years. All teams will be ranked according to their regular season finish. The odd ranked teams will go into one division, and the even ranked teams will go to the other division.
Position Eligibility
Determined by the hosting site. If the hosting site allows us to determine the number of games a player must play at a position to be eligibile at that position, it will be 10 games during the current season or 20 games the previous season. For pitchers I can't set the 10/20 game rule as it uses 5 games at SP or 10 games at RP (either this season or last).
Note that a player's primary position (the position where our site lists him) will always take priority over your league's eligibility rules.
Rule changes
are only allowed in the off-season, unless league integrity is at stake (determined by the commish). It takes a majority vote of 7 owners to change rules, unless league integrity is threatened, then the commish has the power to make rule changes.
Schedule
To be determined (weekly lineups)
A team can finish the week with a record between 10-0 and 0-10. Regular season ties will not be broken. Teams will finish the season based on winning percentage.
Playoffs
6 Teams make the playoffs. Two division winners and 4 wildcard teams. The wildcard teams are the 4 teams with the best record after the division winners. The two division winners get a first round bye and the 4 wildcard teams are seeded, and the #1 wildcard seed plays the #4 wildcard seed, and the #2 wildcard seed plays the #3 wildcard seed. In the simifinals, the #1 seeded Division Winner gets the worst remaining seeded wildcard team. The #2 seeded Division Winner gets the best remaining wildcard seed. Then the winners play for the world series.
The first round (quarterfinals) will consist of a one week head to head game between the wildcard teams. The quarterfinal winners will then play the division winners in the semifinals in a one week head to head game. The world series will be a two week head to head matchup between the winners from the semifinals, where the Stats from any two week game will be combined.
We will allow lineup changes between playoff rounds, and during 2 week World Series.
At the end of the regular season all rosters are frozen
until after our world series. In other words, the 34 man
rosters that all teams had at the end the regular season will be their rosters that they start the OFF-SEASON with. One exception, the teams that were allowed to carry 36 man rosters because they didn't make the playoffs in the previous season or current seaosn, will have 36 until they are able to expand to 38 with our one time off-seaosn waivers. Teams that had a 36 man roster during the current season and made the playoffs, must cut back to 34 before the playoffs start.
Teams still competing in the playoffs will be allowed to use drop/adds to the extent they have any newly DL'd players. Since the rosters will be frozen, if a playoff team has a player go on the DL during the playoffs, post a message at the site requesting a player to replace the DL'd player, and I will make the addition to your roster. As proof of a player going on the DL, we will only require that either CBS or MLB.com say a player was put on the DL.
If a player added to the DL during the playoffs comes off the DL, you must drop a player that was added to your roster after the playoffs started. This protects playoff teams from having to drop a player added during the playoffs when a player comes off the DL that was on the DL before the playoffs started.
At the end of the playoffs all add/drops done during the playoffs will be reversed to what the rosters were at the end of the regular season. This would allow playoff teams to have the flexibility to deal with injuries, yet ensure that they do not gain a long-term advantage vis-a-vis the other teams.
Tie Breakers
In the remote event there is a tie at the end of the regular season, we will use Head to Head, then Power Rank, then Division Record as the end of season tiebreakers to determine playoff seeding. The reason this change was proposed, was because it didn't make sense for a team in a weaker division to get the higher seed because that team was able to accumulate a better record within his division. Also, it doesn't make sense to use Division record as the first tiebreaker when the 4 wildcard teams are the 4 best teams after the division champs, without regard to divisions. This change does not affect the Wildcard and Semi-Finals Tiebreaker, where the higher seeded team advances.
Wildcard Round Playoff Tie Breaker
In the event of a tie in the wildcard playoff round, the higher seeded team will earn the win and advance.
Semifinal Round Playoff Tie Breaker
In the event of a tie in the semifinal playoff round, the higher seeded team (i.e. the division winner) will earn the win and advance.
World Series Tie Breaker
None, if teams are still tied after the two week World Series, the World Series prize mony is split 50/50.
Free Agents/Waiver Wire / Off-season Rosters
After the last game of the regular season the rosters are fozen for the playoffs except for replacing a player that CBS or MLB says has been placed on the DL after the playoffs start. That will be allowed. As far as waivers, the initial waivers will be in reverse order of standings. Waivers will run on a nightly basis, and if a player is dropped, he will be on waivers for 1 day.
After the season I will process the one-time off-season UNLISTED and REGULAR waivers as one waiver process MANUALLY. I will ask that each owner send me all their requests (both unlisted and listed) on a particular day and the commish and co-commish will send their's to each other the day before.
Non-playoff teams will be allowed to carry 38 players during the off-season, and 36 for the next season. The cut down date to get from 38 players to 36 players will the start of the 1st game of the season.
Waivers Overview
In order to provide an equal opportunity for all owners to add players to their roster that are new to the free agent pool, a Waiver process can be implemented. Owners' requests to add players on waivers to their roster are not executed immediately, but are put in a pending status for 24 hours. This allows multiple teams to request the same players. Again, if possible, waivers will run nightly.
When a transaction is made during the Waiver Process, the team's rank is set to last and everyone else's rank moves up one (check the League Home, Rules page to see if your league's waiver ranks are reset every week.) All transactions during the waiver process are effective for the next scoring period.
Conditions for Waivers
MLB players are placed on waivers under the following circumstances:
A player is released during a waiver process: A player released during a waiver process is on waivers until the next waiver process. Example: An owner requests Player A on waivers and drops Player B. This request is pended until the waiver process runs. During the waiver process, the owner is awarded Player A, and Player B is released from the roster and placed on waivers until the next waiver process.
A player is released during a free agent acquisition: Requests for players not on waivers are executed immediately. However, the player dropped in a non-waivers transaction is placed on waivers for 24 hours. He will remain on waivers until the waiver run after 24 hours from being put on waivers.
Waiver Rank
During a waiver process, pending transactions are processed in an order determined by each team's waiver rank. The team with the highest waiver rank will get its first requested player. If that team's highest pending transaction can't be executed because another team has the requested player, the transaction gets deleted and the team's next transaction, if one exists, is then executed. When a team gets a requested player, the team's waiver rank is dropped to the end and every other team moves up one and the process is continued. If a team doesn't have any pending transactions because all players requested were taken by other teams, or the owner simply didn't request any players, the team's turn is skipped but the waiver rank is not dropped. If a team has the highest waiver rank after Monday night and doesn't request any players for Tuesday night's waiver process, that team will still have the highest rank for the next process. The waiver rank resets for each scoring period based upon reverse order of standings.
Waivers Period
The waivers period is the length of time a player is on waivers before a claim will be processed and the player will be added to a roster. Check the League Home, Rules page to see how long dropped players remain on waivers in your league (1, 2 or 3 days). Our league will be 1 day.
Making a Waivers Claim
If you want to drop a player and pick up a player off of waivers follow these steps:
Lets say you have a player that you want to drop (player A) and several players that you would like to add (players B and C), depending on their availability when your turn comes up. If player B is not available you would like to pick up player C. In order to accomplish this you would submit two Add/Drop requests:
Drop player A, Add player B, and
Drop player A, Add player C.
Lets say your turn comes up and player B has already been picked up off waivers by another team. A request cannot be executed if either the add or drop player is not available. Requests will be skipped until the first valid roster move is found. In this case, your second request would be executed and you would get player C (provided he is not also already picked up off waivers).
The same is true in the reverse. If you dropped player A and added player B, then during your next round of waiver selections it will skip over the second waiver request involving Player A and go down your list to see if you have any other waiver requests.
Any waivers request that would cause your roster to exceed the maximum players allowed will be skipped.
Note: Free agents are available on a first-come, first-served basis; they can be picked up at any time. If a player is dropped from a roster and he clears the waiver process without being picked up, he then becomes a free agent, and can be picked up at any time, without having to go through a waivers process.
There will be no transaction fees. The free agent queue will be set up in standard worst to first fashion. You are allowed to pickup any player, whether listed in the hosting site database or not, as long as the hosting site allows me to enter unlisted players.
Waiver Request for players that were previously added as unlisted players, but are not retained in the CBS database after being dropped.
Sometimes when an unlisted player is dropped, he isn't retained in the database. So if an unlisted player is dropped, he is on waivers for a day, just as if he was a listed player. If you want that player, you need to send me an email asking for waivers on that player. However, if you have any waiver request processed on listed players the same night that the unlisted player comes off waivers, the waiver request awarded from CBS will take precedence, and bump you to then end of the line, before your request for the unlisted player is evaluated. I would have to award the waiver request of the unlisted player manuall based upon the current waiver priority.
Obviously if a player was added previously as an unlisted player, but is now listed in the database, you must use the site waiver system to request that player, not email me the waiver request. You cannot prioritize the waiver request for the unlisted player ahead of someone listed, and both come off waivers at the same time. I don't need that extra work trying to figure out the priority, plus I don't want to know your other waiver requests. So to make my job easier, when you want to add a player dropped who is unlisted, to ensure he has top priority, don't make any listed player request at CBS that are due to come off waivers at the same time as the unlisted player.
Start the waivers afer the 1st game of the new season
has started so the first-come-first-serve is still active
until the start of the first game so teams can make last
minute adjustmeents.
Adding Unlisted Players
As you guys know, we are allowed to add unlisted players. As stated at the beginning of this league, when the unlisted player becomes available in the player database, it is YOUR responsibility to add the player to your roster and drop the unlisted player. If someone adds a player that is listed or not, if that player is already on someone else's roster, the team adding the already rostered player will receive 0 pts for that player if he is on the active roster for the current week games. He will not be penalized with a goose egg for the week, because it is just as much responsibility of the owner who owns the player in question, to add the "real" player from the database and drop the unlisted player, as it is for the owner who added the player already on a different roster.
Trading
Veto of trades
There will be a 3 member committee where there has to be a 2/3 consensus to call a vote when any owner files a complaint asking for a vote on a trade. If a member of the committee is involved in the trade, another owner will take his place on the committee for that trade. If a vote is called, the parties involved in the trade do not have a vote. The remaining members of the league will vote on the trade and it will take 7 votes to veto a trade.
Anyone who unreasonably dumps players or participates in a manner the disrupts the integrity of the league or violates a basic standard of conduct can be removed with the consent of 8 owners.
The Trading Deadline will be SEVEN DAYS after the MLB trading deadline, until 11:59 p.m. ET on that day.
Trades are allowed in the off-season as long as the hosting site allows it.
Replacing an Owner
Any team that finished the prior season with a better record than the team being replaced must leave 3 players unprotected. Only a non-playoff team gets to pick from the unprotected list when it's owner is being replaced. A team leaving players unprotected can only lose 1 player.
Payouts
Payouts
+1200 (12 teams x $100)
-300 (wildcard teams = 4 x 75 = 300)
-300 (division winners = 2 x 150 = 300)
-200 (world series loser)
-400 (world series winner)
= $0 remaining
Chuck
Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
That is a flat out lie. First of all, I only know one person in my league. The rest are online internet users that I've never met. Just because your referendums were voted down, don't make it sound like I had something to do with it. People on this board know me as a commish and my reputation is very good. Some may not like what I post here, but they know me as a stand up commish. You proposed a roster increase that was voted in, LOL. You dropped out of my league because you had a roster full of old guys on their last leg, and didn't want to learn the minors. Watch out for lying, it's not beholding. Taking cheap shots at me and my league is not needed. Our owners love our league, and I expect if anyone read my rules they can see why they like it so much. Our current owners know the value of long term committment to the league, and have taken an active effort to learn the minors. A successful dynasty league is condusive to multiple apporaches, both long term and win now. My league does that. Owners who are afraid of learning about prospects should only play in redraft leagues.Rusty Barr said:
Wilbur Wood
Footballguy
Chris
I play in Chuck's league and I only know him through his baseball league. I support Chuck's posts as being accurate and consistent with my recollections of league history.
I am the "Prospect Hound" in Chris' posts that purportedly contributed to the "demise" of this league by trading away good veterans for prospects. To me this is a very acceptable strategy in a DYNASTY league. Dynasty leagues generally try to simulate real MLB action over the LONG TERM. I didn't think that my team was ready to win a title so I opted to go try the Tampa Ray strategy. So I've made a lot of trades, all designed to help my own team. I've stayed in the league and pay $100 a year to do so and have watched my team improve. I like the fact that that strategy is a viable option in Chuck's league. I still have to field an MLB team but I can populate my lineup and roster with young players who I feel will help me in the future. Having read through your rules, I don't think that I could have the opportunity to "rebuild" a franchise under your format. I'd advise you to focus on a Redraft league or maybe a "light keeper" format (keep 3 players), but don't try to do a half baked Dynasty League that frowns on prospects.
More importantly, it is not a good recruiting technique to take pot shots at other leagues, especially one that is very successful and stable. Chuck's league is very active, vibrant and runs 365 days a year with a lot of trading. Most of us also play Fantasy Football (which requires a lot less research anyway).
Good luck with your new league.
I play in Chuck's league and I only know him through his baseball league. I support Chuck's posts as being accurate and consistent with my recollections of league history.
I am the "Prospect Hound" in Chris' posts that purportedly contributed to the "demise" of this league by trading away good veterans for prospects. To me this is a very acceptable strategy in a DYNASTY league. Dynasty leagues generally try to simulate real MLB action over the LONG TERM. I didn't think that my team was ready to win a title so I opted to go try the Tampa Ray strategy. So I've made a lot of trades, all designed to help my own team. I've stayed in the league and pay $100 a year to do so and have watched my team improve. I like the fact that that strategy is a viable option in Chuck's league. I still have to field an MLB team but I can populate my lineup and roster with young players who I feel will help me in the future. Having read through your rules, I don't think that I could have the opportunity to "rebuild" a franchise under your format. I'd advise you to focus on a Redraft league or maybe a "light keeper" format (keep 3 players), but don't try to do a half baked Dynasty League that frowns on prospects.
More importantly, it is not a good recruiting technique to take pot shots at other leagues, especially one that is very successful and stable. Chuck's league is very active, vibrant and runs 365 days a year with a lot of trading. Most of us also play Fantasy Football (which requires a lot less research anyway).
Good luck with your new league.
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Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
Reading comprehension down? I said that I only know one person from my baseball league personally, and the rest I knew only online. Also, I said you lied about what you said about me, not whether you talked to others in the league. Hell, we all know that you talked to most everyone. Just a FYI, when recruiting for your leagues, keep that trash about me and my league out of it and we'll be just fine.Rusty Barr said:
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Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
No, what was uncalled for was to insinuate that I colluded with other owners to vote down your referendums. I put each up to a vote, and you even won a few of them. Also, that you lied about my league not having veto rules to overrule some of the trades I made that you claimed that I "ripped" off an owner. We've always had veto rules (see league constitution). I've had trades where I've got the shaft, and some where I came out on top. Thus the nature of trading. I simply came in here and Rotojunkie to defend my honor and my league's honer. Which by the way is going into it's 5th year and is very successful and active. The best thing you can do now is just drop this, because the more you post the deeper you fall.Rusty Barr said:
Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
I knew what league you were talking about and I wasn't about to let your lying go without defending myself and my league.Rusty Barr said:
Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
I've said my peace, I'm done with this.Rusty Barr said:
Wilbur Wood
Footballguy
I'm re-reading my earlier "attack" post on this thread. Pretty mild "attack" in my mind. You brought Chuck and I by example into your recruiting thread. We saw it, as did a few other owners in our league who read these boards. Once you bring "others" into the fray, you open the door for rebuttal.Rusty Barr said:
