Why wouldn't the short passes go to him though? I mean if you're right, he'd be good in PPR leagues
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Leon Washington (1 Viewer)
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Righetti
Footballguy
As a Jet fan i'm pretty happy with the Barlow/Leon combination but to give you some NY Sportsradio perspective.. Joe Benigno on WFAN who is a big-time Jets homer is sure that the Jets need to find a franchise back in this years NFL draft.
As much as I love Leon, having a guy like Maroney who can virtually do it all would be a nice addition to almost every offense
As much as I love Leon, having a guy like Maroney who can virtually do it all would be a nice addition to almost every offense
corpcow
Footballguy
Yep.Leon is low this week because there's risk. A tough matchup, no goal line carries, and splitting carries in general. He may get passes, but I think they're more likely to use Baker and Coles and Cotchery in the middle seams. Not a bad PPR play, I guess, but still probably better options out there. There's certainly reward, but it doesn't come without risk.Long term (i.e., dynasty), he's probably not a starter in NY next year.
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[scooter]
Footballguy
Will be cutting Leon tomorrow.
He gave me a few solid starts, but it's clear now that the Jets are in full-blown RBBC and will be playing hot hands & matchups the rest of the year. I don't want to touch it with a 10-foot pole.
Then again, I might be starting a Cedric Houston thread next week....
He gave me a few solid starts, but it's clear now that the Jets are in full-blown RBBC and will be playing hot hands & matchups the rest of the year. I don't want to touch it with a 10-foot pole.
Then again, I might be starting a Cedric Houston thread next week....
Lurking
Footballguy
Looks like all three will continue to get carries...
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football...0p-399163c.html
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football...0p-399163c.html
corpcow
Footballguy
Yep. I think it's working - each of them, as I said before, fit into a specific niche, and Mangini is using them well. It's Patriots-lite in the backfield - each guy has a role. And if it's working, why should he change things to appease fantasy owners? 
The fact is, as a defensive player (I played d-line and MLB) it can be difficult to deal with multiple backs with different styles. You have to hit the hole hard to stop a guy like Barlow, but if you do that against Washington he'll cut back and go right past you. So it keeps the defense on their toes and makes each of the individual backs better than they would have been as the sole ball carrier.
The fact is, as a defensive player (I played d-line and MLB) it can be difficult to deal with multiple backs with different styles. You have to hit the hole hard to stop a guy like Barlow, but if you do that against Washington he'll cut back and go right past you. So it keeps the defense on their toes and makes each of the individual backs better than they would have been as the sole ball carrier.
moleculo
Footballguy
so who will excel today? What does Houston do that caters to a specific skill set?
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Ron_Mexico
I Love Doggies
I would hold both of these guys through theoff-season if you're in a dynasty league. One of them may emerge, I have the feeling it may be Ced Houston.
I wouldn't, trade em' now while they still have value. Offseason will likely determine their fate. I'm confident the Jets sign a RB(draft or big FA) and put an end to this RBBC. Leon has really fallen, Houston is the man now. In that mud it was Barlow. He's gotta lock the job up and he hasn't, IMO.
Englishteacher
Footballguy
rebump for 2007 speculation
I think we would agree that the Jets are sure to bring in a back to challenge for the #1 job, and that one of Houston and Barlow will not make it through training camp.
Will Leon Washington win a full-time starting job against the competition? I'm not so sure. Barlow will be in the magic 2nd year back from knee surgery, so I wouldn't write him off. Houston was banged up all season and came on later.
Question is who else come in? I could see the Jets packaging their late first (what is it, 26?) with the 2nd rounder from Washington (#5?) to move up to about 20 and take Marshawn Lynch, if he's available there. I think Lynch would beat out anyone on the Jets right now. If the Jets take Tony Hunt or Kenny Irons after the first round, Washington has a better shot.
The Jets could potentially trade for Michael Turner, who would be the starter. I can't think of free agent RBs who might attract the Jets' interest.
Will Leon Washington win a full-time starting job against the competition? I'm not so sure. Barlow will be in the magic 2nd year back from knee surgery, so I wouldn't write him off. Houston was banged up all season and came on later.
Question is who else come in? I could see the Jets packaging their late first (what is it, 26?) with the 2nd rounder from Washington (#5?) to move up to about 20 and take Marshawn Lynch, if he's available there. I think Lynch would beat out anyone on the Jets right now. If the Jets take Tony Hunt or Kenny Irons after the first round, Washington has a better shot.
The Jets could potentially trade for Michael Turner, who would be the starter. I can't think of free agent RBs who might attract the Jets' interest.
Englishteacher
Footballguy
I guess my question right now is whether Washington will be useful enough to keep in larger keeper leagues (4-7 players or so) over guys at other positions...... QB, WR, TE..... I'm guessing a team would be best served using him in a Maurice Jones Drew role. I don't think he's as good however. I could see him getting as little as 5 carries a game potentially. He's a good third down back so he'll get some targets that way. I think in certain weeks if the jEts needed him too he could tote the rock 25 times but I see that as his upside. I don't think that's their long term plan for him. If he ends up being a feature back for a year or two I see 250-275 carries as his ideal type workload for the top end. However, I'm a little worried he doesn't have the size to fit in on short yardage and goalline work. He wasn't used in that role in 2006 so much as I know. If the Jets are unable to find a suitable feature back I could see Washington in that role for a year or two maybe but I think he'd need help. The aspects you want to see from a true #1 back are running it between the tackles, the ability to get to the outside, and being able to catch the football. This is of course in addition to being able to block and keep his QB upright.
Nookular Power
Footballguy
He seems to have the size/skill-set combo of a Brian Westbrook, which is nice. Judging from his college career, he may also have the injury issues, which is not as nice. For a rook, he put up good numbers, and one can always hope that with hard work he could improve on those. My question: is the OC in NY someone who might adapt a system to really take advantage of a Westbrook-type, if that's the way the Jets decide to go for another year? That is, do they take care of other needs during the off-season/draft, and spend another year "making do" with what they've got, perhaps hoping that they've struck gold with Washington, knowing they could be modestly successful with a Washington/fill-in-the-blank-power-guy combo? Outside of maybe a couple guys who are just really talented all-around -- LT/LJ/SJ -- it seems many RBs are successful because the OC decides to make them so -- Westbrook, FWP coming to mind.
sheerterror
Footballguy
As a mini hijack, I've got to disagree with you about that Westbrook comment - I think he's one of the most underrated " all-around" backs in the league, and quite possibly the best in the open field.ETA something to the discussion:
The Jets have been one of the most commonly mentioned teams this offseason in regards to acquiring an RB, either via the draft or through FA/trade. I honestly believe that it is highly unlikely you will see this team spend money on a free agent or trade for Thomas Jones, as has been mentioned relatively often around here. The Jets run game improved dramatically as the season wore on and the offensive line began to gel, and with another season together and an upgrade on the right side of the line, I think you will continue to see it improve and the coaching staff knows this. I'm fully expecting the Jets to go into this season with an open competition between Washington, Barlow and Houston. Running back isn't a major necessity right now, but if there isn't some semblance of improvement from last season, then I think you see the Jets attempt to upgrade next offseason.
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Nookular Power
Footballguy
Thanks, sheerterror. First, on the Westbrook thing: I couldn't agree more, and believe he *is* one of the more talented guys around. That said, in most places he doesn't get the chance to prove it -- he's 5' 8", and pigeon-holed as a "3rd down back" for life. Likewise, folks would likely have done the same with FWP, and they immediately want to do it with Leon. Not sure Leon is Westbrook, but he might be (and, yeah, as an owner, I'd really, really love it) and would love to see him get his shot. I hope you're right and that they stick with what they did last year. It worked well enough, Mangini showing that the first priority is to build a top line, and the rest will follow.
While I don't expect the Jets to trade for Thomas Jones, I would be shocked if they didn't bring in another back into the stable. The running game did get better as the season wore on, but nobody was consistent, and I think that in Mangini's world that means you bring in more competition.
Rovers
Footballguy
I don't think the Washington-Westbrook comparisons are off base, but that is his high side. He's as fast as Westy, and is a dangerous reciever, but Philly uses Westbrook to maximize what he's best at, receptions out of the backfield, which is not to say he can't run between the tackles either, but he's better suited to be used that way.
The Jets offense, and in particular, the running game doesn't have a real identity yet. Last year, they ran the ball between the guards something like 62% of the time, behind only two ther NFL teams in terms of running play distribution. If Washigton is to be the starter, that has to change. While he can run between the guards, it doesn't seem to be a very good fit for his skill set and body size. Having said that, D'Brick so far has been as advertised... not a very good run blocker, but a LT that can pull and block in space. Whether or nor the Jets begin to change up their run game plans to take better advantage of the talent they now have remains to be seen.
The offensive line is still searching for it's identity as well. Unless there is an upgrade at RG and RT, this Pittsburgh sort of running game between the guards isn't going to work in any case. Remember that both Schotty lite (the OC) and Mangini were rookies last year. But, they do appear to be pretty smart.
Washington's future is very difficult to project, but the draft, FA and the first couple of preseason games should remove a large part of the uncertainty.
It depends on these factors, imo:
The O line:
Right now, Clement at RT is unsigned. Moore at RG is better suited to be depth. If the Jets make some moves to improve the RT and RG spots, that would be very good for a guy like Washington. He's fast, and can slither through small gaps. He'll never be the short yardage guy, but ....
The O game plan:
Mangold and Ferguson can pull and block in space better than most veterans can. This strength was very under-utilized by the Jets last year. Martin made his living running outside, and this offense, based on personell, doesn't do it near enough...yet. Again, if they work on running outside, even better for Washington.
FA:
Obviously, if the Jets get Turner, all bets are off with Washington. If they upgrade the O line and draft an RB in the mid rounds instead, that would be great for Washington's chances.
This CS and FO knows they need to improve the running game. How they decide to do that is the 64 thousand dollar question. It's clear that they like Washington a lot, and I'm guessing they haven't ruled him out as a possible 20 carry RB, but they will have to run more often away from the between the guards play calling they used last year, especially without an major upgrade at RG. More mis-direction and outside runs is actually what I am guessing to see, all other things remaining more or less status quo.
The offensive line is generally smallish but athletic. Running between the guards (unless it's a zone blocking scheme) just doesn't make much sense. If they go get a big road grader... for the RT or RG spots, they can perhaps be more successful running it up the gut as they tried last year. This was really my only complaint with what Schotty and Mangini did as far as game planning and coaching went last year. They ran at their own weaknesses. I expect them to address that problem this year, but how, I certainly don't know.
The Jets offense, and in particular, the running game doesn't have a real identity yet. Last year, they ran the ball between the guards something like 62% of the time, behind only two ther NFL teams in terms of running play distribution. If Washigton is to be the starter, that has to change. While he can run between the guards, it doesn't seem to be a very good fit for his skill set and body size. Having said that, D'Brick so far has been as advertised... not a very good run blocker, but a LT that can pull and block in space. Whether or nor the Jets begin to change up their run game plans to take better advantage of the talent they now have remains to be seen.
The offensive line is still searching for it's identity as well. Unless there is an upgrade at RG and RT, this Pittsburgh sort of running game between the guards isn't going to work in any case. Remember that both Schotty lite (the OC) and Mangini were rookies last year. But, they do appear to be pretty smart.
Washington's future is very difficult to project, but the draft, FA and the first couple of preseason games should remove a large part of the uncertainty.
It depends on these factors, imo:
The O line:
Right now, Clement at RT is unsigned. Moore at RG is better suited to be depth. If the Jets make some moves to improve the RT and RG spots, that would be very good for a guy like Washington. He's fast, and can slither through small gaps. He'll never be the short yardage guy, but ....
The O game plan:
Mangold and Ferguson can pull and block in space better than most veterans can. This strength was very under-utilized by the Jets last year. Martin made his living running outside, and this offense, based on personell, doesn't do it near enough...yet. Again, if they work on running outside, even better for Washington.
FA:
Obviously, if the Jets get Turner, all bets are off with Washington. If they upgrade the O line and draft an RB in the mid rounds instead, that would be great for Washington's chances.
This CS and FO knows they need to improve the running game. How they decide to do that is the 64 thousand dollar question. It's clear that they like Washington a lot, and I'm guessing they haven't ruled him out as a possible 20 carry RB, but they will have to run more often away from the between the guards play calling they used last year, especially without an major upgrade at RG. More mis-direction and outside runs is actually what I am guessing to see, all other things remaining more or less status quo.
The offensive line is generally smallish but athletic. Running between the guards (unless it's a zone blocking scheme) just doesn't make much sense. If they go get a big road grader... for the RT or RG spots, they can perhaps be more successful running it up the gut as they tried last year. This was really my only complaint with what Schotty and Mangini did as far as game planning and coaching went last year. They ran at their own weaknesses. I expect them to address that problem this year, but how, I certainly don't know.
Unless a 20 carries/game talent emerges on the Jets and obviates the question of who the featured back is, the Jets will play RBBC. Leon Washington has a nice skill-set, but I don't think he looked better than Cedric Houston looked in his good games. Speed kills, but it also fools. The fact is that all Washington proved last season is that he belongs on the field in some capacity. That's a big step for a 4th-round pick, but let's maintain perspective. There were no consistent runners on the Jets last year aside from Kevan Barlow, and he was consistently under 4 ypc.
homer
Rovers
Footballguy
Yeah, Barlow was consistant. He consistantly sucked.
lord_helmet
Footballguy
I still think Leon will get more and more touches , he's speedy and elusive. They just need to figure out how to maximize his talents
Prof. Chaos
Footballguy
I wish I could get a read on this. Not getting my hopes up.
zamboni
Footballguy
Jones ran the ball reasonably well, too, so I don't expect Leon's role to change much. Being ahead for most of the game, the Jets were able to run the ball a lot. The increased number of overall touches may have also been due to the absence of Cotchery.Leon is a very good player, and is probably headed to Honolulu for his KR role, but I don't expect him to become a workhorse in this offense. I think Mangini likes his role as is.
BusterTBronco
Footballguy
I just wish Washington were more reliable. Next week he'll probably have his usual game. 2 carries, 10 yards.
moleculo
Footballguy
does Mangini consider Leon's value maximized with fewer touches and ST duty? Is that how this is going to work out, or is there any full time back potential?Does Leon carry between the tackles much?
Tanner9919
Footballguy
at least Meggett was a two-time Pro Bowler, Washington looks like a lesser version of Eric Metcalf...or a poor man's Warrick Dunn
or lousy version of Kenny Watson 
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BobbyLayne
Footballguy
wickster33
Footballguy
At 205 pounds, there's no reason he can't be another Tiki Barber. Quick to the outside, but big enough to hit the 3 hole.
Coach would have to play him more for that to happen. Old thread here, similar sentiments last year
zamboni
Footballguy
As others have said, it's hard to guess what Mangini is thinking. While Leon could be a full-time back, my sense is that we'll never really know (barring injury) as long as Mangini and Schottenheimer are running the show. They probably think - and understandably so - that he might not hold up under a much larger workload. Visions of Tiki or Westrbook may be far-fetched in the current regime.
BusterTBronco
Footballguy
Stinks.
Tanner9919
Footballguy
They'll likely make a big pitch for Michael Turner in the offseason, he previously worked with Brian Shottenheimer in SD..
Sack-Religious
Footballguy
Everytime I see Leon playing either as a RB or KR, I think of Westbook in his first few years. They do a lot of the same things well and they're very similar in size. I know the coaching staff seems hesitant to give him a shot at being the guy, but I'd really like to see what he'd do if given the chance.
