When does Football Start? (1 Viewer)

[Colin Dowling]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

However, the Astros will quickly remove themselves from that conversation if they insist on calling on Brad Lidge and his myriad pyrotechnics in the 9th inning of close games. After the game, Garner essentially said that this is going to happen a few times this year. Fair enough. I wonder how Garner will feel when this year's "few times" happen in the first two weeks of the season. If Garner is hitching his wagon to Lidge, he'll be out of a job at year's end.

What's sad is that this team is actually very solid. While losing Clemens and Pettite seems like a huge deal (and it is), the off-season acquisitions were their best in years. The pitching has the league's best ace and a "good enough" 2-5 to keep them in this thing provided Captain Gopherball gets lost on an island somewhere.

Oh, and Dan Wheeler (who should be the closer starting RIGHT NOW) came in for 3 whole pitches.

 

[ThisGuy]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record. However, the Astros will quickly remove themselves from that conversation if they insist on calling on Brad Lidge and his myriad pyrotechnics in the 9th inning of close games. After the game, Garner essentially said that this is going to happen a few times this year. Fair enough. I wonder how Garner will feel when this year's "few times" happen in the first two weeks of the season. If Garner is hitching his wagon to Lidge, he'll be out of a job at year's end. What's sad is that this team is actually very solid. While losing Clemens and Pettite seems like a huge deal (and it is), the off-season acquisitions were their best in years. The pitching has the league's best ace and a "good enough" 2-5 to keep them in this thing provided Captain Gopherball gets lost on an island somewhere.Oh, and Dan Wheeler (who should be the closer starting RIGHT NOW) came in for 3 whole pitches.

Settle down, Herd.First, the AL Central is the best (read: Most competitive) division in baseball.Secondly, it was one game!! Relax, Nady hit a decent pitch out.

 

[Jethro Q. Walrustitty]

Secondly, it was one game!! Relax, Nady hit a decent pitch out.

Unfortunately for Lidge, this has happened way too often over the last two years. When do we start describing "bad luck" as "predictable pitches"?He's got really good stuff, but he's not doing something right between the time he receives the ball from Ausmus and the time the ball leaves his hand again.FWIW, I don't think Wheeler is the answer either.

 

[ooofffaaa]

Trade Lidge for Benitez.

It's a win-win-win.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

FWIW, Pirates broadcaster (and former MLB pitcher) Bob Walk commented that he felt Lidge lost some velocity...from the mid-high 90s to low-mid 90s. He said Lidge is primarily a fastball/slider pitcher so guys gear up for the hard stuff knowing he doesn't the off-speed fallback. Well if you are throwing 97-98 it doesn't matter if guys know it's coming but when you are hitting 92-93 it makes a big difference.

It will be an interesting season in the NL Central. Perennial leaders like the Astros and Cardinals have plenty of question marks among their starters and relievers.

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

 

[Colin Dowling]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

You disagree?

 

[RnR]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

Yeah, that is pretty funny. 88 wins takes the Central.

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

You disagree?

I'll take the under on RNR's 88 wins.

 

[Colin Dowling]

The problem with the "it was one pitch" theory is that it's becoming a recurring excuse with Lidge: "I threw a good pitch, he happened to hit it." Garner says the same, "He made a good pitch, the other guy managed to hit it."

Bologna. Your closer's best should be BETTER then the other guy's best every time. A great closer (which Lidge once was) makes "bad pitches" two or three times a season' those result in blown saves or home runs. But when a closer is throwing good pitches, the game is over.

I would feel a lot better if Garner/Lidge would say, "It was a bad pitch and he made us pay." Telling me that it was a good pitch and the other guy hit it means that Lidge's good pitches aren't good any more.

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

I tend to agree with Baseball Prospectus on the NL Central though I'd swap the Cubs with the Brewers and the Astros with the Cards.

Central W L

Milwaukee Brewers 85 77

Chicago Cubs 84 78

St. Louis Cardinals 81 81

Houston Astros 80 82

Pittsburgh Pirates 76 86

Cincinnati Reds 71 91

 

[Jethro Q. Walrustitty]

FWIW, Pirates broadcaster (and former MLB pitcher) Bob Walk commented that he felt Lidge lost some velocity...from the mid-high 90s to low-mid 90s. He said Lidge is primarily a fastball/slider pitcher so guys gear up for the hard stuff knowing he doesn't the off-speed fallback. Well if you are throwing 97-98 it doesn't matter if guys know it's coming but when you are hitting 92-93 it makes a big difference.

Lidge was experimenting with a split-finger pitch last year. I don't know if he was ever using it in the games, but some folks liked to blame this experimentation for his poor performance. Others were speculating that he's tipping his pitches. In the games I saw, his pitches seemed as good as ever. His slider is still nasty, and he was still hitting the mid-90s at least with his fastball, yet every other game he got torched.

 

[Zuma]

F'n Lidge, seriously, when does the bad luck excuse run out and predictability creep in?

 

[Funkley]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

You disagree?

DetroitMinnesotaClevelandChicagoThat's the best division in baseball fairly easily.

 

[Funkley]

If you didn't handcuff Wheeler to Lidge then the torture here is self inflicted.

 

[Jethro Q. Walrustitty]

I would feel a lot better if Garner/Lidge would say, "It was a bad pitch and he made us pay." Telling me that it was a good pitch and the other guy hit it means that Lidge's good pitches aren't good any more.

What they mean is, it was the pitch they wanted in the location they wanted. As I said earlier, that's fine unless the hitter can guess with an extraordinarily high frequency the same what/where. Lidge throws hard enough that all these guys have to do is put the bat on the ball and it will go a long way. Even if you're making "good pitches" on the corners or at the knees, a major league hitter will kill it if he knows that's where it's going to be.I've never been a buyer in the "tipping his pitches" conspiracies that have been thrown out there, but Lidge seems to be a good case study.

 

[Colin Dowling]

I tend to agree with Baseball Prospectus on the NL Central though I'd swap the Cubs with the Brewers and the Astros with the Cards.Central W L Milwaukee Brewers 85 77 Chicago Cubs 84 78 St. Louis Cardinals 81 81 Houston Astros 80 82 Pittsburgh Pirates 76 86 Cincinnati Reds 71 91

So my prediction of 4 teams over .500 isn't that outlandish? I think the Brewers and the Astros could compete for the League's best record, actually. With Houston, everyone is so focused on losing Clemens and Pettite that no one is seeing the positives.1. Carlos Lee.2. Lance Berkman being protected by Lee3. Healthy Morgan Ensberg4. Scott/Lane/Burke with another year under their belts.5. Loretta as a utility is an upgrade over Bruntlett6. Farm system loaded with talent that could help or fetch a trade (Pence, Albers, Estrada)

 

[Jethro Q. Walrustitty]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

You disagree?

DetroitMinnesotaClevelandChicagoThat's the best division in baseball fairly easily.

In no particular order, obviously.

 

[Funkley]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

You disagree?

DetroitMinnesotaClevelandChicagoThat's the best division in baseball fairly easily.

In no particular order, obviously.

Right, I think it'll be a 4 team race this year all the way through September. If I had to guess right now I'd say Minnesota, Detroit, Cleveland, Chicago separated by no more than 10 games from 1st to 4th.

 

[Zuma]

If you look at Lidge he is pure power, all a big league hitter has to do is get the bat on the ball and it will go a long way.

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

So my prediction of 4 teams over .500 isn't that outlandish? I think the Brewers and the Astros could compete for the League's best record, actually. With Houston, everyone is so focused on losing Clemens and Pettite that no one is seeing the positives.1. Carlos Lee.2. Lance Berkman being protected by Lee3. Healthy Morgan Ensberg4. Scott/Lane/Burke with another year under their belts.5. Loretta as a utility is an upgrade over Bruntlett6. Farm system loaded with talent that could help or fetch a trade (Pence, Albers, Estrada)

4 teams over .500 is possible but not likely. Brewers and Astros won't sniff the best record. And the NL Central isn't even close to the best division in baseball.Astros have black holes at catcher, 2B, and SS and no pitching to speak of behind Oswalt. Lane sucks.

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

So my prediction of 4 teams over .500 isn't that outlandish? I think the Brewers and the Astros could compete for the League's best record, actually. With Houston, everyone is so focused on losing Clemens and Pettite that no one is seeing the positives.1. Carlos Lee.2. Lance Berkman being protected by Lee3. Healthy Morgan Ensberg4. Scott/Lane/Burke with another year under their belts.5. Loretta as a utility is an upgrade over Bruntlett6. Farm system loaded with talent that could help or fetch a trade (Pence, Albers, Estrada)

4 teams over .500 is possible but not likely. Brewers and Astros won't sniff the best record. And the NL Central isn't even close to the best division in baseball.Astros have black holes at catcher, 2B, and SS and no pitching to speak of behind Oswalt. Lane sucks.

My uber teammate knows things.

 

[RnR]

I think the Brewers and the Astros could compete for the League's best record, actually.

I'm curious as to why you think the Astros and Brewers are more capable than the Cardinals and Cubs. I don't think any of these teams challenge the best record in the NL, but I do think that St. Louis would be the most likely to do so out of the 4. That being said, I expect all of these teams between 80 and 85 wins.

 

[Jethro Q. Walrustitty]

I tend to agree with Baseball Prospectus on the NL Central though I'd swap the Cubs with the Brewers and the Astros with the Cards.Central W L Milwaukee Brewers 85 77 Chicago Cubs 84 78 St. Louis Cardinals 81 81 Houston Astros 80 82 Pittsburgh Pirates 76 86 Cincinnati Reds 71 91

So my prediction of 4 teams over .500 isn't that outlandish? I think the Brewers and the Astros could compete for the League's best record, actually. With Houston, everyone is so focused on losing Clemens and Pettite that no one is seeing the positives.1. Carlos Lee.2. Lance Berkman being protected by Lee3. Healthy Morgan Ensberg4. Scott/Lane/Burke with another year under their belts.5. Loretta as a utility is an upgrade over Bruntlett6. Farm system loaded with talent that could help or fetch a trade (Pence, Albers, Estrada)

So they'll lose a lot of 8-5 and 9-6 games.

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

I think the Brewers and the Astros could compete for the League's best record, actually.

I'm curious as to why you think the Astros and Brewers are more capable than the Cardinals and Cubs. I don't think any of these teams challenge the best record in the NL, but I do think that St. Louis would be the most likely to do so out of the 4. That being said, I expect all of these teams between 80 and 85 wins.

I think the Cubs will win that division but Milwaukee could easily give them a run for it and probably will.I'll give you that the Cards could easily sneak up on them if Reyes and Wainwright pitch the way they're capable and Carpenter is his usual self. But their offense, beyond Pujols and Rolen, is pretty horrid.The Astros have some offensive talent but way too many holes and not nearly enough pitching.

 

[Colin Dowling]

So my prediction of 4 teams over .500 isn't that outlandish? I think the Brewers and the Astros could compete for the League's best record, actually. With Houston, everyone is so focused on losing Clemens and Pettite that no one is seeing the positives.1. Carlos Lee.2. Lance Berkman being protected by Lee3. Healthy Morgan Ensberg4. Scott/Lane/Burke with another year under their belts.5. Loretta as a utility is an upgrade over Bruntlett6. Farm system loaded with talent that could help or fetch a trade (Pence, Albers, Estrada)

4 teams over .500 is possible but not likely. Brewers and Astros won't sniff the best record. And the NL Central isn't even close to the best division in baseball.Astros have black holes at catcher, 2B, and SS and no pitching to speak of behind Oswalt. Lane sucks.

I wouldn't call Jennings terrible, and Woody WIlliams is a decent #3. Lane and Scott may both suck, which is why it's good to have Hunter Pence waiting in Round ROck.The black hole at SS is negated by the fact that Everett is so good defensively. Agree about catcher though.

 

[Gambino]

The Central isn't even the best division in the NL, much less MLB.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Wheeler toasted tonight, Lidge and Qualls last night. Nobody can stop Xavier Nady.

 

[Colin Dowling]

"In the 132-year history of Major League Baseball, the Pirates' win marks only the second time that a team has started a season with a pair of road wins in which it trailed going into the eighth inning."



The season is off to a GREAT start.

 

[Green94]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

I seriously stopped reading here.

 

[ThisGuy]

"In the 132-year history of Major League Baseball, the Pirates' win marks only the second time that a team has started a season with a pair of road wins in which it trailed going into the eighth inning." The season is off to a GREAT start.

uch: Go Pirates!

 

[Colin Dowling]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

I seriously stopped reading here.

I am surprised everyone thinks this is such a terrible opinion. The NLC features the defending WS Champions, a much improved Milwaukee team, a much improved (on paper) Chicago team, the Astros and the Reds (both of whom are thin on the mound but otherwisesolid).

 

[ooofffaaa]

The NL Central may be the best division in baseball this year. There are no fewer then 4 teams that could be above .500 and at least 2 of them could/should challenge for the league's best record.

I seriously stopped reading here.

I am surprised everyone thinks this is such a terrible opinion. The NLC features the defending WS Champions, a much improved Milwaukee team, a much improved (on paper) Chicago team, the Astros and the Reds (both of whom are thin on the mound but otherwisesolid).

The defending WS champion Cards won 83 regular season games last year and then got hot in the playoffs. If they lose Carpenter for a prolonged period of time they are in serious trouble.Agreed - the Brewers look to be improved - but when was the last time they challenged for the division. They need Sheets all year long - he's never gave them that.

The Cubs offense will score a bunch but what exactly can you expect from Wood & Prior?

The Astros lost Clemens & Pettitte and their closer is a right now.

I just don't trust the Reds SP's.

Every team in MLB has question marks. I just think the NL Central has more of them.

 

[Colin Dowling]

Fair enough. In order of your points...

1. THe Cards only won 83 games, but lost a lot of production to injury.

2. Sheets will need to go all year; agreed.

3. The Cubs are likely more concerned about Zambrano and Marquis then Wood and Prior.

4. I'd argue that Jennings / Pettite is a wash at this point. Losing Clemens hurts, but adding Carlos Lee sure beats having Mike Lamb batting cleanup.

 

[buck naked]

Lidge is still suffering from the poo-holeing he took a few years ago.

Funny. I said the name "Albert Pujols" the other night and my 3 year old son said "Eeeewwwww!!!!"

 

[GroveDiesel]

"In the 132-year history of Major League Baseball, the Pirates' win marks only the second time that a team has started a season with a pair of road wins in which it trailed going into the eighth inning." The season is off to a GREAT start.

If it makes you feel any better, it would seem that the Braves are now the second team to do the same thing.

 

[Meat]

"In the 132-year history of Major League Baseball, the Pirates' win marks only the second time that a team has started a season with a pair of road wins in which it trailed going into the eighth inning." The season is off to a GREAT start.

If it makes you feel any better, it would seem that the Braves are now the second team to do the same thing.

woohoo Phillies!

 

[apalmer]

"In the 132-year history of Major League Baseball, the Pirates' win marks only the second time that a team has started a season with a pair of road wins in which it trailed going into the eighth inning."



The season is off to a GREAT start.

If it makes you feel any better, it would seem that the Braves are now the second third team to do the same thing.

woohoo Phillies!

Fixed. BTW, the Phillies were the first (1994).

 

[Colin Dowling]

Glad to see Lidge isn't getting to have all the fun.

 

[Mr. Know-It-All]

I am a diehard Cardinal fan, but to say the NL Central is the best division in baseball this year is absurd.

1. AL East (Boston, New York, Toronto)

2. AL Central (Cleveland, Minnesota, Chicago)

3. NL East (by virtue of the Mets, Phils and Marlins)

4. NL Central (a lot of slightly above average teams, but all with HUGE question marks)

5. AL west (Anaheim, Seattle, Oakland similar to NL Central, Texas and KC on the rise...but its a long climb)

6. NL West (Pads and Dodgers have tools in place, the rest is garbage)

 

[Colin Dowling]

Good grief. No one said it was the best division in baseball. I said it was possible. I'd take if over the NL East easily. The Mets, sure. But the Phillies and Marlins have as many questions as the Cubs, Astros, and Brewers.

I think ranking the AL East as tops is ridiculous. 2nd maybe, but no way is it a better division then the AL Central. Just because the Yankees and Red Sox lead off ESPN every night doesn't mean the division is worth a crap.

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

Good grief. No one said it was the best division in baseball. I said it was possible. I'd take if over the NL East easily. The Mets, sure. But the Phillies and Marlins have as many questions as the Cubs, Astros, and Brewers. I think ranking the AL East as tops is ridiculous. 2nd maybe, but no way is it a better division then the AL Central. Just because the Yankees and Red Sox lead off ESPN every night doesn't mean the division is worth a crap.

It isn't remotely possible. And I'd take the Jays over any of the teams in the Central.

 

[Funkley]

I am a diehard Cardinal fan, but to say the NL Central is the best division in baseball this year is absurd.1. AL East (Boston, New York, Toronto)2. AL Central (Cleveland, Minnesota, Chicago)3. NL East (by virtue of the Mets, Phils and Marlins)4. NL Central (a lot of slightly above average teams, but all with HUGE question marks)5. AL west (Anaheim, Seattle, Oakland similar to NL Central, Texas and KC on the rise...but its a long climb)6. NL West (Pads and Dodgers have tools in place, the rest is garbage)

No Detroit?

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

I am a diehard Cardinal fan, but to say the NL Central is the best division in baseball this year is absurd.1. AL East (Boston, New York, Toronto)2. AL Central (Cleveland, Minnesota, Chicago)3. NL East (by virtue of the Mets, Phils and Marlins)4. NL Central (a lot of slightly above average teams, but all with HUGE question marks)5. AL west (Anaheim, Seattle, Oakland similar to NL Central, Texas and KC on the rise...but its a long climb)6. NL West (Pads and Dodgers have tools in place, the rest is garbage)

No Detroit?

I'd rank them this way:1) AL Central2) AL East3) NL East4) AL West5) NL West6) NL CentralTo be fair though it's fairly close after the top three.

 

[Colin Dowling]

I'd rank them this way:5) NL West6) NL Central

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

I'd rank them this way:5) NL West6) NL Central

Not fishing. I like the Dodgers, Padres, Dbacks, and Rockies over everyone in the Central outside of the Brewers and Cubs I'd put the Brewers behind the DBacks and even with the Dodgers and Pads.The Astros are fairly close to most of those teams too. The rest of the division is abysmal.Forgot about the Cubbies. I like them about as much as Arizona, maybe a little less.

 

[Greco]

You want Fernando Rodney?

 

[Mr. Know-It-All]

I am a diehard Cardinal fan, but to say the NL Central is the best division in baseball this year is absurd.1. AL East (Boston, New York, Toronto)2. AL Central (Cleveland, Minnesota, Chicago)3. NL East (by virtue of the Mets, Phils and Marlins)4. NL Central (a lot of slightly above average teams, but all with HUGE question marks)5. AL west (Anaheim, Seattle, Oakland similar to NL Central, Texas and KC on the rise...but its a long climb)6. NL West (Pads and Dodgers have tools in place, the rest is garbage)

No Detroit?

Oops. How did I forget them? I would have them behind Cleveland and ahead of Minnesota. Shoot, that makes the AL Central the best division.

 

[Colin Dowling]

Lidge out as closer. :X Team is 1-5 but should be 3-3. GO ASTROS!