Chase Stuart
Footballguy
Simple questions.
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Which safety is better? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Chase Stuart
- Start date
Jason Wood
Zoo York
I had this debate midway through this season with a diehard Steelers fan, and I made the case that Ed Reed has the better resume to date, but said that we had a lot of time left to ultimately say whether Troy had the better career. Since then Troy won the DPOY (matching Ed Reed for one each). Both have their injury issues, but Reed's seem to be more career threatening/shortening, at least from what I can recall.
I voted that Troy is the better player right now, Ed was better at his peak, and that Troy will be remembered as having the better career (but both seem HOF bound to me).
I voted that Troy is the better player right now, Ed was better at his peak, and that Troy will be remembered as having the better career (but both seem HOF bound to me).
Sidewinder16
Footballguy
So is this a "who is the better player" poll, or is it a "who is the better safety" poll?
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
They're just different enough that I think it's personal preference.
Reed might be the best cover safety ever, but he's provided very little in the box -- run support or pass rush -- for most of the last 5-6 seasons. Polamalu is a gambler in coverage, and a very successful one, but not in Reed's class in terms of range and recovery speed. But he has lots of in-the-box value.
Reed might be the best cover safety ever, but he's provided very little in the box -- run support or pass rush -- for most of the last 5-6 seasons. Polamalu is a gambler in coverage, and a very successful one, but not in Reed's class in terms of range and recovery speed. But he has lots of in-the-box value.
Cookiemonster
Footballguy
As a Steeler fan, I voted for Reed in the 1st two. Dude came off of hip surgery and BALLED! Troy takes too many bad angles and just flat out misses tackles too often. His highlight reel is more impressive, and both are ballhawks, but Reed's coverage skills get the nod from me. I do think Polo will be remembered with more reverence in part to his Super Bowl wins (and I expect he gets one more before he is done). The defense in front of Reed is falling apart and I'm betting the tail of his career is not so impressive.
Evilgrin 72
Distributor of Pain
Reed is the best ball-hawk S I've seen in the last 20 years.
Polamalu is good, but not as good.
Polamalu is the best run-defending S I've seen in the last 20 years.
Reed is not nearly as good.
Polamalu is a better blitzer. Both are a threat to bring any turnover to the house.
Polamalu > Reed for having increased versatility and allowing more flexibility in the defense, while making just as many splash plays.
Polamalu is good, but not as good.
Polamalu is the best run-defending S I've seen in the last 20 years.
Reed is not nearly as good.
Polamalu is a better blitzer. Both are a threat to bring any turnover to the house.
Polamalu > Reed for having increased versatility and allowing more flexibility in the defense, while making just as many splash plays.
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
Counter argument to this is that Reed's range, recovery speed and instincts allow lots of flexibility in coverage calls and run fronts. Those are things that you may not see on a game-by-game basis, but they impact the thoughts of an offensive coordinator and quarterback on every snap. Rex Ryan could call any zone coverage he wanted or get away with Cover-1 with a average corner or leave Reed as the lone help defender on an overload blitz including a corner. LeBeau can't necessarily do those things.Polamalu is light years better than the average safety in those respects, and has more of a direct impact, but Reed's impact on the versatility of the defense was every bit as important during his peak years.
Some stats:
Reed 414 tackles/128 gms = 3.32/gm
84 assits/128= .65/gm
Polamalu 394 tackles/107 gms = 3.68/gm (471/128gms)
125 assists/107= 1.17/gm (150/128gms)
tp= 8 sack 27 int 328 yds 79 pd 8 ff 4 fr 91 yds 3td's
er= 5 sack 54 int 1438 yds 112 pd 10 ff 10 fr 122 yds 8td's Punt returns=26 175yds 1td Also had 11 fumbles
Reed has waayyy more impact plays on his reume and only about 1 extra year of games. So far batter career is Reed.
Reed 414 tackles/128 gms = 3.32/gm
84 assits/128= .65/gm
Polamalu 394 tackles/107 gms = 3.68/gm (471/128gms)
125 assists/107= 1.17/gm (150/128gms)
tp= 8 sack 27 int 328 yds 79 pd 8 ff 4 fr 91 yds 3td's
er= 5 sack 54 int 1438 yds 112 pd 10 ff 10 fr 122 yds 8td's Punt returns=26 175yds 1td Also had 11 fumbles
Reed has waayyy more impact plays on his reume and only about 1 extra year of games. So far batter career is Reed.
GridironMenace
Footballguy
^ good post. Polamalu is overrated. He makes a lot of in-the-box tackles because the scheme allows for it (plus it doesn't hurt when you have Harrison, Woodley, Timmons and Farrior in front of you. One on one, Polamalu really isn't a great run stopping safety. Remember when he got his ankles broken on the goal line by Ray Rice in the playoffs last year? Troy plays with reckless abandon and quite often finds himself out of position and over running plays. Ed Reed hardly ever finds himself out of position. I'll contend that if Polamalu didn't have those sexy flowing locks of hair, the media wouldn't hype him up the way he is. Ed Reed is the better player now and the better player in his prime. The media will probably make Polamalu the more remembered player when all is said and done (although Reed has had the better career).
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treat88
Footballguy
As Jene alluded to above, they play different positions (SS vs. FS) with different responsibilities within differing schemes so it's not even an apples to apples comparison to begin with.
Kinda like comparing a DE to a DT and saying who's the better DL...?
Reed is one of the all time greats at FS. Troy is one of the all time greats at SS. Seems like that's about as far as the comparison can be carried with any legitimacy.
Kinda like comparing a DE to a DT and saying who's the better DL...?
Reed is one of the all time greats at FS. Troy is one of the all time greats at SS. Seems like that's about as far as the comparison can be carried with any legitimacy.
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FUBAR
Footballguy
these stats are nice, but often misleading. Was Aeneas Williams a better cover corner than Deion Sanders? Was Terrell Buckley better at coverage than Champ Bailey?
jurb26
Footballguy
I'm a Steeler fan and I agree that Polamalu is overrated. I've said he's been overrated for several years as a matter of fact. I agree that scheme allows many advantages to Troy that Ed doesn't get. Most people are saying that Troy is better in the box. I'd say the Steelers scheme is far better at providing those opportunities for plays in the box for Troy. Sure, he makes a good amount but the scheme calls for it. Troy is far too undisciplined in coverage for my taste. As you stated above, he takes far too many poor angles. He missed way too many tackles for my taste because he is too often going for the "kill shot." This very nature is what allows him to make all those fantastic highlight real plays that you will see on Sports Center but I like Reed's game better. Reed's got the best natural instincts for the ball I've ever seen. His recovery skills are 2nd to none and while he may not make that awe inspiring big hit or tackle, he misses far fewer and is a more sure tackler. When it comes to safeties that is what I want, sure tacklers. They are often the last line of defense and making that tackle is the difference between a big play or not. I'm not sure how much Reed has left in the tank as his injuries seem to have taken a far greater toll on his body than any of Troy's. Hell, the guy was contemplating retirement just last year or the year before because of the wear on his body. I think Reed will have a shorter career and thus not be regarded as highly for overall career. Troy just came off DPOY and seems to have more left in the tank.
They are certainly different players and tough to compare, but the Steeler D has looked awful just once in the last 7 or 8 years and that was when Troy missed that stretch of games two years ago. I give the nod to Troy on all three questions, but it certainly is a tough call. Plys Troy has such pretty locks.
You've got me curious Fubar, how are these particular stats misleading in regards to the question on the table? I don't see how anyone can argue Polamalu has been more impactful than Reed even though he has enjoyed much greater team success.
Uruk-Hai
Footballguy
'Jene Bramel said:
Reed has given the Ravens a luxury almost no one else has had in the last decade. Troy plays a different role/position and does things that Reed can't/doesn't do.Both are marvelous players, both will be in the HOF, and both will be considered among the best ever at their position. I would say Troy is better right now, Reed's been better over his career, and Troy will be better-remembered (if they had been drafted by the opposite team, I'd switch this last - Troy plays for one of the glamour franchises while Reed plays for one of the smallest fan bases).
GregR_2
Footballguy
As I was reading through the thread I was planning to make this exact post, even down to the example that people are doing the equivalent of comparing a DE to a DT. If we were comparing Wilfork and Freeney, we wouldn't be knocking Wilfork for not being as good of a pass rusher as Freeney, nor would we knock Freeney for not being as stout against the run as Wilfork. We'd be looking at how each does the job his position requires compared to others who do the same job.We should be doing the same here. It's not a knock on Polamalu that he's not as good in coverage as the best free safeties, nor is it a knock on Reed that he's not as good in the box as the best strong safeties.'treat88 said:
Jeff Pasquino
Footballguy
I was interested when I saw this topic, but I agree that although they are both "safeties", they don't do the same thing. Both are very big impacts when they take the field for their respective defenses, but their deployment in their respective defensive schemes are not comparable.I would add to the debate that Ed Reed used to be also considered a viable PR threat early in his career.I'm curious to see where the NFL-Network's Top 100 list has them both.adrenaline
Footballguy
Reed is the better FS
Polamalu is the better SS
Polamalu is the better SS
