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Mortgage Rates (3 Viewers)

-OZ- said:
@Chadstroma - maybe you can explain this better. 

No issues, I think. But they're asking for a letter confirming I can make the payments. Mind you, I haven't not made a payment in the 4 years we've had the mortgage, and my DTI is ~12%, well below the 28/36% I understand they want. 

My wife isn't on the new mortgage, she doesn't have an income.  Maybe this is the only reason they want the letter but it seems unnecessary.  
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Sounds like they are asking for a LOE/LOX (Letter of Explanation). It is hard to know why they are asking for it without seeing the whole picture (loan file). 

I will say this... most of the time, there are things done with mortgages that may not make sense but there are reasons for them. That being said, sometimes you get a underwriter that is being silly and ask for an LOE when you don't think you need one. The option is to fight with them (which usually is futile unless you can show in Fannie/Freddie or govy guidelines that they are wrong) or if it is just getting an LOE ask the client to get you the LOE. 

If you write out the letter and send it over then it should clear the condition and get the loan file moving forward. 

 
Chadstroma said:
Sounds like they are asking for a LOE/LOX (Letter of Explanation). It is hard to know why they are asking for it without seeing the whole picture (loan file). 

I will say this... most of the time, there are things done with mortgages that may not make sense but there are reasons for them. That being said, sometimes you get a underwriter that is being silly and ask for an LOE when you don't think you need one. The option is to fight with them (which usually is futile unless you can show in Fannie/Freddie or govy guidelines that they are wrong) or if it is just getting an LOE ask the client to get you the LOE. 

If you write out the letter and send it over then it should clear the condition and get the loan file moving forward. 
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UW probably doing this to cover his butt if the file gets audited after closing.

 
Chadstroma said:
Sounds like they are asking for a LOE/LOX (Letter of Explanation). It is hard to know why they are asking for it without seeing the whole picture (loan file). 

I will say this... most of the time, there are things done with mortgages that may not make sense but there are reasons for them. That being said, sometimes you get a underwriter that is being silly and ask for an LOE when you don't think you need one. The option is to fight with them (which usually is futile unless you can show in Fannie/Freddie or govy guidelines that they are wrong) or if it is just getting an LOE ask the client to get you the LOE. 

If you write out the letter and send it over then it should clear the condition and get the loan file moving forward. 
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I sent it. Your gal sent everything, sounds like we should get the title stuff later this week.

 
Update, sounds like I will be going with Chad's guy (shocker).

Going with an 80% loan to value cash out refi which will bring me somewhere in the 60-75k range (pending appraisal).

Rate will be 3% on a 15 year.  The total cost including appraisal is set to be a couple hundred bucks below $3,000.

The only question now is what to do with the money.  Invest?  Buy another rental?  Pay off existing rental which would give me two rental properties free and clear, plus have 20 grand left over?  Vegas trip? 

 
ghostguy123 said:
Update, sounds like I will be going with Chad's guy (shocker).

Going with an 80% loan to value cash out refi which will bring me somewhere in the 60-75k range (pending appraisal).

Rate will be 3% on a 15 year.  The total cost including appraisal is set to be a couple hundred bucks below $3,000.

The only question now is what to do with the money.  Invest?  Buy another rental?  Pay off existing rental which would give me two rental properties free and clear, plus have 20 grand left over?  Vegas trip? 
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Unless you want to be debt free, get another rental. Presuming you find one you like. 

 
ghostguy123 said:
Update, sounds like I will be going with Chad's guy (shocker).

Going with an 80% loan to value cash out refi which will bring me somewhere in the 60-75k range (pending appraisal).

Rate will be 3% on a 15 year.  The total cost including appraisal is set to be a couple hundred bucks below $3,000.

The only question now is what to do with the money.  Invest?  Buy another rental?  Pay off existing rental which would give me two rental properties free and clear, plus have 20 grand left over?  Vegas trip? 
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A nice big gift of a bouquet of cash to your buddy Chad? 🤣 Just playing. Congrats!

Rates are moving in the wrong direction again today.

 
Chadstroma said:
A nice big gift of a bouquet of cash to your buddy Chad? 🤣 Just playing. Congrats!

Rates are moving in the wrong direction again today.
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Spoke with my current lender on the phone last night.  I told him someone else had his offer beat and he proceeded to say something like "you could keep playing this game for a month....." or some snarky crap because of the competition for my business.

F that dude.  They just lost my business

 
ghostguy123 said:
Spoke with my current lender on the phone last night.  I told him someone else had his offer beat and he proceeded to say something like "you could keep playing this game for a month....." or some snarky crap because of the competition for my business.

F that dude.  They just lost my business
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Tell him to pound sand. 

 
ghostguy123 said:
Spoke with my current lender on the phone last night.  I told him someone else had his offer beat and he proceeded to say something like "you could keep playing this game for a month....." or some snarky crap because of the competition for my business.

F that dude.  They just lost my business
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Yup... they are scum there. I refuse to send them loans. 

If he didn't believe you (it isn't uncommon for a borrower to try to tell one lender that another is giving a better deal and either A: being told one thing and the truth is another B: trying to get s lender to go lower) he should have kindly asked for the Loan Estimate. But they are basically Boiler Room "loan officers" with maybe months worth of experience and a very skinny on training other than "this is how you manipulate a borrower into a loan with us". 

 
Which option is better.  Assume that these are the only two options available and you have to choose one of them.

Option 1: Do nothing.  Continue paying down 60k on primary residence at 3.75%.  Also continue paying on rental property with balance of about 48k at 4.25%

Option 2: Take cash out refi on primary residence, get about 65k cash, new loan to be about 128k, at 3%.   Take 48k out and pay off rental property.  Keep the extra 17k or so in savings/checking and max out 403b and HSA for as long as possible.

 
ghostguy123 said:
Which option is better.  Assume that these are the only two options available and you have to choose one of them.

Option 1: Do nothing.  Continue paying down 60k on primary residence at 3.75%.  Also continue paying on rental property with balance of about 48k at 4.25%

Option 2: Take cash out refi on primary residence, get about 65k cash, new loan to be about 128k, at 3%.   Take 48k out and pay off rental property.  Keep the extra 17k or so in savings/checking and max out 403b and HSA for as long as possible.
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When would you be done with either?

I'd think B. But if you're knocking them out this year, keep A. 

 
-OZ- said:
When would you be done with either?

I'd think B. But if you're knocking them out this year, keep A. 
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If I just make the current payment amount the 60k primary residence would be paid off in like 7 or 8 years.  The rental condo of 48k would be paid off in about 12 years

 
ghostguy123 said:
Which option is better.  Assume that these are the only two options available and you have to choose one of them.

Option 1: Do nothing.  Continue paying down 60k on primary residence at 3.75%.  Also continue paying on rental property with balance of about 48k at 4.25%

Option 2: Take cash out refi on primary residence, get about 65k cash, new loan to be about 128k, at 3%.   Take 48k out and pay off rental property.  Keep the extra 17k or so in savings/checking and max out 403b and HSA for as long as possible.
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2

Not sure why the $20K extra but 3% is lowering your cost on $108K. If you continue to make the same payments as you are now on the primary and rental, you will pay off those balances faster and then have all that cash flow freed up. Max out HSA before 403B (more flexibility in HSA and basically the best of all retirement worlds in HSA). I don't see why option 1 is even an option. It really is 2 just a question of do you tweek it a bit here and there. 

 
Awesome stuff guys.  This thread always reminds me to check.  I am about 5 years into a 30 year fixed jumbo at 3.625%, didn't think I could do much better.  Called my banker and turns out Citi will do a loan modification, so I won't lose any of the progress I've made so far along the amortization schedule, shifting me down to 3.375%, which seems small, but turns out it'll save me over $300 a month after I hit the break even period in less than a year.  Basically free money.

Thanks FFA

 
AAABatteries said:
Just got 2.875%. That’s good, right?
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That is a great rate but I will say this again... rate isn't the only factor of getting a good deal or not. You can get an awesome rate but get screwed over in origination fees and discoint points. 

Also, everyone needs to realize that rates aren't the same for everyone. There are a lot of factors that go into what kind of rate is available to you. Type of loan, credit, LTV, geography, loan size, type of property, type of residency, etc all impact available rates.

 
-OZ- said:
:yes:  

It's pretty much what I'm getting (my understanding is conventional have generally been higher than VA)
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Govy loans (VA, FHA and USDA) are aggressively lower than conventional right now if you go to a broker. I have seen some ugly rates for govy from banks and direct lenders.

 
Chadstroma said:
That is a great rate but I will say this again... rate isn't the only factor of getting a good deal or not. You can get an awesome rate but get screwed over in origination fees and discoint points. 

Also, everyone needs to realize that rates aren't the same for everyone. There are a lot of factors that go into what kind of rate is available to you. Type of loan, credit, LTV, geography, loan size, type of property, type of residency, etc all impact available rates.
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That was one thing I really liked about your referral. I asked about points, she responded "we never use points"

I'm thinking there are times when points make sense so I was surprised, but I didn't want to buy points anyway. 

 
Otis said:
Awesome stuff guys.  This thread always reminds me to check.  I am about 5 years into a 30 year fixed jumbo at 3.625%, didn't think I could do much better.  Called my banker and turns out Citi will do a loan modification, so I won't lose any of the progress I've made so far along the amortization schedule, shifting me down to 3.375%, which seems small, but turns out it'll save me over $300 a month after I hit the break even period in less than a year.  Basically free money.

Thanks FFA
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Holy crap — just spoke with the mortgage person, and I made a big payment to principal over night, and I don’t know if she just made a mistake the first time or whether that is what caused it, but she way underestimated my savings.  I’m going to save over $820/month.  That’s sick.

 
Otis said:
Holy crap — just spoke with the mortgage person, and I made a big payment to principal over night, and I don’t know if she just made a mistake the first time or whether that is what caused it, but she way underestimated my savings.  I’m going to save over $820/month.  That’s sick.
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lucky you. No mortgage tax doing it that way?

 
-OZ- said:
That was one thing I really liked about your referral. I asked about points, she responded "we never use points"

I'm thinking there are times when points make sense so I was surprised, but I didn't want to buy points anyway. 
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There are times that points can make sense such as wanting to buy down the rate but what happens with a lot of lenders is that they offer a good rate and try to sneak in the points and fees. 

All the brokers I know talk from par rate (no points) and go up to give lender credits. Zero to minimal fees which mostly are lender fees and not broker. 

But it always about the full picture. There is s lot of sneaky and scummy ways of "selling" and I instead like to educate and offer. 

 
Otis said:
Just a $4k fee for the loan modification, which I'll break even on in 5 months given the savings.
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That's a hefty fee for a mod. I bet you could shop it around and get better if you were inclined. Even more so if you dangle the wealth management relationship as a carrot to another bank. 

 
Chadstroma said:
That's a hefty fee for a mod. I bet you could shop it around and get better if you were inclined. Even more so if you dangle the wealth management relationship as a carrot to another bank. 
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Maybe, but I don’t want to move my relationship — they handle a bunch of financial items for me and I like banking with them. I’m just thrilled to get down to that rate on jumbo mortgage and save that much money on a monthly basis. 

 
@Chadstroma is 1% standard for closing costs? 

All ready to go, only $900 out of pocket, saves $500 / month (which includes removing escrow, really only $200 / month less total)

2.84% apr, 30 years. 

I'm good with it. 

 
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-OZ- said:
@Chadstroma is 1% standard for closing costs? 

All ready to go, only $900 out of pocket, saves $500 / month (which includes removing escrow, really only $200 / month less total)

2.84% apr, 30 years. 

I'm good with it. 
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That really isn't a yes or no question. Closing costs cam range freatly from city to city, county to county , let alone state to state and even then a good chunk of closing costs is title. 

Most of the line items are bot anything to do with a lender and/or broker. 

In the end... that is one sick APR my friend. If it was another lender. I would have questions to ask but knowing who I sent you to, you are good. Enjoy the awesome rate!

 
Sort of related...

County wide tax re-appraisals just came back, and my house came in at ~5% higher than what my recent appraisal came in at. Worth going through the appeals process for that amount of difference?

 
Worm said:
Sort of related...

County wide tax re-appraisals just came back, and my house came in at ~5% higher than what my recent appraisal came in at. Worth going through the appeals process for that amount of difference?
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No

Taxes always go up. 

 
@Chadstroma, you happen to have someone in NJ I can speak to?    I just refinanced 2 months ago at 3.625 over 30.  Might be too late now, but I was thinking it wouldn't be worth it to do again but figured might as well talk to someone and see what they have to say.  TIA.

 
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