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WR DeAndre Hopkins, TEN (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Eminence
- Start date
farfromforgotten
Footballguy
Don’t we all, Nuk. Don’t we all.
greenmountaingoat
Footballguy
I roster him in one of my leagues and I have to say, I would cry real tears of happiness if he goes to KC.
Insein
Footballguy
Was he on camera taking boxes?
Pigskin Fanatic
Footballguy
of all the head scratchers. 22.6M dead cap per Sportrac compared with 19.4M cash he woulda been paid for '23. Dead cap down to 11.3M next year. I mean, the writing was on the wall, but really no one wanted to trade for him?
that's bold strategy cotton, let's see if it works out for them.
that's bold strategy cotton, let's see if it works out for them.
ChiefD
Footballguy
KC will have to do some maneuvering. They are talking about restructuring and extending Chris Jones. The Chiefs have 51 million in cap room for NEXT year. So they could create some money this year for Jones and then sign Hopkins.
It's possible. Not sure they will do it. My gut tells me not a chance.
Pigskin Fanatic
Footballguy
quoting myself like the cool people. having second thoughts now seeing that number, is he still good enough to be a $20M guy this year? I'm not sure and not for a team who isn't ready for a run like AZ. as a fantasy owner i hope he goes to KC also, but that salary might need to be about half or a little more than half.
Terpman22
Footballguy
Gannon starting off on fire in AZ!
zamboni
Footballguy
I was thinking KC, New England or Green Bay. Would be a great addition for Jordan Love, in particular.
People will speculate he's declined but I think it's more complex.
When BOB traded him away for a second years ago I was like most people who thought it was a horrible deal but the part about the deal I thought was so bad was they took on David Johnson's contract. It's not like O'Brien only called one team which means years ago no one wanted to pay much for Hopkins. Why? He does not like to practice is one reason I know about and paying him what he wanted was the other. There may be other issues, I know Michael Lombardi has been hinting at "stuff" with him for a few months but I don't think it's anything overly bad. Might just be his lack of wanting to practice.
So I don't think he's declined much, just not a deep threat who strikes fear into defenses who does not like to practice and wants to be paid a lot.
Not sure where he'll go. KC and Buffalo seem like favorites as been mentioned. A few months ago when he first got put on the block there was a report he wanted to go to Jax or the Chargers but those teams have no need and/or money. NE has need but the BOB factor seems like a no go. Re-uniting with Watson seems like a no go with money they are paying Cooper. I think OBJ has more in the tank then most but I'll say and still say I think the Ravens should have got Hopkins instead, but not sure they can take on that financial obligation now. Giants could use a WR like him but he does not like to practice which I think won't sit with Daboll. Lions on a one year deal to help compensate for Jameson? Not sure he fits the new culture because again no practice.
Carolina actually makes the most sense to me, but I've not heard any credible reports of interest.
When BOB traded him away for a second years ago I was like most people who thought it was a horrible deal but the part about the deal I thought was so bad was they took on David Johnson's contract. It's not like O'Brien only called one team which means years ago no one wanted to pay much for Hopkins. Why? He does not like to practice is one reason I know about and paying him what he wanted was the other. There may be other issues, I know Michael Lombardi has been hinting at "stuff" with him for a few months but I don't think it's anything overly bad. Might just be his lack of wanting to practice.
So I don't think he's declined much, just not a deep threat who strikes fear into defenses who does not like to practice and wants to be paid a lot.
Not sure where he'll go. KC and Buffalo seem like favorites as been mentioned. A few months ago when he first got put on the block there was a report he wanted to go to Jax or the Chargers but those teams have no need and/or money. NE has need but the BOB factor seems like a no go. Re-uniting with Watson seems like a no go with money they are paying Cooper. I think OBJ has more in the tank then most but I'll say and still say I think the Ravens should have got Hopkins instead, but not sure they can take on that financial obligation now. Giants could use a WR like him but he does not like to practice which I think won't sit with Daboll. Lions on a one year deal to help compensate for Jameson? Not sure he fits the new culture because again no practice.
Carolina actually makes the most sense to me, but I've not heard any credible reports of interest.
Amused to Death
Footballguy
Philly could use a slot receiver. Didn't Hopkins recently say Hurts was one of the QBs he'd like to play for? Dak wasn't on his list.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Why is it always those two teams? Kind of reminds me when NE was supposed to get everyone.
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Terpman22
Footballguy
Bc he just released a "Top 5 QB's he'd like to play with" list this week, and those 2 teams were in there and have what appears to be needs at the position.
I don't see Philly or Dallas.
Philadelphia is cognizant of the need to satisfy AJB, Devonta on Goedert on what is already not a huge volume of passes. My guess is they would view the potential to wreck the chemistry as more of a negative then adding him. A high volume possession WR is exactly what this team does not need.
Dallas no because Lamb does the same things and they already have a large commitment financially to Cooks and Gallup, as well as about to extend Lamb. But main thing is he and Lamb are to similar IMO in areas they win.
Philadelphia is cognizant of the need to satisfy AJB, Devonta on Goedert on what is already not a huge volume of passes. My guess is they would view the potential to wreck the chemistry as more of a negative then adding him. A high volume possession WR is exactly what this team does not need.
Dallas no because Lamb does the same things and they already have a large commitment financially to Cooks and Gallup, as well as about to extend Lamb. But main thing is he and Lamb are to similar IMO in areas they win.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Let’s not forget he isn’t the same Hopkins either.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Hopkins cap charges over the next two seasons at age 31 and 32 were set to be $30 MM and 25 MM. I can see why they cut bait, and obviously, they decided to take the full $21 MM dead cap hit this year, rather than spread $11 MM of that into next year by designating this as a June 1 transaction. Can't hate on the logic here, if you decide your team isn't going to contend in 2023, and if no one else wanted to touch that existing deal. Probably also ran into the the Derek Carr dilemma of the entire league knowing they were eager to offload him, so perhaps they all just waited to try to get him free of draft capital expenditure.
As for salary offset language... His 2023 $19MM salary was not guaranteed, so the Cards are free of that entirely, and there is nothing to offset. The $21 MM dead cap acceleration is entirely from prior bonus prorations. There won't be any subsidizing of his next contract by Arizona. Any team that signs him, will have to pay his full current market value, whatever that now is, unless of course he chooses to accept less than, in order to play for a preferred org.
As for salary offset language... His 2023 $19MM salary was not guaranteed, so the Cards are free of that entirely, and there is nothing to offset. The $21 MM dead cap acceleration is entirely from prior bonus prorations. There won't be any subsidizing of his next contract by Arizona. Any team that signs him, will have to pay his full current market value, whatever that now is, unless of course he chooses to accept less than, in order to play for a preferred org.
MAC_32
Footballguy
Dallas and contender in the same sentence was not something I expected to read today.
LawFitz
Footballguy
I think the league isn't forgetting this, even if we are to some degree. Maybe he resurrects in his early thirties playing for a better team. I could see that, but it probably won't be because he is the same player he was in his prime, which was how many years ago now in terms of on-field production?
Terpman22
Footballguy
He averaged 7 catches/79 yards per game last year
Amused to Death
Footballguy
Hopkins recently named QBs/teams he'd like to play for - Bills, Eagles, Chiefs, Chargers, and Ravens. Of those teams, the ones with the most cap space is the Eagles, Chargers, and Ravens. And the Ravens just committed $15 mil to OBJ.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
All I know is he had 700 yards and 3 TDs. He didn’t look like Hopkins to me.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
….and the last sentence explains their foolishness.
LawFitz
Footballguy
His YPR has been in a declining pattern since his rookie year... 15.4, 15.9, 13.7, 12.2, 14.4, 13.7, 11.2, 12.2, 13.6, 11.2. This is without the context of health and quality of team around him, so take with a big salt grain. That said, as a 31+ year-old, I'd expect his body to be in decline (from prime) and he will have to make up for that with extra savvy (he was always super savvy, so not high on him becoming even moreso now) + a better opportunity set (TBD, based on where he signs).
To be perfectly clear though, I'm not suggesting he's a bum or on track to be the next Allen Robinson. Just not optimistic he's going to step into a new situation now and rekindle 2017-18 Hopkins when he was not only getting 150+ targets, but was balling out with them to the tune of 13-14+ YPR and double digit TDs.
Terpman22
Footballguy
....in 9 games, which projects to....119/1343/5
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
I'm thinking Bills and Chiefs if he wants to win and will take a discount.
Otherwise, Patriots in play.
Lions in play with the Jameson suspension.
Maybe Broncos with a trade of Sutton/Jeudy.
Otherwise, Patriots in play.
Lions in play with the Jameson suspension.
Maybe Broncos with a trade of Sutton/Jeudy.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Maybe he just wants to count his money and drink.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Your proration also implies 181 targets. I'll safely take the under on that for 2023.
Amused to Death
Footballguy
How much of a discount? KC currently has under $700k in cap space and the Bills are under $1.5 mil. Either team would have to clear out some space.
Terpman22
Footballguy
For sure, he won't be seeing that many, but if he is the #2 on an offense like Bills/Chiefs, it sure will be north of 100 and should still put up pretty good numbers, although, yeah it won't be a 100/1300/10 season probably.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Can DHop be a solid NFL (and fantasy) WR2 next year and beyond for a good offense? Yes.
Does he still have the upside to be an alpha 1A or even a stud 1B? I am not sure he does, but I'll wait until seeing where he signs before jumping to conclusions. I do think the cards (no pun) are pretty heavily stacked against him ever again being the stud he was in his prime years of 2015, 2017 and 2018.
Does he still have the upside to be an alpha 1A or even a stud 1B? I am not sure he does, but I'll wait until seeing where he signs before jumping to conclusions. I do think the cards (no pun) are pretty heavily stacked against him ever again being the stud he was in his prime years of 2015, 2017 and 2018.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
There's always money in the banana stand.
But yeah, it would have to be a combination of restructuring and a somewhat tempting discount on his end to make it worth their while I would think. It's also possible that the actual market value in 2023 doesn't match the name.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
It's possible. Are my Alec Pierce shares safe for 2023? Would the Colts give any thoughts to giving AR another veteran target if De-Hop's options aren't as robust as what some are assuming?
JohnnyU
Footballguy
I hope he ends up playing for anyone but a contender. Not that I dislike Hopkins, I just dislike the contenders
2 teams not mentioned that make sense to me are Detroit and NYG.
Both teams fancy themselves contenders, and have middling QBs who could really use a perimeter WR (especially in light of Jameson's suspension)
Adding Waller and Hopkins would really make the Giants offense more dangerous. Adding Hopkins outside with Amon-Ra inside and eventually Williams would really stress a defense with Gibbs in the backfield.
ETA: I think Hopkins is more of a high-end #2 at this point, but he probably doesn't. I wonder how much he cares about playing for a contender vs who pays the most?
Both teams fancy themselves contenders, and have middling QBs who could really use a perimeter WR (especially in light of Jameson's suspension)
Adding Waller and Hopkins would really make the Giants offense more dangerous. Adding Hopkins outside with Amon-Ra inside and eventually Williams would really stress a defense with Gibbs in the backfield.
ETA: I think Hopkins is more of a high-end #2 at this point, but he probably doesn't. I wonder how much he cares about playing for a contender vs who pays the most?
Zow
Footballguy
What more did you expect out of him last year? He was very productive especially considering his poor the qb play was on his team.
