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Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
For now, yes he is. However once Romo gets back we'll have to see. I'm not going on record saying Owens is done as a fantasy receiver. He just needs someone to get him the rock.
This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
Agreed. Santana has been a pain to own in the past, but he has been amazing in the new Skins offense. I don't think a top 10 finish is out of the question. (He is the #2 receiver in my league after 8 weeks, even with his off games).I appreciate the rankings in general though. I can respect out of the box thinking.This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
/agree that Santana should be on that list.This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
Who would you take off of my list to put Santana on?This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
WayneWho would you take off of my list to put Santana on?This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
The other Moss. Still a quality WR, but not the same without Brady.Who would you take off of my list to put Santana on?This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
Well than we just disagree cause I would much rather have WayneWayneWho would you take off of my list to put Santana on?This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
And again we just disagree. I would much rather have Randy instead of SantanaThe other Moss. Still a quality WR, but not the same without Brady.Who would you take off of my list to put Santana on?This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
As much as I hate to say it, MegatronWho would you take off of my list to put Santana on?This would mean a whole lot more if Wayne wasn't coming off back to back performances of 2/24/0 and 3/29/0. Or other guys on the list didn't have back to back games that were stinkers as well:A. Johnson2/29/03/38/0C. Johnson4/40/02/16/0WRs are sporadic, it's the nature of the position.Many can blame me again for not putting Santana on this list but I don't trust him and never will. If I was drafting today for the rest of the year there is no way I'd take Santana in my top ten wr's.Last time I got blasted for not putting him in the top ten he went with 0 points and 2 in back to back games
No Donnie Avery?
He's had one good week.No Donnie Avery?
His last 2 have been very good and even his third game ago was pretty good with 4 catches for 70 + yardsHe's had one good week.No Donnie Avery?
His last week was very good. The week before that was just alright. I agree he's coming on and possibly will make a good WR2 from here on out.09/21 SEA 3 24 10 0 09/28 BUF 3 22 15 0 10/12 WAS 4 73 43 0 10/19 DAL 4 55 42 1 10/26 NE 6 163 69 1His last 2 have been very good and even his third game ago was pretty good with 4 catches for 70 + yardsHe's had one good week.No Donnie Avery?
he's top 10 on my potentially top 10 on paper list but not even close in the real world. i realize he lit it up in the second half of the last season, let's see if he does it again. it would be nice for him to put together a full season of super stardom though before he is put on a list like this.Evans and Santana Moss should be put in the same class.They are both streaky wr's with a lot of talent, that can look really good sometimes but kill you more than less.I won't be putting him in my top ten anytime soon but I could see an argument if someone else wanted to put him in there.
Santana is the #1 WR in a lot of leagues right now. Granted he hasn't had his bye week yet so he has an extra game over some other guys. Regardless, there is no way that the #1 WR in most leagues should be left off the top 10 list. Again, the sporadic argument holds little water IMO. Several of the other guys on that list are just as sporadic. WRs are sporadic.
Halfway through the season S. Moss is no longer a wanna-be Top 10 FF WR this year.Biases are part of what we all use when making drafting decisions, but you gotta know when to admit to yourself you were wrong, at least for this year for this WR.
I disagree and agree with the thread starter. He is posting a redraft list as if we draft as if Week 9 was week 1. I agree there are certain players who have produced in the top 10, but players have upside, downside and for good/bad reasons. If I were drafting today, Santana Moss would not be in my top 10 WRs either. I would expect him to fall in the next 5 (11-15) or so, for my taste.So for you to say that he should admit he is wrong (at this point) is laughable. I think the only way he should admit he is wrong is once we get through the week 16 games and Santana Moss managed to rank in the top 10 WRs for production based on weeks 9 through 16. Then in that case you would be correct that he was wrong, but it is impossible to be wrong already (and for someone to admit he was wrong) before the games were even played.
I will NEVER forgive Evans for the start he had last year. I drafted him as my WR1 and he buried my team in the first half. Nobody that can vanish like that for half a season should ever be in anyone's Top 10.
why is calvin johnson so high? what has he done? even if rankings not PPR friendly TJ Housh,Welker,Cotchery/Coles could be ahead of him.
you dont think his vanishing could have had anything to do with the qb situation?I will NEVER forgive Evans for the start he had last year. I drafted him as my WR1 and he buried my team in the first half. Nobody that can vanish like that for half a season should ever be in anyone's Top 10.
I have to fight my biases all the time, I generally don't like to have Lee Evans, Denver RBs, Hasselbeck, Plexiglass, etc...The OP admitted he has a bias against S. Moss, which is fine, we all have them. Halfway through the season, the bias against Moss has been dead wrong - if you can't admit that, thenI disagree and agree with the thread starter. He is posting a redraft list as if we draft as if Week 9 was week 1. I agree there are certain players who have produced in the top 10, but players have upside, downside and for good/bad reasons. If I were drafting today, Santana Moss would not be in my top 10 WRs either. I would expect him to fall in the next 5 (11-15) or so, for my taste.So for you to say that he should admit he is wrong (at this point) is laughable. I think the only way he should admit he is wrong is once we get through the week 16 games and Santana Moss managed to rank in the top 10 WRs for production based on weeks 9 through 16. Then in that case you would be correct that he was wrong, but it is impossible to be wrong already (and for someone to admit he was wrong) before the games were even played.Halfway through the season S. Moss is no longer a wanna-be Top 10 FF WR this year.Biases are part of what we all use when making drafting decisions, but you gotta know when to admit to yourself you were wrong, at least for this year for this WR.
We'll see about the 2nd half - unfortunately Moss has a hammy now, so that could change the equation - and his hammy is the ONLY reason I wouldn't redraft him right now in the top 10.Of course the only way to know for sure is to wait until the end of the season... but you can't manage a FF team by waiting until week 17 to figure out who you should have originally drafted or targeted in-season to trade for.I disagree and agree with the thread starter. He is posting a redraft list as if we draft as if Week 9 was week 1. I agree there are certain players who have produced in the top 10, but players have upside, downside and for good/bad reasons. If I were drafting today, Santana Moss would not be in my top 10 WRs either. I would expect him to fall in the next 5 (11-15) or so, for my taste.So for you to say that he should admit he is wrong (at this point) is laughable. I think the only way he should admit he is wrong is once we get through the week 16 games and Santana Moss managed to rank in the top 10 WRs for production based on weeks 9 through 16. Then in that case you would be correct that he was wrong, but it is impossible to be wrong already (and for someone to admit he was wrong) before the games were even played.
The only relevant question to ask here is, at this moment would you trade Player A for Player B straight-up.The player that you wouldn't trade for any other is #1. The player that has only 5 others you'd trade him for straight up is #6.There are definitely at least 10 WRs I'd trade S Moss for, simply because I don't expect his numbers from this point forward to be in the top 10. He's had a great first half but his injury history and inconsistency leaves him in the second tier for me.
Completely agree with you here.The only relevant question to ask here is, at this moment would you trade Player A for Player B straight-up.The player that you wouldn't trade for any other is #1. The player that has only 5 others you'd trade him for straight up is #6.There are definitely at least 10 WRs I'd trade S Moss for, simply because I don't expect his numbers from this point forward to be in the top 10. He's had a great first half but his injury history and inconsistency leaves him in the second tier for me.Halfway through the season S. Moss is no longer a wanna-be Top 10 FF WR this year.Biases are part of what we all use when making drafting decisions, but you gotta know when to admit to yourself you were wrong, at least for this year for this WR.
Agreed, that is a good way to look at it.But the other thing that is relevant is whether biases are overly influencing a decision vs. what is in black and white for half a season now.People have well founded FF biases against Moss from previous years.But every season stands on its own merits - players do have aberrational great or bad years.Guessing which is in play and acting accordingly wins championships.We'll just have to wait and see about Moss in the 2nd half.... we already know about the 1st half.The only relevant question to ask here is, at this moment would you trade Player A for Player B straight-up.
You say folks have a bias, I say folks have learned from history.You yourself used the term aberration. The question is whether you think Moss' aberrant season will continue, or whether you think he'll return to the norm he's established over many years. If you believe the latter, then he ought not be in the top 10.Agreed, that is a good way to look at it.But the other thing that is relevant is whether biases are overly influencing a decision vs. what is in black and white for half a season now.People have well founded FF biases against Moss from previous years.But every season stands on its own merits - players do have aberrational great or bad years.Guessing which is in play and acting accordingly wins championships.We'll just have to wait and see about Moss in the 2nd half.... we already know about the 1st half.The only relevant question to ask here is, at this moment would you trade Player A for Player B straight-up.
OK Dave, list those 10 players and I'll bet you if you wish that S. Moss will at least outperform one of them, which would then put him in your top 10.The only relevant question to ask here is, at this moment would you trade Player A for Player B straight-up.The player that you wouldn't trade for any other is #1. The player that has only 5 others you'd trade him for straight up is #6.There are definitely at least 10 WRs I'd trade S Moss for, simply because I don't expect his numbers from this point forward to be in the top 10. He's had a great first half but his injury history and inconsistency leaves him in the second tier for me.Halfway through the season S. Moss is no longer a wanna-be Top 10 FF WR this year.Biases are part of what we all use when making drafting decisions, but you gotta know when to admit to yourself you were wrong, at least for this year for this WR.
Both are true, bias and history.My own observation over the years, particularly as it relates to the surprise FA pickups that happen at the beginning of every season, is that there are plenty of players each year that have a couple great games.But only a few who, for whatever reason (coaching change, maturation, contract year, finally free from injury, improved team, new offensive scheme, etc...) continue on to have a consistently good year all year long.In looking at Moss at the beginning of the year, his situation fit several of the above parameters that could result in him having a good year.IMO, after 8 games, it's less likely than not to expect Moss to regress to the norm this year unless something happens to upset the balance in Washington that's allowing his success - in particular an injury to Moss, QB or RB injury, or injuries to Cooley or ARE.Unfortunately Moss's hammy that cropped up last Sunday could be the parameter change that slows down his season.We'll find out this weekend how much of a problem it's going to be.I understand everyone that's wary of Moss and they may well prove to be right.But after half a season, I think it's more likely he continues in the 2nd half as he did in the 1st, barring key injuries.You say folks have a bias, I say folks have learned from history.You yourself used the term aberration. The question is whether you think Moss' aberrant season will continue, or whether you think he'll return to the norm he's established over many years. If you believe the latter, then he ought not be in the top 10.Agreed, that is a good way to look at it.But the other thing that is relevant is whether biases are overly influencing a decision vs. what is in black and white for half a season now.People have well founded FF biases against Moss from previous years.But every season stands on its own merits - players do have aberrational great or bad years.Guessing which is in play and acting accordingly wins championships.We'll just have to wait and see about Moss in the 2nd half.... we already know about the 1st half.The only relevant question to ask here is, at this moment would you trade Player A for Player B straight-up.Halfway through the season S. Moss is no longer a wanna-be Top 10 FF WR this year.Biases are part of what we all use when making drafting decisions, but you gotta know when to admit to yourself you were wrong, at least for this year for this WR.
