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WR Kadarius Toney, KC (1 Viewer)

BobbyLayne said:
who is going to waste a pick on a guy that hits double digits 3x a season?
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I'm down for it because I don't agree with your assessment of his talent and skills.

His ADP in FFPC early BB contest right now is WR44, mid 9th. I'll bet on talent in that range for the upside and hope that a full off-season with one of the best training staffs in the league can help him on his injuries.
 
menobrown said:
habsfan said:
I'm still not sure if he is a receiver who also gets a handful of plays designed for him or a "gadget" player who also catches some passes.
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I think it's both and the Percy Harvin comps are spot on.
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I personally disagree here, and will go back to what I mentioned when he was a prospect.

The Gators tried to use him as a Percy Harvin clone with a bunch of gadget plays and he sucked. Then they switched to using him as a more prototypical receiver and he was awesome.

The few gadget plays that worked out made for fun highlights, so that's what draft media showed, and everyone just assumed he was another Harvin (plus you can't disregard the size and jersey # similarities for people watching). But again, his actual success in college came as a regular WR and not as a gadget guy.

His couple big games he had with the Giants he was used as a regular receiver, running regular NFL routes, not trick/gadget stuff.

I don't know if the Chiefs see him more of a gadget guy or if it's just been that when he's new to the team (and with all the time missed) they try and draw up a few trick plays for him since they haven't been able to incorporate him into the regular offense yet. Remember that's how they started with Tyreek as well until they worked him fully into the system and stopped using him for gadget plays.
 
menobrown said:
BobbyLayne said:
who is going to waste a pick on a guy that hits double digits 3x a season?
Click to expand...
I'm down for it because I don't agree with your assessment of his talent and skills.

His ADP in FFPC early BB contest right now is WR44, mid 9th. I'll bet on talent in that range for the upside and hope that a full off-season with one of the best training staffs in the league can help him on his injuries.
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yeah I'm sure his incredible work ethic will pay huge dividends
 
FreeBaGeL said:
menobrown said:
habsfan said:
I'm still not sure if he is a receiver who also gets a handful of plays designed for him or a "gadget" player who also catches some passes.
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I think it's both and the Percy Harvin comps are spot on.
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I personally disagree here, and will go back to what I mentioned when he was a prospect.

The Gators tried to use him as a Percy Harvin clone with a bunch of gadget plays and he sucked. Then they switched to using him as a more prototypical receiver and he was awesome.

The few gadget plays that worked out made for fun highlights, so that's what draft media showed, and everyone just assumed he was another Harvin (plus you can't disregard the size and jersey # similarities for people watching). But again, his actual success in college came as a regular WR and not as a gadget guy.

His couple big games he had with the Giants he was used as a regular receiver, running regular NFL routes, not trick/gadget stuff.

I don't know if the Chiefs see him more of a gadget guy or if it's just been that when he's new to the team (and with all the time missed) they try and draw up a few trick plays for him since they haven't been able to incorporate him into the regular offense yet. Remember that's how they started with Tyreek as well until they worked him fully into the system and stopped using him for gadget plays.
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It's ok to disagree but I think in the NFL he's shown both the ability to be used a gadget player and as a regular receiver. He's extremely versatile and can be used in a variety of ways, that's what makes him so potentially valuable.
 
I’m hoping to use his couple of highlight plays from the SB to trade him away this off-season. Someone else can try to figure out which games he’ll be healthy enough to play.
 
joey said:
I’m hoping to use his couple of highlight plays from the SB to trade him away this off-season. Someone else can try to figure out which games he’ll be healthy enough to play.
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ditto
I thankfully have him in only a single dynasty league and there there is a chief's fan in the league that likes to accumulate chief's players. So i think i can sell him.

I would take a 3rd, but i will try for a 2nd.
 
How well did that trade work out for KC?

Gave up a 3rd and a 6th.

Toney scores a touchdown and has a huge punt return to set up another.
If he never plays another game, they'd have to be happy with that trade.
 
Skyy Moore muddies this all as well, imo. 4.3 speed, bucket sized hands, he was mostly learning the system this year, but as far as receiving goes he did pretty well with the targets thrown his way. He of course had some drops on the KO/P returns but had a good one in the conference game.

They’ve had very similar usage when both are fit. I think they’ll both be vying to carve out a role next season, and I wonder if across a full camp and pre season, Moore with his better track record of fitness and draft capital might win out in the end.
 
jm192 said:
How well did that trade work out for KC?

Gave up a 3rd and a 6th.

Toney scores a touchdown and has a huge punt return to set up another.
If he never plays another game, they'd have to be happy with that trade.
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I don’t think teams should give up a third and a sixth for a punt returner. Determining how well the trade worked out for KC and NYG isn’t possible for a couple of seasons.
 
TartanLion said:
Skyy Moore muddies this all as well, imo. 4.3 speed, bucket sized hands, he was mostly learning the system this year, but as far as receiving goes he did pretty well with the targets thrown his way. He of course had some drops on the KO/P returns but had a good one in the conference game.

They’ve had very similar usage when both are fit. I think they’ll both be vying to carve out a role next season, and I wonder if across a full camp and pre season, Moore with his better track record of fitness and draft capital might win out in the end.
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I'm trying to figure out if KC is just going to be a team without a fantasy WR1 for a few seasons. There doesn't seem to be that one receiver you can pencil in for 1,200 yds/8 TDs. I understand that 'penciled-in guy' is pretty much Kelce's role, but he and Tyreek Hill were also fantasy starters simultaneously ... so that offense can feed two elites.
 
DocHolliday said:
jm192 said:
How well did that trade work out for KC?

Gave up a 3rd and a 6th.

Toney scores a touchdown and has a huge punt return to set up another.
If he never plays another game, they'd have to be happy with that trade.
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I don’t think teams should give up a third and a sixth for a punt returner. Determining how well the trade worked out for KC and NYG isn’t possible for a couple of seasons.
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Nah, jm192 already summed it up. There is a chance without him they don't win the SB. For a third and a 6 that's not a chance I think KC would ever take. Whether this works out for the Giants or not is another story, KC already won.
 
Dr. Octopus said:
MTskibum said:
I would take a 3rd, but i will try for a 2nd.
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Why would you rather have a third round pick than a guy that has shown the ability to be a star at this level? I get his lack of availability can be frustrating, but there's a far greater likelihood that Toney learns to play "injured" than a third round rookie pick returning stud value.
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agreed. For a 3rd I keep him. For a 2nd I might keep him as well. But packaging up my 2nd and Toney to move into the late 1st…thats more what I’m talking about.
 

Chiefs coach Andy Reid said both Kadarius Toney and Skyy Moore "will probably have bigger roles" next season.​

With both JuJu Smith-Schuster and Mecole Hardman hitting free agency, most of the beat reporter buzz has been that the Chiefs will likely have to choose between the two of them. Toney and Moore figure to have expanded roles. It would probably make the most sense to let Hardman walk since the Chiefs sort of shoehorned Toney into his role to begin with. It's also possible that the Chiefs do more with both of these players in the screen game with Clyde Edwards-Helaire reportedly a candidate to be traded and Jerick McKinnon also hitting free agency.
RELATED:
SOURCE: Nate Taylor on Twitter
Feb 28, 2023, 3:07 PM ET
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Chiefs GM Brett Veach said "I don’t know if there is a limit on [Kadarius Toney's] game because he has a vertical game."​

“It’s a fair question to [ask]: ‘Has he ever played with a quarterback that likes to push the ball down the field?’ We have a lot of high hopes for him. He was a first-round pick for a reason. There’s a reason why we traded for him and we felt like he was first-round talent," Veach continued. The Chiefs added Rashee Rice in the draft but did not add the kind of high-target JuJu Smith-Schuster replacement that would keep Toney from blossoming in Kansas City's passing game. Toney will, yet again, be a WR3 pick with a lot of upside in 2023 drafts.
SOURCE: ESPN
May 7, 2023, 4:30 PM ET
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Faust said:

Chiefs GM Brett Veach said "I don’t know if there is a limit on [Kadarius Toney's] game because he has a vertical game."​

“It’s a fair question to [ask]: ‘Has he ever played with a quarterback that likes to push the ball down the field?’ We have a lot of high hopes for him. He was a first-round pick for a reason. There’s a reason why we traded for him and we felt like he was first-round talent," Veach continued. The Chiefs added Rashee Rice in the draft but did not add the kind of high-target JuJu Smith-Schuster replacement that would keep Toney from blossoming in Kansas City's passing game. Toney will, yet again, be a WR3 pick with a lot of upside in 2023 drafts.
SOURCE: ESPN
May 7, 2023, 4:30 PM ET
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His limit is his brain, not his body’s vertical game.
 
[QUOTE="JetMaxx, post: 24501224, member:
[/QUOTE]
His limit is his brain, not his body’s vertical game.
[/QUOTE]
And his made up maybe not made up injuries.
 
Drake Hater said:
His ADP position leading up to the season will be an interesting one.
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Even if he flashes in the preseason I'm not sure he'll climb too much. The fans and haters mostly have their minds made up already. Everyone knows he's electric but some will never trust him to be healthy.

I like him as a 4th wideout to use when he's looking good and has a plus matchup. As much as I love watching him I'd feel uneasy having to depend on him every week.
 
Apple Juice said:
Even if he flashes in the preseason I'm not sure he'll climb too much. The fans and haters mostly have their minds made up already. Everyone knows he's electric but some will never trust him to be healthy.
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If he flashes in the preseason on this offense watch out.

The hype machine just may push him to win over fans/haters, esp if they haven't been burned by him before. Those of us that have been burned know better but that potential ceiling will be a siren song that could elevate his ADP higher than it should be.
 
dipandglide said:
skillz said:
kface said:
If he breaks it's going to make my season.
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By “break” are you talking break out or break (as in get hurt again)? Both are plausible outcomes with this guy.
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This narrative is why he's a buy. This is all I hear. I remember the same thing being said about CMC and Barkley before last year too. Injury variance happens to anyone.
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Fred Taylor was a poster child for being "injury prone," until 2002-2004 when he started 46 consecutive games. That dude was a baller though. I'm gonna watch Fred Taylor highlights now.
 

Fred Taylor was a poster child for being "injury prone," until 2002-2004 when he started 46 consecutive games. That dude was a baller though. I'm gonna watch Fred Taylor highlights now.
[/QUOTE]
One of all time faves. Will be watching highlights as well at second period intermission.
 
What is the politically correct way to say someone is so lacking in intelligence that it will inhibit his ability to maximize his competitive athletic performance?
 
This guy has a high probability to sink me on draft night. Big league is an auction draft and I know at least one other guy who's high on him. Feel like if I get him, he duds. The other guy gets him, and he explodes.
 
joey said:
pinkstapler said:
JetMaxx said:
What is the politically correct way to say someone is so lacking in intelligence that it will inhibit his ability to maximize his competitive athletic performance?
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Who is Josh Gordon?
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Do you mean XFL Star Wide Receiver, Josh Gordon?
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If he's the same one who pissed away 5+ years of his prime and uncountable millions of dollars cause he had to keep smoking weed, yes that would be him lol. I'm sure he's having fun catching passes from Ben DiNucci now tho 🤣
 
Start-up draft, 16 teams, end of 7th:
Toney or Dotson?
Toney or Monty?
Toney or Chig (TE-P)
Toney or James Cook?

Targeting a WR here & 4 picks away so no guarantee of any of these choices - just crowdsourcing opinions. TIA
 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
Start-up draft, 16 teams, end of 7th:
Toney or Dotson?
Toney or Monty?
Toney or Chig (TE-P)
Toney or James Cook?

Targeting a WR here & 4 picks away so no guarantee of any of these choices - just crowdsourcing opinions. TIA
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Dotson for me, *maybe* followed by Toney if I was looking hard at WR, just hard to trust this guy so I'd be looking for any other WR in his range I think, though I do think he could put it all together this year, just so risky cause the floor is zero.
 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
Start-up draft, 16 teams, end of 7th:
Toney or Dotson?
Toney or Monty?
Toney or Chig (TE-P)
Toney or James Cook?

Targeting a WR here & 4 picks away so no guarantee of any of these choices - just crowdsourcing opinions. TIA
Click to expand...

Dotson or Chig for me depending on roster construction.

Toney has had multiple injuries and would be a hard pass for me in traditional dynasty.
 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
Start-up draft, 16 teams, end of 7th:
Toney or Dotson?
Toney or Monty?
Toney or Chig (TE-P)
Toney or James Cook?

Targeting a WR here & 4 picks away so no guarantee of any of these choices - just crowdsourcing opinions. TIA
Click to expand...
Dotson will be like hitting a single that maybe you can stretch to second base.

Toney is the swing for the fences homerun whose value I think will explode next season if he's healthy. Obviously no small "if". Things change though and he seems dialed in now.

I'd swing for the fences myself but I also don't play 16 team leagues so maybe a more reliable piece/depth is more critical. If Toney makes you nervous I think you just need to get to like week 2-3 of him being healthy and you can move on at a sizeable profit because I expect him to be huge out of the gate.
 
menobrown said:
Toney is the swing for the fences homerun whose value I think will explode next season if he's healthy. Obviously no small "if". Things change though and he seems dialed in now.

I'd swing for the fences myself but I also don't play 16 team leagues so maybe a more reliable piece/depth is more critical. If Toney makes you nervous I think you just need to get to like week 2-3 of him being healthy and you can move on at a sizeable profit because I expect him to be huge out of the gate.
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This is my current philosophy.

I started with Mahomes, Lamb, AJB, Stevenson, Maxx Crosby (IDP) - all very safe.

My QB 2 Howell is a bit risk/reward

So kinda feeling like taking a shot on a breakout. It’s definitely risky.

If Toney hits his ceiling is what, top 5 WR? The stack is irrelevant, but fun nonetheless.

Missing Chig sucks, but there are 6 TE left I like, and more if I include rookies that we’re drafting separately.

4 picks to go. It’s been a looooong turn.
 

ESPN's Jeremy Fowler said the Chiefs believe Kadarius Toney can be the "No. 1 type receiver" they're looking for this season.​

This news comes on the heels of Fowler's appearance on ESPN Radio, where he discussed the possibility of the Chiefs signing DeAndre Hopkins. Fowler noted that while the Chiefs are interested in signing Hopkins, their confidence in Toney could prohibit them from being as aggressive as other teams on the market for Hopkins' services. Toney's explosiveness has never been in question, but the former first-rounder has struggled to stay healthy through his first two seasons. If he's able to play a near-full slate of games in 2023, his upside while tethered to Patrick Mahomes could make him a screaming value in fantasy.
SOURCE: Jeremy Fowler on ESPN
May 29, 2023, 12:16 PM ET
Click to expand...
 

Speaking Thursday, Chiefs OC Matt Nagy praised Kadarius Toney's ability with the ball in his hands. ​

“He’s super talented with the football in his hands, and he’s been that way his entire life in his football career," was Nagy's exact quote. It came in the context of Nagy talking about Toney being more prepared for 2023 now that he knows the "ins and outs" of the Chiefs' system. "He was able to do that, and it’s exciting now for us to be able to take that to Year 2 and build that relationship with (Patrick Mahomes)," Nagy said. Toney has been the subject of a steady drumbeat of offseason hype, but that's nothing new. He is one of this year's most volatile WR3s.
SOURCE: Arrowhead Pride
Jun 1, 2023, 4:51 PM ET
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