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Why Denise Rich Gave Up U.S. Citizenship (1 Viewer)

If I had enough money I'd be 1st in line to say SCREW YOU to Taxes and leave...

But, I lived my life believing in less Govt and less taxes.

These people who act as if they are for the little guy and do whatever they can to promote Redistribution of Wealth and then run away are panzies......

 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
 
Rich is not alone in giving up her U.S. citizenship: In 2011, nearly 1,800 people renounced their U.S. citizenship or residency, a sixfold increase from 2008.
It's obviously Bush's fault.
Why would that be anybody's "fault?" And what's the point in only referencing 2008? Why not cite an average if you're only going to use one other number for a comparison. Oh, that's right, then people like you wouldn't react like you just did. WGAF where this pig is going?
I have seen 1100 people a year as an average quoted from State Dept sources. But no one seems to be willing to give official numbers.
Why would the State Dept. or anyone else in government be hesitant to release these numbers? Is it somehow embarrassing?
 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
We're talking about renouncing citizenship in this thread, right? And the retort seems to be: "there's a lot of other nice places to live."I'm just pointing out that you can go live somewhere else quite easily without renouncing your citizenship. So just saying "there's other nice places to live" isn't really all that relevant.

 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
We're talking about renouncing citizenship in this thread, right? And the retort seems to be: "there's a lot of other nice places to live."I'm just pointing out that you can go live somewhere else quite easily without renouncing your citizenship. So just saying "there's other nice places to live" isn't really all that relevant.
A lot of those places have a much better tax structure than we do as well. Personally, if I decide to move to another country and live there for the rest of my life, it makes economic sense to drop my citizenship because of our tax laws, especially if I'm moving somewhere that has a better handle on the taxation. That's logical, isn't it? :unsure:
 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
We're talking about renouncing citizenship in this thread, right? And the retort seems to be: "there's a lot of other nice places to live."I'm just pointing out that you can go live somewhere else quite easily without renouncing your citizenship. So just saying "there's other nice places to live" isn't really all that relevant.
A lot of those places have a much better tax structure than we do as well. Personally, if I decide to move to another country and live there for the rest of my life, it makes economic sense to drop my citizenship because of our tax laws, especially if I'm moving somewhere that has a better handle on the taxation. That's logical, isn't it? :unsure:
Absolutely. But the reason you're renouncing your US citizenship isn't because you moved to another country and just want to renounce your citizenship, it's specifically for tax reasons. Which is what the OP is saying.
 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
We're talking about renouncing citizenship in this thread, right? And the retort seems to be: "there's a lot of other nice places to live."I'm just pointing out that you can go live somewhere else quite easily without renouncing your citizenship. So just saying "there's other nice places to live" isn't really all that relevant.
Sure it is. The implication is that these people are leaving for tax reasons. Most might be dropping their citizenship for tax reasons, but that doesn't mean they are moving for tax reasons.
 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
We're talking about renouncing citizenship in this thread, right? And the retort seems to be: "there's a lot of other nice places to live."I'm just pointing out that you can go live somewhere else quite easily without renouncing your citizenship. So just saying "there's other nice places to live" isn't really all that relevant.
Sure it is. The implication is that these people are leaving for tax reasons. Most might be dropping their citizenship for tax reasons, but that doesn't mean they are moving for tax reasons.
Do you think only 1800 people moved out of the US?
 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
We're talking about renouncing citizenship in this thread, right? And the retort seems to be: "there's a lot of other nice places to live."I'm just pointing out that you can go live somewhere else quite easily without renouncing your citizenship. So just saying "there's other nice places to live" isn't really all that relevant.
Sure it is. The implication is that these people are leaving for tax reasons. Most might be dropping their citizenship for tax reasons, but that doesn't mean they are moving for tax reasons.
Do you think only 1800 people moved out of the US?
No. Look at the comments quoted. That is the context for the comments that follow.
 
Why not focus on why people are getting fed up with America? Eventually the folks here will get mad and either choose something else or migrate elsewhere. We are starting to accept the global community idea more and more.
Why care where 1800 out of 313M choose to live? There are other nice places in the world. It's not inconceivable that there are those who might find them preferable to the US. Especially, with the Idiocracy traits continuing to increase.
Idiocy traits like believing that you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live somewhere else?
Where did I say you have to renounce your US citizenship to go live elsewhere?
We're talking about renouncing citizenship in this thread, right? And the retort seems to be: "there's a lot of other nice places to live."I'm just pointing out that you can go live somewhere else quite easily without renouncing your citizenship. So just saying "there's other nice places to live" isn't really all that relevant.
A lot of those places have a much better tax structure than we do as well. Personally, if I decide to move to another country and live there for the rest of my life, it makes economic sense to drop my citizenship because of our tax laws, especially if I'm moving somewhere that has a better handle on the taxation. That's logical, isn't it? :unsure:
Absolutely. But the reason you're renouncing your US citizenship isn't because you moved to another country and just want to renounce your citizenship, it's specifically for tax reasons. Which is what the OP is saying.
That's what our tax code dictates by it's structure. You'd be dumb not to do this based on the rules. I don't get the faux outrage at the individuals when they are simply reacting to the incredibly dumb tax code of the US.
 
From today's BNA Daily Tax Reports:

Expatriation
Americans Give Up Passports
As Asset-Disclosure Rules Start


By Dylan Griffiths

Aug. 7 — The number of Americans renouncing U.S. citizenship stayed near an all-time high in the first half of 2014 before rules that make it harder to hide assets from tax authorities came into force.

Some 1,577 people gave up their nationality at U.S. embassies in the six months through June, according to Federal Register data released Aug. 6. While that is a 13 percent decline from the year-earlier period, it is only the second time there has been a reading of more than 1,500, according to Bloomberg News calculations based on records starting in 1998 (152 DTR G-4, 8/7/14).

Tougher asset-disclosure rules effective as of July 1 under the Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act prompted 576 of the estimated 6 million Americans living overseas to give up their passports in the second quarter. The appeal of U.S. citizenship for expatriates faded as more than 100 Swiss banks turn over data on American clients to avoid prosecution for helping tax evaders.

“FATCA and the Swiss bank disclosure program has intensified the search for U.S. nationals beyond all measure,” said Matthew Ledvina, a U.S. tax lawyer at Anaford AG in Zurich. “It's shocking the levels of due diligence they are going through to ensure they have cleaned house.”

Swiss banks are trawling through records going back to the 1990s to find clients with U.S. addresses and telephone numbers, and those who received schooling in the country, Ledvina said. Those identified as U.S. persons are either being asked to leave or placed in special U.S.-only sections of the institution, he said.

Imposing Tax

The U.S., the only Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development nation that taxes citizens wherever they reside, stepped up the search for tax dodgers after UBS AG paid a $780 million penalty in 2009 and handed over data on about 4,700 accounts. Shunned by Swiss and German banks and with FATCA looming, almost 9,000 Americans living overseas gave up their passports during the past five years.

FATCA requires U.S. financial institutions to impose a 30 percent withholding tax on payments made to foreign banks that don't agree to identify and provide information on U.S. account holders. It allows the U.S. to scoop up data from more than 77,000 institutions and 80 governments about its citizens' overseas financial activities.

In establishing the 2010 FATCA law, Congress and President Barack Obama in effect threatened to cut off banks and other companies from easy access to the U.S. market if they didn't pass along such information. It was projected to generate $8.7 billion over 10 years, according to the congressional Joint Committee on Taxation.

Voluntary Disclosures

The start of FATCA was delayed by 18 months to give foreign banks time to comply with the law, after financial institutions including Canada's Toronto-Dominion Bank and Allianz SE of Germany expressed concerns it was too complex.

More than two-thirds of 400 U.S. expatriates surveyed in November by Zurich-based deVere Group said they had considered giving up their passports.

As many as 106 Swiss banks entered a Department of Justice program to volunteer information on how they helped clients hide money from the Internal Revenue Service, in exchange for leniency. Those banks have discovered that thousands of their clients have dual U.S.-Swiss or European citizenship, obliging them to make voluntary disclosures, Ledvina said. To avoid prosecution for handling undeclared American money, the banks must hand over account data and pay penalties.

June 30 was the deadline for turning over information on Americans considered in breach of U.S. tax rules, while July 31 marked the end of the second wave of deliveries and includes documents that show which American clients were compliant.

Compliance Costs

Switzerland is the largest cross-border financial center, with $2.3 trillion of assets.

About a dozen banks, including Julius Baer Group Ltd. and HSBC Holdings Plc's Swiss unit, are excluded from the program because they are already under investigation in the U.S.

Credit Suisse Group AG, the second-biggest Swiss bank that was part of the probe, was fined $2.6 billion in May after it pleaded guilty to aiding tax evasion.

The additional compliance costs for companies to ensure that Americans they hire are filing the correct U.S. tax returns and asset-declaration forms are $7,000 per person, according to Ledvina. The U.S. accounting costs for individuals opting for expatriation are typically about $4,000 per year, he said.

Americans with a net worth exceeding $2 million and an average income tax of at least $157,000 over the previous five years must pay an exit tax on unrealized capital gains when they renounce U.S. citizenship.

U.S. citizens aren't the only ones giving up their ties to America. Treasury is also trying to limit the benefits from corporations adopting foreign addresses to avoid taxes, a process known as inversion.
 
I AM OUTRAGED THAT THIS WOMAN THAT I'VE NEVER HEARD OF HAS LEFT THE COUNTRY!!!!! THIS AFFECTS US ALL IN SO MANY WAYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!one

 

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