WR Michael Thomas, NO (1 Viewer)

[ericttspikes]

There was also a clause in the contract that if he passed his physical on or around April 21 it would trigger a $5 million signing bonus and guarantee his base salary for the year. Anybody hear anything about passing it? Not seeing anything about him passing a physical in April.

Nothing came out in local media about this April 21st physical one way or the other. IMHO, he either didn't take the April physical or else he took it and didn't pass it. The circumstantial evidence is that Michael Thomas was not a full go for team OTAs last month.

https://www.si.com/nfl/saints/news/saints-michael-thomas-ota

Takeaways from Week 3 of Saints OTAs: Mike Thomas makes presence felt in return

Veteran receiver Michael Thomas was a notable new attendee at the New Orleans Saints’ offseason workouts Tuesday.

www.nola.com

Thanks. I had seen some recent articles saying he got his $5 million signing bonus and guaranteed $, but didn't see any updates on the physical that was supposedly the trigger for that.

 

[Doug B]

Thanks. I had seen some recent articles saying he got his $5 million signing bonus and guaranteed $, but didn't see any updates on the physical that was supposedly the trigger for that.

Oh ... I hadn't seen anything about that $5 million bonus, actually. Not saying you didn't -- just saying information about all this stuff is hard to come by.

There are well-connected people over on SaintsReport who regularly get all kinds of minutiae about the team. But information about Michael Thomas seems to be locked down to an unusual level.

 

[massraider]

https://twitter.com/MikeTriplett/status/1638218533757673472

Here's some details on his deal.

Lot of incentives.

 

[titusbramble]

For redraft I'm getting the same sort of feel I had with Nuk this time last year, except with lower cost and potential reward. I could justify the draft and hold there if I can get a potential every week WR2+ like seemed realistic with Hopkins last year, but I doubt with Thomas if we ever get the sort of outcome where we get enough upside often enough to not just say "meh, it can be someone else's problem"

 

[massraider]

For redraft I'm getting the same sort of feel I had with Nuk this time last year, except with lower cost and potential reward. I could justify the draft and hold there if I can get a potential every week WR2+ like seemed realistic with Hopkins last year, but I doubt with Thomas if we ever get the sort of outcome where we get enough upside often enough to not just say "meh, it can be someone else's problem"

I was just looking at his ECR on Fantasy Pros.

Surprised by how high it was.

 

[TripItUp]

I was just looking at his ECR on Fantasy Pros.

Surprised by how high it was.

QB upgrade

Looked good in limited playing time

Health is the biggest question IMHO so the dart throw is justified IMHO

 

[massraider]

QB upgrade

Looked good in limited playing time

Health is the biggest question IMHO

Looking at the ranks, there aren't too many guys I take in front of him, so maybe WR50 is about right, I am just surprised there are that many believers.

It has been a long time since he was playing and healthy. There aren't a bunch of example of guys missing that much time, and coming back.

I own in two dynasties, so I am a hoper, not necessarily a believer.

 

[titusbramble]

I was just looking at his ECR on Fantasy Pros.

Surprised by how high it was.

QB upgrade

Looked good in limited playing time

Health is the biggest question IMHO so the dart throw is justified IMHO

Ok, what is the upside considering:

a) He is 30 already
b) The last three seasons have been basically complete write offs, it is not as if we are punting on someone who was hugely productive in 2021 then tore his ACL mid season in 2022
c) Carr may well be locking into Olave as the de facto WR1 early and often
d) Thomas has never had a huge TD season that can help to overcome possible lower volumes

Don't get me wrong, he was a phenomenal receiver at his peak, but I'm struggling to see how even if everything goes perfectly he is anything other than a WR3 with upside, which frankly are available on waivers every week of the season

 

[ericttspikes]

I was just looking at his ECR on Fantasy Pros.

Surprised by how high it was.

QB upgrade

Looked good in limited playing time

Health is the biggest question IMHO so the dart throw is justified IMHO

Ok, what is the upside considering:

a) He is 30 already
b) The last three seasons have been basically complete write offs, it is not as if we are punting on someone who was hugely productive in 2021 then tore his ACL mid season in 2022
c) Carr may well be locking into Olave as the de facto WR1 early and often
d) Thomas has never had a huge TD season that can help to overcome possible lower volumes

Don't get me wrong, he was a phenomenal receiver at his peak, but I'm struggling to see how even if everything goes perfectly he is anything other than a WR3 with upside, which frankly are available on waivers every week of the season

I feel his upside is what he showed last year when he was on the field for the first two full games he played, which was a top 10 WR those 2 weeks. He got hurt during the week 3 game and was still a top 15 WR over the first 3 weeks. Small sample size, but that is the level he was performing at relative to all other WRs playing at the beginning of last year. Health is the question, and he hasn't given anyone much optimism he can play anywhere near a full season, but I believe there is still talent there and at some point in a draft worth the risk he actually plays a meaningful amount of games in 23 vs. who else is available. I guess it depends on roster size, but I'd much rather draft Thomas as WR 5 and see what happens. Like you said, you can easily find a new WR 4 or 5 any week if it doesn't pan out.

 

[massraider]

I don't know this for sure, but my attitude about him is that I'll know if he's worth anything by Week 2.

 

[menobrown]

Thanks. I had seen some recent articles saying he got his $5 million signing bonus and guaranteed $, but didn't see any updates on the physical that was supposedly the trigger for that.

Don't know but in their last OTA he was listed as a non-participant but he was geared up, on the practice field doing individual work with the QB's. I don't think this would be allowed if he had not passed his physical.

 

[TripItUp]

Don't get me wrong, he was a phenomenal receiver at his peak, but I'm struggling to see how even if everything goes perfectly he is anything other than a WR3 with upside, which frankly are available on waivers every week of the season

Last year in limited action with a crap QB he had proved he has upside IMHO.

Huge QB upgrade and performance last year shouldn't be overlooked.

 

[menobrown]

I was just looking at his ECR on Fantasy Pros.

Surprised by how high it was.

QB upgrade

Looked good in limited playing time

Health is the biggest question IMHO so the dart throw is justified IMHO

Ok, what is the upside considering:

a) He is 30 already
b) The last three seasons have been basically complete write offs, it is not as if we are punting on someone who was hugely productive in 2021 then tore his ACL mid season in 2022
c) Carr may well be locking into Olave as the de facto WR1 early and often
d) Thomas has never had a huge TD season that can help to overcome possible lower volumes

Don't get me wrong, he was a phenomenal receiver at his peak, but I'm struggling to see how even if everything goes perfectly he is anything other than a WR3 with upside, which frankly are available on waivers every week of the season

Short story is he's never not been good. Was a highly productive rookie, 10 games he did manage to play the last 3 years was mainly good, has had solid success with every QB he's played with including Teddy B, Dalton and even Taysom which is pretty impressive.

The age is a factor, time away more so, if he's actually healthy is however the biggest issue going forward and really the key as I think he can overcome the other stuff.

I've been playing fantasy awhile and no player has bit me more like Thomas has done me the past 3 years, in dynasty and redraft. So I"m not trying to go overboard on him but for his cost I still like taking a some shots on a player who has again never not been good still being good. Sometimes a lot of fantasy owners need to see it first before they ever believe in a player. I guess I'm the opposite with Thomas, until I see him on a field failing to perform I'm having a hard time thinking he can't....again so long as he can actually get on the field.

 

[Doug B]

Don't know but in their last OTA he was listed as a non-participant but he was geared up, on the practice field doing individual work with the QB's. I don't think this would be allowed if he had not passed his physical.

I was looking at it the opposite way: Had he passed his physical, he'd have been a full go at OTAs. But your take makes sense to me.

...

Was kicking the "April 21st physical?" topic around over at SaintsReport ... and someone pointed out that Thomas had "hardware" (presumably screws?) removed from his foot -- from the repaired, previously-dislocated toe joint to be specific. This took place during the first week of May, as Dennis Allen told reporters on Saturday, May 13th that it had been about a week since Thomas had the hardware removed.

Here's a recent write-up about Thomas from the Saints' beat reporter with the Times-Picayune - from Friday, June 16th:

Michael Thomas​

All signs point to the veteran wide receiver being available to start training camp. Thomas has not practiced since Week 3 of last season when he suffered a dislocated toe in a game against the Carolina Panthers. He recently underwent a procedure to have hardware removed from the surgically repaired joint.​

​

Allen said the Saints have managed Thomas’ rehab schedule so that he is ready to return to the practice field for the start of camp. Thomas said recently he is ahead of schedule in his rehab.​

 

[Faust]

Saints head coach Dennis Allen said the team expects Michael Thomas (foot) to be a full participant at training camp.

Thomas, who has struggled with various foot and ankle injuries for the better part of three years, looks to finally be healthy headed into the 2023 season. If he’s fully back, Thomas, 30, would slot in as New Orleans’ No. 2 wideout behind second-year stud Chris Olave. Fantasy drafters could find value in Thomas if the Saints’ target distribution is a narrow one this year, with Olave and Thomas dominating looks from Derek Carr. Thomas’ health will be a constant concern for fantasy players and the Saints, however.

 

[Faust]

Saints WR Michael Thomas 'fine-tuning everything' as he moves closer to 100 percent 'every day'

 

[Faust]

Nick Underhill
DA said he felt like Mike Thomas got in and out of his cuts better the last 2 days and noted that he's still knocking off some rust.

Basically what everyone is saying. It's a process and he's ramping up. But ... Thomas performed better in joint practices here than GB last year.

https://twitter.com/nick_underhill/status/1692618492694991285?s=21

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Seems like a guy that no one wants to draft but will have to at some point.

 

[Birdie048]

Seems like a guy that no one wants to draft but will have to at some point.

Him or Rashid Shaheed? Who has more value or probability staying healthy & on the field??
Right now I am holding Shaheed, but roster cut down Sept 1 is coming. Him, Metchie or K Philips as last WR
MT might have a game or 2 but trusting him for a season is fools gold

 

[massraider]

MT might have a game or 2 but trusting him for a season is fools gold

I dunno that I have ever heard the full story about his injuries, so I am kind of intrigued in terms of price.

I don't think he's a top 24 WR, but if his foot is correct, his skills are the type to age well.

 

[need2know]

Never seen such a huge drop-off for a guy that started out so dominate

 

[menobrown]

MT might have a game or 2 but trusting him for a season is fools gold

I dunno that I have ever heard the full story about his injuries, so I am kind of intrigued in terms of price.

I don't think he's a top 24 WR, but if his foot is correct, his skills are the type to age well.

I think his foot, his toe and ankle specifically, is actually ok right now and I think it might actually hold up. And I say Ok from a health angle, not sure if issues exist that are sapping his ability to run even if he's healthy.

Problem is the rust. I'd add this is not anything remotely in the same orbit as something like Ridley missing a season and a half. Ridley was running and training at will during his time away. Thomas has played 3 games in 2 seasons and 10 in the last 3. So not only is his in-activity greater then Ridley's but a lot of that time he's been rehabbing ankle and toe surgeries and not able to really train and often probably not even be on his feet.

He looked rusty to me last season. For sure not the same MT. Was solid for fantasy mainly because of the TD's but looked a little clumsy at times. IIRC he did not participate in any pre-season games last year and only started practicing in full a little before the opener so it's all understandable he'd look rusty after taking a full year off and playing an abbreviated season the year prior but his footwork looked off, he still was not skunking you even if you took away the TD's.

That rust is now worse IMO(and based on reports) then it was last season.

If this was 99% of fantasy relevant WR's I'd move on and conclude he was toast. But this guy has done nothing but put up fantasy stats when he plays and I mean always and I'd stress that word. From day one,with the likes of Taysom Hill as his starting QB, last year in weeks 1-3 when he looked rusty. When he's on the field he's produced for his fantasy owners and that's not disputable.

I strongly push back on the BS unfounded notion he got paid and quit and again I'd say I can't stress that enough. I'm about 180 on that. His competitiveness is incredibly strong and to me that's another reason not to dismiss him because I think he's going to do everything he can to up his level of his play as close as he can to his past standards.

He's hovering in the 9th round area of leagues I mainly play. I think that's legit myself though not really what I'd call a target of mine but I'm ok with him if he's the BPA in that area. He's not someone I'd want to have in my lineup week one but my conclusion on him is if his foot issues hold up he'll reward you later as he knocks the rust off. And again if this was just about any other WR I'd pass but he gets more benefit of the doubt from me.

 

[Boston]

Never seen such a huge drop-off for a guy that started out so dominate

Such an odd career...feels like it was 15 years ago he was basically what Justin Jefferson is now.

 

[massraider]

He's hovering in the 9th round area of leagues I mainly play. I think that's legit myself though not really what I'd call a target of mine but I'm ok with him if he's the BPA in that area. He's not someone I'd want to have in my lineup week one but my conclusion on him is if his foot issues hold up he'll reward you later as he knocks the rust off. And again if this was just about any other WR I'd pass but he gets more benefit of the doubt from me.

He's gonna go later in my drafts.

If I take him, I will probably be happy with it.

In terms of rust, I think he needs to get into 'football ' shape, but I think MT could roll out of bed and run slants in his sleep.

 

[menobrown]

I think MT could roll out of bed and run slants in his sleep.

Yes and report I read on him the other day did say he was struggling with some routes but still running slants very well and I think the area's of the field he'll mainly do his work will be helped by being surrounded by other playmakers that put more stress on the defenses. Of course that means he won't be the same target monster but no one is expecting anything like that.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

He's hovering in the 9th round area of leagues I mainly play. I think that's legit myself though not really what I'd call a target of mine but I'm ok with him if he's the BPA in that area. He's not someone I'd want to have in my lineup week one but my conclusion on him is if his foot issues hold up he'll reward you later as he knocks the rust off. And again if this was just about any other WR I'd pass but he gets more benefit of the doubt from me.

He's gonna go later in my drafts.

If I take him, I will probably be happy with it.

In terms of rust, I think he needs to get into 'football ' shape, but I think MT could roll out of bed and run slants in his sleep.

I have him in 2 leagues now. WR3 & WR4 respectively. Hoping he can step it up a little beyond slants, and hoping Carr develops rapport with him.

 

[rockaction]

I'm about 180 on that.

I don't get this. I think you mean you're 100 percent sure on that. To pull a 180 would mean switching positions to the converse of your original argument. 180 degrees is a semi-circle. Half a circle. Hence the 180 when you switch positions. To do a 360 means you travel a circle's entire circumference to arrive at your original conclusion.

No matter. I think I get it. You're sure he didn't quit after getting a contract.

 

[eighsse2]

I'm about 180 on that.

I don't get this. I think you mean you're 100 percent sure on that. To pull a 180 would mean switching positions to the converse of your original argument. 180 degrees is a semi-circle. Half a circle. Hence the 180 when you switch positions. To do a 360 means you travel a circle's entire circumference to arrive at your original conclusion.

No matter. I think I get it. You're sure he didn't quit after getting a contract.

Orrr ... Maybe he means he's moving along a 180° angle, a straight line, toward what he originally said. Just kidding though, no one ever says it that way.

 

[rockaction]

Orrr ... Maybe he means he's moving along a 180° angle, a straight line, toward what he originally said. Just kidding though, no one ever says it that way.

What if "dog" really meant "cat"?

 

[FantasyMC]

I'm about 180 on that.

I don't get this. I think you mean you're 100 percent sure on that. To pull a 180 would mean switching positions to the converse of your original argument. 180 degrees is a semi-circle. Half a circle. Hence the 180 when you switch positions. To do a 360 means you travel a circle's entire circumference to arrive at your original conclusion.

No matter. I think I get it. You're sure he didn't quit after getting a contract.

I agree 360

 

[-jb-]

Slantboy was 65% Drew's creation. He had (has?) talent, but so much of his production was manufactured by scheme and QB.

 

[massraider]

Slantboy was 65% Drew's creation. He had (has?) talent, but so much of his production was manufactured by scheme and QB.

Well, if a less than courageous QB who would rather check down than take the big shot is required, I have some good news.

 

[FFWhiskey]

He's on my do not draft list. He'll have some huge weeks but will he largely inconsistent.

Will be a nice comeback story but he won't win you any leagues. This is Olave's team now.


With that said, he could be nice in bestball leagues.

 

[SproutDaddy]

Slantboy was 65% Drew's creation. He had (has?) talent, but so much of his production was manufactured by scheme and QB.

Not true. Look at his numbers with the other QBs….including Taysom.

 

[Deamon]

He's on my do not draft list.

You wouldn't take him in Round 16?

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

He's on my do not draft list. He'll have some huge weeks but will he largely inconsistent.

Will be a nice comeback story but he won't win you any leagues. This is Olave's team now.


With that said, he could be nice in bestball leagues.

I like him as a wide receiver three and I like him even more as a wide receiver for. As long as I have depth behind him in case he doesn’t come back to Fuerman I think he’s a good upside investment for where is ADP is.

 

[FFWhiskey]

He's on my do not draft list.

You wouldn't take him in Round 16?

Maybe. Seems like a classic roster clogger, similar to Allen Robinson last year.


I feel like in Round 16 I'd rather take flyers on Tank Johnson or Pierre Strong. Dudes who are still on the rise vs the decline.

 

[SproutDaddy]

He's on my do not draft list. He'll have some huge weeks but will he largely inconsistent.

This seems premature. I’d like to see the evidence you have to support it because I’m confident there isn’t any. Looked great the first 2 weeks last season. Im not making any predictions. Just get tired of the baseless claims on these boards. All that said, it is relative to his health. He’s a ppr beast and will get his undoubtedly.

 

[FFWhiskey]

He's on my do not draft list. He'll have some huge weeks but will he largely inconsistent.

This seems premature. I’d like to see the evidence you have to support it because I’m confident there isn’t any. Looked great the first 2 weeks last season. Im not making any predictions. Just get tired of the baseless claims on these boards. All that said, it is relative to his health. He’s a ppr beast and will get his undoubtedly.

My evidence is the guy hasn't played a full season since 2019 and is now on the wrong side of 30. That's what I am basing it on.

He looked great for 2 weeks before getting... you said it, hurt. I'll take my chances on guys who aren't made of glass and have been fantasy relevant since after COVID-19 happened close to 3-4 years ago.


If he stays healthy, if he hasn't lost a step, if he has chemistry with Carr, if the Saints offense isn't dog water, if there are enough targets to go around consistently. Lots of ifs. You may disagree but I wouldn't say that any of my arguments are baseless.


Because I could turn your own argument against you. "It's baseless to suggest Thomas will return to form."

 

[SproutDaddy]

He's on my do not draft list. He'll have some huge weeks but will he largely inconsistent.

This seems premature. I’d like to see the evidence you have to support it because I’m confident there isn’t any. Looked great the first 2 weeks last season. Im not making any predictions. Just get tired of the baseless claims on these boards. All that said, it is relative to his health. He’s a ppr beast and will get his undoubtedly.

My evidence is the guy hasn't played a full season since 2019 and is now on the wrong side of 30. That's what I am basing it on.

He looked great for 2 weeks before getting... you said it, hurt. I'll take my chances on guys who aren't made of glass and have been fantasy relevant since after COVID-19 happened close to 3-4 years ago.


If he stays healthy, if he hasn't lost a step, if he has chemistry with Carr, if the Saints offense isn't dog water, if there are enough targets to go around consistently. Lots of ifs. You may disagree but I wouldn't say that any of my arguments are baseless.


Because I could turn your own argument against you. "It's baseless to suggest Thomas will return to form."

Both injuries were freak accidents. I’ll wait to accuse anyone of “falling off” until they do. I’m not suggesting taking him as a WR1. Just saying it’s premature to say he’ll be inconsistent. There’s zero evidence of that at this point. I wouldn’t be surprised if he started out slow with a new qb. That’s a very feasible take rather than what you suggest. I guess we’ll see.

 

[FFWhiskey]

He's on my do not draft list. He'll have some huge weeks but will he largely inconsistent.

This seems premature. I’d like to see the evidence you have to support it because I’m confident there isn’t any. Looked great the first 2 weeks last season. Im not making any predictions. Just get tired of the baseless claims on these boards. All that said, it is relative to his health. He’s a ppr beast and will get his undoubtedly.

My evidence is the guy hasn't played a full season since 2019 and is now on the wrong side of 30. That's what I am basing it on.

He looked great for 2 weeks before getting... you said it, hurt. I'll take my chances on guys who aren't made of glass and have been fantasy relevant since after COVID-19 happened close to 3-4 years ago.


If he stays healthy, if he hasn't lost a step, if he has chemistry with Carr, if the Saints offense isn't dog water, if there are enough targets to go around consistently. Lots of ifs. You may disagree but I wouldn't say that any of my arguments are baseless.


Because I could turn your own argument against you. "It's baseless to suggest Thomas will return to form."

Both injuries were freak accidents. I’ll wait to accuse anyone of “falling off” until they do. I’m not suggesting taking him as a WR1. Just saying it’s premature to say he’ll be inconsistent. There’s zero evidence of that at this point. I wouldn’t be surprised if he started out slow with a new qb. That’s a very feasible take rather than what you suggest. I guess we’ll see.

Full disclosure, I was all in on Thomas last year and two weeks in he looked like league winner, but that last injury was what flipped me on him. Dudes had ankle, hamstring, and toe problems the better part of the last 4 years. His lower body is totally ****ed up and that stuff tends to get worse, not better with age.

It was more so the fact of how long it took him to comeback or not comeback, that is. He's a fine dart throw, but after asking the same pretty girl out on a date for 4 years and her giving me a different excuse each time, I have moved on.


Hopefully you and her work out. I'll be chasing the attention of a younger woman. Also, cheers to being cool and agreeing to disagree.



There are some guys here who would spend the next 3 hours arguing with me about this, lol.

 

[Statorama]

Slantboy was 65% Drew's creation. He had (has?) talent, but so much of his production was manufactured by scheme and QB.

I think that's part of what's driving his motivation this year - Saints have a legit playoff-caliber QB for the first time in years.

I'm one of the guys that felt like his heavy wallet was impacting his return, and still feel that way. There was no real motivation to hobble out on the field for a non-playoff contender if you're at 60% and making bank. I don't hate him for it, it's a very human thing to do. I'd probably do the same. Makes sense to get healthy, and be ready when the Saints are ready to make more than a cursory visit to the playoffs. I had a leg cramp before that hurt like a MFer - I can't imagine being in a situation where my foot and ankle hurt ALL THE TIME.

MT was never a guy to jump up on the bench and wave the towel around to get the fans whooped up, but I see a little bit of that fire back in his eyes. He's not going to be the monster he was, but with Carr I can see him easily being one of those solid 5-7 catch per game guys that scores a TD every other game or three. I love him at his current price point and I'm starting him week 1 with confidence as my WR3.

 

[Chaka]

I think that's part of what's driving his motivation this year - Saints have a legit playoff-caliber QB for the first time in years.

Let's go with; they have their best QB since Brees.

 

[Crazy8s--]

I'd only draft him as a bench WR and not a full time starter. He's not reliable. I had him last year and the injury was though to fill.

 

[TripItUp]

I was on him several months ago and have cooled off considerably. Camp reports have not been great and that's from homer beatwriters.

He's a pass for me this year in redrafts and probably a sell high in dynasty if you can find a trade partner.

That being said...75/900/6 is still well within his range of outcomes IMHO but the floor is low and we will probably never see elite level production again. If you can't sell now, I'd consider selling after he has a big game, particularly if the big game doesn't exhibit the old explosive traits he once possessed.

 

[nittanylion]

In his current condition, MThomas provides just enough of a complimentary threat, in conjunction with the other personnel in the passing game, to keep defenses from smothering Olave.

I personally wouldn't want to roster him as anything other than bye week/flex committee bench depth, otherwise...but his presence is a factor in why I'm tremendously bullish on Olave and the Carr/Olave stack.

 

[Faust]

Saints WR Michael Thomas details body rejecting hardware from ankle, toe surgeries

 

[massraider]

Saints WR Michael Thomas details body rejecting hardware from ankle, toe surgeries

Incredible and annoying we are only just hearing about this

 

[FarFromHome]

I've always been so pro Michael Thomas. After last year I just can't. I won't.

 

[FFWhiskey]

Saints WR Michael Thomas details body rejecting hardware from ankle, toe surgeries

Oh wow, more lower body issues from a guy who hasn't played a meaningful amount of snaps in 4 years?

How unexpected! This red flag came out of nowhere.