This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
And he makes plays. Seems like he has that extra gear that kicks in in the game that you can't measure anywhere else. It doesn't show up at the combine or in a "Wonderlick" test. You see it when he plays.
Hey Tyranny,Curious why your list didn't include Daunte Culpepper, Donovan McNabb, Steve McNair, Randall Cunningham and Steve Young? Frankly, guys like Aaron Brooks and Anthony Wright really aren't close to the athlete Young is; although they are certainly athletic.
I think its obvious why the list doesn't include Steve Young, but what about Vince Evans, Doug Williams, Warren Moon and Akili Smith?
I hadn't had this thought until I was reading this thread, and then you beat me to it. :strange:
I'd say he's much more like Culpepper. Culpepper ran a sub 4.7 40 at 6-4, 247.
I don't have McNabb's time but he had Young-like wheels entering the league. He may be a better comparison than Culpepper. Vick is much different.
Ummmm.....one of those 3 doesn't belong on that list.In 3 years as a starter:
The mental aspect? Why because of the wonderlic? Steve McNair did worse, he did fine with Norm Chow's offense.Personally, I just think Vince Young is a great football player. The mental aspect of the game transition (From college to pro) may be rocky for him at times; but make no bones about it this guy is a great football player.
Something else he brings to the table - moxy. The guy played in one National Championship Game against a great, great, great USC team. He did not fold, he elevated his game. This attribute is not measured at the combine nor at individual workouts; but it is certainly a plus that Young has proved it is there.
I still got Young well below Lienart and Cutler.
Amen to that, brother..
Exactly Hawk, people who didn't follow the Texas program before Young made his mark on it typically scoff at comments like these, but Young changed the coaches, including Mack Brown. He changed the way Brown handled not only him, but other players, and coaching situations as well. In a nutshell, he changed the attitude of Coach Brown and, in the process, the entire Texas football team. Now that he's leaving, I hope it sticks.
Young has the rare ability to instill in everyone around him the belief that losing is abjectly unacceptable without making them uptight or nervous. Much to the contrary, he keeps everyone very loose and relaxed on the the sidelines and even moreso in the huddle. He gets the best out of everyone around him, and simply gets better with more pressure.
If you went back and looked at game tapes of Young, you'd see it. He really did improve markedly every game in his college career, almost without exception.
I've been saying this for a while now when all most people can say is Vick, etc. It's hard to categorize Young, but if I had to find one qb he's most like, I'd say it's far and away Staubach...both in style of play and intangibles. He's both subtle and physical, can beat you with his arm and his legs, and brings a ton in the way of intangibles. Get him the ball toward the end of a close game and look out. When the Texas D made the big stop on Lendale White on 4th & 2 in the 4th quarter, they weren't biting their towels or chewing their nails, hoping. The defense was jumping up and down on the sidelines saying things like "game over" and "ball game", because they had seen this scenario multiple times before. They knew the O was gonna score.
I like it. I have said that Young has It what ever It is. Staubach, one of my all-time favorites, had It too.
I agree with your point about not passing judgment on him before he plays in the league...but that's not what this thread is about. We're just saying "We think he'll succeed, and here's why."After legions of posts decrying why Young won't succeed in the league, what's wrong with that?
As much of a physical freak of nature as Young is, I guess what we're trying to get across is that Young brings even more to the table in the way of positve intangibles. Most people just see the physical side of it when evaluating these players, but without his personality and his leadership abilities, Young wouldn't be 1/2 the qb he is now.Many posters wonder why we Texas fans defend Young so vociferously. Well, here's your answer. I mean...when have you ever seen us stick up for any other Texas player with such vehemence?
Steve McNair had about 10 years of pro football experience before he got to Chow's offense.The mental aspect? Why because of the wonderlic? Steve McNair did worse, he did fine with Norm Chow's offense.Personally, I just think Vince Young is a great football player. The mental aspect of the game transition (From college to pro) may be rocky for him at times; but make no bones about it this guy is a great football player.
Something else he brings to the table - moxy. The guy played in one National Championship Game against a great, great, great USC team. He did not fold, he elevated his game. This attribute is not measured at the combine nor at individual workouts; but it is certainly a plus that Young has proved it is there.
I still got Young well below Lienart and Cutler.
A few points here. VY improved dramatically over his 3 seasons at Texas, and it was in LARGE part due to his work ethic and desire to win. I don't think you could be any more wrong about his intangibles. You can question his intelligence if you want to, I don't have any way of knowing how smart he is, but there is no question about his will to win, his poise under pressure, his contagious confidence, or his ability to lead his team to wins. Those are things that Jordan, Brady and Montana had, that is why the names are used, even if it is a premature comparison.You agree that USC had a "great" offense (with at least 4 first round picks on that offense), but you should realize that Texas' offense outscored USC's "great" offense last season on a points per game basis despite having no truly marquee offensive players other than Vince. Vince was the reason we scored over 50 points per game last year. No matter how you slice it, that is impressive.
His potential.He has the ability to become a household name, the ability to force defenses to build a game plan around him, and the ability to lead, not just every game, but the ones that count.
I'm trying to illustrate the perspective that NBA / NFL GMs had when those guys came out of college. You don't think the Trailblazers had their well-thought-out reasons for taking Sam Bowie over Jordan? I'm sure there were folks in their camp saying, "well, let's see how he does after 4-5 years of NBA action." The risk /reward in drafting is identifying those players before it's obvious to the world.Any Joe Schmo can say Jordan should've been #1 overall now. But what about on draft day? Hindsight is 20/20, but you've got to learn from prior mistakes. What did they miss that a wise GM will catch this time around?
Young will need time to develop. His freakish athletic ability will get him on the field sooner rather than later. The Rose Bowl was a slight glimpse at what Vince Young COULD do. USC threw everything at him. They disguised coverages, switched disguises pre-snap, etc. They blitzed him and it didn't stop him. They didn't blitz him and it didn't stop him.
Vick never came close to passing for over 3,000 yards in a season like Vince did, and he certainly never approached the 65% completion percentage that Vince had last year. Vince is a considerably more prolific and accurate passer with better touch coming out of college than Vick was, and Vince is also more prototypical in size for an NFL QB since he is 6'5 230. I don't think Vince's bust risk is that high. In high school he was a Parade All-American, took an otherwise mediocre team to the Texas 5A State Semifinals, and was the #1 rated recruit in the country who was already a star in Houston as a high-schooler. In college all he did was go 24-1 his last two seasons while winning every national player award he could (except getting 2nd for the Heisman) and carried Texas to a national championship on his back, winning it with a stunning individual performance in the title game.
Says who? Isn't that a perfect description of every NFL bust or NCAA star who never amounted to squat in the NFL? College is not the NFL. What works in college doesn't necessarily work in the NFL. I can rattle off several superstar college QBs who have had minimal to no success in the NFL:
I'm pretty high on Young, but I have no qualms with someone that has this opinion.That's why I think situation is even more important for him than most. Not because he needs stud players around him to be successful, but because he needs a good coach that can make his transition to the NFL as smooth as possible.
'few" as in "none"?
I made this exact comparison in an older VY thread. With Staubach at the helm, a lead was never safe. A VY led team is the same. I hated the Cowboys growing up, but IMO Staubach does not get enough credit when the great qbs are debated.
I like it. I have said that Young has It what ever It is. Staubach, one of my all-time favorites, had It too.
