Would the Lions be crazy if: (1 Viewer)

[TheBradyBunch]

No franchise gets dumped on more than the Lions...and deservedly so. They've gone winless and just might have the worst defense in NFL history. Fans are quick to encourage them to finally address both lines after seeing how much Millen's glamor picks of Harrington, KJ, Rogers, RW and BMW failed and set the franchise back..and that's certainly understandable.

My question to Lions fans and the entire pool is this, though:

Would you blame Lions management if they decided to draft Crabtree first overall and then trade their Roy Williams pick to the Pats for Cassel? I understand that the Lions have failed miserably with this drafting formula in the past, but would you not be entertained with the likes of Cassel, Cal, Crabtree and Smith? Crabtree's probably the number one talent in the draft and while many are quick to say grab a QB...the Lions have had ZERO luck in developing QB's and I'd feel much more comfortable handing the show over to a more proven guy like Cassel than any rookie QB.

I know it's probably crazy-talk, but it would be oh-so-tempting. Your thoughts?

 

[PewterFan]

I can't blame the team for wanting to upgrade at QB, but seeing that they have more pressing needs I don't see picking Crabtree as a good idea.

 

[gonzobill5]

No franchise gets dumped on more than the Lions...and deservedly so. They've gone winless and just might have the worst defense in NFL history. Fans are quick to encourage them to finally address both lines after seeing how much Millen's glamor picks of Harrington, KJ, Rogers, RW and BMW failed and set the franchise back..and that's certainly understandable. My question to Lions fans and the entire pool is this, though:Would you blame Lions management if they decided to draft Crabtree first overall and then trade their Roy Williams pick to the Pats for Cassel? I understand that the Lions have failed miserably with this drafting formula in the past, but would you not be entertained with the likes of Cassel, Cal, Crabtree and Smith? Crabtree's probably the number one talent in the draft and while many are quick to say grab a QB...the Lions have had ZERO luck in developing QB's and I'd feel much more comfortable handing the show over to a more proven guy like Cassel than any rookie QB. I know it's probably crazy-talk, but it would be oh-so-tempting. Your thoughts?

that wouldnt make them crazy...that would just make them the lions

 

[Doug B]

The only thing I'd worry about is that Cassel probably isn't a franchise-saving QB. He'd be good on a good team, but struggle on a bad one.

What the Lions need is a John-Elway type who can produce even with lesser talent around him. Obviously, those guys don't grow on trees.

All that said, going after Cassel would at least be throwing the Lions' fan base a bone. The brass would be showing some effort.

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

If they sign Cassel and don't want to draft a QB, they should draft a Left Tackle or trade the pick.

 

[TheBradyBunch]

The only thing I'd worry about is that Cassel probably isn't a franchise-saving QB. He'd be good on a good team, but struggle on a bad one.What the Lions need is a John-Elway type who can produce even with lesser talent around him. Obviously, those guys don't grow on trees.All that said, going after Cassel would at least be throwing the Lions' fan base a bone. The brass would be showing some effort.

Even more incentive to add Crabtree. I know the same was said about RW, Rogers, BMW and Harrington...but how could Cal, Crabtree and Cassel possibly fail? (Insert Lions joke here _________)

 

[faulkfan]

I just don't see Cassel as a franchise QB. Maybe I'm missing something, but he has enormous talent around him and a system that makes QBs look good. Put him in a situation where he has to carry the day every day and I think he'll be Trent Dilfer. Let us not forget that before the season, before Brady was hurt and before the Titans went crazy, the Pats were stated as having the easiest schedule in the League. Obviously things change as seasons wear on, but the entire NFL didn't improve to upgrade their schedule entirely.

I would be nervous calling on Cassel were it not for the fact that the Lions have Calvin. He will make any QB look good, end of story! Cassel should at least be smart enough after playing for the Pats to know the preparation it takes to win, which will only help the Lions.

 

[Doug B]

Even more incentive to add Crabtree. I know the same was said about RW, Rogers, BMW and Harrington...but how could Cal, Crabtree and Cassel possibly fail? (Insert Lions joke here _________)

Well, remember, Cassel was performing well for an elite squad that already had a winning culture deeply entrenched. That's a far, far cry from succeeding in Detroit.

 

[TheBradyBunch]

I get all of the Cassel questionmarks, but wouldn't the majority of people here rather hitch their wagon to him than take a chance on Bradford or Stafford? I'm a biased Pats fan, but I certainly would, especially after seeing how Detroit has struggled to develop players. Not only that, but it would free the Lions up to use the 1st pick elsewhere.

 

[puckalicious]

Name me one QB that has succeeded behind an OL as bad as the Lions. I don't care if Jesus is a WR on that team no QB can complete a pass on their back or running for their lives. That's why getting a "franchise" QB is not a priority right now until the OL is improved. And even more importantly, the D needs huge improvement if they want to win any games.

 

[TheBradyBunch]

Name me one QB that has succeeded behind an OL as bad as the Lions. I don't care if Jesus is a WR on that team no QB can complete a pass on their back or running for their lives. That's why getting a "franchise" QB is not a priority right now until the OL is improved. And even more importantly, the D needs huge improvement if they want to win any games.

When you're a winless team, there's really no perfect answer when it comes to draft picks that can fix all of your problems. Judging by the fact that probably 95% of all of the mock drafts I've seen have the Lions selecting Stafford or Bradford with the first pick tells me that a "franchise" QB is a pretty important place to start as that's the one position that has the power to make everyone on offense better. How about this, name me the last good Lions QB?

 

[Donnybrook]

Would the Lions be crazy if:, they drafted Crabtree and traded for Cassel?

Short answer: Yes.

Just because Cassel is getting the franchise tag it does make him a franchise QB.

 

[Blackjacks]

I'd like to see the Lions take A. Smith with their first pick (if they can't trade down a little) and then take the best defensive player or another olineman with their other #1 and sign either Derek Anderson, Losman or Sage Rosenfeld in the offseason.

I would also like to see them call down to Tenn. and see the availabilty of Vince Young. I know Young has been a flop so far but he has shown ability to lead and win in the NFL at one time. He also can scramble with the best of them which with that line isn't a horrible talent to have.

Talking about scrambling Michael Vick??????????????????????????????????????????

 

[Thunderlips]

they should trade Calvin Johnson to the Eagles for both of their first round picks and DeSean Jackson.

 

[Doug B]

I get all of the Cassel questionmarks, but wouldn't the majority of people here rather hitch their wagon to him than take a chance on Bradford or Stafford? I'm a biased Pats fan, but I certainly would, especially after seeing how Detroit has struggled to develop players. Not only that, but it would free the Lions up to use the 1st pick elsewhere.

Perhaps -- but don't think of Cassel as a finished product. The Lions would still have to develop him a lot further.

 

[TheBradyBunch]

Would the Lions be crazy if:, they drafted Crabtree and traded for Cassel?Short answer: Yes. Just because Cassel is getting the franchise tag it does make him a franchise QB.

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

 

[Doug B]

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

If they were smart, they'd stick with Kitna or a similar vet for a season before throwing Bradford/Stafford to the wolves.

 

[JuniorNB]

I think it would be yet another move that would someday add to the punchline that is the Detroit Lions. Cassel has Scott Mitchell, Billy Volek, and AJ Feeley written all over him. Guys who looked good stepping into an established system only to fail miserably when asked to carry the load themselves.

Detroit should take the picks they have and invest in a can't miss offensive lineman or two and draft whoever they think is the best QB prospect. They already have Calvin Johnson, who can be a Moss/Owens type, and a good running back in Smith. Let one of the veterans QB next year while the draft pick learns. With the improved line, they can shoot for 3-5 wins in 2009, and shoot for .500 the following year.

There is no one they can trade for or draft that will make them a playoff team next year, so don't make crazy moves. They need to build a good foundation and be patient.

 

[Jon_Moore]

The only thing I'd worry about is that Cassel probably isn't a franchise-saving QB. He'd be good on a good team, but struggle on a bad one.

What the Lions need is a John-Elway type who can produce even with lesser talent around him. Obviously, those guys don't grow on trees.

All that said, going after Cassel would at least be throwing the Lions' fan base a bone. The brass would be showing some effort.

Even more incentive to add Crabtree. I know the same was said about RW, Rogers, BMW and Harrington...but how could Cal, Crabtree and Cassel possibly fail? (Insert Lions joke here _________)

You couldn't type the other 3 letters, seriously?And, to answer your question. The other receiver combos/Harrington couldn't succeed because the offensive line couldn't keep the QB upright. So, I might put serious thought into addressing that.

And, it's not like fixing the offense makes them a good team. They can't stop any part of the other team's offense.

You can't fix a team with one draft. The popular thing is to take a franchise QB, so I wouldn't be shocked to see them take a QB entirely too high and start down the path.

 

[TheBradyBunch]

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

If they were smart, they'd stick with Kitna or a similar vet for a season before throwing Bradford/Stafford to the wolves.

I think that idea only adds to Cassel having more value than Bradford and Stafford. Neither of those guys, imo, is worthy of the first pick...especially when you could just as easily get a guy with the 20 pick that could play right away, has experience, is likely to be less of a bust when you consider the high bust rate of drafted QB's AND still use the 1 on the best player. That, and I really want the Patriots to get that pick!

 

[Slider]

They should finally realize D wins a lot of games and lay off the WR's. A LT is always useful.

 

[Chase Stuart]

I get all of the Cassel questionmarks, but wouldn't the majority of people here rather hitch their wagon to him than take a chance on Bradford or Stafford? I'm a biased Pats fan, but I certainly would, especially after seeing how Detroit has struggled to develop players. Not only that, but it would free the Lions up to use the 1st pick elsewhere.

It really depends on how those guys rate out. If they're top ten picks, then I'd probably rather have them. Cassel looks very average to me.

 

[TheBradyBunch]

The only thing I'd worry about is that Cassel probably isn't a franchise-saving QB. He'd be good on a good team, but struggle on a bad one.

What the Lions need is a John-Elway type who can produce even with lesser talent around him. Obviously, those guys don't grow on trees.

All that said, going after Cassel would at least be throwing the Lions' fan base a bone. The brass would be showing some effort.

Even more incentive to add Crabtree. I know the same was said about RW, Rogers, BMW and Harrington...but how could Cal, Crabtree and Cassel possibly fail? (Insert Lions joke here _________)

You couldn't type the other 3 letters, seriously?And, to answer your question. The other receiver combos/Harrington couldn't succeed because the offensive line couldn't keep the QB upright. So, I might put serious thought into addressing that.

And, it's not like fixing the offense makes them a good team. They can't stop any part of the other team's offense.

You can't fix a team with one draft. The popular thing is to take a franchise QB, so I wouldn't be shocked to see them take a QB entirely too high and start down the path.

I think time has proven that the combo of Williams, Rogers, BMW, KJ and Harrington didn't work because they weren't good. It was bad luck or bad drafting more than it was a bad formula for success. The Lions are a bad organization that has a ton of holes, but the fact that 4 of 5 of those guys are either out of the NFL entirely or not even a factor says it all.

 

[Traders2001]

I think before they waste a high pick or trade for a QB , they should give Stanton his chance .

What happened to him. They saw him as their Qb of the future, then he gets injured comes back and does nt get a real chance .

I would go defense , OL . That s what they really need to buil a solid base , then you see how you can improve the offense.

 

[Eminence]

Yeah, because if the Lions draft Crabtree... they should try shipping him somewhere whom would have some interest in them. IE: Seattle.

 

[Donnybrook]

Would the Lions be crazy if:, they drafted Crabtree and traded for Cassel?Short answer: Yes. Just because Cassel is getting the franchise tag it does make him a franchise QB.

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

What is wrong with waiting a year and signing Cassel in 2010? Can NE afford to keep him if in 2010 he is just playing a backup role to Tom Terrific? Situation is very similar to that of Michael Turner in San Diego. Detroit should wait a year - build up their team and salary cap and then, if he is still worth it, make a play for Cassel. It not like anyone is expecting to go from 0-16 to the Super Bowl in one year. BTW: This year rookie QB records speaks for themselves. Cassel 11-5Matt Ryan 11-5Joe Flacco 11-5IMO, Cassel did not do any better than this years 1st round rookies and if you consider his surronding talent Cassel probably did worse. I don't think Atlanta or Baltimore would trade their Rookie QBs for Cassel.

 

[metoo]

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

If they were smart, they'd stick with Kitna or a similar vet for a season before throwing Bradford/Stafford to the wolves.

If the Lions feel that Stafford or Bradford is a franchise QB, they have to take them at 1. Let whomever they take sit for a year and hopefully they can build up the o-line during that time. This would give the Lions the rest of the 2009 draft and entire 2010 to improve the o-line. Kitna starts for the 2009 season and Stafford or Bradford sits and learn.

 

[TwinTurbo]

Cassell at best would be another Scott Mitchell. No thanks. He's not worth a first round pick.

And as for Crabtree, I think in almost all cases it doesn't make sense for a team that is rebuilding to draft WR in the first round. Every year, there is some highly regarded WR prospect that busts and usually you see good value in round 2 and 3. Unless it's a no brainer like CJ (and even then some Lions fans like me would have preferred Adrian Peterson), it's better to address other positions. You can't build your team around WR. The team won't be a consistent winner. Crabtree is no sure thing and the Lions need a QB, O-line, D-line, and CB's more than they need another WR that may or may not pan out.

 

[David Yudkin]

This has been discussed already on sports radio in Boston already, so it's not really that out of the question.

 

[TheBradyBunch]

Would the Lions be crazy if:, they drafted Crabtree and traded for Cassel?Short answer: Yes. Just because Cassel is getting the franchise tag it does make him a franchise QB.

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

What is wrong with waiting a year and signing Cassel in 2010? Can NE afford to keep him if in 2010 he is just playing a backup role to Tom Terrific? Situation is very similar to that of Michael Turner in San Diego. Detroit should wait a year - build up their team and salary cap and then, if he is still worth it, make a play for Cassel. It not like anyone is expecting to go from 0-16 to the Super Bowl in one year. BTW: This year rookie QB records speaks for themselves. Cassel 11-5Matt Ryan 11-5Joe Flacco 11-5IMO, Cassel did not do any better than this years 1st round rookies and if you consider his surronding talent Cassel probably did worse. I don't think Atlanta or Baltimore would trade their Rookie QBs for Cassel.

The odds of the Pats keeping Cassel is slim to none. As you all have said, Detroit has a ton of holes and there's no way to get out of that mess with just one draft. Logic then suggests you take the best player available regardless of position with the hopes that it will at least fill one void. That's the only way to dig out of it. I've seen enough of Bradford and Stafford to know that they're not the best players in the draft and would only be taken to fill a position of need. Why not get the best player at one and trade a lesser pick for a more proven commodity?

 

[Kitrick Taylor]

Would the Lions be crazy if:, they drafted Crabtree and traded for Cassel?Short answer: Yes. Just because Cassel is getting the franchise tag it does make him a franchise QB.

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

If you were the Dolphins or Rams, would you feel more comfortable starting Pennington or Bulger over Ryan? (For the record, Cassel is no Ryan). I'd bet both teams that passed on Ryan without having a franchise QB are kicking themselves for not getting one. If you have a chance at a franchise level QB you almost have to take him. He can improve your fortunes as a franchise for 15 years.

 

[plymkr]

BradyBunch:

Seriously. You can't make the Lions brass trade for Cassell just because you want the#20 pick. You act like you are arguing/trying to convince the Lions front office to make the deal w/o realizing you are on a FF website! lol

Anyway, I wonder if the rest of the league can see throught the Pats ruse of trying to get a first round pick out of a system quarterback. People on this board sure can! If my team was in dire straits, the most you would get from me would be a 3rd...probably nothing though considering he is going to be a free agent next year.

What if the rest of the league said to heck w/you Pats, you franchised him, you pay him and let it be at that?

 

[puckalicious]

Would the Lions be crazy if:, they drafted Crabtree and traded for Cassel?Short answer: Yes. Just because Cassel is getting the franchise tag it does make him a franchise QB.

If you were the Lions would you feel more comfortable starting Stafford or Bradford over Cassel?

If you were the Dolphins or Rams, would you feel more comfortable starting Pennington or Bulger over Ryan? (For the record, Cassel is no Ryan). I'd bet both teams that passed on Ryan without having a franchise QB are kicking themselves for not getting one. If you have a chance at a franchise level QB you almost have to take him. He can improve your fortunes as a franchise for 15 years.

I'm pretty sure Parcells is pretty darn happy with his franchise LT and not second guessing anything.

 

[JuniorNB]

Anyway, I wonder if the rest of the league can see throught the Pats ruse of trying to get a first round pick out of a system quarterback. People on this board sure can! If my team was in dire straits, the most you would get from me would be a 3rd...probably nothing though considering he is going to be a free agent next year.

What if the rest of the league said to heck w/you Pats, you franchised him, you pay him and let it be at that?

I am 100% positive that every GM in football knows what the Pats are trying to do. I am also about 99% sure that some desperate NFL franchise will take teh bait and make a trade for him.

 

[jurb26]

My suggestion for the Lions 09 draft would be (1st 3 picks):

A. Smith (or highest rated LT)

D. Robinson

Best defensive player.

The Lions have a great opportunity to significantly upgrade their Oline thanks to both a deep class of talent at T and their combination of early picks. The Lions largest problems the past 5 years or so have been a total lack of stability and talent at the LOS.

 

[Getinthemix]

The only thing I'd worry about is that Cassel probably isn't a franchise-saving QB. He'd be good on a good team, but struggle on a bad one.What the Lions need is a John-Elway type who can produce even with lesser talent around him. Obviously, those guys don't grow on trees.All that said, going after Cassel would at least be throwing the Lions' fan base a bone. The brass would be showing some effort.

Even more incentive to add Crabtree. I know the same was said about RW, Rogers, BMW and Harrington...but how could Cal, Crabtree and Cassel possibly fail? (Insert Lions joke here _________)

When your line is currently worse than having Turnstile St. Clair at all 5 OLine positions, you fail. You need to give the QB time and the RB holes. The Lions do neither.

 

[JohnnyU]

When will the Lions learn that if your draft pick isn't named Peyton Manning, you need to build your OL before getting a QB. Even if they draft a great QB, getting him smashed 50+ times a year and killing his confidence isn't a good thing.

 

[Balco]

If they wanted Caseel why would they draft Crabtree # 1. Andre Smith would be their # 1.

 

[JuniorNB]

If they wanted Caseel why would they draft Crabtree # 1. Andre Smith would be their # 1.

The Lions already have a top three WR in the league. Wasting that pick on Crabtree would be as silly as Dallas trading for Roy Williams when there are so many other weaknesses that need attention.

 

[Whiplash Inc.]

It remains to be seen how good Cassel would be in a different system with less talent than what he works with in New England (O-line, WRs).

 

[Pat Patriot]

I get all of the Cassel questionmarks, but wouldn't the majority of people here rather hitch their wagon to him than take a chance on Bradford or Stafford? I'm a biased Pats fan, but I certainly would, especially after seeing how Detroit has struggled to develop players. Not only that, but it would free the Lions up to use the 1st pick elsewhere.

It really depends on how those guys rate out. If they're top ten picks, then I'd probably rather have them. Cassel looks very average to me.

In the middle of the season, Cassel was worse than average. He was actually somewhat brutal. However, something happened for him in the Jets game. Now he was running the ball and sliding in and out of the pocket. His sacks went down. The line didnt get any better, Cassel did. He still has room to grow. Cassel has a chance to be a good QB. He has a good arm, is mobile and is careful with the ball. He seemed to make good decisions. I'm not sure why you see him as just average.

 

[David Yudkin]

I would trade our second #1 for Casell.Reason being, he has good size, good arm, can move in the pocket and run when needed and here is the kicker..he has been in a winning oraganization his whole career.If we draft Stafford or Bradford or whoever they will get beaten down like the rest.

I suspect Cassel will be cheaper than a first round rookie QB, but I suppose that would depend if DET took one at pick #1 or pick #20.

 

[The Captain]

While the Lions do need a #2 WR, I'd like to see them fill that need via free agency. Grab a Nate Washington or spend a little more for TJ Housh.

Grab the LT with the #1 pick and draft nothing but defense or interior o-line the rest of the draft. With a standout o-line, good running game and really nice receiving corps Culpepper or Dan Orlovski can produce enough to win a few games.

Go for the QB next year via draft or free agency and draft nothing but defense. The Lions could be playoff contenders by 2010 with this strategy (IMO).

Unfortunately, the Lions will draft the next Joey Harrington this year and throw him to the wolves. I truly believe that neither highly rated QB will be worth anything if the Lions draft them at #1.

 

[Aaron Rudnicki]

drafting skill players that high is obviously not working. Why not focus on the lines first?

 

[Pat Patriot]

I would be happy if the Pats got a #2 for Cassel. However, I wouldnt be surprised if someone gave a #1 for Cassel.

For those of you saying that Cassel is a system QB, you realize that:

1. neither of the TE's had even a decent year this year.

2. Moss was inconsistent

3. Gaffney (who was tremendous last year) came back to the norm this year and had a lot of drops

You can say the above 3 were tied to losing Brady and because of Cassel, but to put up the season he did with the above happening I think does speak to the fact that Cassel has starting QB talent.

 

[Ozymandias]

O-line.

Repeat after me. O-line.

That's where you start to rebuild a broken down franchise. They should take two offensive linemen with their two first round picks.

Then go defense. Then sign some more free agent offensive linemen.

Forget about QB; it's a crapshoot that takes 3 or 4 years to find out about. They have a serviceable running back and one outstanding receiver. They have a journeyman QB, but no qb is going to be any good until they have an o-line.

BTW, did I mention they ought to draft an offensive lineman?

 

[Da Guru]

drafting skill players that high is obviously not working. Why not focus on the lines first?

Drafting a QB may assure job security for Mayhew and Lewand though because you need 3 years to see if he is worth anything.If the Lions draft a QB #1 it could set them back another 3-5 years if things do not work out.

 

[The Captain]

O-line.Repeat after me. O-line.That's where you start to rebuild a broken down franchise. They should take two offensive linemen with their two first round picks.Then go defense. Then sign some more free agent offensive linemen.Forget about QB; it's a crapshoot that takes 3 or 4 years to find out about. They have a serviceable running back and one outstanding receiver. They have a journeyman QB, but no qb is going to be any good until they have an o-line.BTW, did I mention they ought to draft an offensive lineman?

I'm on board with this...though I'd like them to draft D with the second #1. Take the best available interior Olineman with one or both of their 3rd rd picks.

 

[Balco]

O-line.Repeat after me. O-line.That's where you start to rebuild a broken down franchise. They should take two offensive linemen with their two first round picks.Then go defense. Then sign some more free agent offensive linemen.Forget about QB; it's a crapshoot that takes 3 or 4 years to find out about. They have a serviceable running back and one outstanding receiver. They have a journeyman QB, but no qb is going to be any good until they have an o-line.BTW, did I mention they ought to draft an offensive lineman?

I am a firm believer in building teams through the trenches. And on defense you build up the middle (DT, MLB, SS). Good O Lines make average backs good, and good backs great. And good D Tackles do the same for linebackers. The Lions goal should be to rebuild that team, starting with both lines. I think Andre Smith would be a great start. And it is very deep at tackle this year, so they could even trade down a bit and get a solid tackle and more picks.

 

[Chadstroma]

The pure PR problem of picking another WR is just too much for any sane person to consider. Not to mention that there are tons of other positions that the team could use the draft pick on.

New England is not letting go of Cassel until they know for 100% that Brady will be healthy and ready to go day 1.