WR Cooper Kupp, SEA (2 Viewers)

[togo]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

 

[zed2283]

I hate you, Matthew Stafford.

 

[zed2283]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

 

[zed2283]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

On that one too. But missed Kupp on an easy TD the first time, and overthrew the second one.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

On that one too. But missed Kupp on an easy TD the first time, and overthrew the second one.

2nd one hit him on the hands. Kupp dropped it.

1st one was off target & would have been a tough catch, but Kupp usually comes down with those.

But the 2nd one was all on Kupp. He just flat dropped it.

 

[zed2283]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

On that one too. But missed Kupp on an easy TD the first time, and overthrew the second one.

2nd one hit him on the hands. Kupp dropped it.

1st one was off target & would have been a tough catch, but Kupp usually comes down with those.

But the 2nd one was all on Kupp. He just flat dropped it.

The first one was extremely difficult and would have been an extraordinary catch, even for Kupp.

Second one was easier and I agree he usually comes down with it, but a better throw would have been a big difference.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

On that one too. But missed Kupp on an easy TD the first time, and overthrew the second one.

2nd one hit him on the hands. Kupp dropped it.

1st one was off target & would have been a tough catch, but Kupp usually comes down with those.

But the 2nd one was all on Kupp. He just flat dropped it.

The first one was extremely difficult and would have been an extraordinary catch, even for Kupp.

Second one was easier and I agree he usually comes down with it, but a better throw would have been a big difference.

Kupp had both hands on both passes. Every WR in the NFL expects themselves to catch both of them. The first one would have been a “good” catch, but nothing out of the ordinary.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

On that one too. But missed Kupp on an easy TD the first time, and overthrew the second one.

2nd one hit him on the hands. Kupp dropped it.

1st one was off target & would have been a tough catch, but Kupp usually comes down with those.

But the 2nd one was all on Kupp. He just flat dropped it.

The first one was extremely difficult and would have been an extraordinary catch, even for Kupp.

Second one was easier and I agree he usually comes down with it, but a better throw would have been a big difference.

Kupp had both hands on both passes. Every WR in the NFL expects themselves to catch both of them. The first one would have been a “good” catch, but nothing out of the ordinary.

Yeah, on replay the 2nd was a bunny that Stafford floated to where only Kupp could get it. It literally hit him on both hands.

He just whiffed.

 

[zed2283]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

On that one too. But missed Kupp on an easy TD the first time, and overthrew the second one.

2nd one hit him on the hands. Kupp dropped it.

1st one was off target & would have been a tough catch, but Kupp usually comes down with those.

But the 2nd one was all on Kupp. He just flat dropped it.

The first one was extremely difficult and would have been an extraordinary catch, even for Kupp.

Second one was easier and I agree he usually comes down with it, but a better throw would have been a big difference.

Kupp had both hands on both passes. Every WR in the NFL expects themselves to catch both of them. The first one would have been a “good” catch, but nothing out of the ordinary.

Yeah, on replay the 2nd was a bunny that Stafford floated to where only Kupp could get it. It literally hit him on both hands.

He just whiffed.

Sorry but I think you guys are wrong. I might give you the 2nd but not the 1st.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Sorry but I think you guys are wrong. I might give you the 2nd but not the 1st.

I think the 1st would have been a difficult catch. It’s just one we’re used to seeing Kupp make.

So we’re in agreement.

The 2nd was a bunny that hit him on the hands.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Seemed like Everybody on the Rams got a TD except Kupp tonight.

It was fun watching him run in motion all night and then run 3 yard pass patterns.

It wasn’t for a lack of opportunity. Could/should have had a TD on 2 different occasions.

And Stafford totally whiffed.

No, Stafford whiffed on the throw to Nacua, not Kupp.

On that one too. But missed Kupp on an easy TD the first time, and overthrew the second one.

2nd one hit him on the hands. Kupp dropped it.

1st one was off target & would have been a tough catch, but Kupp usually comes down with those.

But the 2nd one was all on Kupp. He just flat dropped it.

The first one was extremely difficult and would have been an extraordinary catch, even for Kupp.

Second one was easier and I agree he usually comes down with it, but a better throw would have been a big difference.

Kupp had both hands on both passes. Every WR in the NFL expects themselves to catch both of them. The first one would have been a “good” catch, but nothing out of the ordinary.

Yeah, on replay the 2nd was a bunny that Stafford floated to where only Kupp could get it. It literally hit him on both hands.

He just whiffed.

Sorry but I think you guys are wrong. I might give you the 2nd but not the 1st.

I am wrong a lot, so I will trust you.

 

[jm192]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

 

[togo]

Oh absolutely.
He's the #2 WR or maybe even #3 WR in the pecking order now. Puka Nacua clearly, and deservedly, number 1 while Demarcus Robinson maybe the #2. (92 yards and 10 targets to Kupp's 6 targets and 27 yards in week 17)
Got the TD week 17 but 27 yards?!
Runs very short routes most of the time. Not really the long ball threat of years past.
Interesting where he gets drafted.

 

[Hoh]

Maybe in the off season DC’s will start to view Puka as the alpha and key on him. Then Kupp can run wild and make them pay for forgetting about him. #pleaseohplease

 

[Pip's Invitation]

Maybe in the off season DC’s will start to view Puka as the alpha and key on him. Then Kupp can run wild and make them pay for forgetting about him. #pleaseohplease

Puka/Kupp/Robinson could well become a combo like Holt/Bruce/Al-Hakim — too difficult to shut down entirely, so it varies who puts up the big numbers.

 

[Down Under]

Are we really talking up Demarcus friggen Robinson here? The one who will be going into his 8th season at age 30? The one who has never topped 50 catches or 500 yards in a season? That one? Really??

 

[BearsFan4Life]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

 

[jm192]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

Great trade. I would go into hiding after that degree of Grand Larceny.

 

[travdogg]

Maybe in the off season DC’s will start to view Puka as the alpha and key on him. Then Kupp can run wild and make them pay for forgetting about him. #pleaseohplease

That's probably a reasonable expectation.

 

[BearsFan4Life]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

Great trade. I would go into hiding after that degree of Grand Larceny.

I thought it was a good trade, but others in my league couldn't believe I dealt Kupp for McBride and that I went way out on a limb. Oldest guy on my team is Mahomes and then CMC with Barkley, Etienne, JJacobs, ARSB, Aiyuk, Higgins, JSN, McBride. Should compete for awhile.

 

[jm192]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

Great trade. I would go into hiding after that degree of Grand Larceny.

I thought it was a good trade, but others in my league couldn't believe I dealt Kupp for McBride and that I went way out on a limb. Oldest guy on my team is Mahomes and then CMC with Barkley, Etienne, JJacobs, ARSB, Aiyuk, Higgins, JSN, McBride. Should compete for awhile.

I'm on your line of thinking.

I think we're seeing the downfall of Kupp. Maybe he's 100% healthy all year next year and puts up a middling WR2-WR3 kind of season. But he's not the same dude.

McBride is TE2 or 3 in dynasty IMO.

 

[BearsFan4Life]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

Great trade. I would go into hiding after that degree of Grand Larceny.

I thought it was a good trade, but others in my league couldn't believe I dealt Kupp for McBride and that I went way out on a limb. Oldest guy on my team is Mahomes and then CMC with Barkley, Etienne, JJacobs, ARSB, Aiyuk, Higgins, JSN, McBride. Should compete for awhile.

I'm on your line of thinking.

I think we're seeing the downfall of Kupp. Maybe he's 100% healthy all year next year and puts up a middling WR2-WR3 kind of season. But he's not the same dude.

McBride is TE2 or 3 in dynasty IMO.

I also have Andrews and Hockenson, but you need a good TE and I can get a younger/better WR for Andrews or Hockenson next year.

 

[Down Under]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

I might crack my screen trying to smash the accept button on this (on the get McBride side).

 

[Mitchie]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

Great trade. I would go into hiding after that degree of Grand Larceny.

I thought it was a good trade, but others in my league couldn't believe I dealt Kupp for McBride and that I went way out on a limb. Oldest guy on my team is Mahomes and then CMC with Barkley, Etienne, JJacobs, ARSB, Aiyuk, Higgins, JSN, McBride. Should compete for awhile.

if you're in rebuild mode prob a good trade, if going for the ship next year think Kupp could have one more top 10, maybe top 15 season in him, so one of those trades that could be good for both sides

 

[jm192]

Right now it feels really difficult to trust him going into 2024.

Dynasty .. I just wound up dealing him for McBride

Great trade. I would go into hiding after that degree of Grand Larceny.

I thought it was a good trade, but others in my league couldn't believe I dealt Kupp for McBride and that I went way out on a limb. Oldest guy on my team is Mahomes and then CMC with Barkley, Etienne, JJacobs, ARSB, Aiyuk, Higgins, JSN, McBride. Should compete for awhile.

if you're in rebuild mode prob a good trade, if going for the ship next year think Kupp could have one more top 10, maybe top 15 season in him, so one of those trades that could be good for both sides

He MIGHT, but I really don’t feel good about it. McBride is a good win now piece and is only going to get better.

Feel like Kupp’s really showing the warning signs that next year won’t be great.

 

[travdogg]

Thinking about it more and more, I think Kupp is an interesting buy-low. He's played in 12 games this season and had 100 yards or a TD in all but 2 (of 8) that he and Stafford were both healthy for.

I get the argument that he's over 30, and has been breaking down a bit, but I also think that could just be noise. He could benefit from decreased coverage with Puka stepping up, and his game could age well in a Keenan Allen sort of way, as they both win with route running, and QB rapport.

2021 is never coming back, that was an all-time great season, and the situation has changed, but I think Kupp can still be a WR2 for fantasy for years to come. I think this year could be more his floor, than a sign of things to come. Having said all that, no issues at all dealing him for McBride, who looks like a top-3 TE already.

 

[efactor]

Thinking about it more and more, I think Kupp is an interesting buy-low.

But in this case, giving McBride is not buying low IMO. But yeah, he is a good potential buy-low

Stafford being healthy is a positive since he will likely be back in 2024 now. Kupp should be healthier and have a nice season. However, sharing with Puka will probably keep him out of elite territory.

 

[Faust]

Can Rams WR Cooper Kupp return to triple-crown status?

 

[Faust]

Rams WR Cooper Kupp excited to 'feel healthy' in camp after past injury issues

 

[Ministry of Pain]

One of the best bargains on the board for Redraft
Even with Nacua doing well in Year 2, the Rams are likely to be playing from behind most of the way
Screams value

 

[Mitchie]

One of the best bargains on the board for Redraft
Even with Nacua doing well in Year 2, the Rams are likely to be playing from behind most of the way
Screams value

like Kupp and Rams should be throwing decent amount but they should have a decent team, not sure about the playing from behind most of the way part.

 

[GreenNGold]

One of the best bargains on the board for Redraft
Even with Nacua doing well in Year 2, the Rams are likely to be playing from behind most of the way
Screams value

like Kupp and Rams should be throwing decent amount but they should have a decent team, not sure about the playing from behind most of the way part.

Agreed, they are a good team. They went 10-7 last year and I'd expect them to be around the same this year.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Rams WR Cooper Kupp excited to 'feel healthy' in camp after past injury issues

It’s kind of crazy he only has two 1000 yard seasons in 7 years.

6/7 times he averaged enough yards per game to get there but injuries derailed him 4x.

ECR WR19 33rd overall
ADP WR22 46th overall

He’s correctly valued in my view. Puka and Kyren will be the focal point, Cooper will be a fine WR2 pick. I’m not seeing high upside, league winner results. For redraft I would pass in the 3rd but feel OK taking him in the 4th.

 

[travdogg]

Rams WR Cooper Kupp excited to 'feel healthy' in camp after past injury issues

It’s kind of crazy he only has two 1000 yard seasons in 7 years.

6/7 times he averaged enough yards per game to get there but injuries derailed him 4x.

ECR WR19 33rd overall
ADP WR22 46th overall

He’s correctly valued in my view. Puka and Kyren will be the focal point, Cooper will be a fine WR2 pick. I’m not seeing high upside, league winner results. For redraft I would pass in the 3rd but feel OK taking him in the 4th.

I agree he's valued about right, but I do think there is a high-upside league winner scenario, it just involves Puka getting injured, which to be fair isn't of the question given Puka's history (though as you pointed out, Kupp is even more likely) in that sense I could see him being a value, much like Waddle and D. Smith are too.

I like Kupp at the 3/4 turn and have had a draft where I took both Puka and Kupp.

 

[Mitchie]

when Kupp and Puca played together last year targets were essentially equal, only reason i'm valuing Puca higher is because of Kupp's injury concerns, both his history and age prob makes him more susceptible as well

 

[Ray_T]

Rams WR Cooper Kupp excited to 'feel healthy' in camp after past injury issues

It’s kind of crazy he only has two 1000 yard seasons in 7 years.

6/7 times he averaged enough yards per game to get there but injuries derailed him 4x.

ECR WR19 33rd overall
ADP WR22 46th overall

He’s correctly valued in my view. Puka and Kyren will be the focal point, Cooper will be a fine WR2 pick. I’m not seeing high upside, league winner results. For redraft I would pass in the 3rd but feel OK taking him in the 4th.

you may be right but when I looked at the game by game numbers, Puka did a whole lot better (on average)in games where Kupp wasnt on the field.

go check the game by game and see for yourself.

that says a lot.

to that end I do think if Kupp stays healthy hes still a great guy to draft. my main question(of course) is whether he will be healthy.

 

[msudaisy26]

Puka and Kupp have a path to being top 12 wrs this year. The Rams lost Donald and their defense could be bad, Kyren has had foot issues every year in the league and his main back up is a rookie that could struggle. I could see Stafford throwing for a ton of yards and 30ish tds and these two guys are the Rams entire receiving core.

 

[BobbyLayne]

The duo played a dozen games together. During that stretch, Nacua posted 62 receptions on 102 targets for 944 yards and four touchdowns. That averages out to 5.2 receptions (8.5 targets), 78.7 yards, and 0.3 TDs per — take those numbers over a full 17-game season and you get 88 receptions, 145 targets, 1,337 yards, and 5.7 TDs.

For comparison, Kupp averaged 4.9 catches (7.9 targets), 61.4 yards, and 0.4 TDs per outing. Nacua’s per-game PPR output dipped 33% when he and Kupp shared the field.

In the WC Playoff Round game, Nacua had 9-181-1 on 10 targets while playing 49 snaps (84%.)

Kupp went 5-27-0 on 9 targets and saw 58 snaps (100%.)

 

[msudaisy26]

The duo played a dozen games together. During that stretch, Nacua posted 62 receptions on 102 targets for 944 yards and four touchdowns. That averages out to 5.2 receptions (8.5 targets), 78.7 yards, and 0.3 TDs per — take those numbers over a full 17-game season and you get 88 receptions, 145 targets, 1,337 yards, and 5.7 TDs.

For comparison, Kupp averaged 4.9 catches (7.9 targets), 61.4 yards, and 0.4 TDs per outing. Nacua’s per-game PPR output dipped 33% when he and Kupp shared the field.

In the WC Playoff Round game, Nacua had 9-181-1 on 10 targets while playing 49 snaps (84%.)

Kupp went 5-27-0 on 9 targets and saw 58 snaps (100%.)

Kupp also wasn't healthy all year. He may even get hurt this year, but if he doesn't his numbers will be closer to Puka.

 

[zamboni]

Kupp to me is one of the biggest bargains this year given how the fantasy community has soured on him. Injuries and aging are a concern, but he's a crafty guy and if he can stay healthy, I can easily see him outperforming his ADP. Stafford loves him.

 

[BobbyLayne]

The duo played a dozen games together. During that stretch, Nacua posted 62 receptions on 102 targets for 944 yards and four touchdowns. That averages out to 5.2 receptions (8.5 targets), 78.7 yards, and 0.3 TDs per — take those numbers over a full 17-game season and you get 88 receptions, 145 targets, 1,337 yards, and 5.7 TDs.

For comparison, Kupp averaged 4.9 catches (7.9 targets), 61.4 yards, and 0.4 TDs per outing. Nacua’s per-game PPR output dipped 33% when he and Kupp shared the field.

In the WC Playoff Round game, Nacua had 9-181-1 on 10 targets while playing 49 snaps (84%.)

Kupp went 5-27-0 on 9 targets and saw 58 snaps (100%.)

Kupp also wasn't healthy all year. He may even get hurt this year, but if he doesn't his numbers will be closer to Puka.

Yeah for sure, the bull case for Kupp is he was never healthy in 2024; from TC through the playoffs.

The bear case is that injuries have impacted his fantasy value in the majority of seasons he’s played.

 

[jm192]

I don't feel confident he stays healthy.
I don't feel confident the volume is where it needs to be for him to get back into the top 12.

FBG has him at 14th in PPR rankings. That's way too rich for me.
Fantasypros has him at WR19 in PPR rankings.

I'm probably closer to WR24 or 25.

If he was 31 and didn't have Puka taking targets, I could get more on board with maybe him having another massive season. As it stands, I Think he's going to be closer to 85 for 1100 than 120 for 1500

 

[msudaisy26]

I don't feel confident he stays healthy.
I don't feel confident the volume is where it needs to be for him to get back into the top 12.

FBG has him at 14th in PPR rankings. That's way too rich for me.
Fantasypros has him at WR19 in PPR rankings.

I'm probably closer to WR24 or 25.

If he was 31 and didn't have Puka taking targets, I could get more on board with maybe him having another massive season. As it stands, I Think he's going to be closer to 85 for 1100 than 120 for 1500

85 for 1100 and 8ish tds would be a top 12 wr.

 

[zamboni]

I don't feel confident he stays healthy.
I don't feel confident the volume is where it needs to be for him to get back into the top 12.

FBG has him at 14th in PPR rankings. That's way too rich for me.
Fantasypros has him at WR19 in PPR rankings.

I'm probably closer to WR24 or 25.

If he was 31 and didn't have Puka taking targets, I could get more on board with maybe him having another massive season. As it stands, I Think he's going to be closer to 85 for 1100 than 120 for 1500

85 for 1100 and 8ish tds would be a top 12 wr.

I’d do cartwheels if he was my WR2/3 and put up those numbers.

 

[jm192]

I don't feel confident he stays healthy.
I don't feel confident the volume is where it needs to be for him to get back into the top 12.

FBG has him at 14th in PPR rankings. That's way too rich for me.
Fantasypros has him at WR19 in PPR rankings.

I'm probably closer to WR24 or 25.

If he was 31 and didn't have Puka taking targets, I could get more on board with maybe him having another massive season. As it stands, I Think he's going to be closer to 85 for 1100 than 120 for 1500

85 for 1100 and 8ish tds would be a top 12 wr.

The 85 for 1100 assumes a full season. I don't have a lot confidence he does that.
8 TD's COULD happen. But he's had more than 6 TD's twice in his career. You can certainly argue what his TD's would have been if not for injury--but you're still having to embrace the injury side of the debate.

But as far as "He could be top 12." Sure. But if you're saying 1100 and 8 gets me there: I think there are a lot of guys that can get there with less age/injury concerns. Devonta Smith has averaged 88 for 1130 and 7 TD's over the last 2 years. Amari Cooper has averaged 1200 and 7 over the last 2 years; is a year younger, doesn't have another star pass catcher, and hasn't missed nearly the time Kupp has.

So, if we're saying Kupp "Could" get back into the top 12. Sure. Lots of people could finish top 12.
Do I feel confident in it for Kupp? Not really.

 

[msudaisy26]

I don't feel confident he stays healthy.
I don't feel confident the volume is where it needs to be for him to get back into the top 12.

FBG has him at 14th in PPR rankings. That's way too rich for me.
Fantasypros has him at WR19 in PPR rankings.

I'm probably closer to WR24 or 25.

If he was 31 and didn't have Puka taking targets, I could get more on board with maybe him having another massive season. As it stands, I Think he's going to be closer to 85 for 1100 than 120 for 1500

85 for 1100 and 8ish tds would be a top 12 wr.

The 85 for 1100 assumes a full season. I don't have a lot confidence he does that.
8 TD's COULD happen. But he's had more than 6 TD's twice in his career. You can certainly argue what his TD's would have been if not for injury--but you're still having to embrace the injury side of the debate.

But as far as "He could be top 12." Sure. But if you're saying 1100 and 8 gets me there: I think there are a lot of guys that can get there with less age/injury concerns. Devonta Smith has averaged 88 for 1130 and 7 TD's over the last 2 years. Amari Cooper has averaged 1200 and 7 over the last 2 years; is a year younger, doesn't have another star pass catcher, and hasn't missed nearly the time Kupp has.

So, if we're saying Kupp "Could" get back into the top 12. Sure. Lots of people could finish top 12.
Do I feel confident in it for Kupp? Not really.

His injury concerns are baked into his price. That is why he is going in the 3rd and 4th round of drafts and not the 1st or 2nd.

 

[jm192]

I don't feel confident he stays healthy.
I don't feel confident the volume is where it needs to be for him to get back into the top 12.

FBG has him at 14th in PPR rankings. That's way too rich for me.
Fantasypros has him at WR19 in PPR rankings.

I'm probably closer to WR24 or 25.

If he was 31 and didn't have Puka taking targets, I could get more on board with maybe him having another massive season. As it stands, I Think he's going to be closer to 85 for 1100 than 120 for 1500

85 for 1100 and 8ish tds would be a top 12 wr.

The 85 for 1100 assumes a full season. I don't have a lot confidence he does that.
8 TD's COULD happen. But he's had more than 6 TD's twice in his career. You can certainly argue what his TD's would have been if not for injury--but you're still having to embrace the injury side of the debate.

But as far as "He could be top 12." Sure. But if you're saying 1100 and 8 gets me there: I think there are a lot of guys that can get there with less age/injury concerns. Devonta Smith has averaged 88 for 1130 and 7 TD's over the last 2 years. Amari Cooper has averaged 1200 and 7 over the last 2 years; is a year younger, doesn't have another star pass catcher, and hasn't missed nearly the time Kupp has.

So, if we're saying Kupp "Could" get back into the top 12. Sure. Lots of people could finish top 12.
Do I feel confident in it for Kupp? Not really.

His injury concerns are baked into his price. That is why he is going in the 3rd and 4th round of drafts and not the 1st or 2nd.

Can you clearly explain to me what you think Kupp does stat wise and finish wise?

1. On one hand, you say he has a path to finishing top 12.
2. I offer up projections for 85 for 1100--and you say with enough TD's, that could be top 12.
3. I offer up guys like Smith and Amari Cooper who are already giving you those numbers with less injury risk
4. You tell me that Kupp would be going in the 1st or 2nd round if not for the injury concern.

So at first you're saying he COULD still be a top 12 finisher. Then you're saying he's really a 1st or 2nd rounder, which suggests you are VERY confident he'll finish top 12. It would seem to me if you think he's a 1st or 2nd round talent--you're expecting ~1300-1400 yards, no? But I don't expect that. Do you think he's going for another massive season at age 31 with Puka taking targets? I think he's a very talented player. But he certainly benefited from little target competition on the roster.

His 17 game pace last year: 84, 1044, 7.

I said upstream, I'd guess 85 for 1100. I'd go 6 or 7 TD's assuming a full season. That's Amari Cooper production. That's Devonta Smith production. So I think the 3rd or 4th round price tag is probably in line with the expected production. I don't think there's actually some big discount.

Again, You say "Cooper Kupp has a path to being top 12" Yeah. But so does Amari. So does Devonta. So does Waddle.

 

[msudaisy26]

I don't feel confident he stays healthy.
I don't feel confident the volume is where it needs to be for him to get back into the top 12.

FBG has him at 14th in PPR rankings. That's way too rich for me.
Fantasypros has him at WR19 in PPR rankings.

I'm probably closer to WR24 or 25.

If he was 31 and didn't have Puka taking targets, I could get more on board with maybe him having another massive season. As it stands, I Think he's going to be closer to 85 for 1100 than 120 for 1500

85 for 1100 and 8ish tds would be a top 12 wr.

The 85 for 1100 assumes a full season. I don't have a lot confidence he does that.
8 TD's COULD happen. But he's had more than 6 TD's twice in his career. You can certainly argue what his TD's would have been if not for injury--but you're still having to embrace the injury side of the debate.

But as far as "He could be top 12." Sure. But if you're saying 1100 and 8 gets me there: I think there are a lot of guys that can get there with less age/injury concerns. Devonta Smith has averaged 88 for 1130 and 7 TD's over the last 2 years. Amari Cooper has averaged 1200 and 7 over the last 2 years; is a year younger, doesn't have another star pass catcher, and hasn't missed nearly the time Kupp has.

So, if we're saying Kupp "Could" get back into the top 12. Sure. Lots of people could finish top 12.
Do I feel confident in it for Kupp? Not really.

His injury concerns are baked into his price. That is why he is going in the 3rd and 4th round of drafts and not the 1st or 2nd.

Can you clearly explain to me what you think Kupp does stat wise and finish wise?

1. On one hand, you say he has a path to finishing top 12.
2. I offer up projections for 85 for 1100--and you say with enough TD's, that could be top 12.
3. I offer up guys like Smith and Amari Cooper who are already giving you those numbers with less injury risk
4. You tell me that Kupp would be going in the 1st or 2nd round if not for the injury concern.

So at first you're saying he COULD still be a top 12 finisher. Then you're saying he's really a 1st or 2nd rounder, which suggests you are VERY confident he'll finish top 12. It would seem to me if you think he's a 1st or 2nd round talent--you're expecting ~1300-1400 yards, no? But I don't expect that. Do you think he's going for another massive season at age 31 with Puka taking targets? I think he's a very talented player. But he certainly benefited from little target competition on the roster.

His 17 game pace last year: 84, 1044, 7.

I said upstream, I'd guess 85 for 1100. I'd go 6 or 7 TD's assuming a full season. That's Amari Cooper production. That's Devonta Smith production. So I think the 3rd or 4th round price tag is probably in line with the expected production. I don't think there's actually some big discount.

Again, You say "Cooper Kupp has a path to being top 12" Yeah. But so does Amari. So does Devonta. So does Waddle.

I don't get it. Where did I say those guys couldn't finish as a top 12 wr? Those guys have issues too. Last year Kupp played hurt, the two years before when he was healthy he averaged over 100 yards and close to a td per game. Neither of those guys have the ceiling Kupp has.